taufik picking up his form as olympic qualification starts

[malbar]

Taufik is starting to up his form. He will have drops in form as his attention will be geared to the olympics but don't be alarmed and started posting threads saying "taufik is no longer a force". He is like hoyer larsen who wins the big events and sacrifices the smaller events with his mind set on what really matters ( the majors - olympics, worlds, asian games & A.E.C ) all greats are like this. Many past 100m olympic sprint champions lost in warm up events only to come good on the big stage, even easing up in the heats to save their A game for the final ( the one that counts!!) Roger federer lost to andy murray only to thrash all of the opposition in the US open. Taufik is like this, he beat lin dan in the worlds ( or should I say trounced him ) again in the asian games. He could lose to lin dan, or any other chinese 5000 times but if he becomes double olympic champion that goes down in history forever. Hoyer larsen won 2 A.E.C championships & olympic gold. Peter gade has won many more events but hoyer is the true champion. ITS QUALITY NOT QUANTITY!!! Taufik is the same in the big events. Thats when the level of who is the best should be judged. When it matters! in those pressure situations and on the big stage. By the way, in those pressure situations lin, bao, chong wei and the rest of them don't produce the goods. And don't reply with lin dan as won this and that, ask him, I bet he would give up all his titles for 1 olympic gold.

[Dan's Shot]

I think it is not fair to define a true champion just based on the tournaments which have been won by Taufik. If you know the history of badminton, winning ALL ENGLAND is the greatest honour for badminton (just like winning Winbledon for Tennis, World cup for soccer) not the Olympic, ASIA or world championship.To name a few, Rudy Hartono, Morten Frost, Yang Yang, Zao Jian Hua. They all have won All England at least once if I am not mistaken. If we were to define a true champion based on the history of badminton, Taufik is not yet a true Champion because he has never won the ALL ENGLAND and I bet you he will never win it because time is running out for him.
As for the Olympic Gold, after watching the Singapore open and Indonesia open results recently, I begin to believe that all the top 8 in the world will have the chance to win it. Both Lin Dan and Taufik are not unbeatable anymore. The other players have caught up and the new scoring system has improve everyone's chance to win in any tournament.

[cooler]

Taufik is starting to up his form. He will have drops in form as his attention will be geared to the olympics but don't be alarmed and started posting threads saying "taufik is no longer a force". He is like hoyer larsen who wins the big events and sacrifices the smaller events with his mind set on what really matters ( the majors - olympics, worlds, asian games & A.E.C ) all greats are like this. Many past 100m olympic sprint champions lost in warm up events only to come good on the big stage, even easing up in the heats to save their A game for the final ( the one that counts!!) Roger federer lost to andy murray only to thrash all of the opposition in the US open. Taufik is like this, he beat lin dan in the worlds ( or should I say trounced him ) again in the asian games. He could lose to lin dan, or any other chinese 5000 times but if he becomes double olympic champion that goes down in history forever. Hoyer larsen won 2 A.E.C championships & olympic gold. Peter gade has won many more events but hoyer is the true champion. ITS QUALITY NOT QUANTITY!!! Taufik is the same in the big events. Thats when the level of who is the best should be judged. When it matters! in those pressure situations and on the big stage. By the way, in those pressure situations lin, bao, chong wei and the rest of them don't produce the goods. And don't reply with lin dan as won this and that, ask him, I bet he would give up all his titles for 1 olympic gold.

i think you're just another TH fan trying to find a plausible excuse for his lost in 2007 IO. Hey, even Indra was quiet after taufik lost in 07 IO. hehe

Base on your loosey goosey analogy, if i won the super lotto (powerball in the US) and Negreanu, prolly the best poker player in the world, am i a better gambler and number picker than Negreanu?? The olympic game is big only because it is a highly promoted game and the dollar involve, it is still tough badminton whether it's OG, AE, WC, sudiman cup, thomas cup, etc...Actually the Opens are harder to win because in the OG, china can only send 3 in each catergory where as in Opens, china, MAL, denmark, KOR can send unlimited players for qualifying.
Also, TH had a good draw in 04 athen, the only tough player he saw was PG.
So TH beats a handicap korean in the final, whooppee:rolleyes: I find shon as a runner up accomplished more with just 1 eye than TH with 2 eyes.

Not done yet.
I say ur view that TH didnt take this IO seriously is grossly incorrect. He was well rested and prepared. TH fans already say that TH only play best when he has an objective. Well, breaking ardy's old record is a milestone for an INA player and is a valid objective for TH to play seriously. Why? if TH won this IO but failed in 08 OG, TH still has the bragging rights of achieving an record of winning 7 IO titles. By losing 07 IO, TH lost this chance since he is older and slower next year. TH missed 2 BIG opportunities in 2006, (1) to win AE and (2) breaking ardy record. Come 2008, i highly doubt taufik can win the AE, 7th IO title or his 2nd olympic. Therefore, TH would have no special record for badminton history. Only tony G has titles in AE, OG and WC. The possible reason why TH make errors in the end was likely because of the home crowd. TH is expected to win. TH did not relax nor fold the 3rd set like in japan open. I believe TH took the match with BCL seriously.

I havent counted yet but LD could claim the record of having the most titles won. If LD win 08 OG, he got a royal flush too:p

[cooler]

And don't reply with lin dan as won this and that, ask him, I bet he would give up all his titles for 1 olympic gold.
LD dont have to give up his medals to trade for a Olympic gold, LD can win it in 2008:p

Personally i rather owns all of LD current titles and no olympic title because if i trade them all for that 1 olympic gold, it only showed that i was lucky, not the dominating best in the class.

zhao jinhua, hartono, and other greats never attained olympic gold medals, are they lower than taufik?

[ye333]

I agree with your opinion that TH is serious about this IO. I think he has beaten BCL too many times last year and he began to underestimate BCL. The result is suddenly BCL is leading 17:10 in the 1st game. This just totally ruined TH's game plan.

But to say TH just had an easy draw in the Olympics is not fair. Who hadn't? Were LD, BCL, CH eliminated by tougher opponents than SSM and Boonsak? Don't think so. Also SSM is doing very well in big events during 03-04. Remember he reached semifinal in 03 WC? Finally, did you forget WCH? Or you think WCH in 04 is weaker than Susilo, Park, Boonsak and SSM?

Olympics is one place where the underdogs suddenly gear up and play at a higher level. Yes, SSM is not a top player, but TH beated him with little effort -- whereas CH fighted for 3 sets and finally lost...


i think you're just another TH fan trying to find a plausible excuse for his lost in 2007 IO. Hey, even Indra was quiet after taufik lost in 07 IO. hehe

Base on your loosey goosey analogy, if i won the super lotto (powerball in the US) and Negreanu, prolly the best poker player in the world, am i a better gambler and number picker than Negreanu?? The olympic game is big only because it is a highly promoted game and the dollar involve, it is still tough badminton whether it's OG, AE, WC, sudiman cup, thomas cup, etc...Actually the Opens are harder to win because in the OG, china can only send 3 in each catergory where as in Opens, china, MAL, denmark, KOR can send unlimited players for qualifying.
Also, TH had a good draw in 04 athen, the only tough player he saw was PG.
So TH beats a handicap korean in the final, whooppee:rolleyes: I find shon as a runner up accomplished more with just 1 eye than TH with 2 eyes.

Not done yet.
I say ur view that TH didnt take this IO seriously is grossly incorrect. He was well rested and prepared. TH fans already say that TH only play best when he has an objective. Well, breaking ardy's old record is a milestone for an INA player and is a valid objective for TH to play seriously. Why? if TH won this IO but failed in 08 OG, TH still has the bragging rights of achieving an record of winning 7 IO titles. By losing 07 IO, TH lost this chance since he is older and slower next year. TH missed 2 BIG opportunities in 2006, (1) to win AE and (2) breaking ardy record. Come 2008, i highly doubt taufik can win the AE, 7th IO title or his 2nd olympic. Therefore, TH would have no special record for badminton history. Only tony G has titles in AE, OG and WC. The possible reason why TH make errors in the end was likely because of the home crowd. TH is expected to win. TH did not relax nor fold the 3rd set like in japan open. I believe TH took the match with BCL seriously.

I havent counted yet but LD could claim the record of having the most titles won. If LD win 08 OG, he got a royal flush too:p

[cooler]

I agree with your opinion that TH is serious about this IO. I think he has beaten BCL too many times last year and he began to underestimate BCL. The result is suddenly BCL is leading 17:10 in the 1st game. This just totally ruined TH's game plan.

But to say TH just had an easy draw in the Olympics is not fair. Who hadn't? Were LD, BCL, CH eliminated by tougher opponents than SSM and Boonsak? Don't think so. Also SSM is doing very well in big events during 03-04. Remember he reached semifinal in 03 WC? Finally, did you forget WCH? Or you think WCH in 04 is weaker than Susilo, Park, Boonsak and SSM?

Olympics is one place where the underdogs suddenly gear up and play at a higher level. Yes, SSM is not a top player, but TH beated him with little effort -- whereas CH fighted for 3 sets and finally lost...
that's what meant by good draw, having opponent that u can beat although those opponents are great against other players. China lost in 04 OG because they only did homework on their key opponents like gade, taufik. When chinese players is behind the score against susilo & SSM, they panicked and crumbled.

[phaarix]

Personally I decided that Taufik was great just by watching him. Before I actually started following the international badminton scene I watched all the badminton videos on google video and youtube and out of all the players, Taufik's relaxed style really impressed me. I got my friend to watch the All England match I think in 2004 where TH lost to PG (hope I'm not getting this wrong lol :p), and my friend who doesn't even play badminton had eyes only for Taufik despite the fact he lost in the end. Taufik is just a naturally brilliant badminton player and there's no question about that.

I think Taufik is great, but I think Lin Dan is great in a different respect. Lin Dan is consistent whereas Taufik is not. Lin Dan has what it takes to dominate and keep on dominating. That's where he's great. Whereas Taufik is completely unpredictable. When he is on top of his game though he really shines. He doesn't eclipse Lin Dan like he once did, but I think at his best he just seems to have that little bit extra. And I think that little bit extra is his unpredictability. Lin Dan doesn't vary his game as much. That's part of what makes him so consistent though. You can't be great at everything. They're both great in their own ways.

In my opinion anyone saying the only way to be great is to be consistent is not being very open minded.

IO2007: I think Taufik did underestimate Bao, but Bao definitely deserved the win this time. Taufik should have been more prepared in the second set after seeing Bao's surprising form in the first.

[Dan's Shot]

Lee Choong Wei made Malaysian proud in Indonesia. He is superb. Speed, power and in command. That's the way you should be playing to be a true champion.

[s1nn3r]

If you know the history of badminton, winning ALL ENGLAND is the greatest honour for badminton (just like winning Winbledon for Tennis, World cup for soccer) not the Olympic, ASIA or world championship.To name a few, Rudy Hartono, Morten Frost, Yang Yang, Zao Jian Hua.

I guess it was before the Olympic came along. Now the Olympic Gold medal is the ONE! but All England is still a special tournaments because of its history and tradision. If not mistaken AE is the oldest badminton international tournament in the world, just like FA cup in English premeir leauge but it's not the priority now...

[alfa-2]

TH lost because he wasnt in his usual form and BCL played extremely well. Period.

BCL lost in the final because BCL wasnt in his usual form n LCW played extremely well.

I think both matches' result were almost similar. Everyone predicted the latter would lose but it went the other way round. Suprise !!!

[JaCk™]

surprise makes badminton alive and interesting. that's how underdogs can win in Super Series. boonsak and LCW really surprised us..

[pjswift]

I think it is not fair to define a true champion just based on the tournaments which have been won by Taufik. If you know the history of badminton, winning ALL ENGLAND is the greatest honour for badminton (just like winning Winbledon for Tennis, World cup for soccer) not the Olympic, ASIA or world championship.To name a few, Rudy Hartono, Morten Frost, Yang Yang, Zao Jian Hua. They all have won All England at least once if I am not mistaken. If we were to define a true champion based on the history of badminton, Taufik is not yet a true Champion because he has never won the ALL ENGLAND and I bet you he will never win it because time is running out for him.
As for the Olympic Gold, after watching the Singapore open and Indonesia open results recently, I begin to believe that all the top 8 in the world will have the chance to win it. Both Lin Dan and Taufik are not unbeatable anymore. The other players have caught up and the new scoring system has improve everyone's chance to win in any tournament.
So Hafiz is a true champion? Same with India's Gopichand?

[emanto]

Taufik lost because he is tired of winning Indonesia Open.He is afraid people may call him "kampung champion".

[JaCk™]

Taufik lost because he is tired of winning Indonesia Open.He is afraid people may call him "kampung champion".

haha. Taufik seemed to lost his stamina and can't last long on court. he is waiting eagerly for the arrival of his baby.

[pjswift]

TH lost because he wasnt in his usual form and BCL played extremely well. Period.

BCL lost in the final because BCL wasnt in his usual form n LCW played extremely well.

I think both matches' result were almost similar. Everyone predicted the latter would lose but it went the other way round. Suprise !!!

Part of a winning strategy has to be to deactivate your opponent's usual best game and to surprise him by playing quite differently from what he expected.

[Simp84]

what the hell, please stop this sort of thread
Taufik admits his defeat and felt disappointed, please dont simply put words into his mouth or his action (ie he dont care if he lose), really made him sound lame.
I downloaded the match provided by Aero, and you can see that he just wasn't playing his best and Bao was much better that day.
Full stop.

[s1nn3r]

Taufik lost because he is tired of winning Indonesia Open.He is afraid people may call him "kampung champion".

That's the best excuses I heard in my whole life... GOOOOOOD!
:crying:

[bananaboy]

Lee Choong Wei made Malaysian proud in Indonesia. He is superb. Speed, power and in command. That's the way you should be playing to be a true champion.
Do you mind explaining how your post relates to the thread title???:confused:

Winning 1 IO title makes someone a true champion??? TH won 6 already by the way.


Get back to this thread...
Taufik lost to Bao simply because Bao was very damn good that day. Did Taufik try his best against Bao in that game... H*ll Yeah, he did... or else how are you going to explain the catch up he was doing at the end of each game. If he wasn't trying at all, he could have given up the games like he did in Japan Open 06 against Lin Dan.

Taufik is at the stage where he may not be fully prepared for every tournament, but that can not always be used as an excuse for losing. There are plenty of players older than him, and they definitely can use the same excuse to cover their loss, but so far we have never heard of any Kenneth, Gade, or even Chen Hong's fans using those excuses whatsoever.

[s1nn3r]

The standard between top player are not far differents, is all down to form on that day, mental readiness and luck... so I guess is not TH dayss..

TH is not superman,,, even superman got his weaknesses!

[bic33]

I think it is not fair to define a true champion just based on the tournaments which have been won by Taufik. If you know the history of badminton, winning ALL ENGLAND is the greatest honour for badminton (just like winning Winbledon for Tennis, World cup for soccer) not the Olympic, ASIA or world championship.To name a few, Rudy Hartono, Morten Frost, Yang Yang, Zao Jian Hua. They all have won All England at least once if I am not mistaken. If we were to define a true champion based on the history of badminton, Taufik is not yet a true Champion because he has never won the ALL ENGLAND and I bet you he will never win it because time is running out for him.
As for the Olympic Gold, after watching the Singapore open and Indonesia open results recently, I begin to believe that all the top 8 in the world will have the chance to win it. Both Lin Dan and Taufik are not unbeatable anymore. The other players have caught up and the new scoring system has improve everyone's chance to win in any tournament.

are you still watching 60's badminton? lol AE now isn't as prestigious as it used to be... ask every pro badminton player, what is more important to them, win an AE or win an OG... you'll have your answer... :D

[bic33]

Do you mind explaining how your post relates to the thread title???:confused:

Winning 1 IO title makes someone a true champion??? TH won 6 already by the way.


Get back to this thread...
Taufik lost to Bao simply because Bao was very damn good that day. Did Taufik try his best against Bao in that game... H*ll Yeah, he did... or else how are you going to explain the catch up he was doing at the end of each game. If he wasn't trying at all, he could have given up the games like he did in Japan Open 06 against Lin Dan.

Taufik is at the stage where he may not be fully prepared for every tournament, but that can not always be used as an excuse for losing. There are plenty of players older than him, and they definitely can use the same excuse to cover their loss, but so far we have never heard of any Kenneth, Gade, or even Chen Hong's fans using those excuses whatsoever.
banana, you're just right... BAO played a heck of a game against taufik... he's possesed.. i mean, he didn't commit many errors like he did fighting chong wei.. in the second set in IO, BCL self-destructs... he clears and drops and wide or even short.. even BCL is very frustrated with his performance.. so fighting PG and TH in consecutive games finally took its toll..:p

[pjswift]

The standard between top player are not far differents, is all down to form on that day, mental readiness and luck... so I guess is not TH dayss..

TH is not superman,,, even superman got his weaknesses!

Among the top players, TH has the smallest tank. As long as he does not make the effort to increase the size, he's not going to win any more titles because he won't last the distance. But he'll always be great to watch...on second thought, maybe the year end Masters ,ie if he makes the top10!

[bic33]

speaking of making the top ten.. 5 chinese are in the top 7.. omg.. it's just like team practice if the year end masters happens now.. :D lol

[pjswift]

Do you mind explaining how your post relates to the thread title???:confused:

Winning 1 IO title makes someone a true champion??? TH won 6 already by the way.


Get back to this thread...
Taufik lost to Bao simply because Bao was very damn good that day. Did Taufik try his best against Bao in that game... H*ll Yeah, he did... or else how are you going to explain the catch up he was doing at the end of each game. If he wasn't trying at all, he could have given up the games like he did in Japan Open 06 against Lin Dan.

Taufik is at the stage where he may not be fully prepared for every tournament, but that can not always be used as an excuse for losing. There are plenty of players older than him, and they definitely can use the same excuse to cover their loss, but so far we have never heard of any Kenneth, Gade, or even Chen Hong's fans using those excuses whatsoever.
It's called 'hitching a ride' getting onto the hottest thread for max.exposure.But read carefully. Dan's saying'to be a true champion'. That means 'not yet a true champion'. He did not say '..is a true champion'. Check with your English prof. Let me know if I'm wrong.

[pjswift]

speaking of making the top ten.. 5 chinese are in the top 7.. omg.. it's just like team practice if the year end masters happens now.. :D lol
I believe there is a max of two per country but I may be wrong, so no chance of team practice.

[hcyong]

Olympics, WC, All-England or any other tournament alone does not make a great player. Good examples: All-England - Hafiz, Gopichand (as someone stated before), Olympics - Ji Xinpeng. 20 years down the road, people will remember Lin Dan (even if the Olympic gold eludes him) more than Ji Xinpeng.

To me, greatness may not even be defined by what or how many titles you won. It's the great battles or great displays that people remember. For me, Yang Yang and Morten Frost held the helm of greatness during the few years in the 80s, and the two great players of this era are Taufik and Lin Dan.

[alfa-2]

So Hafiz is a true champion? Same with India's Gopichand? hahaha.......:D:D:D:D:D:D

[alfa-2]

Olympics, WC, All-England or any other tournament alone does not make a great player. Good examples: All-England - Hafiz, Gopichand (as someone stated before), Olympics - Ji Xinpeng. 20 years down the road, people will remember Lin Dan (even if the Olympic gold eludes him) more than Ji Xinpeng.

To me, greatness may not even be defined by what or how many titles you won. It's the great battles or great displays that people remember. For me, Yang Yang and Morten Frost held the helm of greatness during the few years in the 80s, and the two great players of this era are Taufik and Lin Dan.

dont forget ZhaoJianHua too........

[OneToughBirdie]

dont forget ZhaoJianHua too........
The way ZJH demolish Joko in AE final, in my opinion, is the greatest one game I have ever witnessed...that was the first time I watched ZJH, the game left me with awe, bearing in mind Joko was a world and AE champion himself...and today, people still consider ZJH one of the best of all time...to me, ZJH is the best ever played the game.;)

[bananaboy]

It's called 'hitching a ride' getting onto the hottest thread for max.exposure.But read carefully. Dan's saying'to be a true champion'. That means 'not yet a true champion'. He did not say '..is a true champion'. Check with your English prof. Let me know if I'm wrong.
The title of this thread is "Taufik picking up his form as Olympic qualification starts", and Dan's post was about LCW... How is that supposed to be relevant to the topic???

I may have added another irrelevant statement at the end though, but his post was totally in the wrong thread. To praise LCW, go to X Ball's LCW thread.

[ye333]

That's what I call "unfair". Is Susilo indeed good at beating LD? Is Park indeed good at beating Bao? I don't think so. If they are they should, say, win at least 2 times every 3 times they met LD/BCL or something. (SSM does seem good at beating CH in 03/04 I think. :-) ) I think the truth is that these underdogs played so well in the Olympics that Lin/Bao/Chen got surprised and just crumbled under pressure. On the other hand, TH was calm when he lost the first game to WCH, when he was facing Gade who in fact was in very good form, and when he was trailing 1:7 in the Gold medal's match.

If Team China really only did research on big guys like TH and PG, that shows nothing but stupidity. And do you think WCH didn't do research on TH? Do you think PG didn't do research on TH? What makes you think LD/BCL/CH will do much better than WCH/PG if they are facing TH? In 04 PG was still powerful and fast, he was still at the same level as LD -- although less consistent but definitely much more experienced -- and experience plays big role in big tournaments like OG.

Finally, if we look at TH's opponents in Olympics, he met one "top 3" player: PG, one 1st level player: WCH, and two 2nd rate players: SSM, Boonsak. I think if you do the draw many times, this should be the average distribution of opponents' levels. So I would say TH had a normal draw, not an easy one, not a difficulty one.



that's what meant by good draw, having opponent that u can beat although those opponents are great against other players. China lost in 04 OG because they only did homework on their key opponents like gade, taufik. When chinese players is behind the score against susilo & SSM, they panicked and crumbled.

[malbar]

Olympics, WC, All-England or any other tournament alone does not make a great player. Good examples: All-England - Hafiz, Gopichand (as someone stated before), Olympics - Ji Xinpeng. 20 years down the road, people will remember Lin Dan (even if the Olympic gold eludes him) more than Ji Xinpeng.

To me, greatness may not even be defined by what or how many titles you won. It's the great battles or great displays that people remember. For me, Yang Yang and Morten Frost held the helm of greatness during the few years in the 80s, and the two great players of this era are Taufik and Lin Dan.Lin Dan is a great player and will go down in history but what i am getting at is that he always loses to Taufik in the big events or falls before the final. He did this in the olympics and beat him twice in the asian games team event then when it really mattered he lost in the individual and to me thats the sign of a champion on taufiks part. When he wants to produce it. He does!!

[hcyong]

Lin Dan is a great player and will go down in history but what i am getting at is that he always loses to Taufik in the big events or falls before the final. He did this in the olympics and beat him twice in the asian games team event then when it really mattered he lost in the individual and to me thats the sign of a champion on taufiks part. When he wants to produce it. He does!!

I am not disputing you. My point was that we cannot say Taufik is a great player simply because he won Olympics, and that Lin is not a great player simply because he hasn't. Winning tournaments is important but not the sole fact that makes a player great.

[pjswift]

that's what meant by good draw, having opponent that u can beat although those opponents are great against other players. China lost in 04 OG because they only did homework on their key opponents like gade, taufik. When chinese players is behind the score against susilo & SSM, they panicked and crumbled.
Shows that CHN MS are mentally prepared against players they have done homework on but mentally vulnerable when non-opponents surprise them?
A title is a title regardless of the draw. If you start to question that ,then a lot of LD's titles are questionable. Any coincidence that the two SS titles LD bagged resulted from him playing other CHN MS in the semi and MSF? I doubt he can win a SS title if he were to play non-CHN MS for all the 5 matches.(May not even get past semi but we'll see.)

[azabaz_ipoh]

all this "who is the best in the world" arguments are kinda moot in my opinion. some say taufik is the best. some say lin dan is the best. i say all top players are good players. when they work hard and prepare themselves properly, they win tournaments. when they are injured or demoralized, they lose. my way of seeing it, when i am old and these players are no longer playing, who will i remember. i remember yang yang. i remember razif and jailani. i remember rexy and ricky. i remember ong ewe hock and foo kok keong. i remember ardi wiranata. i remember cheah soon kit and soo beng kiang. i remember joko suprianto. i remember hoyer larsson. i remember moerten frost hansen. i will always remember these players and the best i have seen. and i believe in the future, i will remember taufik. and i will remember lin dan. i will remember LCW. i will remember peter gade. i think i will remember a lot of them. and those players will always be great players to me. because i have enjoyed the matches they play. it does not matter to me if it is all england or olympic or whatever.

[s1nn3r]

all this "who is the best in the world" arguments are kinda moot in my opinion. some say taufik is the best. some say lin dan is the best. i say all top players are good players. when they work hard and prepare themselves properly, they win tournaments. when they are injured or demoralized, they lose. my way of seeing it, when i am old and these players are no longer playing, who will i remember. i remember yang yang. i remember razif and jailani. i remember rexy and ricky. i remember ong ewe hock and foo kok keong. i remember ardi wiranata. i remember cheah soon kit and soo beng kiang. i remember joko suprianto. i remember hoyer larsson. i remember moerten frost hansen. i will always remember these players and the best i have seen. and i believe in the future, i will remember taufik. and i will remember lin dan. i will remember LCW. i will remember peter gade. i think i will remember a lot of them. and those players will always be great players to me. because i have enjoyed the matches they play. it does not matter to me if it is all england or olympic or whatever.

I totally agreed with this statement...
They are all here to entertain us... so give credits to all them
but above all I really appreciate what Peter Gade & company has done...
bcoz they stop the total domination of asian and this will help expand badminton to the west!

[indra]

I am very "sad" with the results of the IO 07.

Taufik lost....but it is not because TH did not play well...it was Bao who played extremelly well...Taufik looked very exhausted...That's OK....

[tjl_vanguard]

hey indra.. but at least TH's friend, LCW helped TH to balas dendam tu.. :D

[Joyous]

Hi Indra, I emphatize with the feeling of your hero having fallen on homeground. You said it - TH played well & Bao extremely well. For that, you have to give TH credit. Once in a while our idol player will lose becoz they are just as human as us. Take heart.
Altho' I admire Gao Ling a lot, I wasn't rooting for her & ZB at the IO 07. In a way, I was hoping Nova would win to give Indo fans something to cheer about. But GL/ZB prevailed & they deserved to win.

[taufik-ist]

Hi Indra, I emphatize with the feeling of your hero having fallen on homeground. You said it - TH played well & Bao extremely well. For that, you have to give TH credit. Once in a while our idol player will lose becoz they are just as human as us. Take heart.
Altho' I admire Gao Ling a lot, I wasn't rooting for her & ZB at the IO 07. In a way, I was hoping Nova would win to give Indo fans something to cheer about. But GL/ZB prevailed & they deserved to win.

taufik must strenghten his stamina, in IO 2007 it proved his bad stamina couldn't support his skill anymore (his net play and smash didn't work well).

unbeliveable, 60 % of zb/gl points came from nova's unforce error (kompas newspaper) :rolleyes: , nova said he could not play as he used to be becos he couldn't handle 'must-win' burden.. PBSI should reconsider to split nova/butet :cool:

[taufik-ist]

hey indra.. but at least TH's friend, LCW helped TH to balas dendam tu.. :D

ya... i'm glad LCW had beaten up BCL :D

[cooler]

Shows that CHN MS are mentally prepared against players they have done homework on but mentally vulnerable when non-opponents surprise them?
A title is a title regardless of the draw. If you start to question that ,then a lot of LD's titles are questionable. Any coincidence that the two SS titles LD bagged resulted from him playing other CHN MS in the semi and MSF? I doubt he can win a SS title if he were to play non-CHN MS for all the 5 matches.(May not even get past semi but we'll see.)

(1) if a title is a title, why do taufik fans keep bragging about taufik's olympic achievement as proof of supremacy over LD? LD career isnt over where as TH is looking shakey as time goes.

(2) lol, LD love to play another non chinese in the finals, if they make it that far lol
LD bagged 2 SS titles so far, how many TH bagged? lol Matter of fact how many PG bagged, or WCH? or hafiz? or roslin? or susilo? or santoso? or kendrick? or dicky? etc When lcw and boonsak bag 2 titles, then we can talk some more.

[tjl_vanguard]

from wad i saw is that TH din reli played the usual game he used to.. i wonder whY?? he could have won actually.. but instead, he played rallies and drop shots.. but luck wasnt on his side cuz most of his smashes and drops all went "OUT!" sad... :(

[tjl_vanguard]

ya... i'm glad LCW had beaten up BCL :D
ME TOO!!! hihihih :D :D :D :D :D extremely extremely happy!!!!

[taufik-ist]

(1) if a title is a title, why do taufik fans keep bragging about taufik's olympic achievement as proof of supremacy over LD? LD career isnt over where as TH is looking shakey as time goes.

(2) lol, LD love to play another non chinese in the finals, if they make it that far lol
LD bagged 2 SS titles so far, how many TH bagged? lol Matter of fact how many PG bagged, or WCH? or hafiz? or roslin? or susilo? or santoso? or kendrick? or dicky? etc When lcw and boonsak bag 2 titles, then we can talk some more.

olympic is the biggest achievement for a athelete :D ...

people always remember the olympic champion, you want a proove ? ( you must asnwer instanly ;)
who is the MS champion of korea open 2004 ?
who is the MS champion of olympic 2004 ?

[taufik-ist]

(1) if a title is a title, why do taufik fans keep bragging about taufik's olympic achievement as proof of supremacy over LD? LD career isnt over where as TH is looking shakey as time goes.

(2) lol, LD love to play another non chinese in the finals, if they make it that far lol
LD bagged 2 SS titles so far, how many TH bagged? lol Matter of fact how many PG bagged, or WCH? or hafiz? or roslin? or susilo? or santoso? or kendrick? or dicky? etc When lcw and boonsak bag 2 titles, then we can talk some more.

olympic is the biggest achievement for a athelete :D ...

people always remember the olympic champion easily, you want a proove ? ( you must asnwer instanly ;)
who is the MS champion of korea open 2004 ?
who is the MS champion of olympic 2004 ?

:D :D :p

[taufik-ist]

(1) if a title is a title, why do taufik fans keep bragging about taufik's olympic achievement as proof of supremacy over LD? LD career isnt over where as TH is looking shakey as time goes.

(2) lol, LD love to play another non chinese in the finals, if they make it that far lol
LD bagged 2 SS titles so far, how many TH bagged? lol Matter of fact how many PG bagged, or WCH? or hafiz? or roslin? or susilo? or santoso? or kendrick? or dicky? etc When lcw and boonsak bag 2 titles, then we can talk some more.

olympic champion is the biggest achievement for a athelete :D ...

people always remember the olympic champion easily, you want a proove ? ( you must asnwer instanly ;)
who is the MS champion of korea open 2004 ?
who is the MS champion of olympic 2004 ?

:D :D :p

[cooler]

Do you mind explaining how your post relates to the thread title???:confused:

Winning 1 IO title makes someone a true champion??? TH won 6 already by the way.


Get back to this thread...
Taufik lost to Bao simply because Bao was very damn good that day. Did Taufik try his best against Bao in that game... H*ll Yeah, he did... or else how are you going to explain the catch up he was doing at the end of each game. If he wasn't trying at all, he could have given up the games like he did in Japan Open 06 against Lin Dan.

Taufik is at the stage where he may not be fully prepared for every tournament, but that can not always be used as an excuse for losing. There are plenty of players older than him, and they definitely can use the same excuse to cover their loss, but so far we have never heard of any Kenneth, Gade, or even Chen Hong's fans using those excuses whatsoever.
taufik fans will find excuses for taufik losses, we heard them all; age, lack of prepareness, lack of stamina, no crowd support, too much crowd support, he doesnt care, he's fighting pbsi, etc etc But when taufik win, the reasons will be he is focused, he played with passion and determination, he has an objective to win, etc etc

[cooler]

banana, you're just right... BAO played a heck of a game against taufik... he's possesed.. i mean, he didn't commit many errors like he did fighting chong wei.. in the second set in IO, BCL self-destructs... he clears and drops and wide or even short.. even BCL is very frustrated with his performance.. so fighting PG and TH in consecutive games finally took its toll..:pas mentioned by others than myself, LCW had the best draw in 07 IO

[2cents]

if a title is a title, why do taufik fans keep bragging about taufik's olympic achievement as proof of supremacy over LD? LD career isnt over where as TH is looking shakey as time goes. ...

I guess they tried so hard to prove that Taufik's so good as Ji Xinpeng who beat Taufik and won Olympics.

But reality check, Ji Xinpeng won Olympics in his debut. While Taufik had used up all his chances.

Lin Dan is levels above Ji Xinpeng. Even though Olympics is a poor measure of players ability, I believe Lin Dan is still the most favourite to win it.

[cooler]

Among the top players, TH has the smallest tank. As long as he does not make the effort to increase the size, he's not going to win any more titles because he won't last the distance. But he'll always be great to watch...on second thought, maybe the year end Masters ,ie if he makes the top10!i think lcw is a smaller package than taufik:p

[taufik-ist]

taufik fans will find excuses for taufik losses, we heard them all; age, lack of prepareness, lack of stamina, no crowd support, too much crowd support, he doesnt care, he's fighting pbsi, etc etc But when taufik win, the reasons will be he is focused, he played with passion and determination, he has an objective to win, etc etc

it's true tH is lack of stamina :D , it's not excuses :p

[cooler]

Among the top players, TH has the smallest tank. As long as he does not make the effort to increase the size, he's not going to win any more titles because he won't last the distance. But he'll always be great to watch...on second thought, maybe the year end Masters ,ie if he makes the top10!i think lcw, sato and simon santoso are smaller packages than taufik:p

[cooler]

Olympics, WC, All-England or any other tournament alone does not make a great player. Good examples: All-England - Hafiz, Gopichand (as someone stated before), Olympics - Ji Xinpeng. 20 years down the road, people will remember Lin Dan (even if the Olympic gold eludes him) more than Ji Xinpeng.

To me, greatness may not even be defined by what or how many titles you won. It's the great battles or great displays that people remember. For me, Yang Yang and Morten Frost held the helm of greatness during the few years in the 80s, and the two great players of this era are Taufik and Lin Dan.

yup.
also Alan Budi Kusuma, he won gold but he isnt special. Zhao jinhua beated him before convincingly.

[Felicia_txh]

I am very "sad" with the results of the IO 07.

Taufik lost....but it is not because TH did not play well...it was Bao who played extremelly well...Taufik looked very exhausted...That's OK....
Ya..when TH play wif BCL,i cant c confidence on his face!!TH on tat day is different fr TH b4!!luckily,LCW had defeated BCL!!:p

[cooler]

Lin Dan is a great player and will go down in history but what i am getting at is that he always loses to Taufik in the big events or falls before the final. He did this in the olympics and beat him twice in the asian games team event then when it really mattered he lost in the individual and to me thats the sign of a champion on taufiks part. When he wants to produce it. He does!!
oh, tell me next time when taufik want to win so i can place bet on it LOL
If he didnt want to win, why does he show up in other tournaments?

from my memory, i thot LD beat TH is the doha team event, while LD lost to TH in the individual event.

[cooler]

I am very "sad" with the results of the IO 07.

Taufik lost....but it is not because TH did not play well...it was Bao who played extremelly well...Taufik looked very exhausted...That's OK....
IE, there are better players out there than TH:confused: :eek:

[cooler]

ya... i'm glad LCW had beaten up BCL :D
me too, so to reaffirm bcl status as Mr runner-up :p

[Felicia_txh]

ME TOO!!! hihihih :D :D :D :D :D extremely extremely happy!!!!
haha..he had bounced back!!He had succeeded wat he had promised b4!!:D
But i think he is stil not great yet!!Mayb I m greedy..:D :D I hope to c 'superb' LCW in future!!

[cooler]

ya... i'm glad LCW had beaten up BCL :D
me too, so to reaffirm bcl status as Mr runner-up :p

dunno why bcl morphed back to his old girly play style.
One cant say BCL is tired since he lost to lcw easy on the 1st set as well.

[cooler]

Ya..when TH play wif BCL,i cant c confidence on his face!!TH on tat day is different fr TH b4!!luckily,LCW had defeated BCL!!:p
i hope bcl find his cellphone:p

[eskey]

i think you're just another TH fan trying to find a plausible excuse for his lost in 2007 IO. Hey, even Indra was quiet after taufik lost in 07 IO. hehe

Also, TH had a good draw in 04 athen, the only tough player he saw was PG.
So TH beats a handicap korean in the final, whooppee:rolleyes: I find shon as a runner up accomplished more with just 1 eye than TH with 2 eyes.



I think you're just another LD fan trying to find excuse for his lost in OG04 or rather you're just another TH hater that doesn't want to give credit to TH winning the OG04 by saying he had good draw while LD didn't.

did you know that LD was in the same half as TH in OG04 draw? so if let's say LD went to final at that time, beat SSM and win OG04, would you say same thing? I don't think so. That proves me, you are being unfair to TH and also being rude to SSM by saying 'a handicap Korean'.

Talking about the draw, LD had better draw than TH in OG04. LD was no 1 seed, while TH was unseeded, so most of the time (if not all), the seeded players will have better draw compare to unseeded, because the unseeded player will have seeded players waiting for them. In the draw (top half), LD had Susilo, Bjoern Joppien, then Boonsak while TH had (i forgot who TH faced in 1st Round) then WCH then PG, before they could meet in the semifinal. So which one you say better? I would say LD's one was better/easier, but what was the result? LD crumbled under pressure and fell to Susilo, so if that was the case, 'blame' LD failure to win OG04 because of TH had good draw?
hahaha really good joke.

or maybe because of TH didn't have to face chinese player? then blame them why they didn't win their matches so that they could meet TH, especially LD because he could meet TH in the semi otherwise.

[cooler]

I think you're just another LD fan trying to find excuse for his lost in OG04 or rather you're just another TH hater that doesn't want to give credit to TH winning the OG04 by saying he had good draw while LD didn't.

did you know that LD was in the same half as TH in OG04 draw? so if let's say LD went to final at that time, beat SSM and win OG04, would you say same thing? I don't think so. That proves me, you are being unfair to TH and also being rude to SSM by saying 'a handicap Korean'.

Talking about the draw, LD had better draw than TH in OG04. LD was no 1 seed, while TH was unseeded, so most of the time (if not all), the seeded players will have better draw compare to unseeded, because the unseeded player will have seeded players waiting for them. In the draw (top half), LD had Susilo, Bjoern Joppien, then Boonsak while TH had (i forgot who TH faced in 1st Round) then WCH then PG, before they could meet in the semifinal. So which one you say better? I would say LD's one was better/easier, but what was the result? LD crumbled under pressure and fell to Susilo, so if that was the case, 'blame' LD failure to win OG04 because of TH had good draw?
hahaha really good joke.

or maybe because of TH didn't have to face chinese player? then blame them why they didn't win their matches so that they could meet TH, especially LD because he could meet TH in the semi otherwise.
i never said LD should of or could of or would of winning the 04 OG. All chinese are weak mentally. It took zhang ning more than 10 years to blossom. What i meant was PG was the only real match TH had to deal with in 04 OG. All other 3 chineses choked. HOWEVER, the OG is easier for no chinese countries like INA since china can't send ALL their arsenals to the games like XZX, and other 2nd stringers like chen yu.

I wasnt rude to SSM. It suppose to be a compliment since he achieve the final with just 1 eye. Face the fact, SSM is handicapped. I only talk facts.

[Joyous]

Sigh...prejudiced is all I can say about some of the badminton fans. I think to some no matter how many more titles LD wins or perhaps even the Olympics 08, they will still ridicule him & say he has no skills, no footwork, etc.
For once can some of us who are prejudiced imagine the current badminton scene without LD or TH. Would it have been that enjoyable? That the tickets for the 1st round of MO 07 being sold out is an indication of how these 2 players have managed to make badminton more interesting on the whole.
Less succcessful players who get an opportunity to beat either TH or LD are overjoyed even tho' they don't proceed to win the title. Actions such as mentioned are confirmation of how good these 2 players are in their own respective ways & that they command crowd attention. I say this in good spirit.

[bic33]

olympic champion is the biggest achievement for a athelete :D ...

people always remember the olympic champion easily, you want a proove ? ( you must asnwer instanly ;)
who is the MS champion of korea open 2004 ?
who is the MS champion of olympic 2004 ?

:D :D :p

very funny... TH will never be forgotten not only because of his OG win.. he will be remembered as the most temperamental of his time and as "bad boy" lol

[bic33]

...................
JUST WAIT FOR THE 2008 OG... your questions will all be answered there... PERIOD! (....)

[eskey]

i never said LD should of or could of or would of winning the 04 OG. All chinese are weak mentally. It took zhang ning more than 10 years to blossom. What i meant was PG was the only real match TH had to deal with in 04 OG. All other 3 chineses choked. HOWEVER, the OG is easier for no chinese countries like INA since china can't send ALL their arsenals to the games like XZX, and other 2nd stringers like chen yu.

I wasnt rude to SSM. It suppose to be a compliment since he achieve the final with just 1 eye. Face the fact, SSM is handicapped. I only talk facts.

Easier is relative word so I don't want to argue about that, but my point is winning OG04 was not easy nor small achievement, so you got to give the credit to TH for that. But I don't see you did that by looking at the way you put your words below
(the emoticon is sarcastic)



Also, TH had a good draw in 04 athen, the only tough player he saw was PG. So TH beats a handicap korean in the final, whooppee:rolleyes: I find shon as a runner up accomplished more with just 1 eye than TH with 2 eyes.


By trying to find excuse why TH didn't deserve winning OG04 will make you no different with some of TH die-hard fans whom you criticized trying to find excuse when TH lost.

[Joyous]

very funny... TH will never be forgotten not only because of his OG win.. he will be remembered as the most temperamental of his time and as "bad boy" lol

Yeah..that's so very trueee. People have a good memory for bad things and a bad memory for good things. That's life.

[phaarix]

Yeah..that's so very trueee. People have a good memory for bad things and a bad memory for good things. That's life.

Yeah I'll say >_>. Taufik sure slips up on occasion but compare him with the "bad boys" of other sports and he suddenly looks like an angel :p.

I haven't seen any signs of Chinese players being mentally weak cooler. Especially Lin Dan (although BCL might be a bit, after all he is Mr Runner Up). That sounds like an excuse to me. How did Lin Dan become World Champion if Chinese players choke in big events? And wasn't Bao his opponent in the finals? And Chen Hong in the semis? How did Lin Dan make the finals in the Asian Games?

[OneToughBirdie]

Joyous: Imagine the current badminton scene without LD or TH. Would it have been that enjoyable? That the tickets for the 1st round of MO 07 being sold out is an indication of how these 2 players have managed to make badminton more interesting on the whole.
Totally agree with you that LD, TH and you can include PG and LCW too are the main draw cards...I flew to Anaheim to watch WC05 and to see LD and TH live is for that one reason only. That is why I always said, badminton needs LD and TH.

[cooler]

Yeah I'll say >_>. Taufik sure slips up on occasion but compare him with the "bad boys" of other sports and he suddenly looks like an angel :p.

I haven't seen any signs of Chinese players being mentally weak cooler. Especially Lin Dan (although BCL might be a bit, after all he is Mr Runner Up). That sounds like an excuse to me. How did Lin Dan become World Champion if Chinese players choke in big events? And wasn't Bao his opponent in the finals? And Chen Hong in the semis? How did Lin Dan make the finals in the Asian Games?
have u seen LD played in 05 WC? have u seen the score?
have u seen LD got embarrassed by losing to susilo in first round at 04 OG?

[phaarix]

have u seen LD played in 05 WC? have u seen the score?
have u seen LD got embarrassed by losing to susilo in first round at 04 OG?

Lin Dan is a lot better than he was back then :).

[cooler]

Joyous: Imagine the current badminton scene without LD or TH. Would it have been that enjoyable? That the tickets for the 1st round of MO 07 being sold out is an indication of how these 2 players have managed to make badminton more interesting on the whole.
Totally agree with you that LD, TH and you can include PG and LCW too are the main draw cards...I flew to Anaheim to watch WC05 and to see LD and TH live is for that one reason only. That is why I always said, badminton needs LD and TH.
yep, these 2 are from 2 opposite spectrum, one is a rooster and another is a pig. One like to be 'cocky' :D while the other one can be 'boaring' at times.:p

[OneToughBirdie]

i hope bcl find his cellphone:p
Sorry, already auction off to some female fan possessed!!!LOL!:D

[bhtan]

Relax, guys.

LD or TH arn't going to give you anything they won. I like to see them play full three ... until they die .

MS is very competitive, regular semi-finalist all have chance to win OG08.

[ctjcad]

...the debates, arguments, EXCUSES shall continue in the next tourney.....or even til end of next yr's Olympics....:p
Hmm, perhaps we should make this thread a sticky and see what type of posts will be here next yr(after Olympics)..:p :D ;)

[Joyous]

yep, these 2 are from 2 opposite spectrum, one is a rooster and another is a pig. One like to be 'cocky' :D while the other one can be 'boaring' at times.:p

That's a good one ...ha...ha...ha.. you sure know how to 'play' with words.


{quote bhtan} LD or TH arn't going to give you anything they won. I like to see them play full three ... until they die .

Another good one...so true...I actually believe deep, deep down in their inner thoughts they do have a certain amount of respect for each other's game and can be friends on & off court. It's just that they have to break the ice & it's not easy esp. when they can't communicate. The media is of no help when they constantly bring up irrelevant issues.

[Joyous]

Sorry, already auction off to some female fan possessed!!!LOL!:D

I am falling off my chair reading all these funny comments. Now, we know why BCL lost - too much female distraction.

[cooler]

Relax, guys.

LD or TH arn't going to give you anything they won. I like to see them play full three ... until they die .

MS is very competitive, regular semi-finalist all have chance to win OG08.
that's what i had proposed before, badminton skins.
Only the best get to compete. It cut to the chase and no excuses for wasting stamina playing early rounds. The best plays against the best on the best term. http://www.badmintoncentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=39263&highlight=skin

[OneToughBirdie]

Sorry, already auction off to some female fan possessed!!!LOL!:D

I am falling off my chair reading all these funny comments. Now, we know why BCL lost - too much female distraction.
Sigh! That is a tough life i.e. too much female distraction ar, only the pretty ones, but someone, poor Bao, has to do it...hehehe!LOL!:D

[phaarix]

Maybe we need a TH and LD subforum...

[hcyong]

I am falling off my chair reading all these funny comments. Now, we know why BCL lost - too much female distraction.

Not a good excuse. I have similar distractions, but I do just fine.

[saugusli]

I know that This people don't like TH..


i think you're just another TH fan trying to find a plausible excuse for his lost in 2007 IO. Hey, even Indra was quiet after taufik lost in 07 IO. hehe

Base on your loosey goosey analogy, if i won the super lotto (powerball in the US) and Negreanu, prolly the best poker player in the world, am i a better gambler and number picker than Negreanu?? The olympic game is big only because it is a highly promoted game and the dollar involve, it is still tough badminton whether it's OG, AE, WC, sudiman cup, thomas cup, etc...Actually the Opens are harder to win because in the OG, china can only send 3 in each catergory where as in Opens, china, MAL, denmark, KOR can send unlimited players for qualifying.
Also, TH had a good draw in 04 athen, the only tough player he saw was PG.
So TH beats a handicap korean in the final, whooppee:rolleyes: I find shon as a runner up accomplished more with just 1 eye than TH with 2 eyes.

Not done yet.
I say ur view that TH didnt take this IO seriously is grossly incorrect. He was well rested and prepared. TH fans already say that TH only play best when he has an objective. Well, breaking ardy's old record is a milestone for an INA player and is a valid objective for TH to play seriously. Why? if TH won this IO but failed in 08 OG, TH still has the bragging rights of achieving an record of winning 7 IO titles. By losing 07 IO, TH lost this chance since he is older and slower next year. TH missed 2 BIG opportunities in 2006, (1) to win AE and (2) breaking ardy record. Come 2008, i highly doubt taufik can win the AE, 7th IO title or his 2nd olympic. Therefore, TH would have no special record for badminton history. Only tony G has titles in AE, OG and WC. The possible reason why TH make errors in the end was likely because of the home crowd. TH is expected to win. TH did not relax nor fold the 3rd set like in japan open. I believe TH took the match with BCL seriously.

I havent counted yet but LD could claim the record of having the most titles won. If LD win 08 OG, he got a royal flush too:p

[saugusli]

Hi,

LD don't have Olimpic Title and Asean Games Title.

TH has Olimpic Title, WC, Asean Games (2 times). Only All England don't have.

That u know, In China: Taufik Still in the list to be carefull for any china players.

I remember u that u always used Lucky... This people very stupid lahhhh...


LD dont have to give up his medals to trade for a Olympic gold, LD can win it in 2008:p

Personally i rather owns all of LD current titles and no olympic title because if i trade them all for that 1 olympic gold, it only showed that i was lucky, not the dominating best in the class.

zhao jinhua, hartono, and other greats never attained olympic gold medals, are they lower than taufik?

[taufik-ist]

Hi,

LD don't have Olimpic Title and Asean Games Title.

TH has Olimpic Title, WC, Asean Games (2 times). Only All England don't have.

That u know, In China: Taufik Still in the list to be carefull for any china players.

I remember u that u always used Lucky... This people very stupid lahhhh...

ya.....

a lucky guy doesn't win Olimpic Title, WC, Asean Games (2 times) :D

[Joyous]

Not a good excuse. I have similar distractions, but I do just fine.

Was joking along with the rest. LCW played well & he deserves the victory.

[cooler]

ya.....

a lucky guy doesn't win Olimpic Title, WC, Asean Games (2 times) :D

olympic and asian games ARE NOT A TRUE COMPETITIVE CONTEST.

In 04 OG, there were several top chinese MS players not entered due to maximum of 3 per country. The main threat to TH was XXZ and he was kept inside china wall by LYB's mistake. What make u think LD can't get the 08 gold now that he's more experienced?

August 06, 2004
Dropping Xuanze a grave mistake, says Misbun
"CHINA'S decision to drop world champion Xia Xuanze from the Athens Olympics is a grave mistake and national singles coach Misbun Sidek believes the move could prove costly for them.

Although China are supremely confident that one of their three players — World No 1 Lin Dan, World No 2 Chen Hong and World No 4 Bao Chunlai are capable of retaining the singles gold won by Ji Xinpeng in Sydney four years ago, none of them have the big match temperament Xuanze possesses. Misbun said, despite Xuanze's drop in form after winning the World Championships in Birmingham last year, he performs well in major events and has performed consistently over the last five years. After all, Xuanze won the bronze in Sydney beating then World No 1 Peter Gade Christensen of Denmark and his experience is something his three compatriots lack. Besides the world title, Xuanze has won the 2000 All-England, 2001 World Grand Prix Finals and more than 15 international titles over the last six years. "Lin Dan is in fiery form and is the man to beat in Athens. But favourites have never won the Olympic gold on previous occasions and this is where China are going to miss Xuanze," said Misbun. "Chen Hong and Chunlai are great shuttlers but have succumbed to pressure on many occasions. "On the other hand, Xuanze is most lethal when least expected to do well. The pressure will be on Lin Dan. "Xuanze is the most reliable player in such situations. Without him, the draw is very open and anyone is capable of running away with the gold." Previous favourites in the Olympics, Zhao Jianhua of China in 1992, Joko Suprianto of Indonesia in 1996 and Christensen in 2000 ; fell in the quarter-finals and this could well happen to Lin Dan in Athens. Lin Dan, 21, has won five grand prix titles, including the All-England title, over the last nine months but he will realise in Athens that it needs more than consistency to clinch the Olympic gold."



In asian games, kenneth J and peter gade are shut out. It was a like a private party and not all the guests are invited.

Have u forgot TH's 06 HK walkout and japan open fold out already? Who really afraid of who? Get your fact straight.

Since TH went as far as Semi final in 07 IO, home turf, what make u TH fans think he can do better next time when he would be even less fit and tired from raising a baby?

Count the number of titles LD owns and see who has more than him.

[cooler]

I know that This people don't like TH..
Only people like you calling member here stupid that is full of hatre.

[cooler]

ya.....

a lucky guy doesn't win Olimpic Title, WC, Asean Games (2 times) :D

Yes, it happened before, several times.
Ji Xinpeng of china and alan budi kusuma.

it seem die hard TH fans have short memory span and have to be constantly reminded of basic statistics and facts.
Regarding Asian game, I know TH get a huge incentive for winning. For china team, it was just a free trip and meals to doha and back...like it was a big deal:rolleyes: NOT. You want confirmation? XXF and zhang ning all lost too to Wang chen and a Yip girl. LD beat TH in the team event anyway.

[Misty100]

The debate is going off topic... maybe the moderator should consider closing this thread.

[phaarix]

The debate is going off topic... maybe the moderator should consider closing this thread.

Whenever Taufik and Lin Dan are involved in a thread you know something like that has a pretty good chance of happening... *sigh*. Some people are just dead set on attacking Taufik...

[ye333]

You are just so biased.

A while ago some Hongkong TV program was posted here. It contains an interview of LD some time last year, should be between WC and AG I guess. LD mentioned two events in the future that he will try to do well in. Guess which two?

AG and OG.

Even 07 WC was not mentioned. (Maybe because he had already won WC)

Another side evidence. After losing to LHI in team event, LD mentioned "I have been thinking too much about the singles event" as one main reason for the loss. Seems LD does care about AG MS title, to such an extend that he under-prepared team event final. :eek:

Finally, you kept saying TH had an easy draw in 04 OG. Let compare, say with LD's 06 WC draw. After a few nobodies, he met -- Yoyo King, then an exhausted CH, and finally BCL who has been a piece of cake for LD for quite a few years. Even if we do not take into account of the facts that LD always beats BCL and CH was exhausted, do you think CH in 06> PG in 04? Do you think BCL in 06> WCH in 04? Do you think Yoyo King is tougher than SSM or Boonsak in 04? If not, should we call LD's draw an easy draw too?

I am not saying TH is much better than LD, but could Taufik-haters use more facts and logic when attacking him?



Yes, it happened before, several times.
Ji Xinpeng of china and alan budi kusuma.

it seem die hard TH fans have short memory span and have to be constantly reminded of basic statistics and facts.
Regarding Asian game, I know TH get a huge incentive for winning. For china team, it was just a free trip and meals to doha and back...like it was a big deal:rolleyes: NOT. You want confirmation? XXF and zhang ning all lost too to Wang chen and a Yip girl. LD beat TH in the team event anyway.

[Misty100]

Whenever Taufik and Lin Dan are involved in a thread you know something like that has a pretty good chance of happening... *sigh*. Some people are just dead set on attacking Taufik...

When in written debate, they can get so personal and passionate, i dare not imagine what will happen if they are put together in the same cage... sighs :cool:

[Simp84]

lol its always the same old story.. Winning lots of tournament vs winning important events theories..
Lets put it this way.. LD's dream is to be the gold medalist in Olympic, PG's dream is to do the same.. LCW's and many many more wants to be Gold medalist too
So it means OG is one of the most important event to win, as it goes into history and it is every badminton players greatest achievement to win OG
Winning the most tournament guy will always be replaced by another greater new comer in the future, ie PG who we all thought was superb for being world #1 for quite some time, are now just a shadow of LD, and do people remember him for being such a legend? Not so much after the emergence of LD
So lets put an end to what is the most important event, as argument doesn't make any differences, if LD wants the title to so bad, he has to prove that he can win OG08. And if that happens then he is truely the greatest badminton player in this era. And yes > TH i will say.

[cooler]

lol its always the same old story.. Winning lots of tournament vs winning important events theories..
Lets put it this way.. LD's dream is to be the gold medalist in Olympic, PG's dream is to do the same.. LCW's and many many more wants to be Gold medalist too
So it means OG is one of the most important event to win, as it goes into history and it is every badminton players greatest achievement to win OG
Winning the most tournament guy will always be replaced by another greater new comer in the future, ie PG who we all thought was superb for being world #1 for quite some time, are now just a shadow of LD, and do people remember him for being such a legend? Not so much after the emergence of LD
So lets put an end to what is the most important event, as argument doesn't make any differences, if LD wants the title to so bad, he has to prove that he can win OG08. And if that happens then he is truely the greatest badminton player in this era. And yes > TH i will say.

I agree an OG medal has more symbolic status but TH fans see the OG medal as owning technical supremacy instead. It comes 1st a year so it's more scarce, not an end all benchmark of technical superiority.

I already gave you guys the analogy of a one time lottery winner versus a
multi year poker winner.

Why TH is the greatest when so so players like Ji Xinpeng and alan budi kusuma are gold medalists too? Peter gade, hendrawan, zhao jianhua are obviously better players than Jixinpeng and alan budi but yet PG, hendrawen, ZJH don't own any OG gold.

[cooler]

Whenever Taufik and Lin Dan are involved in a thread you know something like that has a pretty good chance of happening... *sigh*. Some people are just dead set on attacking Taufik...
As in badminton that u should know that, attacking can only be achieved because the attacker has an advantage position or better vantage point to launch the attack. The defender succumbs to defending because they have many weak area where the attacker obviously see through.

So, in this case, I attack TH fans because i have many good points while TH fans are defending because they have many weak points.

[phaarix]

I agree an OG medal has more symbolic status but TH fans see the OG medal as owning technical supremacy instead. It comes 1st a year so it's more scarce, not an end all benchmark of technical superiority.

I already gave you guys the analogy of a one time lottery winner versus a
multi year poker winner.

Why TH is the greatest when so so players like Ji Xinpeng and alan budi kusuma are gold medalists too?

Yep I agree with that first paragraph. But Taufik didn't only win the Olympics did he? He also won the World Champs and the Asian Games twice. That's where he's different from Alan and Ji Xinpeng. He does have some consistency. And Ji Xinpeng wasn't completely useless anyway. Winning the Olympics didn't make him great but he rose to the occasion and outplayed his opposition. But he didn't achieve much else unlike Taufik.

But like I said before, I don't like Taufik for his achievements. I love to watch him play. He's great to watch, and I've noticed Lin Dan also is becoming more enjoyable. He's becoming more dynamic and really using his mind. Why do people have to make out that one totally eclipses the other? They're both great players and they've both proven themselves on numerous occasions :)!

But I don't see why you think it's necessary to attack others on a community message board. And you attack them because you think their views are weak :rolleyes:? No I don't have a huge problem with you. As you for the most part know your bounds. But other people on this board have gone too far in the past. Anyway there are a fair few of your own points that don't really convince me. Especially trying to make out that Taufik's Olympic draw was "weak". I just think maybe you should lay off "Taufik fans" for a bit :cool:.

[cooler]

Taufik is starting to up his form. He will have drops in form as his attention will be geared to the olympics but don't be alarmed and started posting threads saying "taufik is no longer a force". He is like hoyer larsen who wins the big events and sacrifices the smaller events with his mind set on what really matters ( the majors - olympics, worlds, asian games & A.E.C ) all greats are like this. Many past 100m olympic sprint champions lost in warm up events only to come good on the big stage, even easing up in the heats to save their A game for the final ( the one that counts!!) Roger federer lost to andy murray only to thrash all of the opposition in the US open. Taufik is like this, he beat lin dan in the worlds ( or should I say trounced him ) again in the asian games. He could lose to lin dan, or any other chinese 5000 times but if he becomes double olympic champion that goes down in history forever. Hoyer larsen won 2 A.E.C championships & olympic gold. Peter gade has won many more events but hoyer is the true champion. ITS QUALITY NOT QUANTITY!!! Taufik is the same in the big events. Thats when the level of who is the best should be judged. When it matters! in those pressure situations and on the big stage. By the way, in those pressure situations lin, bao, chong wei and the rest of them don't produce the goods. And don't reply with lin dan as won this and that, ask him, I bet he would give up all his titles for 1 olympic gold.
funny how TH is compared to federer. Federer plays alot and win alot. TH, well....:rolleyes:

[cooler]

Yep I agree with that first paragraph. But Taufik didn't only win the Olympics did he? He also won the World Champs and the Asian Games twice. That's where he's different from Alan and Ji Xinpeng. He does have some consistency. And Ji Xinpeng wasn't completely useless anyway. Winning the Olympics didn't make him great but he rose to the occasion and outplayed his opposition. But he didn't achieve much else unlike Taufik.

But like I said before, I don't like Taufik for his achievements. I love to watch him play. He's great to watch, and I've noticed Lin Dan also is becoming more enjoyable. He's becoming more dynamic and really using his mind. Why do people have to make out that one totally eclipses the other? They're both great players and they've both proven themselves on numerous occasions :)!

But I don't see why you think it's necessary to attack others on a community message board. And you attack them because you think their views are weak :rolleyes:? No I don't have a huge problem with you. As you for the most part know your bounds. But other people on this board have gone too far in the past. Anyway there are a fair few of your own points that don't really convince me. Especially trying to make out that Taufik's Olympic draw was "weak". I just think maybe you should lay off "Taufik fans" for a bit :cool:.

I'm just trying to help the delirious TH fans from being possesed and only see thing with tunnel vision. Things like TH is like federer, LD is afraid of TH. LOL. Reality is 180 degree of those things

[OneToughBirdie]

Since TH went as far as Semi final in 07 IO, home turf, what make u TH fans think he can do better next time when he would be even less fit and tired from raising a baby?
That depends whether the baby sucks milk from (you know ehere???) or TH has to wake up every 3-4 hours to make prepared baby milk...that is serious business! hehehe!! LOL!!:p :p :p :D :D :D

[phaarix]

I'm just trying to help the delirious TH fans from being possesed and only see thing with tunnel vision. Things like TH is like federer, LD is afraid of TH. LOL. Reality is 180 degree of those things
I know but some of the things people are saying aren't too outrageous. I mean Federer's a great and very dominant tennis player but he certainly isn't a god or anything ;) (but you can't really compare them anyway as they're both completely different sports). And I'm sure Lin Dan isn't "afraid" of Taufik or anything but I'm sure he takes him seriously. I mean even if you're not a huge fan of TH you've got to give him some credit :). He's certainly not just your average player.

[cooler]

I know but some of the things people are saying aren't too outrageous. I mean Federer's a great and very dominant tennis player but he certainly isn't a god or anything ;) (but you can't really compare them anyway as they're both completely different sports). And I'm sure Lin Dan isn't "afraid" of Taufik or anything but I'm sure he takes him seriously. I mean even if you're not a huge fan of TH you've got to give him some credit :). He's certainly not just your average player.
lol, regarding of his on court skill, his off court antics automatically qualifies TH as not your average player.:D I've already said it before, i'm not anti TH, i just want to 'cool' down some of the taufik fans:p If only i can bottles TH fan's enthusiasm, I will be a famous doctor because i've found a better medicine than Lithium:cool: It would wipe out autism and depression. :)

[phaarix]

Lol ok ok then :rolleyes:. I can tell I'm not going to change your mind about anything (but you're still yet to convince me you're not at least a little bit anti-TH :p).

[azabaz_ipoh]

But like I said before, I don't like Taufik for his achievements. I love to watch him play. He's great to watch, and I've noticed Lin Dan also is becoming more enjoyable. He's becoming more dynamic and really using his mind. Why do people have to make out that one totally eclipses the other? They're both great players and they've both proven themselves on numerous occasions :)!



i agree. why the need to put one player way above another? even federer cannot win consistently on clay against nadal and nadal is not like federer who consistently wins a lot of tournaments. but i still think nadal rocks. and federer rocks too. i like both TH and LD though when they fight each other i tend to be on TH's side. i suspect it has something to do with my heart who likes TH's face. :D plus his backhand and style of play is very entertaining. but i will never say one is greater than the other. if TH's die hard fans want to think of him as the greatest that ever lived, then it is their prerogative. they just cant expect other people to validate what they think is the truth. lets then, agree to disagree. :D ;)

[Cramps]

okay, you're all wrong. IM THE BEST.

[bic33]

i used to be part of this debate, but eventually, i got tired... just let LD and TH face each other and ask in front of them: "A lot of people are arguing about who's the better player between you two, can you please give me an honest answer?" dang, i can't imagine the looks in their faces...

[azabaz_ipoh]

i used to be part of this debate, but eventually, i got tired... just let LD and TH face each other and ask in front of them: "A lot of people are arguing about who's the better player between you two, can you please give me an honest answer?" dang, i can't imagine the looks in their faces...

totally. i would really like to know what they would say. oh, surely they will say no comment and all, but really, if they could be honest. i wonder what they would say. :D

[amaze]

totally. i would really like to know what they would say. oh, surely they will say no comment and all, but really, if they could be honest. i wonder what they would say. :D

I think.... deep in their hearts, each respects the other in terms of skill AND mental strength. We, the fans, are the ones who benefit the most from this pitting of skills, don't you all agree ? So... pl don't debate anymore..... cool it man:cool:

[azabaz_ipoh]

I think.... deep in their hearts, each respects the other in terms of skill AND mental strength. We, the fans, are the ones who benefit the most from this pitting of skills, don't you all agree ? So... pl don't debate anymore..... cool it man:cool:

i'm sorry you took my comment the wrong way. i did not meant to incite. i was just thinking. yes i agree, we the fans are benefiting from their skills. please read my previous comments, i said i would never say either one of them are better than the other. :p only we know what is in our heart and i believe only taufik and lin dan knows what they feel towards each other. i never expect to get an answer to my question. :rolleyes:

[Winston_T]

Taufik lost because he is tired of winning Indonesia Open.He is afraid people may call him "kampung champion".

err... what kind of an excuse?
TH targetted for 7th title in Ina open, a new record.

[Winston_T]

Hi,

LD don't have Olimpic Title and Asean Games Title.

TH has Olimpic Title, WC, Asean Games (2 times). Only All England don't have.

That u know, In China: Taufik Still in the list to be carefull for any china players.

I remember u that u always used Lucky... This people very stupid lahhhh...

can't u count how many titles that TH never won compare to LD?

Asean Games?
ASEAN means Association of South East Asian Nations.
for sure LD can't compete in Asean Games, coz CHN is not a part of ASEAN.

[Winston_T]

olympic is the biggest achievement for a athelete :D ...

people always remember the olympic champion, you want a proove ? ( you must asnwer instanly ;)
who is the MS champion of korea open 2004 ?
who is the MS champion of olympic 2004 ?

let say now is 2108, not 2008.
can u remembered exactly who is the MS champion of OG 04?
at that time, there are 30 OG winners.

ppl will only remembered the player that held an incredible world's record such as:

World #1 position for 3,5 yrs
30 consecutive wins
5 titles in a row