Rafael Nadal - what Malaysian badminton players/sportsmen should learn from

[Pemuda]

I watched the French Open tennis final between Nadal & Federer and I was simply blown away by Rafa's attitude and drive on his way to capture his 3rd successive French Open title while at the young age of 21. And I sincerely think our Malaysian badminton players and sportsmen in general should emulate and learn from a top notch guy like Rafa. Rafa has won 3 grand slam titles so far and have been in a total 31 finals and have won 22 of it, and he is still as hungry as ever. The boy is very young, won numerous titles, has lot of money and yet he is as level headed as ever. He is all business when on court, no matter who he is playing against, you will never see him playing to the gallery.

I personally feel sick in the stomach when I see for example our KKK losing his focus after winning a few titles. I guess it is a Malaysian disease - whenever any of our sportsmen/women win something big, they get showered with praises, given titles and the end results is always them losing concentration and then fizzling out. We just never, never learn. Is it a Malaysian mentality thing?

In badminton, the WC is just around the corner while the Olympics is less than 12 months away. Do we actually have a serious contender for that elusive Olympic gold??

Just my 2sen ...

[dunker]

Oh yea man, Rafa rocks...the key is motivation. The willingness to give up everything and want to do well...not just well, but take it the whole nine yards and wanting to do the very best. Training and coaches can only do so much but it is the heart and spirit of the fighter that makes the difference. rafa faced one of the best tennis players of our time, some say, in Fed ex and showed no fear. Just the look in the eyes in rafa tells us so much, the dude was all fired up. Then u have some of our players who goes tru the motion of the game. NOw, I did not watch the resent match between mas and eng mens doubles, but the scores showed a fight, nor am i acctually refering to just them, but malaysian badminton players in general could do no wrong watching nadal's semi finals and final matches in the french open. (Yep I am a Rafa fan)

[ants]

Well some play for the money and some play.. just for the sake of loving the game.

[llpjlau]

how the heck do you play to the gallery in tennis anyway? double motion? come on you have to think rationally not just blurt out anything.

[Pemuda]

how the heck do you play to the gallery in tennis anyway? double motion? come on you have to think rationally not just blurt out anything.

Playing to the gallery means showboating. You underestimate certain 'weaker opponents'.
Agree with your 'think rationally not just blurt out anything' theory. As such, suggest you do likewise.

[zqloy]

Playing to the gallery means showboating. You underestimate certain 'weaker opponents'.
Agree with your 'think rationally not just blurt out anything' theory. As such, suggest you do likewise.

Wat r u referring to? Did u watch the match btw our boys vs england anyway? According to YKH, KKK/TBH did not played badly nor playing to the gallery, but the Eng pair just outperformed them, thx to Tam Kim Her.

[dunker]

Duno about the sudirman cup, but i saw most of the matches KKK/TBH played from the asian games to the all england....recently the seem to lose the fire that took the badminton world by storm a few months ago. While ppl like Rafa or Fed Ex seem to be fired up to win all the time. THAT may be what Pemuda was tring to point out. The inner fire is what seperates winners and champions.

[ants]

Wat r u referring to? Did u watch the match btw our boys vs england anyway? According to YKH, KKK/TBH did not played badly nor playing to the gallery, but the Eng pair just outperformed them, thx to Tam Kim Her.

I dont think anyone did say KKK/TBH played to show off during the Sudirman CUp. SHOW OFF or play to the Gallery have no association with KKK/TBH.

[cute_tbh]

come on, guys...
try look at it on different view...
how many times did kkk/tbh beat cy/fhf...doha, AE, SO...three times in a row..in MO, cy/fhf was beaten by another MAS double (i'm not really sure what their names are)...
did chinese people blame cy/fhf personally? i dun think so...and now look at them..back in shape again...
we won't win all the time, and we won't lose all the time, as well...
look at chong wei...he's trying very hard to be in his best form again..
even lin dan was beaten by simon santoso...
see my points?

its a matter of strategy...i think what we should do is support kkk/tbh all the way, and hopes that they would think of something to improve their games...like what cai yun and fu haifeng did...

besides, talking about losing and winning...when cai yun and fu haifeng lost to kkk/tbh, kkk/tbh were not even the top 20 doubles...
now, kkk/tbh lost to ENG's pairs who are the runner up of World Champ, rite...
it's not because kkk/tbh lack of determination, it was because the ENG double is finally living up to their names and achievements...

so, kkk/tbh needs to work harder...practice makes perfect....

[s1nn3r]

I've the chance to work with Asian & Europen. I must admit there are certain quality of profesionalism that european has that we asian lack. When they do their job... they really focus on it. I guess it goes same also as they involvement in sports. and there are not usually affected by the public comments. I am not a scientist not sure if it goes with their genes or their upbringing?

That's why u always see wonderkid from the west but not from the east. Maradona, Pele, LJames, Messi, & etc. but we also have our TH. I see Japan & Korea are catching up in the mental departments but other Azn country still thinking abt physical improvement.

My initial thought was that we Asian are moderate ppl, we are not actsy & We lack self believe but self believe is very essential to be successful in sport. We need some LCLY players to be BIG! The players doesnt need to talk BIG but must believe he is the VERY BEST!!

JUst my 2cents..

Cheers

[llpjlau]

oh yes we have a psychic among us who can read minds.... now where is my Yuri's Revenge cd....

[azabaz_ipoh]

not all malaysian players starts losing focus. look at nicol david. yeah, she hit a slump for a while. every athlete have to go through that sometimes. but she is back. she is focused. and our diving athletes are focused and show good results on a regular basis. maybe not winners like china, but they have been contender all the same. and i think KKK/TBH will get over this slump. as long as they work hard, losing is not the end. only when they play like they would rather be somewhere else, will i be throwing in my towel on them. malaysia's sportsmen and sportswomen frequently disappoint us fans, but i will still be behind them. just maybe, not cheering so much as standing with my head down. but behind them nonetheless. :) nadal, well, he deserves the win as any hardworking athlete does. and hardworking he is. :)

[Pemuda]

Wat r u referring to? Did u watch the match btw our boys vs england anyway? According to YKH, KKK/TBH did not played badly nor playing to the gallery, but the Eng pair just outperformed them, thx to Tam Kim Her.

I am saying that our badminton players and sportsmen/women should take a leaf out of Nadal and emulate his success. In short, there is no short cut to success. You dont just take the foot off the pedal after one win. You need to be level headed, focused and driven to stay on top.

I did not watch the game between Msia and England. But the fact is given our badminton history, funding and infrastructure for the game in Msia, we should have beaten off England. In short, in football we are not expected to beat England but in badminton, we are EXPECTED to beat England.

Now for KKK/TBH, lets me clear here. After their win at the Swiss Open, cant you not see their performances have dipped tremendously??

[ksooi]

Maybe when the govt and public stop showering our winners with gifts and praises then they wil start to be more professional......msian public truly have the 'lalang' effect.....when they win, lots of support....but a few losses and they are shite and get criticised....:mad:
now tht NSC is thinkin of cutting the govt sponsorship which i fully support, i think tht will spur them on.....:D

the reason the tennis players(and golf) are so focused is bcoz winning is their bread and butter...its their one and only career.....if our badminton players dont win tournaments, they are stil getting paid.....so unless the govt and public do somthin, we hav ourselves to blame :)

[Pemuda]

not all malaysian players starts losing focus. look at nicol david. yeah, she hit a slump for a while. every athlete have to go through that sometimes. but she is back. she is focused. and our diving athletes are focused and show good results on a regular basis. maybe not winners like china, but they have been contender all the same. and i think KKK/TBH will get over this slump. as long as they work hard, losing is not the end. only when they play like they would rather be somewhere else, will i be throwing in my towel on them. malaysia's sportsmen and sportswomen frequently disappoint us fans, but i will still be behind them. just maybe, not cheering so much as standing with my head down. but behind them nonetheless. :) nadal, well, he deserves the win as any hardworking athlete does. and hardworking he is. :)

Nicol David is a top class squash player. She is world class. But for a sports loving country like Msia with excellent infrastructure and government funding, dont you think we should have a couple more like Nicol Davids??

Look at our national football team, we are like at the bottom of the bottom. We used to beat Japan & S Korea in the 70s and early 80s, now look at us and Japan/S Korea! :o Even war torn countries like Ivory Coast made it to the WC and we are struggling to beat minnows like Laos.

Look at what happened to our badminton players after the Thomas Cup win in KL in 91. Some of the players even went bankrupt. We dont have a Thomas Cup to show nor a WC title or an Olympic Gold. Even USA won the WC men's doubles.

Even sepak takraw, we cant even beat Thailand and are finding it hard to fend off Vietnam even.

Hockey?? I wont even want to get into that.

Why are we so bad?? I believe, as long as we, Msians continue to accept poor results and then coming out with excuses, we will continue to lag behind.

[badking]

:D
Nicol David is a top class squash player. She is world class. But for a sports loving country like Msia with excellent infrastructure and government funding, dont you think we should have a couple more like Nicol Davids??

Look at our national football team, we are like at the bottom of the bottom. We used to beat Japan & S Korea in the 70s and early 80s, now look at us and Japan/S Korea! :o Even war torn countries like Ivory Coast made it to the WC and we are struggling to beat minnows like Laos.

Look at what happened to our badminton players after the Thomas Cup win in KL in 91. Some of the players even went bankrupt. We dont have a Thomas Cup to show nor a WC title or an Olympic Gold. Even USA won the WC men's doubles.

Even sepak takraw, we cant even beat Thailand and are finding it hard to fend off Vietnam even.

Hockey?? I wont even want to get into that.

Why are we so bad?? I believe, as long as we, Msians continue to accept poor results and then coming out with excuses, we will continue to lag behind.


well pemuda....before you start blaming the athletes, you have to look at the people behind it :rolleyes:....sports is now a business :).....unless it is run properly, a lot wont happen....
you also have to look at the culture 20-30 years ago and the culture now...i dont believe malaysians accept poor results but is anything done after the poor results....i knw the malaysian govt have loads of plan but is it executed properly.....it is all abt execution....
I sincerely believe if malaysian is to be a world beater in sports, you need professionals to run the sports associations and not politicians or people that dont even kwn the ins and outs of the industry.....sports is now a billion dollar industry....:D

[Pemuda]

I've the chance to work with Asian & Europen. I must admit there are certain quality of profesionalism that european has that we asian lack. When they do their job... they really focus on it. I guess it goes same also as they involvement in sports. and there are not usually affected by the public comments. I am not a scientist not sure if it goes with their genes or their upbringing?

That's why u always see wonderkid from the west but not from the east. Maradona, Pele, LJames, Messi, & etc. but we also have our TH. I see Japan & Korea are catching up in the mental departments but other Azn country still thinking abt physical improvement.

My initial thought was that we Asian are moderate ppl, we are not actsy & We lack self believe but self believe is very essential to be successful in sport. We need some LCLY players to be BIG! The players doesnt need to talk BIG but must believe he is the VERY BEST!!

JUst my 2cents..

Cheers

I agree with you on the professionalism but I will add one more thing called desire.

Money is important, make no doubts about it. But when top class athletes like Federer, Nadal, Maradona, Lin Dan are out competing I believe, they want to win titles/trophies first. And if you win them, the money will come along. Last Sunday, when NAdal played Federer, I am sure whats on Nadal mind then was to win that French Open so that he can be amongst the greats i.e. winning it 3 times in a row. He was not thinking about the millions of USD. He knows the money will come later after the win. And the best thing about true champions like Nadal is that despite having millions of USD in his bank, he will still come onto court hungry as ever. And this is what our Msian sportsmen/women should learn.

[Pemuda]

:D


well pemuda....before you start blaming the athletes, you have to look at the people behind it :rolleyes:....sports is now a business :).....unless it is run properly, a lot wont happen....
you also have to look at the culture 20-30 years ago and the culture now...i dont believe malaysians accept poor results but is anything done after the poor results....i knw the malaysian govt have loads of plan but is it executed properly.....it is all abt execution....
I sincerely believe if malaysian is to be a world beater in sports, you need professionals to run the sports associations and not politicians or people that dont even kwn the ins and outs of the industry.....sports is now a billion dollar industry....:D

Well badking, why are we having politicians running our sports associations and not professionals managing it?? I tell you why, it is because we, Malaysians allow this to happen by continuing accepting poor results, poor management and favourtism. As long as we continue to vote in these politicians , what do you expect? What do you get when you put a couple of monkeys in a cage = you get monkey business :rolleyes:

Agree sports is now big business and it is a jungle out there, meaning we got to be competitive or else we will be eaten alive.

In badminton, for all the money poured in to develop the game dont you think it is a little poor showing as we still dont have an Olympic gold and the last Thomas Cup win was like 15 years ago?? :o

[azabaz_ipoh]

yes, i agree that we should have more nicol david since our sports facilities are one of the best in the region. but you see, the people running these facilities are mainly sports uneducated politicians. and by sports uneducated i mean they are not trained to make good judgements in sports administrations. i agree that politicians runs sports bodies all over the world but in malaysia, it seems that these politicians pay more attention to building the best sports facilities rather than building sports talents. so more show than substance. what we need is sports development in the earlier stages. school kids. groomed from young. build up their passion. train them to focus and not just to win money. our footballer back then played their hearts out for their country. i guess some of our players now also play for their country more than for the money, but i think very few of them exists. what we need are athletes that love the game, trained well from young, athletes that will want to sang the NEGARAKU at olympics and work hard towards it. Australia was once not a great sporting nation but they have a solid sports development programme now. and look at their athletes. competing with the best of them. so in conclusion, world class facilities will just remain as beautiful buildings until we do something about putting world class athletes in there. and sports mad nation will just be another sports mad nation and not a champion until we put sports interest well and above personal interest and political moves. how about we put former athletes and coaches in charge of sport in malaysia. how about giving them a chance to plan our sports' future minus the heavy-handed interference from politics minds. give them 10 years. give them support in this period. let them do what they think is best and see the result. if we are still at our current level after 10 years, then we should let the politicians take over again. and accept the facts that we will never be champions or at least a world contender. :)

[s1nn3r]

Long has gone when the time sport = passions! I mean profesional sports. Now is all about money. Why we got politician running our sport body?
IMHO:)

Govrnment subsidy sport development, so there is a way for them to channel the money for their own use.
Msian is sport crazy, by being head of some sporting assocation, politician are better known.
More effort is put into facilities than atheltes because you can suck money from construction of facilities but u cant suck from athletes..:cool:

[dunker]

oh yes we have a psychic among us who can read minds.... now where is my Yuri's Revenge cd....

Go look for it. At least it is somthing useful for you to do:rolleyes:.

[llpjlau]

how are you going to prevent government intervention, especially in malaysia where there is only 'one' political party?
okay lets say a politician comes thru the doors of a high class facility. he says he wants to be the head honcho around here. what are the people going to do? go on a hunger strike?

[m_hael99]

yes, i agree that we should have more nicol david since our sports facilities are one of the best in the region. but you see, the people running these facilities are mainly sports uneducated politicians. and by sports uneducated i mean they are not trained to make good judgements in sports administrations. i agree that politicians runs sports bodies all over the world but in malaysia, it seems that these politicians pay more attention to building the best sports facilities rather than building sports talents. so more show than substance. what we need is sports development in the earlier stages. school kids. groomed from young. build up their passion. train them to focus and not just to win money. our footballer back then played their hearts out for their country. i guess some of our players now also play for their country more than for the money, but i think very few of them exists. what we need are athletes that love the game, trained well from young, athletes that will want to sang the NEGARAKU at olympics and work hard towards it. Australia was once not a great sporting nation but they have a solid sports development programme now. and look at their athletes. competing with the best of them. so in conclusion, world class facilities will just remain as beautiful buildings until we do something about putting world class athletes in there. and sports mad nation will just be another sports mad nation and not a champion until we put sports interest well and above personal interest and political moves. how about we put former athletes and coaches in charge of sport in malaysia. how about giving them a chance to plan our sports' future minus the heavy-handed interference from politics minds. give them 10 years. give them support in this period. let them do what they think is best and see the result. if we are still at our current level after 10 years, then we should let the politicians take over again. and accept the facts that we will never be champions or at least a world contender. :)

totally agree! corruption is also a big issue :( but i do not think politicians ever take their hands off anything in malaysia..I still remember my PJK session in school sucks big time man (we did nothing at all)..and the sports facilities too, especially badminton (my school has a badminton hall thats inacessible to students during school hours and also after school, they are only rented out at night). Everything is about money nowadays. More opportunities should be given, especially to students since young to cultivate interest and harness whatever talents there are.

[llpjlau]

totally agree! corruption is also a big issue :( but i do not think politicians ever take their hands off anything in malaysia..I still remember my PJK session in school sucks big time man (we did nothing at all)..and the sports facilities too, especially badminton (my school has a badminton hall thats inacessible to students during school hours and also after school, they are only rented out at night). Everything is about money nowadays. More opportunities should be given, especially to students since young to cultivate interest and harness whatever talents there are.

that is so true. i had the same experience during PJK lessons. i wonder why the halls are not open to students but to big bosses after school hours instead.

[OneToughBirdie]

I am saying that our badminton players and sportsmen/women should take a leaf out of Nadal and emulate his success. In short, there is no short cut to success. You dont just take the foot off the pedal after one win. You need to be level headed, focused and driven to stay on top.

I did not watch the game between Msia and England. But the fact is given our badminton history, funding and infrastructure for the game in Msia, we should have beaten off England. In short, in football we are not expected to beat England but in badminton, we are EXPECTED to beat England.

Now for KKK/TBH, lets me clear here. After their win at the Swiss Open, cant you not see their performances have dipped tremendously??

I was surprised too of KKK/TBH lost in MD...when they first started, people were cursing Rexy for pairing them in the first place, and when they started winning, people were singing their praises and jumping on the band wagon, and now they were losing, the bandwagon hits a pot hole and people jumping off. I notice too they have slipped a bit in their play, maybe it is because other players and coaches have zero in on them, study them as they are no longer unknown and pay respect to them and therefore play hard. When they were first winning, people said they were arrogant, well, you have to be confident to be arrogant, look no further than LD, I would call him arrogant for taking his early opponents easy and often go to 3-set, same for TH too, but they are also confident in themselves.
As for TKH, I doubt his impact on the English MD is that huge, given the short time he take over the coaching job and too much credit is given to coaches, as the players till have to execute on court day...:)

[OneToughBirdie]

Nicol David is a top class squash player. She is world class. But for a sports loving country like Msia with excellent infrastructure and government funding, dont you think we should have a couple more like Nicol Davids??

Look at our national football team, we are like at the bottom of the bottom. We used to beat Japan & S Korea in the 70s and early 80s, now look at us and Japan/S Korea! :o Even war torn countries like Ivory Coast made it to the WC and we are struggling to beat minnows like Laos.

Look at what happened to our badminton players after the Thomas Cup win in KL in 91. Some of the players even went bankrupt. We dont have a Thomas Cup to show nor a WC title or an Olympic Gold. Even USA won the WC men's doubles.

Even sepak takraw, we cant even beat Thailand and are finding it hard to fend off Vietnam even.

Hockey?? I wont even want to get into that.

Why are we so bad?? I believe, as long as we, Msians continue to accept poor results and then coming out with excuses, we will continue to lag behind.
Good comments...find the answer and you be the MAS hero.:)

[OneToughBirdie]

With the political scene in MAS so one sided, trying to get politicians to get out of the sport business, to change the status quo...well, good luck, we can dream on! Politicians will milk the sports industry to death, seize every opportunity to photo-ops for political gains, corruption and inefficiency. Same for INA too.

[ants]

Another thing is that most parents dont want their kids to be a sportman/women in msia because.. you cannot make money.

[OneToughBirdie]

Another thing is that most parents dont want their kids to be a sportman/women in msia because.. you cannot make money.

Hi Ants, granted true what you said, but if the kids are not book smart, then sport career is not too bad, consider LCW made RM365K last year, but then again, there is only one LCW and many others making petty $$$, also a sports career is so fleeting and short, no guarantee of sustainable and successful, and what does the future holds for a retiring athlete, aging and with other formal training or education to rely on (maybe go into coaching???) while a professional career like medicine, engineering, teaching, etc would assure a more stable, 'safe' and sustainable way to earn a livelihood. That's why I admire badminton players who train so hard for so small a monetary reward...need to expand the game to generate more interest esp. in North America and Europe, like tennis...I would not watch a tennis game except to catch Maria Sharapova panting and dripping wet on court...hahaha! that alone is worth the price of admission and priceless as Mastercard said...hahaha!!!LOL!:D

[m_hael99]

Another thing is that most parents dont want their kids to be a sportman/women in msia because.. you cannot make money.

totally agree! my parents are one of them!:crying: and now after joining the uni badminton club, i'm having a hard time correcting all my wrong grips and playing style! if only i was trained properly..sigh..

[llpjlau]

With the political scene in MAS so one sided, trying to get politicians to get out of the sport business, to change the status quo...well, good luck, we can dream on! Politicians will milk the sports industry to death, seize every opportunity to photo-ops for political gains, corruption and inefficiency. Same for INA too.

exactly what i was implying.

[Pemuda]

Another thing is that most parents dont want their kids to be a sportman/women in msia because.. you cannot make money.

You got to be really good in your respective field then the money will come. Our Nicol David is well off. At her age, I would say she is worth probably over RM1 million. Shalin Zulkifli is also worth around that region too, maybe more even. Esther Cheah is pretty well off. Lee Chong Wei's income is in the higher bracket too.

The problem we have here in Msian is the mentality. We expect the money to come first before the hard work. We need to wake up because the only place where success/money come before hard work is in the dictionary.

Sports is like any career. You need to achieve and be good at what you do before the big bucks come along. You cant be a village champion and expect to rake in the cash, right?

In Msia, the reality is that if you want to be successful in sports it has to be a non team sports like squash, tennis, golf, bowling, badminton.

Put it another way, if poor countries like Ethopia can produced world class long distance runners how come we are not able to do likewise and even be better.

It is down to desire at the end of the day.

[Pemuda]

I was surprised too of KKK/TBH lost in MD...when they first started, people were cursing Rexy for pairing them in the first place, and when they started winning, people were singing their praises and jumping on the band wagon, and now they were losing, the bandwagon hits a pot hole and people jumping off. I notice too they have slipped a bit in their play, maybe it is because other players and coaches have zero in on them, study them as they are no longer unknown and pay respect to them and therefore play hard. When they were first winning, people said they were arrogant, well, you have to be confident to be arrogant, look no further than LD, I would call him arrogant for taking his early opponents easy and often go to 3-set, same for TH too, but they are also confident in themselves.
As for TKH, I doubt his impact on the English MD is that huge, given the short time he take over the coaching job and too much credit is given to coaches, as the players till have to execute on court day...:)

I beg to differ a bit here.

I believe KKK in particular dropped the ball after winning the SO. At the highest level, once you take your foot off the pedal you are gonna be found out right away. And yes coupled with the fact that the rest of the field have zeroed in on KKK/TBH's game, it is no wonder to see them struggling.

From the look of things now, I would say our hopes of winning the WC and bringing home an Olympic gold is looking rather dim.

[Pemuda]

how are you going to prevent government intervention, especially in malaysia where there is only 'one' political party?
okay lets say a politician comes thru the doors of a high class facility. he says he wants to be the head honcho around here. what are the people going to do? go on a hunger strike?

I dont want to get into politics too deep here but I will throw forward a few questions for all of us here.


Who vote in those leaders in every GE?
As voters, who has the power of choice?If we look at countries like Ethopia where it is worse off many many times, how come they are able to produced numerous world class athletes? They had civil wars there and I am sure their politicians are even worst.

What about Argentina? The government there is no better off. Their economy is lagging behind. But yet, they are able to produced numerous world class athletes from tennis players, race car drivers to footballers.

In Serbia the facilities for tennis are not even there but yet, there are a few world class tennis players from Serbia now.

[m_hael99]

I dont want to get into politics too deep here but I will throw forward a few questions for all of us here.

Who vote in those leaders in every GE?
As voters, who has the power of choice?If we look at countries like Ethopia where it is worse off many many times, how come they are able to produced numerous world class athletes? They had civil wars there and I am sure their politicians are even worst.

What about Argentina? The government there is no better off. Their economy is lagging behind. But yet, they are able to produced numerous world class athletes from tennis players, race car drivers to footballers.

In Serbia the facilities for tennis are not even there but yet, there are a few world class tennis players from Serbia now.

hmm I agree..people tend to use resources and opportunities more efficiently when the resources are scarce. It's just human nature, take everything for granted. But still..i still think the government can do more in talent searching throughout the country, u know what i mean? do roadshows etc etc or organizing something like malaysian 'badminton' idol :D

[llpjlau]

Who vote in those leaders in every GE?
As voters, who has the power of choice?yes exactly who votes in those leaders? the majority of the people do, or some may argue that they voted themselves in (ballot manipulation etc)
so what are you going to do about it? stand up to BN? you know very well that BN cannot lose in a major general election. they may lose few small seats, but not the main ones.
there is just nothing the malaysian people can do. its just a fact that the government is that way. thats why people have civil wars and revolutions; because they can't do anything else about it. surely, you dont want that to happen in malaysia do you? so just ride with the flow. of course, you can always move to another country.

[azabaz_ipoh]

The problem we have here in Msian is the mentality. We expect the money to come first before the hard work. We need to wake up because the only place where success/money come before hard work is in the dictionary.

actually, Hard work comes first in a dictionary. he he he he. then come money and success. just to lighten up a bit this thread. we are starting to be too cynical. our government is flawed. so are other governments in the world. all i ask is for us to change the way the government treat sports. one thing at a time. yes, i know that is near impossible. maybe if we speak loud enough sooner or later, they will hear us. hope is a wonderful thing.:)

[m_hael99]

actually, Hard work comes first in a dictionary. he he he he. then come money and success. just to lighten up a bit this thread. we are starting to be too cynical. our government is flawed. so are other governments in the world. all i ask is for us to change the way the government treat sports. one thing at a time. yes, i know that is near impossible. maybe if we speak loud enough sooner or later, they will hear us. hope is a wonderful thing.:)

malaysia boleh! :D

hmm is this thread too short..la la la..just to make it longer..

[Pemuda]

[/list]yes exactly who votes in those leaders? the majority of the people do, or some may argue that they voted themselves in (ballot manipulation etc)
so what are you going to do about it? stand up to BN? you know very well that BN cannot lose in a major general election. they may lose few small seats, but not the main ones.
there is just nothing the malaysian people can do. its just a fact that the government is that way. thats why people have civil wars and revolutions; because they can't do anything else about it. surely, you dont want that to happen in malaysia do you? so just ride with the flow. of course, you can always move to another country.

Lets not make assumptions here unless we have the facts. So, I wont comment about your 'ballot manipulation' theory.

"BN cannot lose in a major general election". Well, tell that to the Roman Empire or the old Soviet block. Nothing is forever or everlasting, history have taught us that.

And we dont need to resort to civil wars or revolutions just to change things in Msia. We are living in a civilised society today just in case you are unaware.

I will end this political debate with you by stating that in a democracy we all have a choice.

Now back to Msian badminton ....

[Pemuda]

actually, Hard work comes first in a dictionary. he he he he. then come money and success. just to lighten up a bit this thread. we are starting to be too cynical. our government is flawed. so are other governments in the world. all i ask is for us to change the way the government treat sports. one thing at a time. yes, i know that is near impossible. maybe if we speak loud enough sooner or later, they will hear us. hope is a wonderful thing.:)

You are refering in alphabetical order, I see.

Actually not cynical, it is just our Malaysian make up. It is part of our mentality. We expect the money ... big money before the work. And when our athletes do win something big they get distracted easily and then things will go downhill.

We point our fingers at the government for not doing enough. Why do we still persist on this kind of subsidy mentality?? Look at Tiger Woods for example, the US government certainly didnt give him handouts when he was a kid learning the game. His parents got to fork out money on their own to support his game. Vijay Singh is another fine example. Born in Fiji (do you think the government there funds the game?), he grew up in a middle class family who could not afford to supply him with golf balls, Vijay had to make do with coconuts.

At the end of the day, it is all about desire.

[OneToughBirdie]

I beg to differ a bit here.

I believe KKK in particular dropped the ball after winning the SO. At the highest level, once you take your foot off the pedal you are gonna be found out right away. And yes coupled with the fact that the rest of the field have zeroed in on KKK/TBH's game, it is no wonder to see them struggling.

From the look of things now, I would say our hopes of winning the WC and bringing home an Olympic gold is looking rather dim.

The current slack in KKK/TBH play is a concern to MAS fans and BAM. But MAS chances of winning WC at home with 4 very good pairs, and with WC setup that MAS MD would not meet each other early, I would think that booster MAS chances of winning the first ever WC gold, don't you think so?MAS does not have to rely on KKK/TBH only to deliver the goods.:)

[dunker]

Yep, another malaysian pair winning the WC gold may acctually be a good thing for malaysian badminton.

[llpjlau]

democracy? what democracy is there in malaysia? is is just called a democracy because it has a bicameral parliament, a monarch as the source of power, a de facto head of government and an opposition sitting in the house.
i dont know what background you come from but many people are well aware of the state of "democracy" in malaysia. most of the times it is just not spoken about.

just to clear your mind,
the thread is called "Rafael Nadal - what Malaysian badminton players/sportsmen should learn from"
yes, you say malaysian badminton players should learn from nadal.
then you go on saying that it is the government's fault for all that intervention in our sporting bodies.
then you go on saying that it is the people's fault for supporting such a government.

edit:
oh ya, the Roman Empire fell after the death of Julius Ceasar, which came about from the plot of certain members of the Senate to kill him.
and there was the Russian Revolution....
i dont get your point, no empire lasts forever but both those empires fell because of violence and disillusion.
i dont know when is the day that BN wont be the elected government. perhaps we will see Anuar Ibrahim as prime minister or Lim Kit Siang..

edit2:
okay, lets just assume that the Malaysian system of government is very very democratic. when are you going to find a majority for another politcal party other than BN?

[Krisna]

oh ya, the Roman Empire fell after the death of Julius Ceasar, which came about from the plot of certain members of the Senate to kill him.
and there was the Russian Revolution....
i dont get your point, no empire lasts forever but both those empires fell because of violence and disillusion.


Mmm, no. ...the Roman REPUBLIC was de-facto technically disbanded a few years after Julius Caesar [circa 50 B.C.]. That's when Rome's first Emperor, Augustus Caesar, took control of the whole empire as a de-facto dictator for life. After Augustus, Rome had many many more dictatorial Caesars, including Marcus Aurelius, Maximus' Caesar in the film Gladiator. Yes, the setting of that film happened more than 150 years after the death of Julius Caesar.

Later on, the WESTERN Roman EMPIRE fell circa 400 A.D. due the Hun, Vandal, and finally the Visigoth invasion. While the EASTERN Roman EMPIRE, otherwise known as the Byzantine Empire, fell at around 1400 A.D. to the Ottoman Turks.

I agree with your point that no Empire last forever, but please don't cut Rome's history that short. They ruled Europe, North Africa, and the Asian Minor for a loooonnnnggg time. Note: Rome was established around 700 B.C.! ;)

I know this is Badminton Central and we do not discuss a lot of non-badminton history here, but let's get our general world history correct, shall we?!?

[s1nn3r]

Another thing is that most parents dont want their kids to be a sportman/women in msia because.. you cannot make money.

Is true sport man cant make money althought ppl like LCW make 400k last year but he is the top athelete in Msia. and there could only be few less than 10 sportmans in Msia who earn that much. Further more, the most they can do it for 10yrs?

In another way, If you see a TOp salesman or businessman at the age of LCW can earn maybe millions and their numbers of much more than top atheletes. and their career can last a life time.

Exp: a fren of mine working in dubai earn 15k a mth (Tax free), he is 24 same age as LCW. :)

[dunker]

"democracy"...My sarawakian brother maybe you should go to other countries like N Korea or Sudan or some place like that. THen you would know that even though we in malaysia may not be perfect but i can have a roof over my head, meals to eat when i want and not have to think about dodging bullets when i go for a run. Is our political systam soooo bad? I mean If it is indeed so why dont come back and do somthing about it insted of troting off to another country and blasting the goverment system from there? We are or were talking about the spirit and fire on Rafa in the first place. Well you not happy, stand up and be counted. U cant say that it is all bad, i come from Kapit and at least i see schools being built and efforts to bring my people from jungle dweling denizens to citizens ofthe 21st century. The goverment is not perfect but looking at the big picture, I would say badminton is a small portion of the big socio-political picture. They do well enough in other fields to allow us to live relatively happily in this country. Of coz i have never been to wonderfull Perth, hence i dont now how glorious it is like in AUS, but this is only my narrow minded view, i am sorry if i stamped on anyones toes and tails but thats my take. Have a good day.

[m_hael99]

it's true that there are rooms for improvement but we must admit and identify our weaknesses to be improved on in the first place :) it's ok to include some politics in our discussion but too much of it will result in heated arguments due to differences in opinions so why don't we keep politics down and focus more on badminton :) anyways, i think the bottomline is that everyone would like to see Malaysia prosper and become developed nation by 2020, that includes the development and the maturity of our beloved badminton as well

[s1nn3r]

To be Fair, one man medicine might be another poison...
So there isnt a single winning fomula here....
Things might work for Nadal but not LCW! So we have to plan our move according to our needs & vission!

[llpjlau]

there is nothing sane that can be done. there may be a minimum standard of living but there are so many things the government is incompetent at. for example, equality and justice. how many guilty people have got off? my point is that there is nothing that malaysian citizens can actually do. and many many many people cannot see that. they either think that the government is fine the way it is now or they think that they can actually do something.
they may be able to do simple things like setting up a school in a remote area but that is not all. i agree malaysia is better off than many other nations (goodness sake we can buy US$1 for RM3.50, how good is that compared to other countries) but it is also far behind in many other disciplines like ethics, for one, and racial equality. do you think the NEP has given every single race in Malaysia a fair go?
its just one example of tons of other stuff.
malaysia is good in many different ways, i like malaysia but it is also bad in many different ways.

plus, being an international forum, i think malaysians (some) are the only nationality that say such things about their own players.

[azabaz_ipoh]

it's true that there are rooms for improvement but we must admit and identify our weaknesses to be improved on in the first place :) it's ok to include some politics in our discussion but too much of it will result in heated arguments due to differences in opinions so why don't we keep politics down and focus more on badminton :) anyways, i think the bottomline is that everyone would like to see Malaysia prosper and become developed nation by 2020, that includes the development and the maturity of our beloved badminton as well

i agree. let's stop with the politics. let's concentrate now on the badminton. it is the common factor we all have here. :D

[azabaz_ipoh]

You got to be really good in your respective field then the money will come. Our Nicol David is well off. At her age, I would say she is worth probably over RM1 million. Shalin Zulkifli is also worth around that region too, maybe more even. Esther Cheah is pretty well off. Lee Chong Wei's income is in the higher bracket too.

The problem we have here in Msian is the mentality. We expect the money to come first before the hard work. We need to wake up because the only place where success/money come before hard work is in the dictionary.

Sports is like any career. You need to achieve and be good at what you do before the big bucks come along. You cant be a village champion and expect to rake in the cash, right?

In Msia, the reality is that if you want to be successful in sports it has to be a non team sports like squash, tennis, golf, bowling, badminton.

Put it another way, if poor countries like Ethopia can produced world class long distance runners how come we are not able to do likewise and even be better.

It is down to desire at the end of the day.

You are refering in alphabetical order, I see.

Actually not cynical, it is just our Malaysian make up. It is part of our mentality. We expect the money ... big money before the work. And when our athletes do win something big they get distracted easily and then things will go downhill.

We point our fingers at the government for not doing enough. Why do we still persist on this kind of subsidy mentality?? Look at Tiger Woods for example, the US government certainly didnt give him handouts when he was a kid learning the game. His parents got to fork out money on their own to support his game. Vijay Singh is another fine example. Born in Fiji (do you think the government there funds the game?), he grew up in a middle class family who could not afford to supply him with golf balls, Vijay had to make do with coconuts.

At the end of the day, it is all about desire.

this i very much agree with. maybe malaysian athlete lacks desire. it might be borned of general believe in malaysia that sports will not be enough to make a living of here. like ants said, even parents dont encourage their children to take up sports full time. and really, i dont blame the parents. they are only looking out for their children. education is still the one that can promise a better future. sports have so many risks. not winning enough meaning no money. injuries might mean sudden lost of income. etc...... glory might never come for most of our athletes. so it boils down to desire. wanting it so bad, you dont care what you sacrifice. like nadal. i think even though the money is there, he is still hungry for more victory. difference is, with our athletes, the money is not there. and thus when they do succeed, it is even more remarkable than nadal i think. :D

[llpjlau]

i think tennis players get paid much more than badminton players despite they win or not. for some reason, they all seem rich.

[Pemuda]

democracy? what democracy is there in malaysia? is is just called a democracy because it has a bicameral parliament, a monarch as the source of power, a de facto head of government and an opposition sitting in the house.
i dont know what background you come from but many people are well aware of the state of "democracy" in malaysia. most of the times it is just not spoken about.

just to clear your mind,
the thread is called "Rafael Nadal - what Malaysian badminton players/sportsmen should learn from"
yes, you say malaysian badminton players should learn from nadal.
then you go on saying that it is the government's fault for all that intervention in our sporting bodies.
then you go on saying that it is the people's fault for supporting such a government.

edit:
oh ya, the Roman Empire fell after the death of Julius Ceasar, which came about from the plot of certain members of the Senate to kill him.
and there was the Russian Revolution....
i dont get your point, no empire lasts forever but both those empires fell because of violence and disillusion.
i dont know when is the day that BN wont be the elected government. perhaps we will see Anuar Ibrahim as prime minister or Lim Kit Siang..

edit2:
okay, lets just assume that the Malaysian system of government is very very democratic. when are you going to find a majority for another politcal party other than BN?

No democracy in Msia???!! :o
And when and where did I say that the government is at fault. All I merely asked was who voted and selected their leaders. For someone who claimed that there is no democracy in Msia, I dont blame you actually.

Will be happy to continue this discussion in another political themed blog.

[madturtle]

it's amusing how this has become a political debate. well perhaps KKK loves to play to the crowd, and he's rather well-known for that, but i think he has matured over the years and he has become more serious. you don't see him peppering his play with those funny (and irritating bcos more often than not it doesn't succeed) shots often now. he still has a very long way to go though -- maybe malaysia has to find some sports expert to train the players in the area of consistency (something that China can pull off so well, thats why they are the big powers)

[Pemuda]

I watched both the Msia vs China & Denmark games in the Sudirman Cup and the reality is that countries such as Denmark are now ahead of us while England is a pretty close even. It wont be long before countries like Singapore, HK and Thailand will be challenging us strongly.

In the China game, we were resoundly beaten with LCW getting us a consolation point. Cai/Fu gave our Asian Gold medal, All England and Swiss Open champions a badminton lesson. KKK/TBH were made to llook like ordinary schoolboys. Cai/Fu really upped their game and they really tore KKK/TBH into pieces. No wonder Rexy blew his top and decided to ground this pair.

Time to really dig in if we really aspire to to win the WC or the Olympic gold. Rexy should really crack the whip this time and crack it hard. Bite the bullet and get rid of those dead weight.

[robin7]

Remember what happened to our national heroes when they won the TC back in 1992. They were rewarded money, bungalows, cars and so on. After all the praises and rewards, they were back to square one - disappointment after disappointment.

OVER PROMISE & UNDER DELIVERY, OVER CONFIDENCE & UNDER PERFORMANCE are what I can summarise on MAS squad on major events such as TC, SC & WC.

Is history gonna repeat itself on KKK/TBH? I hope not...

[Pemuda]

Remember what happened to our national heroes when they won the TC back in 1992. They were rewarded money, bungalows, cars and so on. After all the praises and rewards, they were back to square one - disappointment after disappointment.

OVER PROMISE & UNDER DELIVERY, OVER CONFIDENCE & UNDER PERFORMANCE are what I can summarise on MAS squad on major events such as TC, SC & WC.

Is history gonna repeat itself on KKK/TBH? I hope not...

Yes, I remember very well. Not only did their performance went down the gutter, some of the players even went bankrupt as well.

With KKK's attitude, I can see Rexy is fed up.

[Hitman71]

I watched both the Msia vs China & Denmark games in the Sudirman Cup and the reality is that countries such as Denmark are now ahead of us while England is a pretty close even. It wont be long before countries like Singapore, HK and Thailand will be challenging us strongly.

In the China game, we were resoundly beaten with LCW getting us a consolation point. Cai/Fu gave our Asian Gold medal, All England and Swiss Open champions a badminton lesson. KKK/TBH were made to llook like ordinary schoolboys. Cai/Fu really upped their game and they really tore KKK/TBH into pieces. No wonder Rexy blew his top and decided to ground this pair.

Time to really dig in if we really aspire to to win the WC or the Olympic gold. Rexy should really crack the whip this time and crack it hard. Bite the bullet and get rid of those dead weight.



Well keneth were beaten quite badly by LCW, KKK&TBH beat ML/JE convincingly in the 2nd set. MAs WD I don't think that they can handle pressure. Anita Kaur to beat Tina Rassmussen (sp) ??? seriously ...

And who is going to replace Gade,Keneth & ML/JE ???

Beside Clark & Robert who else is there in the mens event for team england ??

IMHO for the Sudirman cup, any country has a good chance to beat m'sia
:D

[Pemuda]

Well keneth were beaten quite badly by LCW, KKK&TBH beat ML/JE convincingly in the 2nd set. MAs WD I don't think that they can handle pressure. Anita Kaur to beat Tina Rassmussen (sp) ??? seriously ...

And who is going to replace Gade,Keneth & ML/JE ???

Beside Clark & Robert who else is there in the mens event for team england ??

IMHO for the Sudirman cup, any country has a good chance to beat m'sia
:D

Well, whether Kenneth was beaten quite badly, ML/JE lost and who is in the pipeline to take over from Gade & co is irrelevant as Denmark won.

[Hitman71]

Denmark won because their womans are better than Mas, but at least Mas are doing something about it, by sending their younger players to play in the event. The point is, Mas team in sudirman cup is weak bcoz of their woman player, and Den winning over Mas is expected. End, HK, S'pore & Thai are already strong contender for MAS in sudirman cup, but to overtake MAS in mens event is bit overrated I think.

[s1nn3r]

Denmark won because their womans are better than Mas, but at least Mas are doing something about it, by sending their younger players to play in the event. The point is, Mas team in sudirman cup is weak bcoz of their woman player, and Den winning over Mas is expected. End, HK, S'pore & Thai are already strong contender for MAS in sudirman cup, but to overtake MAS in mens event is bit overrated I think.

Mas has strong tradition in mens event & we have strong foundation in almost every district. This kind of foundation isnt build overnight, I doubt HK, Spore & Thai would be able to challenge Mas mens overall strength in the next 10yrs. But they might produce 1 or 2 good players in that periods. :cool:

[Pemuda]

Denmark won because their womans are better than Mas, but at least Mas are doing something about it, by sending their younger players to play in the event. The point is, Mas team in sudirman cup is weak bcoz of their woman player, and Den winning over Mas is expected. End, HK, S'pore & Thai are already strong contender for MAS in sudirman cup, but to overtake MAS in mens event is bit overrated I think.

A win is a win. If we say Denmark women are stronger than we should also say that given MAS government funding and support for the game arent MAS expected to produce some decent women shuttlers??

Nothing is overrated in today's competitive sports world. MAS used to eat Japan for lunch in football in the 60s, 70s and 80s but look where is the Japanese team now?? HK, Singapore & Thailand are coming up in badminton. Even the USA have won the men's doubles title in the last WC , if I am not wrong.

[OneToughBirdie]

[quote=Pemuda;600169]HK, Singapore & Thailand are coming up in badminton. Even the USA have won the men's doubles title in the last WC , if I am not wrong.

Sing depends on import to raise their standard, ditto for HK too. MAS generally over the years does not produce strong women badders...MAS women seem not passionate as their men partners...Japan and England and maybe USA, if I am not mistaken, were world beaters prior to the domination of the CHN and INA.

[Pemuda]

Sing depends on import to raise their standard, ditto for HK too. MAS generally over the years does not produce strong women badders...MAS women seem not passionate as their men partners...Japan and England and maybe USA, if I am not mistaken, were world beaters prior to the domination of the CHN and INA.

Wait a minute here. Depends on import to raise their standard??? What about Yang Yang, Morten Frost, Li Mao, Han Jian, Rexy etc etc. Arent they 'imports'? Brought in to raise our standards??? Or is it different for us because we are Msians and thus can be biased??

Mind you , USA won the mens' doubles in the last WC. And England in the mixed doubles has a top class pair.