Body Movement during smashing

[MYSRH]

I just found out that I don't have quite correct smash. Anyone can tell me theoritically the body, arm, to wrist movements before and after smash?

[paul]

A big smash involves the whole body - but most of the power comes from 4 things. Turning the shoulders, rotating the arm, extension of the forearm, and the wrist. The power flows by coordinating and connecting these movements. When I smash I sort of imagine my arm is like a whip or a ball and chain and keep the wrist quite loose. The wrist movement is most important and can generate a lot of power even when you haven't got enough time to get the whole body into the stroke. I think it's best to approach the shot straight wrist and just before hitting the arm moves backward slighty and the wrist cocks back. The tendons of the wrist naturally spring forward and you should strike the shuttle with the wrist bent forward slightly. Most of the racket speed comes from the elasticity of the wrist/forearm muscle and tendons. In fact its possible to do a huge smash by keeping the wrist totally loose but then you lose control.
Its better to learn how to hit with a slightly loose wrist because you won't get forearm injuries.

What does everyone think about the relationship between muscular strengh and smashing power ?

[MYSRH]

Hey, Paul thanks for that.
Do you mean muscular strength from biceps or triceps?
What I know, muscular strength doesn't have anything to do with wrist, but it helps you gain more power when cocking your arm.
I just share this, it might not be right.

[kwun]

Paul has an excellent analysis (as usual :)

the coordination is the key part. i still have problem coordinating all my muscle into a concerting motion. so sometime my smash are good, sometimes it is terrible. it gets worse at the end of the day coz some muscles will start to bail out due to fatigue.

i do find that sometimes a pure wrist motion can be more powerful then trying to add together all other muscles motion at the same time. watching tournament tapes seems to reinforce that idea since they can do a quite flick of the wrist and the shuttle flies off at some insane speed.

how does weight training help smashing? i think it may help consistency, but not sure about power.

i am going to try this "whip" idea this weekend.

[vince poon]

I am using the whip smash theory also for almost 6 months now. Before I use a lot of brute force for smash, is very tiring and cause terrible pain on my shoulder rotational cup but all pain is gone now. During smash, I just relax and imagine my hand and racquet is just one whip, I could feel the energy transfer from my torso to the head of racquet. Although my whip smash is not as powerful as my original technique, it is less energy consumption, I can smash more consecutively in double and if I fine tune the whip smash technique it will be a force to be reckon with.

[Cheung]

The relaxation part is very important. More speed is generated by having looser muscles.

I too used to put a lot of effort in. Recently I have trying to work out why I put so much effort in with little return.

1) Used to rotate too much in preparation for the smash.
2) Not getting weight into shot
3) Muscles too tense
4) Not enough wrist pronation on impact.

My elbow doesn;t seem to ache so much recently. Is this because of the alterations I am trying to make?

[paul]

I suppose its a similar situation for 100M sprinters who often talk about relaxing while running. Putting tension in the muscles must slow them down but it helps to have strong and fast muscles. I find that when playing a tournement or an important match I can smash a lot harder than in practice games. Not sure why.

[viver]

In my own opinion, the basics for a good smash:
- correct technique;
- strong legs;
- correct body dissociation during the execution of the technique and good coordination of the movements;
- racquet swing speed;
- correct timing.

A full swing smash will always be more powerful than using only your wrist. In may not be most efficient in all situations. Just consider the doubles game, those world class players still do a full swing when executing the baseline smashes.

Just my thoughts,
Viver

[Cheung]

I am the opposite, probably because I get tense and I'm not thinking about the correct technique.

[kwun]

same here. my smashes are much sharper and harder when i play tournaments. i find that i take around 1-2 hours of play before my gain my touch, sometimes longer. tournaments are great coz i will have completely warmed up by the time i get to the more important matches.

[marshall]

I'm still trying to get a consistent smash. Not concentrating on technique is my biggest problem. Weight training has improved my power, both for smashes and clears (more for clears, because my smash timing is bad so I can't judge effect of power as well). I found that strengthening the triceps helped generate extra power on a fast backswing with no pause before beginning the forward stroke. I can feel the spring action of the triceps.

BTW, Thanks to everyone for the high quality of the discussions on this and other topics. There's lots of participation. I enjoy reading this forum better than any other.

marshall

[Dude]

Smash - Power Stroke in Badminton

Power from badminton swing is derived from something called "pronation."

Pronation describes the "correct" motion of the wrist as it bends or "pronates" from back to forward *with the correct grip*. This is not the same motion as when you flex the wrist straight back to straight forward.

As you swing, you cock your arm&wrist back. Then you extend your arm (at this point your wrist pronation begins). Then your wrist moves from cocked position to straight forward until you break the plane. In continuous motion the wrist pronates to 4-5 o'clock direction for right handed person. (it is extremely important that you have the correct grip).

When you see pictures of pro players frozen at the mid-end of their overhead swing motion, you'll notice that their racquet is pointed toward the out 4-5 o'clock direction from their body.

The smooth and quick "pronation" with practiced timing is the key to powerful shot in badminton.

"Whipping technique" is a very good analogy that teach people to relax before a shot and to time the point of impact. However, without correct pronation of your wrists, you will never achieve the good level of efficiency in transferring the power created by your muscles to your shots.

gluck

[Ricky]

It's too bad that I can't totally understand what you mean by 4-5 o'clock direction. Could you explain a bit more clearer ? What I get from your message is that the power in smash is mainly generated from the correct movement of the wrist, right ?

[paul]

The whip visualiztion technique I'm talking about works for me when I'm in a bit of a rut smashing. Do you get much power when your thinking about your smashing theory ? If you watched me smashing you can see the correct technique - I just think visualization can help putting the shuttle where you want and how fast you want. I've been playing at a high level for many years and of course don't need to think about stroke production because everything feels so natural. The 4 or 5 o'clock position your talking about is meaningless. The most important consideraton is angle of the wrist at the point of contact with the shuttle which for smashing is about 1 o'clock. If you think "I must end the stroke with 4 or 5 o'clock pronation" you will probably miss the shuttle completely.

[Magnus]

OK, this is being picky but it's still worth emphasizing:
The wrist has very little to do with power in badminton. The wrist (or rather, the cocking of the wrist) basically determines the placement of the shot.

As "Dude" stated, pronation is the key, but this takes place in the underarm, not in the wrist.

Thus, the term "wrist player" ought to be "underarm player"...

[paul]

As I said previously in this thread I also think it is possible to do a huge smash without any wrist power. But the power comes from the elasticity of the wrist/forearm tendon and muscle.

Dude and Magnus - do you smash big, as hard as a pro ?

So you're recommending I think "pronation" the next time I crush the shuttle with a smash ?

[viver]

Paul,
I have read your post about the possibility of having a loose wrist and yet a powerful smash. Can you elaborate a little bit more on this issue?

I agree with you regarding the "thinking" the stroke during a match. This visualization (Imagineering is the scientific name for this method??). should be done during training sessions. During the game the technical movements should come naturally as result from training.

About the pronation is a fundamental part in the basic strokes. But some research done by some Chinese coaches, it shows that you could produce a more powerful smash (20-30%) without the pronation!!?? Basically the stroke is the same as I described in a previous post (more in detail in yours) only without the pronating action. Thoughts about this?

Regards,
Viver

[Magnus]

Paul,

My smash is OK :-) But as I'm not a coach, nor a scientist, I just regurgitate what I've been taught and read. You say "the power comes from the elasticity of the wrist/forearm tendon and muscle." Well, to me this is a perfect description of the pronation/supenation action. I think we're talking about the same thing. If you smash hard there's pronation at work -- whether you're aware of it or not...

I've learned that the real shift of paradigms happened on an international coaching conference in Canada in 1977. Before 1977, every coach would tell you that the wrist generated power. However, high-speed photography enabled scientists to study the smash of hard-hitting players, and they discovered that they were in fact using a pronation movement of the forearm. This they didn't find this in the "weaker" players. So -- top players had been taught to use wrist movement, but were in fact using forearm pronation to get that extra kick...

[paul]

Its very difficult to describe without actual demonstration. Magnus is right - we are probably talking about the same thing but our wording is different.

When I smash I feel that most of the power comes from a rebounding of the wrist. The wrist cocks back (as Magnus described) and the tendon/muscle naturally sping the wrist forward. I think some muscle power can be added to this movement to increase speed but this too has to be timed correctly. Timing is the key to power. Start the stroke too early or late, or if you don't set up with the right arm/shoulder position power will be lost. Also people who try use too much muscle will lose power and probably injure themselves.

Visualization is a very useful tool for me. I'm talking about visualizing where the shuttle will land a fraction of a second before the stroke. Of course shot selection is almost instinctive but if you are lacking length in your clear then visualizing can help the accuracy. If you're being beaten by an opponent you have to do something to change the game around - visualiztion can be one of those techniques.