Yonex rackets= inferior quality?

[bertbrainz]

Hi fellow badders,
Here in Singapore, Stringers in Singapore claim that Yonex rackets are not able to take high tension, above 24. But other brands like apacs etc can take higher tension. Is it true? Whats the highest tension you guys ever strung on your Yonex rackets? Please state model and country code. Does the difference in Country code makes a difference in the racket's ability to take high tension? Many Thanks.
Regards,
Bertbrainz

[Matt]

Sounds like a bunch of non-sense regarding the Yonex part.

[bertbrainz]

Stringers in Singapore usually say that they cant string high tensions on yonex rackets. Or maybe its just the stringer that i usually go to? Singaporeans any views?

[DinkAlot]

I string Yonex rackets regularly from 28x31lbs. to as high as 31x34lbs. with no problems whatsoever.

[Pete LSD]

And I string at 32 lbs X 35.2 lbs under drop-weight constant pull :p:D. The point is most baddie rackets can take 30 lbs.

[bertbrainz]

What about the country code? Does it make a difference? In Singapore usually when i want string at 25lbs, they wouldnt let me do it.

[Pete LSD]

I have SP coded rackets with no problems at all.

Did you mean that the stringer wouldn't string 25 lbs for you?


What about the country code? Does it make a difference? In Singapore usually when i want string at 25lbs, they wouldnt let me do it.

[bertbrainz]

yes. They wouldnt string 25lbs for me. They say that yonex recommended tension is only 18-22lbs. So they wouldnt recommend tension so high on a yonex racket.

[DinkAlot]

I have SP coded rackets with no problems at all.

Did you mean that the stringer wouldn't string 25 lbs for you?

Concur, SP code = no problems. My Cab 20 SPs say recommended tension is 16-22lbs. I've strung one as high as 30x33lbs. That's like 32x35 on an iso. :p

[bertbrainz]

Thanks alot for the input guys. Maybe we can hear more from the other Singaporeans. Does anyone in Singapore second what i experienced?

[DinkAlot]

I believe they are just trying to be safe, don't want any liability. That's all.

[cooler]

Concur, SP code = no problems. My Cab 20 SPs say recommended tension is 16-22lbs. I've strung one as high as 30x33lbs. That's like 32x35 on an iso. :p
u just help supporting my other post in cab explosion thread that iso needed higher tension to achieve explosiveness of a cab strung at lower tension:)

[Pete LSD]

Oh dear, let's not bring in the CAB explosiveness thread here. Okay, where is that EZ filter that Master NGP is selling for US$19.99?

[bertbrainz]

haa, but wont the strings snap when you guys are stringing at such high tensions?

[Blurry D]

I believe they are just trying to be safe, don't want any liability. That's all.

I believe that too.Yonex are expensive so stringer decides not to take the responsibility.

Yonex are build to be strong so i dont think you should worry.

On another note, Is it true that when you buy a racket.You need to strung it at the prescribes tension and the later one string it at other higher tension?

[h4n5ip]

That's rubbish. I think your stringer will do at 25lbs or more if you say "I'll take the responsibility"
My At700 Sp is currently string at 27/29 lbs. It's still in one piece thoo.

[cooler]

Oh dear, let's not bring in the CAB explosiveness thread here. Okay, where is that EZ filter that Master NGP is selling for US$19.99?


nah, u worry too much, like those stringers in Singapore :p:p

[sifuyono]

I string Yonex rackets regularly from 28x31lbs. to as high as 31x34lbs. with no problems whatsoever.
no problem for you....:eek::eek:
can't you hear the racket crying dan??..:D:D:D

[smashing boy]

usully the stringers dont string the racket for to high tension because they dont know is the racket is damage or not,so they afraid.you just have to find some pro stringer to string for your racket string high tension have to got some skill one.my ti 6,i string at 28-30 7year already still the same old racket.:D

[bertbrainz]

I see. So its safe to do right? Because i just got my stringing machine and i am thinking whether or not should i string it so high. Thanks for the input guys.

[DinkAlot]

I see. So its safe to do right? Because i just got my stringing machine and i am thinking whether or not should i string it so high. Thanks for the input guys.

It's only safe if you are competent at stringing at that tension.

A person who does not know how to string can be dangerous stringing at 15lbs. While a seasoned, good stringer could string the same racket at 34lbs. and have no problems.

[silentheart]

I said it before and I am saying it again, IT IS FOR WARRANTY ISSUE! So, if it is an older racquet that is older than 1 yr, go for higher tension because warranty is over anyway.

[DinkAlot]

I said it before and I am saying it again, IT IS FOR WARRANTY ISSUE! So, if it is an older racquet that is older than 1 yr, go for higher tension because warranty is over anyway.

But we all know Panda and Pete string their rackets at 18lbs. :p

[kikks9]

that means we puny humans must be stringing ours at 9 pounds :P


But we all know Panda and Pete string their rackets at 18lbs. :p

[Athelete1234]

that means we puny humans must be stringing ours at 9 pounds :P
And Cooldoob strings at 1lb.:p

[silentheart]

Dear NGP,
Should I change my userid to silenttear or silentcry for all the torture you put on those innocent racquet?
Thanks
Your #1 fan.

[twobeer]

Stringers in Singapore usually say that they cant string high tensions on yonex rackets. Or maybe its just the stringer that i usually go to? Singaporeans any views?

I would assume the major issue is that Yonex only guarantees very low tension on their rackets Like (21lbs on a 4U AT700 (old model) ), And maybe they don't warrant claims in Singapore if tension above their "recommended" is used..

Other makers may have a more generous warranties, and often has higher "reccomended" tension for their rackets..

We all know that Yonex rackets CAN be strung at high-tension (no Yonex sponsored pro uses below 25lbs to my knowledge).. The tricky part is who is gonna replace your racket if it breaks for the stringer, I suppose..

/Twobeer

[jerby]

well, take a look from the shopowners point of view (I take the stringers work at a shop?)
You sell rackets,and on those rackets it says 18-24lbs. You sell the racket to a guy who asks it to be strung at 28lbs.

scenario one: shopowner strings it himself, player breaks it and claims warranty...warranty doesn't apply, because it's strung at 28lbs...But the shopowner himself strung it...How is he supposed to tell his customer?

scenario two: shopowner says no...customers goes somewhere else and voids his warranty there. Same result, no hassle for the shopowner...

(worst-case scenarios offcourse)

[twobeer]

Added to this I think Yonex have had some major issues with some of their rackets (many shops Withdrev MP55 in Denmark because of frame collapses, The ISO-TI series also broke quite easilly).. Personally I experience serious qualty issues with the early Nanospeeds..

Today It seems Yonex is moving "slowly" in the right direction.. Quality of AT900T/P seems top notch, and recommended tension has been raised a bit (for AT700 for example) etc..

The latest NS and ATs I have bought/strung have been much better quality than a few years back, But styill Yonex "recommended" tension is still ridicliously low (especially compared to competitors)..

Cheers,
Twobeer

[XtC-604]

no problem for you....:eek::eek:
can't you hear the racket crying dan??..:D:D:D


31x34 lbs...isn't all that serious, except shouldn't it be 32x34?

My input on this thread is that your stringer is a piece of crap...unless your racquet has clash marks all over and looks like its going to break, if not then your stringer is just a cheapskate that doesn't wanna take liability in his faulty stringing skills, because if he sucks at stringing the racquet will be able to take the abuse if its in the prescribed tensions, but at higher ones the racquet will not be able to withstand crappy stringing.

[cooler]

31x34 lbs...isn't all that serious, except shouldn't it be 32x34?

My input on this thread is that your stringer is a piece of crap...unless your racquet has clash marks all over and looks like its going to break, if not then your stringer is just a cheapskate that doesn't wanna take liability in his faulty stringing skills, because if he sucks at stringing the racquet will be able to take the abuse if its in the prescribed tensions, but at higher ones the racquet will not be able to withstand crappy stringing.No, it's basic economics. It is cheaper to lose business of stringing extreme high tension rackets than to fork out $$$ for broken rackets strung at higher than warrantied tension.

[jerby]

31x34 lbs...isn't all that serious, except shouldn't it be 32x34?

My input on this thread is that your stringer is a piece of crap...unless your racquet has clash marks all over and looks like its going to break, if not then your stringer is just a cheapskate that doesn't wanna take liability in his faulty stringing skills, because if he sucks at stringing the racquet will be able to take the abuse if its in the prescribed tensions, but at higher ones the racquet will not be able to withstand crappy stringing.
31x110%= 34,1
32x110%= 35,2
so...no :o

even with the best stringers worldwide, taking 2 hours to do the best job at 30lbs they can do....**** still happens, and the stringers doesn't know what kind of player/person stands before him, I can't blame him for not risking his neck (though, if he explained everything and all risks, there might be an opening)
I certainly wouldn't call him a piece of crap, I'd call him smart/wise for knowing his of limitations...Better than a half-certain sweaty "ohhh, ehh sure, I can try, can't I?":p:D

[silentheart]

OK, I had a conversation with Yonex rep last week. I ponder a very long time and decided not to post our conversation earlier. However, I think this might be a good place to bring it up. Yonex set "recommended rension" for badminton racquet for following reason.
1) Playability
2) Warranty Issue
3) Stringer

Reason
1) We are not pros. Many of us play just for fun and love of the game. Does Joe Bruin know anything about badminton? 95% chance says "NO". So Yonex recommend a tension range to give best of combination of power, control, string life and sweet spot size. For many of us BCBF members, we know our racquets, we know the tension we like, we know where the sweet spot is on our racquet (assuming we usually hit it) and warranty is usually not in the back of our mind. Yonex is more than OK for people like you and me (except twobeer after he had 2 beers) to string to whatever tension we like (up to 36lb. Why? String will break and cause the frame to warp)
2) Following the #1, Most of damage to the badminton frame is done when the string break. Example, when you break the center main near the top, you actually lost tension to all 4 center mains. That is a lot of stress at the 12 o'clockof the frame. (Yonex has been guessing that might be #1 cause of highnoon) So if you string a NS9k-s at 24lb vs 30lb main, you there is actually 24lb difference at 12 o'clock of the frame or 96lb vs 120lb force. Just imagin you pull your frame at 120lb at top. Guess what, it is going to break. Think about it, after a few string breaks at high tension, your frame is going to have structual damage.
3) Tell me which one of the stringer you use is certified? If you don't know, How the hell is Yonex is going to know? Yes we are experienced bunch here and we know what to do. But out side of our little family here, does prople at Sportchex or Big5 know now to string a badminton racquet? How many badminton racquet do they string a year? How comfortable are you when you hand your badminton racquet to a 20 yr. old punk in Sports Authority vs a middle age shop owner? (the 20 yr old is most likely learned from the 21 yr old who just quit 2 week ago) Yonex has no control over these stringer factors.

Many of us stress this point. Find a good experienced stringer in your area. get to know him/her and just stick with that stringer as long as you can. It will take may be 1 or 2 restring to get to your right tension, after you know what to tell the stringer to get the tension you want. I like the stringer in the beginning. He know there is a liability issue. He know he might not be experienced enought to do the job right. At this point, you still have a good racquet, not a broken racquet.

Have a nice badminton weekend.

[Pete LSD]

Dink it! Somehow you read my mind :D


31x110%= 34,1
32x110%= 35,2
so...no :o

even with the best stringers worldwide, taking 2 hours to do the best job at 30lbs they can do....**** still happens, and the stringers doesn't know what kind of player/person stands before him, I can't blame him for not risking his neck (though, if he explained everything and all risks, there might be an opening)
I certainly wouldn't call him a piece of crap, I'd call him smart/wise for knowing his of limitations...Better than a half-certain sweaty "ohhh, ehh sure, I can try, can't I?":p:D

[twobeer]

OK, I had a conversation with Yonex rep last week. I ponder a very long time and decided not to post our conversation earlier. However, I think this might be a good place to bring it up. Yonex set "recommended rension" for badminton racquet for following reason.
1) Playability
2) Warranty Issue
3) Stringer

Reason
1) We are not pros. Many of us play just for fun and love of the game. Does Joe Bruin know anything about badminton? 95% chance says "NO". So Yonex recommend a tension range to give best of combination of power, control, string life and sweet spot size. For many of us BCBF members, we know our racquets, we know the tension we like, we know where the sweet spot is on our racquet (assuming we usually hit it) and warranty is usually not in the back of our mind. Yonex is more than OK for people like you and me (except twobeer after he had 2 beers) to string to whatever tension we like (up to 36lb. Why? String will break and cause the frame to warp)


Most Joe Bruins, don't buy top-of-the-line rackets. Most Joe Bruins does not even break their original strings. Most casual players would not even ask for high-tension stringing (thus no problem to begin with .-) )... And certainly stringers will most certainly not use 30lbs or so tension if they are not asked by the customer :-).

I would think 95% of the buyers of AT900P is not equivalent of 95% percentile of the MP21 buyers.. So if the playability issue was a biggie, I would assume there would be a bigger variance in reccomended tension between the models targeted for different cosnumers...



2) Following the #1, Most of damage to the badminton frame is done when the string break. Example, when you break the center main near the top, you actually lost tension to all 4 center mains. That is a lot of stress at the 12 o'clockof the frame. (Yonex has been guessing that might be #1 cause of highnoon) So if you string a NS9k-s at 24lb vs 30lb main, you there is actually 24lb difference at 12 o'clock of the frame or 96lb vs 120lb force. Just imagin you pull your frame at 120lb at top. Guess what, it is going to break. Think about it, after a few string breaks at high tension, your frame is going to have structual damage.


There are numerous ways a racket can break. Clashes, Incorrect stringinng, hitting the floor, posts, partner, shuttle and also breakge whe strings snaps, that are not directly linked to the tension (of course higher tension means higher stress in general of the frame, leading to higher risk). So i don't see how this can be directlhy linked to the max-tension warranty claims, as the racket can break in most of these ways regardless if recommended tension or high-tension strining is used.

I doubt many would try to claim warranty if they strung at 30lbs and the frame warped when a string snapped in game... (I am always embarrased if my string breakage doesn't occur in the sweetspot :D )

I've seen plenty of low-tensionsed rackets break as well, and I bet a really bad stringer can break most rackets as well stringing within recommended tension.

I also think string breakage issues ec. are no different for Yonex, than for other brands like Forza, Carlton, SOTX, Victor, Tactiv etc etc. all having higher recommended max-tensions on their top-models..

An interesting note here is that I just got a Forza TI-45 (Yes its spanking new :-) ) and it has NO recommended or max tension at all printed on it.. interesting :-)



3) Tell me which one of the stringer you use is certified? If you don't know, How the hell is Yonex is going to know? Yes we are experienced bunch here and we know what to do. But out side of our little family here, does prople at Sportchex or Big5 know now to string a badminton racquet? How many badminton racquet do they string a year? How comfortable are you when you hand your badminton racquet to a 20 yr. old punk in Sports Authority vs a middle age shop owner? (the 20 yr old is most likely learned from the 21 yr old who just quit 2 week ago) Yonex has no control over these stringer factors.


Well, This is also nothing unique for Yonex.. If nothing else Yonex has a greater chance of having stringers educated on their stringingpatterns and how to best string their models (as they are the market-leader).. Smaller brands would have even bigger problems to "educate" stringers on how to best string their rackets at high-tensions, and probably the stringer are less experienced with these models.. Still they have higher recommendations and warranties. So the explanation seems "dodgy" to me :-)

cheers,
Twobeer

[XtC-604]

i agree with twobeer, yonex prescribed tensions are quite low...i think that my steel carlton would be able to take atleast 25lbs, so theres no reason why the highest recommended tension for any yonex racquet i've seen is only freaken 25lbs?!

[silentheart]

Thank you Twobeer,

I am just posting the conversation I remembered. Here is my thought.
1) Most of people do not know badminton as much as you. However, they come up to a shop and ask what is the best racquet? What is the most expensive racquet? Without knowing their playing style and skillset. Without demo a racquet. They buy a AT700, NS6000, or a MP99. Then the shop owner ask them what tension would you like on it. The user either say mid or high tension. When that happen, what is mid? what is high? Every one has different tension preference. I think it is right for Yonex to set a standard and use it as recommendation range for low/mid/high.
2) I hope both you and I agrre that 5~10% over the recom tension is reasonable. I often string racquets for pepole at 2 lb over Yonex recom tension. I never had RMA problem when the tension is just 1 or 2 lb over. People request high tension are experienced palyer and they know the rule. They know the limit of the racquet. I agree with you that "Recommanded Tension" means absolutly nothing to you and me. However, I do unerstand what he is saying is that racquet will hold when stringbed is fine. When center main snap, the stress is very high and at > 30lb tension. Racquets will survive a couple time before the structure damage start and string break more freq when it is high tension. So these kind of stress happen more freq. No matter what, it is not good for the racquet.
3) Only very few manufacture offer replacement warranty on their warranty. To reduce the cost of warranty insurance, they need to set a range to cut the warranty claims.

Sorry for not pointing out the read between the line. Here is the moral of the story. It is all about the profit and money.

[Optiblue]

I don't believe yonex is not as durable, I've strung both my mp100 and my ns9kx @ 30lbs and they're CD coded~ I've also done my so called "fragile" aerotus 110 CD at 28lbs and my mp100 CP at 29lbs and no problems so far! The grommets rip, but the racquet frame is fine

[LazyBuddy]

I believe they are just trying to be safe, don't want any liability. That's all.

Yes, especially if there's warranty concerns.

In addtional, I was told some store owners creates their own "stories" to push customers to other brands, in order to gain more profit margin. :cool:

[twobeer]

Thank you Twobeer,

I am just posting the conversation I remembered. Here is my thought.
1) Most of people do not know badminton as much as you. However, they come up to a shop and ask what is the best racquet? What is the most expensive racquet? Without knowing their playing style and skillset. Without demo a racquet. They buy a AT700, NS6000, or a MP99. Then the shop owner ask them what tension would you like on it. The user either say mid or high tension. When that happen, what is mid? what is high? Every one has different tension preference. I think it is right for Yonex to set a standard and use it as recommendation range for low/mid/high.


For argument sake, lets assume the customer in the obove case thinks the Armortec 700 is to expensive and buys an APAC Armopower 700 from the shop which seems similar in desing but much less expensive. The shop owner asks him what tension he wants, and he says mid.. what will the shop owner do?? The Apacs has "max 30lbs written on it" (most likely he will get 20lbs or less) thats my guess anyway..

Also if the customer had said he wanted high-tension stringing from the shop, Don't you think its a bit wrong to give him 23lbs??



2) I hope both you and I agrre that 5~10% over the recom tension is reasonable. I often string racquets for pepole at 2 lb over Yonex recom tension. I never had RMA problem when the tension is just 1 or 2 lb over. People request high tension are experienced palyer and they know the rule. They know the limit of the racquet. I agree with you that "Recommanded Tension" means absolutly nothing to you and me. However, I do unerstand what he is saying is that racquet will hold when stringbed is fine. When center main snap, the stress is very high and at > 30lb tension. Racquets will survive a couple time before the structure damage start and string break more freq when it is high tension. So these kind of stress happen more freq. No matter what, it is not good for the racquet.


I see the point. But when I refer to warranties on stringing tension I really refer to the ability to carefully be able to string it up to that tension without the frame collapsing. It's a differnt thing if it breaks during play (mishits, clashes & racket abuse) i think.

3) Only very few manufacture offer replacement warranty on their warranty. To reduce the cost of warranty insurance, they need to set a range to cut the warranty claims.

Don't know how consumer laws are where you live. But over here you are obliged by law to replace products or get refund if there is a manufacture defect on them.



Sorry for not pointing out the read between the line. Here is the moral of the story. It is all about the profit and money.

Sure :-) If I where making rackets and could get away with a only having warranty up to 12lbs, I would be very happy and could probably avoid lots of claims (or get lots of goodwill by pointing out that I will replace it despite the warranty actually was voided :-) ).

/T

[silentheart]

Without CD6, we actually have great conversation and good and civilized debate. I feel good... Thank you all.

[zerosaber]

i heard that some rackets for yonex can go up to even 36 pounds
my friend strings his rackets at 26 lbs so yeah ...

[smashing boy]

yonex racket can string at 34pound i see it before,this year at abc i saw the yonex stringer string the higher tension is 34pound and many player is using the 34pound.If the racket is broken yonex got the guarantee my friend buy a nano9000 it is broken went he is crashing with his partner and he got a brand new one,it is depend on the seller how to write the guarantee letter,if the seller want help sure got new one.

[Pete LSD]

Don't speak so soon. There is always another one :D.


Without CD6, we actually have great conversation and good and civilized debate. I feel good... Thank you all.

[wocdam]

let me relate my experience with a shop over 2 decades in singapore. the shopowner is in his late 50s, sells lots of yonex rackets over all these years. the thing is, if you buy a new racket from him, he knows how the condition of the racket is, and if you want higher tension, say 28lbs for MP99 (rec 24lbs), he will do it. however, if you bring your own racket there, same model, chances are he will only string at 26lbs if the racket seems to be in a good condition. he will inspect each racket before telling you what he can deliver. if upon insisting by the customer, he will tell the customer that he holds no gurantees for breakage. so far, after 20 years, i have not seen anyone complained about his workmanship. so it's basically about whether the stringer wants to take the risk or not. for your info, I bought a MP100 from him and got it strung at 31lbs.