http://www.djarumindonesiaopen.com/main/

http://www.djarumindonesiaopen.com/main/
Thanks for sharing the info seawell..:cool:
Finally heh!!they have some sort of a professional website for this tourney..:p :rolleyes:

^^Mods might want to merge this thread with the Indonesian Open thread that is being locked??..

fiuuw..
Finally indonesia open has a website...

OMG, I never thought Indonesians could do something so professional. This website is even more informative and better than some of the other websites I have seen over the past few years. I am so proud to be from Surabaya. It must be the Surabaya organisers who could think of something so brilliant. One piece of advice, boys and girls: next time, if you guys wanna organise something really big in Indonesia, do it in Surabaya.

OMG, I never thought Indonesians could do something so professional. This website is even more informative and better than some of the other websites I have seen over the past few years. I am so proud to be from Surabaya. It must be the Surabaya organisers who could think of something so brilliant. One piece of advice, boys and girls: next time, if you guys wanna organise something really big in Indonesia, do it in Surabaya.
yes it is, and quite professional to say the least(esp. since it is in English); probably the organizers read some of our complaints here from last yr's IO with the lack of informative website...and they realize this is a 6* tourney and really wanted this yr's IO to be the best it can be...
as far as them having IO in Surabaya again, well, they don't have to do it again in Surabaya to have this same quality of website...but what they(PBSI) can do is hire the same people who designed this yr's IO website to do next yr's one(wherever it is)...Hmm, Bali sounds nice, esp. for all the foreign players coming in...:rolleyes: :) :cool:

OMG, I never thought Indonesians could do something so professional. This website is even more informative and better than some of the other websites I have seen over the past few years. I am so proud to be from Surabaya. It must be the Surabaya organisers who could think of something so brilliant. One piece of advice, boys and girls: next time, if you guys wanna organise something really big in Indonesia, do it in Surabaya.

they get fully supported by local goverment (surabaya city)

Well done,Indonesia for its website without INA language! Who's next that follow it to design bdm tourney's web in English? Maybe ChnOpen-HkgOpen-JpnOpen or other countries (because many people can't understand their native language)?? This step can make bdm more go international in globalization era when info must update everytime...

Well done,Indonesia for its website without INA language! Who's next that follow it to design bdm tourney's web in English? Maybe ChnOpen-HkgOpen-JpnOpen or other countries (because many people can't understand their native language)?? This step can make bdm more go international in globalization era when info must update everytime...Well done? Of course it's great to have an international language for an international tournament, but why should that have to come at the expense of the local population. As long as a bilingual website is updated in both languages at once, I don't see anything wrong with it.

A few years ago, the Korean Open went to an English-only site. Since so few people here, especially in badminton circles, can use English sites easily, fortunately, they mirrored the information in Korean on the KBA website. Unfortunately, the official site was often left with a lot of static and otherwise outdated information.

In what way is a well-maintained bilingual website not the best option?

(because many people can't understand their native language)I don't understand what you mean here. Are you being sarcastic? Everyone understands their native language even when said language is not the official one of the land. At any rate, Indonesia is linguistically very diverse but, from my experience, people whose native language is not Bahasa Indonesia are still more likely to know that language than they are to know English.

Well done? Of course it's great to have an international language for an international tournament, but why should that have to come at the expense of the local population. As long as a bilingual website is updated in both languages at once, I don't see anything wrong with it.

I don't understand what you mean here. Are you being sarcastic? Everyone understands their native language even when said language is not the official one of the land. At any rate, Indonesia is linguistically very diverse but, from my experience, people whose native language is not Bahasa Indonesia are still more likely to know that language than they are to know English.

Sorry, you must be misunderstanding for what I mean! Of course definitely,someone whose being citizen in one country automatically they understand very well with its mother-tongue. In my case: I really proud and comfortable to use Bahasa Indonesia compare than English but for foreigners must be hard to understand any local language so the solution is using English as international language (like or dislike) to make it easier way.How a perfect one if an international tourney/event use bilingual as that you said (local and english).Last year I got some problem when I want to find an info about SC-05 (Beijing/CHN) because its web using mandarin only (as we know mandarin language use symbol/character not an alphabet).How come we get the source with language that we're totally blank??Then,I hope you should be clear now from that above explanation -- I never be a sarcastic or cynical person to another language (although I don't understand it).

Sorry, you must be misunderstanding for what I mean! Of course definitely,someone whose being citizen in one country automatically they understand very well with its mother-tongue. In my case: I really proud and comfortable to use Bahasa Indonesia compare than English but for foreigners must be hard to understand any local language so the solution is using English as international language (like or dislike) to make it easier way.How a perfect one if an international tourney/event use bilingual as that you said (local and english).Last year I got some problem when I want to find an info about SC-05 (Beijing/CHN) because its web using mandarin only (as we know mandarin language use symbol/character not an alphabet).How come we get the source with language that we're totally blank??Then,I hope you should be clear now from that above explanation -- I never be a sarcastic or cynical person to another language (although I don't understand it).I understand.

I guess, having never operated a website before, that I don't fully appreciate the amount of work that might go into keeping one going in two languages. Hence, I was assuming that the logical alternative to a website only in Korean or only in Bahasa Indonesia or only in Chinese would be a bilingual one. English only would be less work than a bilingual one, I suppose, but I hate to think of people in the country hosting the tournament not being able to understand the stuff on the website. This might be less of a problem in Indonesia, where a change to English-only does not involve a change in alphabet but in Korea or China or Japan, where the writing systems are completely different, an English-only website would be a real burden to the local people.

I understand.

I guess, having never operated a website before, that I don't fully appreciate the amount of work that might go into keeping one going in two languages. Hence, I was assuming that the logical alternative to a website only in Korean or only in Bahasa Indonesia or only in Chinese would be a bilingual one. English only would be less work than a bilingual one, I suppose, but I hate to think of people in the country hosting the tournament not being able to understand the stuff on the website. This might be less of a problem in Indonesia, where a change to English-only does not involve a change in alphabet but in Korea or China or Japan, where the writing systems are completely different, an English-only website would be a real burden to the local people.
Regarding you mentioned that Chinese, Japanese and Korean uses a totally different type of writing/character, i understand. Even India(Hindi) or Arabic or Russia uses different characters. But i think it's just a matter of getting people proficient in English language to translate and compose the content for the website; which i'm sure there are a lot of them out there in those countries. I mean, i'm sure the people translating and making this yr's IO website most likely go thru the same process, no different, even if Indonesian language uses similar alphabets like English.:rolleyes:

On that note, personally, i feel these kind of websites *should* use English as the *main* language of communication. Not to sound like i'm being indifferent to a country's native language, but why do a bilingual website if you can present it in 1(common) language. Especially for a sport like badminton, if they want to make it "popular"..:rolleyes: :cool:

The most important thing is the site updated the matches regulary. Cause I don't see any Live Scoring.

Regarding you mentioned that Chinese, Japanese and Korean uses a totally different type of writing/character, i understand. Even India(Hindi) or Arabic or Russia uses different characters. But i think it's just a matter of getting people proficient in English language to translate and compose the content for the website; which i'm sure there are a lot of them out there in those countries. I mean, i'm sure the people translating and making this yr's IO website most likely go thru the same process, no different, even if Indonesian language uses similar alphabets like English.Oh, no doubt the process is similar for the people making the website. My point is that for the local people who have to use the website, reading a word like badminton in English is easy for Indonesians because it is the same word with the same spelling. However, it is very different for people who usually see it as 배드민턴 or 羽毛球. So using an English website might be slightly easier for Indonesian end-users than for Chinese or Korean users. Perhaps that word isn't the best example because its English spelling might be familiar to speakers of most languages but there may well be other English words that Indonesians would recognize.On that note, personally, i feel these kind of websites *should* use English as the *main* language of communication. Not to sound like i'm being indifferent to a country's native language, but why do a bilingual website if you can present it in 1(common) language.Why? So that it will be usable for the people who live in the country hosting the tournament. If, as you point out, the people maintaining the site are going through the process of translating, then it shouldn't be that difficult to maintain a parallel site on which you leave the "untranslated" stuff for the local people, who are ultimately paying for the tournament and forming the bulk of the spectators, etc..Especially for a sport like badminton, if they want to make it "popular".To what "it" are you referring? How on earth would the absence of a button on the homepage saying "Bahasa Indonesia", which speakers of that language could click to get readable information, make badminton, the tournament, or the website itself, more popular?

wah~ thanks! and , i want to say 'FINALLY' too
congratulations!~

then it shouldn't be that difficult to maintain a parallel site on which you leave the "untranslated" stuff for the local people,

they should give us indonesian edition :D
maybe you're willing to become their indo-english translator
you can translate them from usa :D

they should give us indonesian editionYes. That's what I'm saying.maybe you're willing to become their indo-english translatorWho, me? Why me? They clearly don't need anyone else. They've already made the English site. They certainly don't need me. Saya sudah lupa semua bahasa yang saya sudah belajar. See what I mean?you can translate them from usa Can't do anything from the U.S. I never go there.

event, I think my point is how to make a website convenient to other "outside/non-Indonesian" people, to read and understand the infos. Not so much for the local people..
Anyways, sigh, since this is getting a bit more off topic, this will be my last response..:p:)
Oh, no doubt the process is similar for the people making the website. My point is that for the local people who have to use the website, reading a word like badminton in English is easy for Indonesians because it is the same word with the same spelling. However, it is very different for people who usually see it as 배드민턴 or 羽毛球. So using an English website might be slightly easier for Indonesian end-users than for Chinese or Korean users. Perhaps that word isn't the best example because its English spelling might be familiar to speakers of most languages but there may well be other English words that Indonesians would recognize.
sure it's spelled the same, and it's only 1 word..there are other similar spelled-words, ie. smash, set, deuce, match etc.
Why? So that it will be usable for the people who live in the country hosting the tournament. If, as you point out, the people maintaining the site are going through the process of translating, then it shouldn't be that difficult to maintain a parallel site on which you leave the "untranslated" stuff for the local people, who are ultimately paying for the tournament and forming the bulk of the spectators, etc..
Specific to IO, hmm, why would local people read an English website, which is more likely dedicated to "non-Indonesians" speaking people or those who don't understand, when they have local newspapers/magazines at their disposal.:rolleyes: :p
Besides, if one thinks abt it, why would there even be a website?? Isn't the main purpose of a website is to share information internationally??..And why do a bilingual task if one can just do it in 1 language??Simpler and less work, don't you think, whilst still achieving the same purpose..Now, since you are referring back to a website being catered to the local population, imagine the official IBF website; since it's based in Malaysia, do you think they should do another parallel site dedicated to the Malaysians or Bahasa Malay??..:rolleyes::p

To what "it" are you referring? How on earth would the absence of a button on the homepage saying "Bahasa Indonesia", which speakers of that language could click to get readable information, make badminton, the tournament, or the website itself, more popular?
the "it" i'm referring to is the sport of badminton..This might sound "extreme" but specifically for the IO, making an English based-only website will only attract non-Indonesian speaking/understanding people to follow and keep up, i'm sure you can imagine it as well...:) Therefore, more people will be interested...
Sigh, how i wonder if IBF will make this a *requirement* for all websites which are presenting all the higher stars tourneys..:p :rolleyes:

Saya sudah lupa semua bahasa yang saya sudah belajar.
event,
so you did learn bahasa Indonesia, eventhough you forgot abt it..and you know a bit of the language..:)

sure it's spelled the same, and it's only 1 word..there are other similar spelled-words, ie. smash, set, deuce, match etc.Right, which is why the problem for local people dealing with an English-only website might be slightly reduced in the particular case of Indonesia.Specific to IO, hmm, why would local people read an English website, which is more likely dedicated to "non-Indonesians" speaking people or those who don't understand, when they have local newspapers/magazines at their disposal..They likely wouldn't use an English website. In the case of Indonesia, you're talking about one of the few countries in which even international tournaments are covered in the regular press. This isn't true in the case of other countries that host tournaments and I was making my earlier point in general terms.Besides, if one thinks abt it, why would there even be a website?? Isn't the main purpose of a website is to share information internationally??.Well, here, you're ignoring the fact that the Indonesian Open used to have a website and it was only in Indonesian. This seems to prove that someone in Indonesia thought it would be useful to have all the information in one place..Isn't the main purpose of a website is to share information internationally??Now I know you are kidding about this one. Of all the thousands of websites you've visited, you've never seen one that was intended for one country or even one local community? As I said before, the local people are paying for the tournament (ie. buying the sponsors' products) and they will make up 80% of the spectators or more. They deserve to have a place to look to find all the information in one place...And why do a bilingual task if one can just do it in 1 language??Simpler and less work, don't you think, whilst still achieving the same purpose.??I think I answered this question. First, I don't know how much work it would be. I've never operated a website. If translation is being done into English, then operating a website in the local language does not involve translation. It implies that the data that had to be translated into English had to be translated from Bahasa Indonesia, for example. If a parallel website can be set up with that untranslated data at a low cost, I think it would help a lot of people. But I admit that I don't know how much more work or cost is involved.whilst still achieving the same purpose.??Well, this is the key, isn't it? If the local people can't understand what's on the English website, then part of that purpose is not achieved with a unilingual site. Now, since you are referring back to a website being catered to the local population, imagine the official IBF website; since it's based in Malaysia, do you think they should do another parallel site dedicated to the Malaysians or Bahasa MalayThe local population of Malaysia has no special relationship to the operations of the IBF headquarters. Their dealings with the IBF, if any, are identical to those of the citizens of Russia or Pakistan. No Malaysians visit the IBF unless they work there and they don't pay the IBF to have the headquarters there. A decision to operate a Bahasa Melayu version of the IBF site would involve the same considerations as a Spanish or Chinese or German version of that site. The fact that English is the default is, of course, just a cruel historical accident. To answer your question from another post, yes, I learned a little Bahasa Indonesia a long time ago and forgot a lot of it. One time, upon hearing my explanation of one of the many irritating complexities of English, an Indonesian man said "Why is English the international language then? Everyone should use Bahasa Indonesia. It's much simpler!" I couldn't help agreeing. I just included that quote to demonstrate how bad my skills are these days.[quote=ctjcad]the "it" i'm referring to is the sport of badminton..This might sound "extreme" but specifically for the IO, making an English based-only website will only attract non-Indonesian speaking/understanding people to follow and keep up, i'm sure you can imagine it as well... Therefore, more people will be interested...
Sigh, how i wonder if IBF will make this a *requirement* for all websites which are presenting all the higher stars tourneys.I don't buy it. More popular than a site with no English yes. But not more popular than if the site were bilingual. There would be no difference in the latter case. And yes, I agree the IBF should require an English version with live scoring for 4* and above.

Website? What... what... Dont really bother with the website... the best thing is you can watch the match live... website and online scoring is the alternative option... heheheheeee

event,
i don't know how this ended up with a long discussion between you and me over a silly issue of whether to use bilingual or not over a silly Indonesian Open website..And i was already going to close this case, but since you respond even longer, hehe, i just want to make 2 comments:
First, which one would you *prefer*, an Indonesian-only website or English based website. Or let's say any other language, other than Chinese or Korean(which you know), which one would choose? If you propose to have bilingual website for IBF tourneys, one for local/native speakers and the other in English, now imagine those people who are reading and following the info in their own native/local language, if they go and follow in other international IBF tourney website, which language will they be reading and understand, taking into account they don't understand the other language??..Don't you think it's English??..:rolleyes:
And second, since this IO website is updating very2 slow, which you and many can see and experience, imagine this a bilingual service website, how "much work" is there to be done, let alone a 1 language based website..:p:rolleyes: :(
My choice is, if anyone is going to do a website on IBF tourneys, stick with one common language, English, in presentation and run with it. Forget abt setting it up in bilingual or trilingual format. And don't forget to update all the live scores or what-have-you...hehe:p :rolleyes:

event,
i don't know how this ended up with a long discussion between you and me over a silly issue of whether to use bilingual or not over a silly Indonesian Open website..And i was already going to close this case, but since you respond even longer, hehe, i just want to make 2 comments:
First, which one would you *prefer*, an Indonesian-only website or English based website. Or let's say any other language, other than Chinese or Korean(which you know), which one would choose? If you propose to have bilingual website for IBF tourneys, one for local/native speakers and the other in English, now imagine those people who are reading and following the info in their own native/local language, if they go and follow in other international IBF tourney website, which language will they be reading and understand, taking into account they don't understand the other language??..Don't you think it's English??..:rolleyes:
And second, since this IO website is updating very2 slow, which you and many can see and experience, imagine this a bilingual service website, how "much work" is there to be done, let alone a 1 language based website..:p:rolleyes: :(
My choice is, if anyone is going to do a website on IBF tourneys, stick with one common language, English, in presentation and run with it. Forget abt setting it up in bilingual or trilingual format. And don't forget to update all the live scores or what-have-you...hehe:p :rolleyes:I don't know if the issue is that silly. You bring up an interesting question. If it is proven that bilingual sites are impossible and I say I'd prefer an English-only site, that makes me a) irrelevant because the organizers are the ones who decide on the language of the site; and b) insensitive to the needs of the people who are more likely than I am to actually attend the tournament. I could do without English websites if they hinder people who might actually go to watch, for whom the info on the site is more than just a curiosity as it is for me. I went without any pro badminton knowledge for 30 years. I could keep stumbling around non-English sites a little longer for their sake.

When the Korea Open first went to English-only, I found more up-to-date information on the koreabadminton.org site and I wondered if the lack of English-proficient personnel were the reason for the delays. That may not be the problem with the Indonesian Open site. It seems to me the IO didn't even have a site not too long ago. Does that sound familiar?

One alternative to an IBF requirement for an English-only site would be for the IBF to set up its own site with live scoring and draw sheets in English with tournament organizers having the power to update for their tournament. That would save the tournament organizers the trouble of re-inventing the wheel for each tournament. Judging from the state of its new website, the IBF lacks either the will or the resources or the competence to do something like that, but it might be a fairer alternative to making exigencies on the part of tournament organizers whom the IBF isn't paying, and who may have difficulty setting up a whole site in English.

event, i was abt to stop replying altogether, but you kept on baiting me..anyways...:p
I don't know if the issue is that silly. You bring up an interesting question. If it is proven that bilingual sites are impossible and I say I'd prefer an English-only site, that makes me a) irrelevant because the organizers are the ones who decide on the language of the site; and b) insensitive to the needs of the people who are more likely than I am to actually attend the tournament. I could do without English websites if they hinder people who might actually go to watch, for whom the info on the site is more than just a curiosity as it is for me. I went without any pro badminton knowledge for 30 years. I could keep stumbling around non-English sites a little longer for their sake.
Hmm, true, it's not totally impossible to have a bilingual or even trilingual website, if the website organizer wants to-more power to them. But also looking at your points above which i've highlighted in bold, could that also be vice-versa, say if the website is not provided in an English-language, could that also mean the organizers are being "insensitive" to us non-native language people who wants to follow that particular tourney/website?? I mean, i'm sure you know the majority of people knowing the language of English is much more than any other language, well, maybe Chinese language is close in competition.
Sure some people could do without an English only website, i've tried it also, by just "blindly" clicking one link to another, but i believe that's as far as one can roam...and most likely end up saying to ourselves "Help, where is an English site for this??"..:p

When the Korea Open first went to English-only, I found more up-to-date information on the koreabadminton.org site and I wondered if the lack of English-proficient personnel were the reason for the delays. That may not be the problem with the Indonesian Open site. It seems to me the IO didn't even have a site not too long ago. Does that sound familiar?
Hmm, that doesn't make sense. I mean don't tell me there are *less* English-speaking able people in Korea than Indonesia..?!?!..I'm sure there are quite a few of them in Korea..:rolleyes:
Sure, there hasn't even been a website dedicated to the IO in the past, well as far as i know of. Cos maybe the organizer wasn't really concerned abt making one or could be there's no budget..?!?!..:rolleyes: :p

One alternative to an IBF requirement for an English-only site would be for the IBF to set up its own site with live scoring and draw sheets in English with tournament organizers having the power to update for their tournament. That would save the tournament organizers the trouble of re-inventing the wheel for each tournament. Judging from the state of its new website, the IBF lacks either the will or the resources or the competence to do something like that, but it might be a fairer alternative to making exigencies on the part of tournament organizers whom the IBF isn't paying, and who may have difficulty setting up a whole site in English.
This idea of yours sounds better and plausible. Hey, how abt the idea of IBF having full control of all media outlets(let it be TV/cable or live web broadcasting for us fans)..just like here in the U.S., most of the major sports is somewhat "controlled" by the league(ie. NFL, NBA, MLB)
Hmm, now imagine if that idea really comes into fruition, could it be the missing solution to their marketing strategy??(which is of course a whole different topic altogether)..:( :rolleyes: :)

event, i was abt to stop replying altogether, but you kept on baiting meBaiting? I realize this is all good-natured debate but of course it hasn't escaped my attention that you're only offering to stop debating on the condition that you get the last word. If you were conceding points in that last word, it might work - and both of us are conceding more with each post so I think we agree on more than the length of the exchange might suggest - but you did ask me a few ostensibly rhetorical questions which I though warranted genuine answers. could that also mean the organizers are being "insensitive" to us non-native language people who wants to follow that particular tourney/website?Fair enough, but as a person who benefits daily from being a speaker of a language that the whole world seems to need to learn, I feel the need to hold myself to a higher standard when it comes to sensitivity to the effort involved in producing translations I might demand. I mean, the opportunity to communicate in my mother tongue is handed to me on a silver platter in country after country and in most cases I have neither the will nor the means to reciprocate. Non-native speakers have far more right than I have to demand information in an international language that they have learned at great expense.Hmm, that doesn't make sense. I mean don't tell me there are *less* English-speaking able people in Korea than Indonesia..?!?!..I'm sure there are quite a few of them in Korea..Yes, I didn't explain that well. My point about Indonesia was more that the existence of a tournament website at all is a more recent development, and so a lack of experience, rather than the language barrier, might be a more likely cause for hiccups in the operation of this year's site. This is pure conjecture, however. In the case of Korea, there is not a lot of English competence in badminton circles, to be sure, but the online badminton community is quite well-developed, as is the Internet in general. Therefore, I'm more likely to blame problems on the language barrier, especially when the information goes up on the KBA website, in Korean, much faster.

Baiting? I realize this is all good-natured debate but you're only offering to stop debating on the condition that you get the last word. If you were conceding points in that last word, it might work - and both of us are conceding more with each post so I think we agree on more than the length of the exchange might suggest - but you did ask me a few ostensibly rhetorical questions which I though warranted genuine answers.
In most if not all of my replies, I'm just putting my point across as logically as possible, even if you thought i may be asking a "few ostensibly rhetorical questions" and needed "a genuine answers"(and in a way prolonging this discussion). Anyways, I'll leave this one up in the air for the rest of the BCers in here to read and decide/or not decide on the comments i highlighted in bold(probably they could care less abt what we are discussing) for themselves. Yes, you're right, i'm trying to concede and close this discussion and move on. :p :)
Fair enough, but as a person who benefits daily from being a speaker of a language that the whole world seems to need to learn, I feel the need to hold myself to a higher standard.
Sorry, i may not catch what you meant or your point. But are you referring to the English language being "a language that the whole world seems to need to learn"??..
Yes, I didn't explain that well. My point about Indonesia was more that the existence of a tournament website at all is a more recent development, and so a lack of experience, rather than the language barrier, might be a more likely cause for hiccups in the operation of this year's site. This is pure conjecture, however. In the case of Korea, there is not a lot of English competence in badminton circles, to be sure, but the online badminton community is quite well-developed, as is the Internet in general. Therefore, I'm more likely to blame problems on the language barrier, especially when the information goes up on the KBA website, in Korean, much faster.
As you mentioned, I understand abt "the existence of an IO website is a recent development", and IMO, it could be due to many factors. Last, not to sound as if i'm pointing fingers, but if i(or anyone else) was to track back on this thread, i believe it was you who "started" by mentioning and elaborating abt having to have "bilingual" website in response to CLELY's post, which turned out to be a slight misunderstanding..
anyways, let's move on..:p :)

But are you referring to the English language being "a language that the whole world seems to need to learn"?Yes.
i believe it was you who "started" by mentioning and elaborating abt having to have "bilingual" website in response to CLELY's post, which turned out to be a slight misunderstanding.Yes, it was me. I take full responsibility.

OMG, I never thought Indonesians could do something so professional. This website is even more informative and better than some of the other websites I have seen over the past few years. I am so proud to be from Surabaya. It must be the Surabaya organisers who could think of something so brilliant. One piece of advice, boys and girls: next time, if you guys wanna organise something really big in Indonesia, do it in Surabaya.

but i would like to ask from this website..where should i go if i wanna get the latest result??? :confused: :confused: as i said when i clicked at the 'result' it gave me the list of the winner of the tournament...not the thing that i want...:mad: :crying:

but i would like to ask from this website..where should i go if i wanna get the latest result??? :confused: :confused: as i said when i clicked at the 'result' it gave me the list of the winner of the tournament...not the thing that i want...:mad: :crying:

It is a lousy site !!!

fiuuw..
Finally indonesia open has a website...

and....the website needs lots of help ! Look at the results page....elementary job.

Whoa.. those are really long threads up there, guys...

About this website, the only thing i can say is dat i coudnt find what i really want here