Legal Stroke

[KC]

While playing a game, we have the following disputes.
1) Our opponent lift up the racket in front of the net and block our return, the returned shuttle hit the racket and fall back to our end. Is this a legal stroke and which rule should arrest this issue.

2) While executing a smash to either the baseline or a diagonal smash, the tip of the shuttle falls out but the feather drops on to the line. Is this out or in? Again which rule in the IBF applies.

Thanks for replies.

KC

[Byro-Nenium]

1) I often use this tactic as it often will intimidate your opponent. As long as the racket is on your side of the net and the shuttle hits it, dropping it back on your on your opponents half, then its in. If the shuttle is hit before it cross the net then its considered a fault... btw, Peter Gade had this fault when he was playing Gopichand in the All England Semi Final.

2) I believe that the shuttle tip (cork) is what counts. even if the feather is in and the cork hits out first, its called out.

hope it helps......

[harry]

I agree with byro about the shuttle being out thing, the part that counts is the cork and if the cork is out that it counts as an out.
I have a problem sometimes with the thing about the racket at the net too, i know that hitting the net will be a fault but is it legal to swing into the opponent's side in a swing? like u start off swing at your side and end up with your racket on the other side....is that legal? cos when i play, i've came across that occasion quite a few times and don't know if to count it or not.

[Phil]

Your follow-through may cross into their side, just as long as you don't hit the net. So if you hit it just as it crosses to your side, then swing into thei side, it is legal.

[Brett]

The contact with the shuttle must be made on your side of the net - no reaching over the net to hit it, but as Phil stated, if your follow through crosses the net, it will still be a legal point.

Additionally, it is not illegal to hit the net provided that your shuttle has hit the ground before your follow through reaches the net.

[Byro-Nenium]

To me, i had always thought that would be a fault and made sure that that shot was omitted from my game.

[Jaysee]

Yes, it is true that as long as the shuttle contact the racket on your side. But raisng your racket to block the shot in KC's case, isn't that distracting the opponent which is a fault?

[KC]

Hi Guys,
Thanks for the replies. Jaysee is correct. I have attached the following rules from the IBF
13) Faults:
It is a "fault"

13.3) If, when in play, the initial point of Contact with the shuttle is on the striker's side of the net. (The striker may, however, follow the shuttle over the net with the racket in the course of a stroke).
"A stroke involves a swing ofthe racket heat, so lifting the racket and blocking the return is not a legal stroke( no swing).

13.4.4) Obstructs an opponent, ie prevents an opponent from making a legal stroke where the shuttle is followed over the net.
"The follow thru would result in a clash of rackets, so the Blocker is Fault".

13.5) If in play, a player deliberately distracts an opponent by any action such as shouting or making gestures.
"Placing the racket in front of your opponent is distracting his vision".

I hv. never seen this Blocking the Return in any Internatinal competition. It would be funny playing Volleyball style Badminton. One guy putting his racket in front and trying to block out any return from the forecourt.

In the recent ALL England Double Final, SIGIT tried to guess and smash the shuttle in the forecourt. He was sucessful once, the return hit his racket. But he swing his racket to smash, so his stroke was legal as the contact with the shuttle was on his side.

Thanks fo

KC

[Cheung]

The block at the net is definately a fault. There must be a stroke. you are not allowed to just hold up the racquet at the net and hope the shuttle will hit it and fall into the opponent's court. I have seen faults for this in International competition. (1985 world champs singles final Han vs Frost, as one example).

I asked some qualified umpires about the shuttle in/out because on TV, the commetator states that "any part of the shuttle touching the line is deemed in". But my friends tell me it is the base of the shuttle that counts, not the feathers.
So I take it as the base.
Who's correct??

[cooler]

It's the base (cork) for sure, cheung. So sleep well.

[Cheung]

Thanks.

The confusion comes about because on some of the linesman calls, the base lands out, the feathers touch the line and the commentator goes with the line judge call of in. Just basically a case of poor line judging and something the IBF have got to improve on. Though I appreciate the difficulty of judging some of the shots - it doesn't mean that players get points against them for those calls. In the 5 x 7 system, there is even less tolerance for this sort of mistake as one point is equivalent to 14% of the game!

[cooler]

good point. I could see players would contest each incorrect line call more vigorously. On the 5x7 system, do you know the time allowed break between games?

[Cheung]

Now that you mention, no I don;t know. Just assumed it would be 90 secs. But the adverts get in. Ahh, it was not live broadcast so the adverts are bound to get in.

[cooler]

maybe the break time between games would be decided by ther number of sponsors and commericals. Doesn't matter, IBF won't admit to it anyway.

[harry]

so itz not okay to hold your racket up on your side and try to block any return from the opponent's side that might be low and attempt a drop or tip? I thought u can hold your racket in anyway in your own court as long as you don't distract the other opponents.
Is it really countedin when any part of the shuttle touches the line? i thought it was only the cork part that counts
now i'm really confused.....

[Cheung]

No, the racquet cannot be just held up in front of the net. Another example I've just remembered is the All-England quarter final 1990?, Rashid Sidek vs Morten Frost. Frost did it against Rashid and was faulted.

Cooler confirmed what my friends said. Only use the cork to judge in/out. nothe the feathers.

[harry]

okay, i'm clear on the thing about which part of the shuttle counts for ins and outs but why is it a fault to have your racket held up on your own side? which rule goes against that on the book?

[cooler]

sometime, it is really up to the umpire's call. Maybe it's me but i see less pros use this tactic anymore.

[Mag]

A follow-through over the net is allowed, if you hit the shuttle on your side of the net.

[Mag]

Oops -- that had already been pointed out by Phil, sorry about that. (Although his reply was in the wrong place).

[Mag]

Hmmm... I never thought much about this, but now that you bring it up I remember seeing at least two international matches where this happened and it was NOT deemed a fault:

<B>Poul-Erik Hoyer vs Sun Jun</B>, in the 1999 Danish Open semifinal. Hoyer makes a flat drive at Sun Jun, who squats and just puts his racquet up, the shuttle hits Sun Jun's racquet and lands on Hoyer's side. It all happened so fast... Hoyer looked pretty surprised but Sun Jun looked completely bewildered... Obviously he had no idea what had happened. Sun Jun won the point, although he didn't make a proper stroke.

<B>Jesper Larsen & Jens Eriksen vs Ricky Subagdja & Denny Kantono</B>, Copenhagen Masters 1999 (?). Jens Eriksen squats close to the net with his racquet up, Ricky hits the shuttle straight at Jens racquet from close range. I didn't even understand what happened until I saw the replay... Anyway it was not considered a fault and the Danes won the point. Before the next serve, Jens Eriksen raised his racquet to Ricky to say "I'm sorry"...

So, you're saying the judges were wrong? These were obvious cases. There were no proper swing involved.

[cooler]

not to dampen your agrument but your 2 examples given are not borderline enough for the need to bring out rule book. I see them as easy no fault calls. Saying sorry doesn't mean acceptance of a fault. I say sorry too when my smash shots bounce off the tape or hit on opponent body but the points still go to me. It has to be obvious illegal by the defender before a fault is call.

[Cheung]

Sun Jun could still have been moving his racquet unintentionally.

Not sure about your second example

[viver]

I believe the rule says you cannot interfere/obstruct your opponent so in my opinion it does not constitute a fault if you raise your racquet to anticipate a block at the net. But if your action interferes, obstructs or distract your opponent (i.e. waving the racquet to distract your opponent) then it should be a foul. This case is up to the umpire interpretation.

What Mag commented about Ricky and Jens, I'm inclined towards Cooler. It could be that Jens was in a unfavourable position and likely to lose the rally but somehow he won it under a "fortunate" situation. Apologizing to your opponent just show his sportmanship.

[Mag]

This is also how I had interpreted the rules. And indeed, neither of those examples I described was an interference or obstruction.

I just got confused by this (to me) new rule about racquet swing... it doesn't make sense. Is there really such a rule? Cheung wrote:
"The block at the net is definately a fault. There must be a stroke."

[Cheung]

Just repeating what the commentator said. I'm not one to go into the fine details of the rule book. Techniques are a different matter.

[Cheung]

Just repeating what the commentator said. I'm not one to go into the fine details of the rule book. Techniques are a different matter though.

[AF]

It is a fault to just be sitting at the net with your racquet up like a "flag" to block the shuttle. A player must contact the shuttle on his side of the net and is allowed to follow through on the after swing to the opponent's side of the court, but a racquet cannot be stuck straight up to impede the swing. That is a fault on the receiver cause they didn't allow the other team to follow through. A player rushing the net can anticipate a shot by swinging their racquet at the moment the opponent hits the shuttle, but cannot sit there with a raised "flag".

[Ron]

90 secs is correct. Enought time for advertisment.

[Ron]

And I forgot to mention, coaching is allowed during the 90 secs.

[Ron]

KC, which part of the shuttlecock hits the ground first? In most cases, it would be the cock / base end, then the call would be call "out". But, if the feather hits the ground first, the call should be "in". ( Not that you will see many of this happening but there is always a possibility!!) After all, the shuttlecock consist of feathers + cock / base. There is not rule saying that the cock must hit the ground first.