Can the Malaysian win a gold medal? [Archive] - Page 2 - Badminton Central Discussion Forums

eaglehelang

02-26-2008, 05:49 AM

Of course not. Capturing the eagle with bare hands is almost an impossible feat! :)

He he esp this is eagle + helang, must catch 2 eagles.

Is it you target for two golds, but got one is good enough lah? :D
And even if you can't achieve two, you won't regret hah? :D:D:D

In real life, miracles(if one believes there's such thing) do happen to those who have faith to believe - but that's for our own life. But we are not the one who's participating in OG, the gold isnt for us to achieve, so, difficult to say.

That's why Xball only bet 1 miserable coconut drink. :rolleyes:

Hahaha, ok bet you a cocounut drink that Malaysia wins two golds.

Only ONE coconut drink, tsk, tsk, so stingy.

In any case, I'm rooting for Msia 'underdog' sports - sailing, archery. Too bad, Wushu isnt official OG sport yet, just exhibition(is that correct?) we have lady World Champ for that.

X Ball

02-26-2008, 05:54 AM

He he esp this is eagle + helang, must catch 2 eagles.

In real life, miracles(if one believes there's such thing) do happen to those who have faith to believe - but that's for our own life. But we are not the one who's participating in OG, the gold isnt for us to achieve, so, difficult to say.

That's why Xball only bet 1 miserable coconut drink. :rolleyes:

Only ONE coconut drink, tsk, tsk, so stingy.

In any case, I'm rooting for Msia 'underdog' sports - sailing, archery. Too bad, Wushu isnt official OG sport yet, just exhibition(is that correct?) we have lady World Champ for that.

Hahaha, I don't want to win too much from you, in case I win. Forget about the other sport -- just watch.

Winston_T

02-26-2008, 08:37 AM

yeah right....an unofficial tourney which was cut off in 2007 :cool: Whereas, the Asian Games has a long history and tradition :rolleyes::cool:

Oh....the AG will be held in Guangzhou in 2 years time, in case you didn't know about it. How about asking the organizer to cancel it as well, like the Invitational World Cup, if it is such an unimportant and unofficial tourney :eek::rolleyes:;)

OT: Funny but unsubstantiated comments. If it is so UNOFFICIAL and so UNIMPORTANT, those countries will not have spent so much time and money to bid for hosting it once every 4 years :cool: Oh....if China were to think that the AG is as you mention, they would just send their backup players to most of the sports :eek:

the objective to host AG 2010:
to attract foreign tourists (financial & economic reason)

2 rich countries, Kor & Qatar (even Qatar was not so good in sports) also wants to host AG bcoz of the reason.

CLEAR?

Pemuda

02-26-2008, 08:37 AM

Errr....on the contrary, Jung Jae Sung/Lee Jae Jin are no pushovers either :o
They ranked among the top 5 pairs before Jung Jae Sung was eventually paired up with Lee Yong Dae and Lee Jae Jin with Hwang Ji Man.

We'll see...of course, as an INA-fan, I have a selfish thought which I wouldn't reveal here :rolleyes::D:p

Errrr x 2 .... Jung Jae Sung/Lee Jae Jin were only very recently paired back together again in HCM after playing with their respective regular partners for sometime. And yet they still managed to put their game together and beat KKK/TBH!! :eek::eek::eek:

Errrr x 3 ... how long have KKK/TBH been paired together? ;)

Well, the writing is already on the wall .... but we will see .... indeed. ;)

Pemuda

02-26-2008, 08:47 AM

Well... you keep on harping on your 1st paragraph above ;) and other issues, in which many already know, so you cannot get angry when other people 'harp'. Other people 'harp' you dont like, you keep on repeating/harping can(remember I said before 2X in the other thread you dont have to sharp about it) of course-lah, we 'harp' back. So, it's even.:)

I'm stating the facts of media reports, which are documented in black & white, which has been happening in Msian media scene for many years. In which other non-Msians (here & Offline) also have commented as to the critical nature of Msia's media & some say Msian fans - in which the non-Msians here already pointed out as such to you.

In which is also a reply to your post of "You need to get this thru your head; no one is beating up shuttlers who gave their all. Only those with a big time Charlie attitude and then get beaten is taken to task. Do you understand the difference now?"

I was just pointing out the facts in real life it is not so in the media reports over the years.
More recent example, is HK 2007 when LCW played with injured knee & lost to LD. When he commented about the bad line calls, he is said to be "whining, mentally weak". Was LCW condition in HK 2007 considered to be 'not giving his all'- no one is beating up shuttlers who gave their all??.
When knee injury was the reason given for his Semi F lost to BCL in Denmark Open, it was said to be giving excuses. It only slowed down when he won the next tourney - French Open.
Compare to how China media's treatment/ how they slant the story to LD Korea 2008 incident.
And since when LCW has "big time Charlie attitude"? He hasnt won the 4 major titles - AE, AG, OG, WC. Walks with head looking down to the ground most times.

It is to emphasize that in real life, it is not like what you often say fans "sabre playing" or the players "modly cuddled", or that all concerned "over the moon" with celebrations (that's what you said about SEA Games 2007); in recent times, no such thing, esp in men's department.

"Only those with a big time Charlie attitude and then get beaten is taken to task" ??? - no such thing, the back up players get it when they lose, the top players get it even more. Results is what counts to the powers-that-be, no matter how hard the players try, or give their all, if they did not achieve the objective set, that's it.
And those comments via media are documented as proof.

WCH said bf (since you admire WCH) when he was no 1 MS that when players win titles, the expectation is they must keep on delivering good results, failure to keep to that will be scrutinized, that's the situation in Msia.

And again the above are also facts, not assumptions or speculations, anyone can do a search & find the articles.

So, as long as you keep stating those paragraphs you posted or along those lines, I will keep pointing out that media did not state so.

Dear,

Stop beating around the bush. Lets get straight to the point, shall we??

This thread is about whether Msia being able to win a gold in Beijing. My answer is a big straight up no. And the writing is already on the wall when KKK/TBH got nicely packed away by some makeshift last minute Korean pair.

Our newspapers reports etc ... I take that with a pinch of salt as I am a firm believer of free press.

And the facts are Msia dont have a WC or an Olympic gold to show todate.

It is also a fact that our shuttlers can easily be side tracked after winning one major title i.e Thomas Cup 92, Hafiz's AE and KKK/TBH's situation now of which Rexy have ranted a few times.

AE will be starting soon, lets just wait and see.

Pemuda

02-26-2008, 08:54 AM

'There is no we here'.
I guess that is why you are deaf (perhaps the right word is blind).

Yeah facts -- your facts, nobody else's. Petty insults ? What else do you expect for people like you - praises ? And holding a discussion with you ? Only you think this is holding a discussion with you -- nobody else does and how sad.

Blind?? Got no other alternatives but to throw more petty insults, eh?
Well, am happy for you. Real classy of you.

Winston_T

02-26-2008, 08:55 AM

OT: Funny but unsubstantiated comments. If it is so UNOFFICIAL and so UNIMPORTANT, those countries will not have spent so much time and money to bid for hosting it once every 4 years :cool: Oh....if China were to think that the AG is as you mention, they would just send their backup players to most of the sports :eek:

as I said it before, CHN doesn't care about AG 06.
even they send 63% of younger athletes.
since 1982, CHN is the best in Asia.
CHN govt wants their athletes to got some experience, so they can perform very well in OG 08.

CHINA won 165 golds in AG 06. JPN & KOR only around 90 - 100 golds. Ina only 2 golds.
what else to pursue?

Pemuda

02-26-2008, 09:00 AM

In the 1st place,it was a reply to wilfred's post, has certain meaning, related to his earlier posts.

Distracted with stuff off court?? It's documented that TBH is the weak line of the combo due to:
1) Park Joo Bong atrributed KKK/TBH's loss in WC 2007 to TBH's nervousness. And you know very well which pair PJB is coaching. This was Sept 2007.

2) Lars/Jonas atrributed their win over KKK/TBH to TBH's 'nervousness" & targetted TBH in MO 2008. This was Jan 2008

3) Rexy said TBH wake up in the morning, already feel the pressure - this was after MO 2008 lost.

4) Assistant coach Pang said in Feb 2008 that now TBH has 'fear of losing". As a result, he plays safe, doesnt dare take risks like he used to. They are helping TBH to "regain his confidence". Pang also said TBH goes for extra training, on top of the usual one, he's very hardworking.

5) Reporters asked Rexy about no 4), Rexy said TBH has fear of making errors- "takut melakukan kesilapan, takut ini, takut itu, bila ada banyak ketakutan, mudah melakukan kesilapan." This was Feb 2008, before going for TC qualifiers.

Hence, Badmania's (as you know, he's Indonesia & an ardent Indonesia fan) post to you about TBH's nervousness.

6) Those who watched the game between KKK/TBH & LJJ/Jung (including myself) all said TBH is nervous. He was the only Msia player who did not smile during prize presentation, instead he looked sad/dissappointed/dejected. Maybe you watch the game again aft it's uploaded, see for yourself.

So, it is not becoming prima donna or sthing along those lines - which you have mentioned in one of the threads, refering to specifically to TBH's dyed hair & branded clothing.

So, based on your long posting above, as long as this TBH's thingy is not cured, KKK/TBH will get beaten by some hastily put together scratched pair?? :confused:

ctjcad

02-26-2008, 09:01 AM

....and all (or most) of us should be populating that sub-forum??...are we going to ignore the upcoming AE, too??..:confused: :cool:

...
My friend, he, he, I thought you werent getting involved in all this, you also cannot 'tahan', tsk tsk....:p;) to you too
..i was looking for badMania's previews of the German Open's rounds/matches, but couldn't find them...;)

eaglehelang

02-26-2008, 09:47 AM

Dear,

Stop beating around the bush. Lets get straight to the point, shall we??

1) This thread is about whether Msia being able to win a gold in Beijing. My answer is a big straight up no. And the writing is already on the wall when KKK/TBH got nicely packed away by some makeshift last minute Korean pair.

2) Our newspapers reports etc ... I take that with a pinch of salt as I am a firm believer of free press.

3) And the facts are Msia dont have a WC or an Olympic gold to show todate.

4) It is also a fact that our shuttlers can easily be side tracked after winning one major title i.e Thomas Cup 92, Hafiz's AE and KKK/TBH's situation now of which Rexy have ranted a few times.

5) AE will be starting soon, lets just wait and see.

Well... you started it... ;) + make such similar statements many times

1) you already said that dozens of times, we already know that
The thread is "Can Malaysia win gold?" - not necessarily from badminton, which already been discussed in preceding pages.

Yes, we already know how it looks about KKK/TBH's chances, it's discussed in 2008 TC/Uber Prelimary thread.

2) That doesnt discount the fact that the media wrote it, in black & white. I also already wrote many times in other threads, along the lines that - in private could be different...

3) You just said that in the post before that, AGAIN, we already know that very well.
4) You also already said that many times in many threads, every opportunity you get, we already know that.
Wlifred already answered this one, & a few other BCers, it's a matter of perspective.
Yes Rexy has ranted in 2007, in public, in private we dunno (you say you take the media reports with a pinch of salt mah).
Look at his public stance this year 2008, esp of TBH, in private, we also dunno. As to how KKK/TBH really are in real life, Ants already gave his points many times.

If you really feel strongly about all the points you have presented in earlier posts & other threads, take some actual action, dont just complain about it.

5) Yup, we shall see in AE & OG

badMania

02-26-2008, 09:49 AM

eaglehelang

02-26-2008, 09:55 AM

So, based on your long posting above, as long as this TBH's thingy is not cured, KKK/TBH will get beaten by some hastily put together scratched pair?? :confused:

Badmania already replied you on that in this thread & he's not Msian fan. They said what they said, make your own conclusion, you dont agree with most of my views anyway, no point to discuss.
If you really want to know, ask Rexy or Pang (like Huang does) what they actually meant.

eaglehelang

02-26-2008, 09:58 AM

....and all (or most) of us should be populating that sub-forum??...are we going to ignore the upcoming AE, too??..:confused: :cool:

..i was looking for badMania's previews of the German Open's rounds/matches, but couldn't find them...;)

Oh sorry, that paragraph was meant for Badmania.

German Open involve very few Msians cos Msia had to play for TC/Uber qualifiers & whole senior squad have 3 day team building camp this week.

AE, of course I'll 'fly' there when it's on.

koo_fan

02-26-2008, 10:00 AM

as I said it before, CHN doesn't care about AG 06.
even they send 63% of younger athletes.
since 1982, CHN is the best in Asia.
CHN govt wants their athletes to got some experience, so they can perform very well in OG 08.

CHINA won 165 golds in AG 06. JPN & KOR only around 90 - 100 golds. Ina only 2 golds.
what else to pursue?
I do respected China n its peoples from being Asian pride.

But ur post.ur thoughts.ur words.
i doubt myself if i should support China in Olympic.u are asia's only chance to grab the title from USA.
U did have support from asians.dont ruined it.

huangkwokhau

02-26-2008, 10:01 AM

Badmania already replied you on that in this thread & he's not Msian fan. Make your own conclusion, you dont agree with most of my views anyway, no point to discuss. If you really want to know, ask Rexy or Pang (like Huang does).
How do you know I ask Rexy??:D:D........

eaglehelang

02-26-2008, 10:10 AM

How do you know I ask Rexy??:D:D........

In CO 2007, Zakry/Fairuz.... remember....he he he. You yourself said you had breakfast with Rexy & another coach.

You also said you spoke to Pang bf, I think it was Denmark or French Open, Rexy didnt go that tourney.:D:D

huangkwokhau

02-26-2008, 10:13 AM

In CO 2007, Zakry/Fairuz.... remember....he he he. You yourself said you had breakfast with Rexy & another coach.

You also said you spoke to Pang bf, I think it was Denmark or French Open, Rexy didnt go that tourney.:D:D
Oops...yes...we chatted once a while.....had great time with Rexy in MAS Open........:D

Loh

02-26-2008, 11:30 AM

Pemuda

02-26-2008, 07:40 PM

Well... you started it... ;) + make such similar statements many times

1) you already said that dozens of times, we already know that
The thread is "Can Malaysia win gold?" - not necessarily from badminton, which already been discussed in preceding pages.

Yes, we already know how it looks about KKK/TBH's chances, it's discussed in 2008 TC/Uber Prelimary thread.

2) That doesnt discount the fact that the media wrote it, in black & white. I also already wrote many times in other threads, along the lines that - in private could be different...

3) You just said that in the post before that, AGAIN, we already know that very well.
4) You also already said that many times in many threads, every opportunity you get, we already know that.
Wlifred already answered this one, & a few other BCers, it's a matter of perspective.
Yes Rexy has ranted in 2007, in public, in private we dunno (you say you take the media reports with a pinch of salt mah).
Look at his public stance this year 2008, esp of TBH, in private, we also dunno. As to how KKK/TBH really are in real life, Ants already gave his points many times.

If you really feel strongly about all the points you have presented in earlier posts & other threads, take some actual action, dont just complain about it.

5) Yup, we shall see in AE & OG

My dear,

This thread, 'Can Malaysia win a gold medal' listed under Olympics Beijing 2008 is in the section of Badminton Tournaments 2008. What are you now talking about the gold for Malaysia being "not necessarily from badminton' :confused::confused:. You are indeed confused. Please stay on topic. ;)

I rest my case.

AE and Beijing it shall be. :D

Pemuda

02-26-2008, 07:44 PM

Badmania already replied you on that in this thread & he's not Msian fan. They said what they said, make your own conclusion, you dont agree with most of my views anyway, no point to discuss.
If you really want to know, ask Rexy or Pang (like Huang does) what they actually meant.

My dear,

I dont need to ask anyone. I have already said Msia will win no gold medal in Beijing. And I stand to be corrected.

The writing is already on the wall with KKK/TBH being bundled out by some temp Korean pair.

And this AE is gonna be interesting. Just cant wait for the same old, same old excuses to be rolled out again.

Have a nice day.

X Ball

02-26-2008, 08:02 PM

Frankly I think LCW is as good as any to win the gold if he keeps up his present form right up to the Beijing Olympics, barring any injuries. In other words if he peaks at the right time during the BO. And if he continues to strengthen his mental prowess. ;)

X Ball is still my friend and I have to lend him support too! :D
So is Eagle who kept faith although I think that if LCW wins it is not miracle which does the work but the man himself who has to work very hard to achieve his goal. Luck helps obviously! :)

Top man. Barring injuries, LCW should be in a good position to contest for that gold. I think the incentives are just too much to ignore -- he is known for his hard 'yakka' and will fight for it. If he wins the AE, he will be favourite
for the Olympics else I think it gets harder, and all the sooth-sayers will predict doom and gloom.

azabaz_ipoh

02-26-2008, 08:22 PM

LOL....Pemuda's points are basically repeated over and over again until most of us can memorize those by heart!
1. Some players have "big-time Charlie" attitude.
2. BAM is not professionally run.
--> So, his conclusion: it's IMPOSSIBLE for Team MAS to win a gold medal in the Olympics

For the second one, all of us basically know it right? But, there's nothing we can do about it, except to hope for change :o

As for the first one, it has to do with perspectives. Pemuda thinks so, but it does not mean that is the real case, which ants has repeatedly stated.

My point: whether or not Malaysia can win a gold medal will have to depend on many factors, not just the above 2. If Lee Chong Wei or Koo Kien Keat/Tan Boon Heong can overcome some of the problems they have right now, they might surprise us with victories in Beijing. Lee Chong Wei will have a better chance, given his recent results in the Super Series events.

So, I believe that it's NOT IMPOSSIBLE for the MAS players to win.

Note, I am not a Malaysian, so, I am not one of those Malaysia-Boleh hordes :p:o;)

thank you for seeing it the way it is. it is not impossible for any of the top ten players to win the OG. it could be an indonesian player, Chinese player or Malaysian player or a player from denmark. :D :D though we all hope the player that we support will win it. ;):p:D

One gold is possible.
Will it happen? Dunno.
Am I expecting it? No.
Do I want the player(s) to win it? Yes.
Do I think BoA is hot? Hell yeah!

wholeheartedly agree, with the exception on the BoA statement. :):p;)

Frankly I think LCW is as good as any to win the gold if he keeps up his present form right up to the Beijing Olympics, barring any injuries. In other words if he peaks at the right time during the BO. And if he continues to strengthen his mental prowess. ;)

X Ball is still my friend and I have to lend him support too! :D
So is Eagle who kept faith although I think that if LCW wins it is not miracle which does the work but the man himself who has to work very hard to achieve his goal. Luck helps obviously! :)

yes, barring any injuries anybody can take the gold. :) so it will be down to mental strength, luck and determination. ;)

Pemuda

02-26-2008, 08:22 PM

as I said it before, CHN doesn't care about AG 06.
even they send 63% of younger athletes.
since 1982, CHN is the best in Asia.
CHN govt wants their athletes to got some experience, so they can perform very well in OG 08.

CHINA won 165 golds in AG 06. JPN & KOR only around 90 - 100 golds. Ina only 2 golds.
what else to pursue?

Yes, I do agree China treats the AG as a testing ground to blood new up and coming talents. The main target is the Olympics and I think it is a very good move.

I believe China will do very well in the coming Beijing games, expecially in badminton.

I only wish Malaysia are able to adopt the methods of China or South Korea rather than hoping and hoping for that elusive gold.

Winston_T

02-26-2008, 08:56 PM

yeah right....an unofficial tourney which was cut off in 2007 :cool: Whereas, the Asian Games has a long history and tradition :rolleyes::cool:

Oh....the AG will be held in Guangzhou in 2 years time, in case you didn't know about it. How about asking the organizer to cancel it as well, like the Invitational World Cup, if it is such an unimportant and unofficial tourney :eek::rolleyes:;)

OT: Funny but unsubstantiated comments. If it is so UNOFFICIAL and so UNIMPORTANT, those countries will not have spent so much time and money to bid for hosting it once every 4 years :cool: Oh....if China were to think that the AG is as you mention, they would just send their backup players to most of the sports :eek:

Swiss (WC 95), Spain (WC 01 & 06), USA (WC 05), India (WC 2009), and France (WC 2010) are not a country that likes badminton as well as CHN, Ina, Kor, Mal and Denm. why they want to hosted World Championships contest?
can u give ur reason, besides financial & economic factors?

Winston_T

02-26-2008, 09:12 PM

I do respected China n its peoples from being Asian pride.

But ur post.ur thoughts.ur words.
i doubt myself if i should support China in Olympic.u are asia's only chance to grab the title from USA.
U did have support from asians.dont ruined it.

I doubt if Asians peoples want to support China to grab the title from USA.
support, no!
jealous, yes!

Loh

02-26-2008, 09:44 PM

Swiss (WC 95), Spain (WC 01 & 06), USA (WC 05), India (WC 2009), and France (WC 2010) are not a country that likes badminton as well as CHN, Ina, Kor, Mal and Denm. why they want to hosted World Championships contest?
can u give ur reason, besides financial & economic factors?

I think the intangible rewards cannot be discounted.

For non-powerful badminton countries, it is an effective means of introducing the game to the masses at home and even abroad since some of the matches will be broadcast worldwide. However, whether the game will take off from there remains to be seen as it then becomes incumbent on the local NSA to further promote and develop the game.

It is also one way to introduce one's country to the world and herein lies the political mileage to be gained. Now that the world is getting closer, having friends worldwide can help to advance one's country's aspirations say at the UN and other world bodies, including the BWF.

badMania

02-26-2008, 09:55 PM

I doubt if Asians peoples want to support China to grab the title from USA.
support, no!
jealous, yes!

LOL...another wrong assumption here dude :eek:

I myself like some China athletes like Yao Ming, Liu Xiang and their tennis players (Li Na, etc). So, if those players can bring glory to Asia, we WILL SUPPORT THEM 100%!

I still remembered when the China tennis WD players won a couple of Grand Slams titles, it was a wonderful feeling, despite being an Indonesian ;)

As for the women's doubles, I personally like Yang Wei/Zhang Jiewen and would be happy for them if they can retain their title in Beijing this year. But not the other disciplines of course :D

eaglehelang

02-26-2008, 10:00 PM

wholeheartedly agree, with the exception on the BoA statement. :):p;)

yes, barring any injuries anybody can take the gold. :) so it will be down to mental strength, luck and determination. ;)

I dont follow the BoA singer thingy either:D, Aza we're getting old.

Frankly I think LCW is as good as any to win the gold if he keeps up his present form right up to the Beijing Olympics, barring any injuries. In other words if he peaks at the right time during the BO. And if he continues to strengthen his mental prowess. ;)

X Ball is still my friend and I have to lend him support too! :D
So is Eagle who kept faith although I think that if LCW wins it is not miracle which does the work but the man himself who has to work very hard to achieve his goal. Luck helps obviously! :)

Of course LCW has to work hard & strengthen his mental prowness. That was reply to Wilfred's 'dare to dream' post.:D:D

My dear,

I dont need to ask anyone. I have already said Msia will win no gold medal in Beijing. And I stand to be corrected.

The writing is already on the wall with KKK/TBH being bundled out by some temp Korean pair.

And this AE is gonna be interesting. Just cant wait for the same old, same old excuses to be rolled out again.

Have a nice day.

Old excuse? LOL. Who among the decision makers gave the excuse in the latest matches? Yap Kim Hock & Rexy did not give excuse for the losses to Koreans, they were downright disappointed.

And if they dont get at least till finals at AE, woe unto them, they'll be bashed from Sports Minister, to NSC, media, etc. BC forum members are the minority compared to rest of Msian population, the scenario in real life is different.
You might call it 'harping', I have to emphasize this so non-Msians dont get the wrong idea, since it will effect my reputation as a Msian( and it has) .

Writing on the wall thingy, in real life, the writing can be changed ;);) & I've seen it changed, against all odds - dont ask what it means, it's either you catch it or dont.

Back to OG : And I've stated before I dont expect KKK/TBH to win gold, or LCW or any Msian contingent. A medal of any colour will make me happy. Win gold or no win gold wouldnt effect me, a lowly fan.

badMania

02-26-2008, 10:07 PM

I think the intangible rewards cannot be discounted.

For non-powerful badminton countries, it is an effective means of introducing the game to the masses at home and even abroad since some of the matches will be broadcast worldwide. However, whether the game will take off from there remains to be seen as it then becomes incumbent on the local NSA to further promote and develop the game.

It is also one way to introduce one's country to the world and herein lies the political mileage to be gained. Now that the world is getting closer, having friends worldwide can help to advance one's country's aspirations say at the UN and other world bodies, including the BWF.

Bingo. It's a way for BWF to ensure the IOC that badminton is still a popular sport after all, if not, badminton will risk being cut off from the Olympics in 2016 :o

It will be pretty boring if the WC and Thomas/Uber/Sudirman Cups were only to be rotated among the badminton-strong countries. Let the other countries also be exposed to the phenomena and who knows they might come up with some good players in the future.

Oh....this guy also must have forgotten Sweden and India used to have some pretty good players too. Lim Xiao Qing (who won the European Championships 3 times and the All-England in 1996), Pullela Gopichand (who won the All-England in 2001, beating Chen Hong in the Final), and Prakash Padukone (who also won the All-England in 1980).

Oh...Saina Nehwal is also the emerging star from India, having finished 2nd in the World Junior Championships in 2006.

koo_fan

02-27-2008, 03:03 AM

Frankly I think LCW is as good as any to win the gold if he keeps up his present form right up to the Beijing Olympics, barring any injuries. In other words if he peaks at the right time during the BO. And if he continues to strengthen his mental prowess. ;)

X Ball is still my friend and I have to lend him support too! :D
So is Eagle who kept faith although I think that if LCW wins it is not miracle which does the work but the man himself who has to work very hard to achieve his goal. Luck helps obviously! :)
Yes.LCW is good prospect of bringing the first gold.(although i put my hopes on kkk/tbh ),i've to admit with recent performance,Lcw should be the first hope.

n with a possibility of badminton to be drop from the next olympis games n
we are still unsure with squasy to be included...
i must say this is malaysia's only chance to get something from olympic.
things get tougher after this.

Pemuda

02-27-2008, 08:07 PM

Old excuse? LOL. Who among the decision makers gave the excuse in the latest matches? Yap Kim Hock & Rexy did not give excuse for the losses to Koreans, they were downright disappointed.

And if they dont get at least till finals at AE, woe unto them, they'll be bashed from Sports Minister, to NSC, media, etc. BC forum members are the minority compared to rest of Msian population, the scenario in real life is different.
You might call it 'harping', I have to emphasize this so non-Msians dont get the wrong idea, since it will effect my reputation as a Msian( and it has) .

Writing on the wall thingy, in real life, the writing can be changed ;);) & I've seen it changed, against all odds - dont ask what it means, it's either you catch it or dont.

Back to OG : And I've stated before I dont expect KKK/TBH to win gold, or LCW or any Msian contingent. A medal of any colour will make me happy. Win gold or no win gold wouldnt effect me, a lowly fan.

Rexy did not give any excuses. HE gave up by stating that he quit the team, only to retract his resignation the next day. I wonder why he so suddenly quit the team?? ;) That must be his 2nd time wanting to quit and all. Hmmm ... why??? ;)

"They are still young', 'still learning', 'TBH gets nervous' etc etc etc ... not excuses???

Bashing from Sports Minister, NSC, media etc?? Well, if they cant take the so-called 'bashing' for poor performance then maybe professional badminton is not their calling. Maybe they should be insurance salesmen, fashion designers or something.

As for your claim that writings on the wall can be changed thingy ... well, I hope the change will come pretty soon cos' AE is just round the corner and Beijing is just a few months away .... but since you now say you dont expect KKK/TBH to win the gold or LCW or even any Msian contingent ... I find it amusing to say the least. On one hand you say you have seen how things can change from bad to good and on the other hand, you are saying Msia aint gonna be winning a single gold. Why the flip flopping?? :eek:

Pemuda

02-27-2008, 08:09 PM

I doubt if Asians peoples want to support China to grab the title from USA.
support, no!
jealous, yes!

I would like to see China emerge as the new Olympic champion. And I think it is possible.

Pemuda

02-27-2008, 08:12 PM

i wondered.
what is the point of being againts majority?
being a rival for family members n a 'friend' of an outsider?

We must have an open mind. If others are doing things right, we must be big enough to accept our system have failed us. Being unable or unwilling to adopt will take us no where. Thats the failing of Malaysia Boleh.

eaglehelang

02-27-2008, 09:01 PM

1) Rexy did not give any excuses. HE gave up by stating that he quit the team, only to retract his resignation the next day. I wonder why he so suddenly quit the team?? ;) That must be his 2nd time wanting to quit and all. Hmmm ... why??? ;)

"They are still young', 'still learning', 'TBH gets nervous' etc etc etc ... not excuses???

2) Bashing from Sports Minister, NSC, media etc?? Well, if they cant take the so-called 'bashing' for poor performance then maybe professional badminton is not their calling. Maybe they should be insurance salesmen, fashion designers or something.

3) As for your claim that writings on the wall can be changed thingy ... well, I hope the change will come pretty soon cos' AE is just round the corner and Beijing is just a few months away .... but since you now say you dont expect KKK/TBH to win the gold or LCW or even any Msian contingent ... I find it amusing to say the least. On one hand you say you have seen how things can change from bad to good and on the other hand, you are saying Msia aint gonna be winning a single gold. Why the flip flopping?? :eek:

1) The resigning thingy was bf TC qualifying. Rexy & YKH didnt give excuses for TC qualifiers, by the looks of it, they wont for AE 2008 either, at least not from Rexy. YKH, depends which stance he wants to take.
KKK/TBH too, so far, in their losses, they always admit they didnt play well, or lost it along the way.

2) You know very well, that's to point out there's no "moddly coldling" (like you often say) from those in authority. Not only 'poor performance', if they try very hard but fail to reach set objective also will get it.

And as I've said bf many times, it's to point out to non Msians those who continously support the players are minority, the majority has your kind of view(as one non Msian BCers said bf 'typical msian fan").
Your posts makes it sound like you're the few (some non Msians here think so too), where as in real life, it isnt so.

3) Now? I already said that last year, in prediction thread - prediction is according to logical progression.

...And as I expected you dont catch it. In real life, I've seen the seemingly impossible become reality or 100% no hope situation turn +ve, that's me or ppl I know, that takes belief/vision beyond any logical thought.

Yup, I dont expect, but I will root for Msia players all the way, one match at a time. The relation between the 2 paragraphs, figure it yourself ;):p, you either catch it or dont.

X Ball

02-27-2008, 09:12 PM

Pemuda

02-27-2008, 09:14 PM

1) The resigning thingy was bf TC qualifying. Rexy & YKH didnt give excuses for TC, by the looks of it, they wont for AE 2008 either, at least not from Rexy. YKH, depends which stance he wants to take.
KKK/TBH too, so far, in their losses, they always admit they didnt play well, or lost it along the way.

2) You know very well, that's to point out there's no "moddly coldling" (like you often say) from those in authority.

And as I've said bf many times, it's to point out to non Msians those who continously support the players are minority, the majority has your kind of view(as one non Msian BCers said bf 'typical msian fan").
Your posts makes it sound like you're the few (some non Msians here think so too), where as in real life, it isnt so.

3) Now? I already said that last year, in prediction thread - prediction is according to logical progression.

...And as I expected you dont catch it. I've seen the seemingly impossible become reality or 100% no hope situation turn +ve, that's me or ppl I know, that takes belief/vision beyond any logical thought.

Yup, I dont expect, but I will root for Msia players all the way, one match at a time. The relation between the 2 paragraphs, figure it yourself ;):p, you either catch it or dont.

The point is why Rexy threatened to resign, not once but TWICE?? Whether it is before TC qualifying or not is irrelevant. Why would a world class coach suddenly wanna walk out of the team in a huff??? Thats the question. Rexy must be fed up with something.

What Malaysian fans feel or dont feel is another subject. This thread is about whether Msia can win a gold in Beijing or not. It is as simple as that.

If you dont expect Msia to win a gold in badminton then you contradict yourself. What happened to your claim about having seen how things can change from bad to good??

eaglehelang

02-27-2008, 09:52 PM

If you dont expect Msia to win a gold in badminton then you contradict yourself. What happened to your claim about having seen how things can change from bad to good??

Like I said TWICE, either you can catch it or you dont;), I already said as directly as possible in a public forum. If you still cannot catch, never mind loh, doesnt change anything in real life:D.

eaglehelang

02-27-2008, 10:05 PM

Eaglehelang,

Doom and gloom is here -- there is no gold to look forward to. The rot continues, we are pampering our players and there is no use hoping. We will lose for sure.

Open your minds - everyone is better than us. Get real else don't say I have not told you.:)

:D:D:D I wouldnt bother so much if it doesnt effect my ehem.. reputation as Msian. Since it does......

tsk, tsk, sad eh? if the great ppl in the world believed in that aft their 10th failure when success only came aft 25 failures, history would have been changed.....

Now you're getting hilarious Xball. Better you add "Sup Tulang" to the bet, a lot of work to deflect gloom...
1 bowl of "Sup Tulang" + 1 coconut drink for the 2 golds, win or no win we go makan. yum yum :D:D

badMania

02-27-2008, 10:14 PM

If you dont expect Msia to win a gold in badminton then you contradict yourself. What happened to your claim about having seen how things can change from bad to good??

Hope is different from expectation.

I hope that Kido/Hendra will win a gold in Beijing 2008...but my expectation is only a moderate one (albeit improved from last year), since I do recognize that they still have to beat Koo/Tan :o

Now, almost everyone expect Lin Dan to win the Olympic Gold big time....whereas a small bunch of us hope that Lee Chong Wei or Taufik Hidayat to upset Lin Dan, so, our expectation on either player is certainly not as big as Lin Dan's fans' expectations.

Similar to the case in KL 2007. Based on their wretched form for the past half a year, my expectation of either Kido/Hendra or Nova/Butet to win the WC is a small one....nevertheless, there's always a small flickering hope, which is inside every fan's heart. So, obviously, when they won the big thing, didn't things change from bad to good?

Its better that while hoping for something, we only carry a small expectation (like what I usually do).

badMania

02-27-2008, 10:19 PM

The point is why Rexy threatened to resign, not once but TWICE?? Whether it is before TC qualifying or not is irrelevant. Why would a world class coach suddenly wanna walk out of the team in a huff??? Thats the question. Rexy must be fed up with something.

Do you know what's the real reason yourself? If he changed his decision, does it also imply that at least, he saw some hope in those doubles players for him to remain in the post :rolleyes:

Lots of foreign coaches walked out of the Malaysian national team and most attribute their decision not because of the players, but more because of interference from politics, etc. Correct me if I am wrong here since I am not 100% sure.

Since players and fans can not change how BAM or PBSI operates, no matter how loudly we voiced out our opinion, like I have mentioned before, we can only hope for changes to happen :o:cool:

azabaz_ipoh

02-27-2008, 10:28 PM

Hope is different from expectation.

I hope that Kido/Hendra will win a gold in Beijing 2008...but my expectation is only a moderate one (albeit improved from last year), since I do recognize that they still have to beat Koo/Tan :o

Now, almost everyone expect Lin Dan to win the Olympic Gold big time....whereas a small bunch of us hope that Lee Chong Wei or Taufik Hidayat to upset Lin Dan, so, our expectation on either player is certainly not as big as Lin Dan's fans' expectations.

Similar to the case in KL 2007. Based on their wretched form for the past half a year, my expectation of either Kido/Hendra or Nova/Butet to win the WC is a small one....nevertheless, there's always a small flickering hope, which is inside every fan's heart. So, obviously, when they won the big thing, didn't things change from bad to good?

Its better that while hoping for something, we only carry a small expectation (like what I usually do).

i agree. hope is what makes us fans. since we still support players that does not show consistency but have shown the ability to be a winner. expectation is what makes us a sceptic. if we only expect the best all the time, we will be disappointed. and if we only expect the worse all the time, what's the point in watching the players anyway. :)

eaglehelang

02-28-2008, 03:21 AM

Hope is different from expectation.........

[quote]

He he he, my friend you is smart to catch my meaning :D for on paper, for logically Msia cant win gold in any official OG sport (apparently Wushu will be contested but as unofficial sport - Msia has female World & AG champ for Wushu).
I wouldnt call mine just passive 'hope' but the faith to believe, beyond logical thought, for nothing is impossible.....- I think you know what I mean. Of course the players themselves need to have that faith.

[quote=badMania;798812].........
Lots of foreign coaches walked out of the Malaysian national team and most attribute their decision not because of the players, but more because of interference from politics, etc. Correct me if I am wrong here since I am not 100% sure.

Since players and fans can not change how BAM or PBSI operates, no matter how loudly we voiced out our opinion, like I have mentioned before, we can only hope for changes to happen :o:cool:

Yup, it was featured in the media, Rexy said his 2nd resignation was cos of accusations by 'certain quarters' he was not doing his job, loyalty of foreign coach in question thingy. Politics part, our Abedeng has already elaborated very eloquently.

And it felt good -- maybe I will do more of that.;)

he he he, any 'sup tulang' or you prefer fish ball, to complement your nick 'X Ball'?

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 08:27 AM

Like I said TWICE, either you can catch it or you dont;), I already said as directly as possible in a public forum. If you still cannot catch, never mind loh, doesnt change anything in real life:D.

It would definitely help if you are consistent rather than flip flopping all over.

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 08:30 AM

Hope is different from expectation.

I hope that Kido/Hendra will win a gold in Beijing 2008...but my expectation is only a moderate one (albeit improved from last year), since I do recognize that they still have to beat Koo/Tan :o

Now, almost everyone expect Lin Dan to win the Olympic Gold big time....whereas a small bunch of us hope that Lee Chong Wei or Taufik Hidayat to upset Lin Dan, so, our expectation on either player is certainly not as big as Lin Dan's fans' expectations.

Similar to the case in KL 2007. Based on their wretched form for the past half a year, my expectation of either Kido/Hendra or Nova/Butet to win the WC is a small one....nevertheless, there's always a small flickering hope, which is inside every fan's heart. So, obviously, when they won the big thing, didn't things change from bad to good?

Its better that while hoping for something, we only carry a small expectation (like what I usually do).

Lets not confuse wishful thinking with hope shall we?

badMania

02-28-2008, 08:38 AM

Lets not confuse wishful thinking with hope shall we?

Err...why is it wishful thinking for either LCW or Koo/Tan to win any medals in the Olympics :confused:?? They certainly have fulfilled the criteria of bearing MAS's hope as potential gold-medallists in Beijing as they won some important titles last year (Super Series Levels, and not one title only).

Now, on the other hand, it will be wishful thinking for Mohd Hafiz Hashim to win any medals in the Olympics :cool: But, wishful thinking also does not mean he will not surprise us and put in a good performance. We can only hope he suddenly finds some form ;):o

One example: Shon Sheung Mo. NOBODY expects him to win any medals of any color before the Olympics. If you ask any Korean fans, they would say it will be wishful thinking to hope for any medals from him. Yet, he surprised everyone and won the Silver :eek: Since then, he disappeared from the arena until only recently.

extremenanopowe

02-28-2008, 08:40 AM

The Korean have the guts to try out scratch pair and why not Malaysia? Damaged done correct? Now the pressure keeps on piling up and can be demotivating.

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 08:43 AM

Do you know what's the real reason yourself? If he changed his decision, does it also imply that at least, he saw some hope in those doubles players for him to remain in the post :rolleyes:

Lots of foreign coaches walked out of the Malaysian national team and most attribute their decision not because of the players, but more because of interference from politics, etc. Correct me if I am wrong here since I am not 100% sure.

Since players and fans can not change how BAM or PBSI operates, no matter how loudly we voiced out our opinion, like I have mentioned before, we can only hope for changes to happen :o:cool:

Why would you think a good coach like Rexy would suddenly go on a rant and then suddenly quit, twice??? What 'hope' you are talking about here?? KKK/TBh just got beaten by some scratched Korean pair. Yes, do tell me about that great 'hope' ... please :rolleyes:

You said it spot on, interference from politics and etc.

Who is talking about changing BAM or PBSI or the world here :confused:. Dude, this is just a badminton forum and we are here to discuss, share and maybe debate civilly (except for one who tend to resort to petty insults) on matters related to badminton.

badMania

02-28-2008, 08:43 AM

The Korean have the guts to try out scratch pair and why not Malaysia? Damaged done correct? Now the pressure keeps on piling up and can be demotivating.

Malaysia has done that in 2006 remember? Koo Kien Keat/Tan Boon Heong were barely 2 months old, their first tournament being the Japan Open 2006 in October.

They also did not have good form during the Asian Games Team Event, being beaten by Lee Jae Jin/Hwang Ji Man, which prompted Rexy to quit...but...they regrouped themselves and won the Asian Games Individual Event!

So, anything can happen!

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 08:51 AM

Err...why is it wishful thinking for either LCW or Koo/Tan to win any medals in the Olympics :confused:?? They certainly have fulfilled the criteria of bearing MAS's hope as potential gold-medallists in Beijing as they won some important titles last year (Super Series Levels, and not one title only).

Now, on the other hand, it will be wishful thinking for Mohd Hafiz Hashim to win any medals in the Olympics :cool: But, wishful thinking also does not mean he will not surprise us and put in a good performance. We can only hope he suddenly finds some form ;):o

One example: Shon Sheung Mo. NOBODY expects him to win any medals of any color before the Olympics. If you ask any Korean fans, they would say it will be wishful thinking to hope for any medals from him. Yet, he surprised everyone and won the Silver :eek: Since then, he disappeared from the arena until only recently.

Take a look at the titles LCW have won todate. Any AEs, WCs??? LCW is a good player, that I am sure but his mentality is not strong and is known to break down in the big tournaments.

KKK/TBH, dont look good indeed when they cant even get past some cardboard pair from Korea.

Who is talking about silver medals here??? :confused: This thread is about Msia winning the gold, dude. But since you are talking about winning the silver medal, Msia have won that before back in 1996. So, hurray lets celebrate ;)

eaglehelang

02-28-2008, 09:23 AM

It would definitely help if you are consistent rather than flip flopping all over.

Well... Badmania understood what I meant ;). The posts in last few pages are there, you just didnt bother to make the connection .

And if one havent seen it happen before, % is very high that one wouldnt understand what it means, and thus no amount of explaining would suffice. If I've seen the impossible become possible (defying all expert opinion & logic), this.....

Back to OG badminton, on paper, all those expert baddy observers will say: LCW will be one of the favourites, but LD will top the list. If they dont defend the AE, KKK/TBH will be swhere in the middle of the pack but still one of the favourites. So, it's not in the impossible category.

Our 2nd MS & MD (barring any injuries = CTF/LWW) will be the underdogs, if they somehow manage to win gold, would be minor miracle but still not in the impossible category.

Our women's department, WMC, WPT/CEH will be the dark horses.
If the women somehow manage wins a medal, even bronze, that would be a miracle since our women never won before. This would be somewhere in the near impossible category.

If our young Julia Wong, lo & behold, for some reason, manages to get 4th place.....,that would be bigger miracle <- I dont know how young Boonsak Ponsana managed to get 4th place in 2004 OG but he did.:)

Before you poof poof it, remember I said I've seen the impossible happen in real life, these are not in the totally impossible category yet.

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 10:05 AM

Well... Badmania understood what I meant ;). The posts in last few pages are there, you just didnt bother to make the connection .

And if one havent seen it happen before, % is very high that one wouldnt understand what it means, and thus no amount of explaining would suffice. If I've seen the impossible become possible (defying all expert opinion & logic), this.....

Back to OG badminton, on paper, all those expert baddy observers will say: LCW will be one of the favourites, but LD will top the list. If they dont defend the AE, KKK/TBH will be swhere in the middle of the pack but still one of the favourites. So, it's not in the impossible category.

Our 2nd MS & MD (barring any injuries = CTF/LWW) will be the underdogs, if they somehow manage to win gold, would be minor miracle but still not in the impossible category.

Our women's department, WMC, WPT/CEH will be the dark horses.
If the women somehow manage wins a medal, even bronze, that would be a miracle since our women never won before. This would be somewhere in the near impossible category.

If our young Julia Wong, lo & behold, for some reason, manages to get 4th place.....,that would be bigger miracle <- I dont know how young Boonsak Ponsana managed to get 4th place in 2004 OG but he did.:)

Before you poof poof it, remember I said I've seen the impossible happen in real life, these are not in the totally impossible category yet.

It was not me not taking the time to read your postings. It would greatly help me if you know what you are talking about in the first place. By that I mean, for example, this thread about Msia winning the gold is listed under 2008 badminton tournaments. But you are talking about Msia 'not necessarily winning the gold from badminton' :confused: Please refer to your post #269.

As for your *poof poof* thingy, since you have said you have seen the impossible and all and etc, then why say this ; "Back to OG : And I've stated before I dont expect KKK/TBH to win gold, or LCW or any Msian contingent" (post 287)??? :confused: Why contradict yourself??? I mean since you have witnessed the great impossible why the sudden no confidence in KKK/TBH or LCW or 'any Msian contingent' (please la this is a badminton thread!!)?? :(

So, again if you could be consistent rather than going all over the place, it would help. Thanks.

OK ok back to OG badminton , I wont rate LCW as one of the favourites. I would rate LD & TH as favourites and maybe BCL, PG, KJ & CH as darkhorses. Frankly, I dont see LCW making the q/finals. My money is on LD but in my heart I want KJ to win

As for KKK/TBH, I am predicting a meltdown that will begin in this coming AE and I see them being packed away in the early rounds in Beijing. I rate Cai/Fu as the main favourites. But I personally want JE/ML to win.

Thats my 2sen, but anyway someone here predicted Msia winning two gold medals ... so lets see. ;)

badMania

02-28-2008, 10:42 AM

Take a look at the titles LCW have won todate. Any AEs, WCs??? LCW is a good player, that I am sure but his mentality is not strong and is known to break down in the big tournaments.

Psst: before u forget, have Taufik Hidayat won ANY AE or WC before he won that Gold Medal in Athens 2004? Oh...and he was on a wretched form prior to the Olympics, winning only the Asian Continental Championships 2004. He even threw a tantrum when Mulyo was ousted from PBSI and was one time on the books of the Singapore Badminton Association. Our uncle Loh will know better :D

He failed to win the AE despite reaching the Finals twice. He was seeded top to win the Olympics in 2000 and lost eventually. Likewise, he progressed to the SF of the WC 2001, but lost to the eventual champion, Hendrawan, due to injury.

The titles he won from 2001-2004 prior to the Olympics: a handful of 5 titles only in the Singapore Open 2001, Indonesia Opens 2002-2003, Asian Continental Championships 2004, and that insignificant Asian Games Gold that so many ppl thought its unimportant :o Thats a total of 4 GP titles and 1 "unofficial" tourney in 3 years++. Hardly Gold-Medal contender material by your standard, won't u think so? So, according to your logic, it will be wishful thinking to imagine Taufik winning that Gold medal 4 years back?

Lo and behold...he DID WIN the Gold! Incidentally, Lee Chong Wei was right at where Taufik was 4 years back....except that, his form is more consistent than Taufik's then :cool:

badMania

02-28-2008, 10:47 AM

I don't think you need to win the World Championships before you can even be considered a favorite in the Olympics :o

Look at Alan Budi Kusuma...has he won the All England or the World Championships prior to his victory in Barcelona 92? Or Zhang Jun/Gao Ling back in 2000?

badMania

02-28-2008, 10:57 AM

KKK/TBH, dont look good indeed when they cant even get past some cardboard pair from Korea.

That happened to many INA pairs...including the current World Champion Markis Kido/Hendra Setiawan. They lost to an even lower-ranked pair Han Sang Hoon/Yoo Yeon Seong in the AE R16 2007. Oh and another World Champion Nova Widianto/Lilyana Natsir had their fair share of upsets too in the past few years, losing to unheralded opponents, including: Koo Kien Keat/Wong Pei Tty in WC06, David Lindley/Suzanne Rayappan in KO07.

So, what's the big deal then :o

badadum

02-28-2008, 02:10 PM

eaglehelang

02-28-2008, 04:11 PM

It was not me not taking the time to read your postings. It would greatly help me if you know what you are talking about in the first place. By that I mean, for example, this thread about Msia winning the gold is listed under 2008 badminton tournaments. But you are talking about Msia 'not necessarily winning the gold from badminton' :confused: Please refer to your post #269.

As for your *poof poof* thingy, since you have said you have seen the impossible and all and etc, then why say this ; "Back to OG : And I've stated before I dont expect KKK/TBH to win gold, or LCW or any Msian contingent" (post 287)??? :confused: Why contradict yourself??? I mean since you have witnessed the great impossible why the sudden no confidence in KKK/TBH or LCW or 'any Msian contingent' (please la this is a badminton thread!!)?? :(

So, again if you could be consistent rather than going all over the place, it would help. Thanks.

I know what I'm talking about. One also needs to read the other replies in this thread. Often times you dont follow, not only my posts but the others. Just checking if this time you did. Badmania can catch it, he he he.

Myself & a few other BCers go by the title "Can the Malaysian win a gold medal?" under OG since badminton has been discussed ad nauseum & many have not considered the other sports. If it's considered off topic, ok, fine. You also have gone off topic bf mah.

3rd time : I said I dont expect, not they can or cannot;););). For OG, I dont expect or demand from our players, I just support them one match at a time.

Beyond the logical & what's comprehensible, anything can happen.

With that I rest my case.

badMania

02-28-2008, 07:26 PM

I can't believe some here thinking that WR#2 or WR#3 winning the Olympic Gold = wishful thinking.
TH more of a favorite than LCW? What have TH done lately to deserve that? LCW has far been more consistent and achieve more.

Dude...before you start chipping in the "endless" debates, you should probably state that you are not Malaysian....so that will mean you are also like me, not one of those Malaysian Boleh hordes :o

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 07:53 PM

Psst: before u forget, have Taufik Hidayat won ANY AE or WC before he won that Gold Medal in Athens 2004? Oh...and he was on a wretched form prior to the Olympics, winning only the Asian Continental Championships 2004. He even threw a tantrum when Mulyo was ousted from PBSI and was one time on the books of the Singapore Badminton Association. Our uncle Loh will know better :D

He failed to win the AE despite reaching the Finals twice. He was seeded top to win the Olympics in 2000 and lost eventually. Likewise, he progressed to the SF of the WC 2001, but lost to the eventual champion, Hendrawan, due to injury.

The titles he won from 2001-2004 prior to the Olympics: a handful of 5 titles only in the Singapore Open 2001, Indonesia Opens 2002-2003, Asian Continental Championships 2004, and that insignificant Asian Games Gold that so many ppl thought its unimportant :o Thats a total of 4 GP titles and 1 "unofficial" tourney in 3 years++. Hardly Gold-Medal contender material by your standard, won't u think so? So, according to your logic, it will be wishful thinking to imagine Taufik winning that Gold medal 4 years back?

Lo and behold...he DID WIN the Gold! Incidentally, Lee Chong Wei was right at where Taufik was 4 years back....except that, his form is more consistent than Taufik's then :cool:

Yo, TH won Indo Opens in 99, 00, 02, 03 & 04 prior to taking that Olympic gold. And I believe the Indo Opens are no picnics. And he was the AG champ 2002 plus MO 2000.

How many super series titles LCW got under his belt?

In the runup to Beijing, TH got 1 WC, 1 OG, 9 Super Series, 2 AG golds plus 2 Thomas Cups (team). LCW how??

Psst .... whether TH threw a tantrum or even dropped his pants, you cant deny the fact that the lad won 1 OG & 1 WC and LCW zero todate. ;)

TH have danced on the big stage and delivered the goods while LCW chided Yap Kim Hock for sitting too close to his court in WC KL last year. :D

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 07:59 PM

That happened to many INA pairs...including the current World Champion Markis Kido/Hendra Setiawan. They lost to an even lower-ranked pair Han Sang Hoon/Yoo Yeon Seong in the AE R16 2007. Oh and another World Champion Nova Widianto/Lilyana Natsir had their fair share of upsets too in the past few years, losing to unheralded opponents, including: Koo Kien Keat/Wong Pei Tty in WC06, David Lindley/Suzanne Rayappan in KO07.

So, what's the big deal then :o

Whats the big deal? No big deal as MK/HS & NW/LN won the WCs before.
KKK/TBH has yet to win either the WC/OG ... but in the Malaysia Boleh spirit, lets hoooope they do one day.

Lets all hope ok?;)

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 08:08 PM

I can't believe some here thinking that WR#2 or WR#3 winning the Olympic Gold = wishful thinking.
TH more of a favorite than LCW? What have TH done lately to deserve that? LCW has far been more consistent and achieve more.

In LCW case, very simple actually ... this coming AE will be a good indication prior to Beijing.

Lets see ... shall we?

badMania

02-28-2008, 08:08 PM

Yo, TH won Indo Opens in 99, 00, 02, 03 & 04 prior to taking that Olympic gold. And I believe the Indo Opens are no picnics. And he was the AG champ 2002 plus MO 2000.

How many super series titles LCW got under his belt?

Well....I believe Lee Chong Wei HAS ALSO WON the INA Open 2007 (a no-picnic tourney according to your logic), Japan Open 2007 (beating Lin Dan and Taufik Hidayat in the SF and Final, considered to be one of the hardest Asian GP titles to win), MAS Open 2004-2006, 2008, French Open 2007, Swiss Open 2006, Denmark Open 2005 (the premier European title), Asian Continental Championships 2006. That's 10 TITLES, compared to Taufik's handful 5.

If you want to count which of those titles belong to SS categories now, its basically all of them (9), except the Asian Continental Championships, which is by your standard a mickey-mouse tourney.

Ah....I remember you did discount AG title as a major title in one of your earlier discussion, right ;)? So, that won't count as a major title too? But, if do u count it as a major title, remember, Koo/Tan also won the AG title. They also won a total of 4 Super Series titles (Malaysia, AE, Swiss, Denmark) last year alone in their 1 year of partnership. So, going by your standard, they are also not "qualified" to be considered a major contender, don't they?

My point is: TH has indeed won the big titles, BUT, that was after 2004!
And...I am talking about 2004 here since Taufik has yet to win the Olympics, AE (even up to now) and the WC prior to the Athens Olympics then. His situation then was more or less similar to what LCW has at the moment, won't u agree with me on this one ?

The fact: Taufik form was woeful prior to 2004 Olympics, yet, he managed to defy the odds and won the Gold. So, anything is possible.

Of course, for my own selfish reason, I would rather Koo/Tan not win the Beijing Olympics this year hehe.

badMania

02-28-2008, 08:10 PM

Whats the big deal? No big deal as MK/HS & NW/LN won the WCs before.
KKK/TBH has yet to win either the WC/OG ... but in the Malaysia Boleh spirit, lets hoooope they do one day.

Lets all hope ok?;)

Another Psst: Kido/Hendra HAD NOT WON the WC when they lost to the lower-ranked Korean pair. So, by your standard, they had lost to a "card-board" pair....shameful....no chance and wishful thinking for them to win the upcoming WC in 2007, won't you think so? Remember, they HAD NOT WON (no AE, Asian Games, WC or Olympics) any major titles prior to the KL triumph. If they were to end up with nothing in KL (which most of us expected), by your standard, it will be the start of their melt-down too?

Still, life went on after that shocking loss, and they eventually redeemeed themselves ;)

BTW, neither have Kido/Hendra or Nova/Butet won the OG.

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 08:17 PM

Well....I believe Lee Chong Wei HAS ALSO WON the INA Open 2007 (a no-picnic tourney according to your logic), Japan Open 2007 (beating Lin Dan and Taufik Hidayat in the SF and Final, considered to be one of the hardest Asian GP titles to win), MAS Open 2004-2006, 2008, French Open 2007, Swiss Open 2006, Denmark Open 2005 (the premier European title), Asian Continental Championships 2006. That's 10 TITLES, compared to Taufik's handful 5.

If you want to count which of those titles belong to SS categories now, its basocially all of them (9), except the Asian Continental Championships, which is by your standard a mickey-mouse tourney.

Ah....I remember you did discount AG title as a major title in one of your earlier discussion, right ;)? So, that won't count as a major title too? But, if do u count it as a major title, remember, Koo/Tan also won the AG title. They also won a total of 4 Super Series titles (Malaysia, AE, Swiss, Denmark) last year alone in their 1 year of partnership. So, going by your standard, they are also not "qualified" to be considered a major contender, don't they?

My point is: TH has indeed won the big titles, BUT, that was after 2004!
And...I am about 2004 here since Taufik has yet to win the Olympics, AE (even up to now) and the WC prior to the Athens Olympics. His situation then was more or less similar to what LCW has at the moment, won't u agree with me on this one ?

Dude, LCW won the IO ONCE while TH won it SIX TIMES, and prior to winning that Olympic gold he has already won the Indo Open 5 times. See the diff??

And dude, hang on to your pants. Didnt I list TH's achievements in the following order; 1WC, 1OG, 9 Super Series, 2 AG golds plus 2 Thomas Cups??? :rolleyes: Oh deary me:confused:

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 08:22 PM

Another Psst: Kido/Hendra HAD NOT WON the WC when they lost to the lower-ranked Korean pair. So, by your standard, they had lost to a "card-board" pair....shameful....no chance and wishful thinking for them to win the upcoming WC in 2007, won't you think so? Remember, they HAD NOT WON (no AE, Asian Games, WC or Olympics) any major titles prior to the KL triumph.

Still, life went on after that shocking loss, and they eventually redeemeed themselves ;)

BTW, neither have Kido/Hendra or Nova/Butet won the OG.

Lol ... MK/HS are WC. The fact is they won that WC. They may lost to lesser known opponents, yes but the fact remains that they are WC, period.

Psst ... LD too got beaten in this year KO. BUT the fact is the lad is a WC winner, twice.

badMania

02-28-2008, 08:24 PM

Dude, LCW won the IO ONCE while TH won it SIX TIMES, and prior to winning that Olympic gold he has already won the Indo Open 5 times. See the diff??

Dude...many ppl said the INA Open title is a mickey-mouse tourney (since many Chinese top guns choose to miss that one for many reasons)....so, Taufik is basically a "jagoh-kampung". On the contrary, Lee Chong Wei has also won the MO FOUR TIMES prior to this year's Olympics. Also similar right = jagoh kampong.

LOL...its hard to convince u I have to say: 1 OG, 1 Olympics and 1 more Asian Games Gold HAPPENED AFTER THAT WIN IN ATHENS!

Prior to Athens, LCW's situation in 2008 is the more or less the same as Taufik's in 2004 :o If you consider LCW's hope of a gold to be wishful thinking, then, Taufik's hope for a gold in 2004 would also be the same, do u agree on me with this one?

The fact: despite the wishful thinking (by your standard), he DID WIN THE GOLD! So, anything is possible ;)

badMania

02-28-2008, 08:35 PM

badMania

02-28-2008, 08:42 PM

Another case...Ji Xingpeng, the Gold Winner in 2000.
Major titles: countable....only remember Japan Open 2000
AE, WC, Asian Games, Thomas Cups: a big FAT NIL.
--> result: he WON and then DISAPPEARED from the scene :o

Quoting from wikipedia: Ji's gold medal feat came as a big surprise because no one had expected him to do so since he has never won any tournaments previously. He also defeated Taufik Hidayat and Peter Gade Christensen along the way to the final.

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 09:40 PM

Dude...many ppl said the INA Open title is a mickey-mouse tourney (since many Chinese top guns choose to miss that one for many reasons)....so, Taufik is basically a "jagoh-kampung". On the contrary, Lee Chong Wei has also won the MO FOUR TIMES prior to this year's Olympics. Also similar right = jagoh kampong.

LOL...its hard to convince u I have to say: 1 OG, 1 Olympics and 1 more Asian Games Gold HAPPENED AFTER THAT WIN IN ATHENS!

Prior to Athens, LCW's situation in 2008 is the more or less the same as Taufik's in 2004 :o If you consider LCW's hope of a gold to be wishful thinking, then, Taufik's hope for a gold in 2004 would also be the same, do u agree on me with this one?

The fact: despite the wishful thinking (by your standard), he DID WIN THE GOLD! So, anything is possible ;)

My brother, we can always agree to disagree. ;) But with TH being a 'jagoh kampong', well, in that case TH is a jagoh kampong with 1 WC & 1 Olympic gold. And thats a pretty cushy jagoh kampong.

Well, if Greece can win Euro 2004 ... anything is possible in that sense. Lets hope LCW can do a Greece in Beijing then. ;)

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 09:43 PM

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 09:47 PM

badadum

02-28-2008, 09:51 PM

To summarize the situation for interested parties who want to chip in the "endless" debates :D:

LCW's situation in 2008:
Super Series titles (by today's standards): 9
AG, AE, WC, Olympics: 0
--> nah....gloom and doom for him.

Taufik's situation back in 2004:
Super Series titles: 7
AG: 1
AE, WC, Olympics: 0
--> wishful thinking for him to win at that time.....yet, he won gold!

Koo/Tan in 2008:
Super Series titles: 4
AG, AE: 1
Olympics, WC: 0
--> bah...."big-Charlie" pair won't make it big...start of meltdown...Rexy will quit...etc etc

My own favorite pair, Markis Kido/Hendra Setiawan
Super Series titles: 6
AG, Olympics, AE: 0
WC: 1
--> my own verdict: quietly optimistic, but, might lose to Koo/Tan if they were to meet in SF, going by their possible seedings (2 vs 3) :o

Nicely put. :)

Hopefuly MK/HS can overcome the mental barrier against Koo/Tan in AE/Swiss SS. They're the biggest obstacle to obtain an Olympic gold. For some reason they're much more comfortable playing (and beating) FHF/CY and based on recent history, playing in the heart of enemy territory ain't a problem for them.

As for MS, I can't see anyone besides LCW or one of the korean players (with Li Mao's aid) to be able to beat LD.

badMania

02-28-2008, 09:54 PM

Mind to explain LCW's 9 Super Series titles?

LOL...that shows u didn't even read what I wrote earlier :D
Malaysia Open: 4 titles
Indonesia Open: 1 title
French Open: 1 title
Denmark Open: 1 title
Swiss Open: 1 title
Japan Open: 1 title

... I rest my case.

badMania

02-28-2008, 09:56 PM

Of all the badminton Olympic gold winners todate, how many Ji Xinqpengs are out there?? In sports, there a bound to be a 'Greece Euro 2004' every now and then.

Oh...apparently in Badminton, there seems to be a number of them
1992: Alan Budikusuma (no WC, AE, whatsoever)
1996: Paul-Eric Hoyer-Larsen (AEs in 1995, 1996, no WC before and after if I am not wrong)
2000: Ji Xinpeng (no WC, AE, whatsover before and after)
2004: Taufik Hidayat (no WC, AE, prior to the triumph)

That's 4 out of 4 my friend without prior World Championships triumph.....

badMania

02-28-2008, 10:25 PM

U want more examples only in badminton? Since I have time today, let me also do some research (for my own knowledge too)

Women's Singles
1992: Susi Susanti (2 AEs in 1990, 1991; no WC before)
1996: Bang Soo Hyun (1 AE in 1996, no WC before and after)
2000: Gong Zhichao (1 AE in 2000, no WC before and after)
2004: Zhang Ning (no AE before and after, WC in 2003)

Men's Doubles:
1992: Park Joo Bong/Kim Moon Soo (the legendary pair -- 3 AEs (1985, 1986, and 1990 and 2 WCs in 1985 & 1991)
1996: Rexy Mainaxy/Ricky Subagja (another legendary pair -- 2 AEs (1995 & 1996), 1 WC in 1995)
2000: Tony Gunawan/Candra Wijaya (1 AE in 1999, no WC before and after)
2004: Ha Tae Kwon/Kim Dong Moon (1 AE in 2000, 1 WC in 1999)

Women's Doubles:
1992: Hwang Hye Young/Choong So Young (1 AE in 1991, no WC before and after)
1996: Ge Fei/Gu Jun (the legendary pair -- 1 AE in 1996, no WC before)
2000: Ge Fei/Gu Jun (3 AEs in 1997, 1998, 2000; 2 WCs in 1997 and 1999)
2004: Yang Wei/Zhang Jiewen (no AE before & after, no WC before)

Mixed Doubles:
1996: Kim Dong Moon/Gil Young Ah (no WC or AE before and after)
2000: Zhang Jun/Gao Ling (no WC or AE before)
2004: Zhang Jun/Gao Ling (1 Olympics, 2 AEs in 2001 & 2003, 1 WC in 2001)

badMania

02-28-2008, 10:33 PM

Interesting statistics: 13 out of the 19 winners of the Olympics Gold Medals DID NOT WIN the WC prior to their triumph. Out of the 13, 8 still HAVE YET TO WIN the WC up to now.

It's better for AE though. 7 out of the 19 winners DID NOT WIN the All-England prior to the triumph. Out of the 7, 6 still HAVE YET TO WIN the All-England up to now.

Someone please double check my calculations :p:o;)

badMania

02-28-2008, 10:49 PM

Damn...I have too much free time over the past 2 days to engage in the debates with Pemuda and I am not even a Malaysian fan :o:p:D

badMania

02-28-2008, 10:52 PM

Dude, LCW won the IO ONCE while TH won it SIX TIMES, and prior to winning that Olympic gold he has already won the Indo Open 5 times. See the diff??

Uh-hoh....we now see the light! Wow....its encouraging to see ppl suddenly takes notice and emphasize the importance of Indonesia Open :o:p??

Taufik's 6 victories in home event are INDEED MAGNIFICENT! Hurrah! But he still has to win 1 more to match Ardi B. Wiranata's record. Ardi won the AE too while Taufik has this year's AE to prove to us INA fans.

As Indonesians, we are proud that ppl consider this to be a major title....thanks folks for the recognition :D Djarum's efforts in sponsoring the events for the past few years has bear fruits....;)

OT: Hidup Indonesia Terbuka :p!!!

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 10:57 PM

LOL...that shows u didn't even read what I wrote earlier :D
Malaysia Open: 4 titles
Indonesia Open: 1 title
French Open: 1 title
Denmark Open: 1 title
Swiss Open: 1 title
Japan Open: 1 title

... I rest my case.

Dude ... psst ... since you quoted from wikipedia, shall we be consistent? Here's a link to LCW's Super Series titles ;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Chong_Wei#Super_Series

badMania

02-28-2008, 10:59 PM

Dude ... psst ... since you quoted from wikipedia, shall we be consistent? Here's a link to LCW's Super Series titles ;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lee_Chong_Wei#Super_Series

Psst: I did not quote LCW's record from wikipedia, and oh yeah Taufik's 10 SS (by today's standards) titles becomes a big fat kosong, don't u know that ;):cool::p

badMania

02-28-2008, 11:05 PM

Ok....comparing Super Series 2007-2008 results only (as Pemuda requested):

The so-called favorites (by Pemuda's standards):
Lin Dan -- still the best....5 titles: Korea, All-England, China-Masters, Denmark, Hong Kong Opens 2007, 2 WCs, 2 AEs. (IMHO: the hot-favorite for the Olympic Golds)
Taufik Hidayat -- big 0! As an INA fan, of course I feel sad :mad::o But, he has the OG 04, WC 05 titles, and don't forget...the 6 INA OPENS TITLES in his pocket. We feel proud of him!

The so-called dark-horses:
Chen Jin -- 1 title in Swiss Open 2007, no WC, no AE
Bao Chunlai -- 1 title in China Open 2007, no WC, no AE
Peter Gade -- 1 title in Malaysia Open 2007, no WC, no AE
Lee Hyun Il -- 1 title in Korea Open 2008, no WC, no AE

oh...and of course...coming to Pemuda's dream player to snatch the OG 08: Kenneth Jonassen.....another big kosong I am afraid :o

As for the no-hopers.....Malaysian's own Lee Chong Wei:
4 Super Series titles -- Indonesia, Japan, French Opens 2007, Korea Opens 2008.

Honestly, going by the overall achievements, I cannot see why Lee Chong Wei will be considered no-hopers. Seriously.....

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 11:12 PM

Oh...apparently in Badminton, there seems to be a number of them
1992: Alan Budikusuma (no WC, AE, whatsoever)
1996: Paul-Eric Hoyer-Larsen (AEs in 1995, 1996, no WC before and after if I am not wrong)
2000: Ji Xinpeng (no WC, AE, whatsover before and after)
2004: Taufik Hidayat (no WC, AE, prior to the triumph)

That's 4 out of 4 my friend without prior World Championships triumph.....

"Of all the badminton Olympic gold winners todate, how many Ji Xinqpengs are out there?? In sports, there a bound to be a 'Greece Euro 2004' every now and then."

Please read my above statement carefully again. Let me help you along the way ; "Of all the badminton Olympic gold winners todate ..". Key word ; 'ALL'

Talk about not reading your postings and all . Maybe you should walk the talk, dude ;)

And dude, please point to me where and when I said that the pre-requisite to win that gold in Beijing one must either have won a WC / OG before???

badMania

02-28-2008, 11:17 PM

Before I forget, let's talk about Pemuda's another dream pair: Jens Eriksen/Martin Lundgaard Hansen, shall we?

2007: a big fat zero! Which means kosong SS titles

The Big-Titles: All-England 2004, 2006.
Mickey-Mouse Titles: European Championships 2004, 2006
Other GP Titles: China Masters 2006; Korea, Japan Opens 2005; Singapore Open 2003

NO victories ever in home event Denmark Open and the BIG ONE in INDONESIA OPEN!

badMania

02-28-2008, 11:21 PM

Please read my above statement carefully again. Let me help you along the way ; "Of all the badminton Olympic gold winners todate ..". Key word ; 'ALL'

Talk about not reading your postings and all . Maybe you should walk the talk, dude ;)

And dude, please point to me where and when I said that the pre-requisite to win that gold in Beijing one must either have won a WC / OG before???

Dude.....please also read the following post which summarizes ALL THE OLYMPIC WINNERS :p:o

U keep on harping and going on about the WC/OG as the big-titles so...of course that players naturally will have to be screened to such pre-req to be considered a favorite for the OG this year, don't they my friend ;)? Otherwise, any Tom, Dick, Harry or Jane in that respect will be jostling for places in the Olympics and want their names to be counted to, don't they?

U have written: Taufik and Lin Dan have won those, so naturally, they are hot favorites. Fu/Cai have won the WC and AE, so, naturally, they are the hot favorites too.

As for Malaysia's poor LCW and Koo/Tan....sorry folks....they are not part of the elite group yet....come back next time u guys have won the AE/WC/OG.

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 11:25 PM

Psst: I did not quote LCW's record from wikipedia, and oh yeah Taufik's 10 SS (by today's standards) titles becomes a big fat kosong, don't u know that ;):cool::p

From your post #334;
"Quoting from wikipedia: Ji's gold medal feat came as a big surprise because no one had expected him to do so since he has never won any tournaments previously. He also defeated Taufik Hidayat and Peter Gade Christensen along the way to the final."

Dude, if you are using wikipedia then lets stay consistent with it. You cant use wikipedia for one and something else for another.

Just to be specific, lets list down the titles TH & LCW won todate. Ok, for TH here goes; 1 OG, 1 WC, 6 Indo Opens, 1 Sing Open, 1 MO, 2 AG gold. The 3 ABC titles and Sea Games no need to put la.

Can you list down LCW's so that we can have a look see?? ;)

As for your claims about TH having a 'big fat kosong', well if having 1 OG and 1 WC is a big fat kosong, I guess LCW 0 OG, 0 WC is a nice designer zero ;)

badMania

02-28-2008, 11:26 PM

"Of all the badminton Olympic gold winners todate, how many Ji Xinqpengs are out there?? In sports, there a bound to be a 'Greece Euro 2004' every now and then."

I have shown u that there are lots of Ji Xinpengs out there...unfortunately...in terms of badminton gold medals in Olympics :o

Please take your pleasure to read the subsequent post :p;):rolleyes:

13 of 19 (NO prior WC...well this is your definition of big title right?) -- 68%...that's a damning statistics really :cool:

And for those who have won the Olympic Golds, ONLY Zhang Jun/Gao Ling managed to retain their Gold in Athens 2004.

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 11:34 PM

Dude.....please also read the following post which summarizes ALL THE OLYMPIC WINNERS :p:o

U keep on harping and going on about the WC/OG as the big-titles so...of course that players naturally will have to be screened to such pre-req to be considered a favorite for the OG this year, don't they my friend ;)? Otherwise, any Tom, Dick, Harry or Jane in that respect will be jostling for places in the Olympics and want their names to be counted to, don't they?

U have written: Taufik and Lin Dan have won those, so naturally, they are hot favorites. Fu/Cai have won the WC and AE, so, naturally, they are the hot favorites too.

As for Malaysia's poor LCW and Koo/Tan....sorry folks....they are not part of the elite group yet....come back next time u guys have won the AE/WC/OG.

Isnt the WC/OG the big ones in badminton??? I mean, since you are into wikipedia, allow me to point out that the OG/WC are listed as level one competitions. Here's a link; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Badminton#Competitions

Dude, please read my post # 318, slowly this time round, ok? I listed LD & TH as the favourites, BCL, PG, KJ & CH as darkhorses. I mentioned LD should take it but I would like to see KJ pull an upset. Now, can you tell me whether PG, BCL, KJ of CH won the WC/OG before??

badMania

02-28-2008, 11:36 PM

Just to be specific, lets list down the titles TH & LCW won todate. Ok, for TH here goes; 1 OG, 1 WC, 6 Indo Opens, 1 Sing Open, 1 MO, 2 AG gold. The 3 ABC titles and Sea Games no need to put la.

Can you list down LCW's so that we can have a look see?? ;)

As for your claims about TH having a 'big fat kosong', well if having 1 OG and 1 WC is a big fat kosong, I guess LCW 0 OG, 0 WC is a nice designer zero ;)

LOL....debating with you will never-end....like many seasoned BCers have experienced (including our much respected ants and abedeng). I can only blame myself for having too much free-time today....sigh....:o

The wikipedia is to quote Ji Xinpeng's record, since its impossible to find those from the BWF.

I don't need to repeat what I have written. It's all above for all to see :D;)

Well, u have to look at Taufik Hidayat BEFORE he won the Gold right and compare to LCW AT THIS POINT IN TIME. If we can't agree on this, then, its no pt to agree further.

Besides, also compare Taufik's and Lin Dan's records prior to the Olympics 2004: Taufik -- 0 WC, 0 AE; Lin Dan -- 0 WC, 1 AE.

As for myself, I don't see any difference between Taufik's record then and Lee Chong Wei's record now :cool: Taufik even competed in one prior Olympics, same like LCW's case now. As for WC and AEs, Taufik competed in more WC and AEs than LCW now.

badMania

02-28-2008, 11:37 PM

Isnt the WC/OG the big ones in badminton??? I mean, since you are into wikipedia, allow me to point out that the OG/WC are listed as level one competitions. Here's a link; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Badminton#Competitions

So, I have put out the record up there for u to see :p;)

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 11:41 PM

I have shown u that there are lots of Ji Xinpengs out there...unfortunately...in terms of badminton gold medals in Olympics :o

Please take your pleasure to read the subsequent post :p;):rolleyes:

13 of 19 (NO prior WC...well this is your definition of big title right?) -- 68%...that's a damning statistics really :cool:

And for those who have won the Olympic Golds, ONLY Zhang Jun/Gao Ling managed to retain their Gold in Athens 2004.

And dude, again I ask of you to tell me where and when it is I said that the pre-requisite to win that gold in Beijing depends on one being a previous winner of either OG/WC??

Yes, I did say the OG & WC are big titles and this is confirmed in your little wikipedia as well. BUT did I say for one to win gold in Beijing this summer, one must have a OG/WC nicely tucked away at home?? Or even the AE for that matter?? :confused:

Seriously dude, if I have said so, please point it out where and when.

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 11:45 PM

LOL....debating with you will never-end....like many seasoned BCers have experienced (including our much respected ants and abedeng). I can only blame myself for having too much free-time today....sigh....:o

The wikipedia is to quote Ji Xinpeng's record, since its impossible to find those from the BWF.

I don't need to repeat what I have written. It's all above for all to see :D;)

Well, u have to look at Taufik Hidayat BEFORE he won the Gold right and compare to LCW AT THIS POINT IN TIME. If we can't agree on this, then, its no pt to agree further.

Besides, also compare Taufik's and Lin Dan's records prior to the Olympics 2004: Taufik -- 0 WC, 0 AE; Lin Dan -- 0 WC, 1 AE.

As for myself, I don't see any difference between Taufik's record then and Lee Chong Wei's record now :cool: Taufik even competed in one prior Olympics, same like LCW's case now. As for WC and AEs, Taufik competed in more WC and AEs than LCW now.

Dude, now you are talking about LD. Why dont you list down LCW titles and lets compare with TH first.

And dude, this is a free world. Dont blame yourself. Just run along if you have something else to do. No worries.

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 11:46 PM

So, I have put out the record up there for u to see :p;)

Well, if you would like to think so and if it makes your day, go ahead, dude. ;)

Go for it.

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 11:48 PM

Pemuda

02-28-2008, 11:50 PM

Damn...I have too much free time over the past 2 days to engage in the debates with Pemuda and I am not even a Malaysian fan :o:p:D

This thread limited only to Malaysians? :confused:

badMania

02-28-2008, 11:56 PM

Yes, I did say the OG & WC are big titles and this is confirmed in your little wikipedia as well. BUT did I say for one to win gold in Beijing this summer, one must have a OG/WC nicely tucked away at home?? Or even the AE for that matter?? :confused:

Seriously dude, if I have said so, please point it out where and when.

So pardon me then my friend...what are your prerequisites of being branded as a favorite for the OG in 2008? Be specific u see...otherwise...most of us will be lulled into some wrong zones and then we have to bother you to direct us to the correct traffic....our bad really :o :eek:

U see my friend....we all knowledge the significance and importance of OG & WC as the big titles in badminton. Since u keep harping on it and EMPHASIZE in countless times that LCW and Koo/Tan HAVE YET TO WIN those titles. So, based on these facts+other factors unrelated to their titles ("big-charlie" attitude, gold rings, primadonas, talking on HP while lining up etc), u declared to us that these Malaysian players are NO-HOPERS! Now, u have to correct me if I am wrong in my deduction here my dear friend, I don't want to make any more further mistake that will further embarass myself...sigh....:o;)

OK...so I digged out the record books and showed how many percentages of Olympics Gold Winners out there DID NOT HAVE PRIOR WC titles before they competed in that year's Olympics. The statistics (first time I know of it too) were pretty damning.....68%! As for PRIOR OG titles....basically only 1 pair has retained the Gold.

So, pardon me for asking the second time (I am an old man u see...unlike u....still a 20++ young guy). Now, u said that u never claimed WC/OG Titles were pre-requisities for being considered a favorite for this year's Olympics, so...tell us my friend.... what ARE YOUR PRE-REQUISITIES REALLY?

We would so very much like to know.....and thanks for your answers as always :D;)

pjswift

02-29-2008, 12:57 AM

Damn...I have too much free time over the past 2 days to engage in the debates with Pemuda and I am not even a Malaysian fan :o:p:D
That's pemuda's gift.He tempts you with his incongruousness and before you know it,you actually created too much free time out of nowhere.But I'm delighted with the research you've generated.Although it's clear that pemuda have highly limited capacity for your data output and can operate on only one frequency,pls know your efforts are appreciated and the research, great food for thought.Let's hope you continue to have free time over the weekend and if this thread is not closed by then, maybe I'll find the free time to chip in with a post.

Pemuda

02-29-2008, 01:12 AM

So pardon me then my friend...what are your prerequisites of being branded as a favorite for the OG in 2008? Be specific u see...otherwise...most of us will be lulled into some wrong zones and then we have to bother you to direct us to the correct traffic....our bad really :o :eek:

U see my friend....we all knowledge the significance and importance of OG & WC as the big titles in badminton. Since u keep harping on it and EMPHASIZE in countless times that LCW and Koo/Tan HAVE YET TO WIN those titles. So, based on these facts+other factors unrelated to their titles ("big-charlie" attitude, gold rings, primadonas, talking on HP while lining up etc), u declared to us that these Malaysian players are NO-HOPERS! Now, u have to correct me if I am wrong in my deduction here my dear friend, I don't want to make any more further mistake that will further embarass myself...sigh....:o;)

OK...so I digged out the record books and showed how many percentages of Olympics Gold Winners out there DID NOT HAVE PRIOR WC titles before they competed in that year's Olympics. The statistics (first time I know of it too) were pretty damning.....68%! As for PRIOR OG titles....basically only 1 pair has retained the Gold.

So, pardon me for asking the second time (I am an old man u see...unlike u....still a 20++ young guy). Now, u said that u never claimed WC/OG Titles were pre-requisities for being considered a favorite for this year's Olympics, so...tell us my friend.... what ARE YOUR PRE-REQUISITIES REALLY?

We would so very much like to know.....and thanks for your answers as always :D;)

Wow! Look at the bold letters and all. ;)
I think someone is all heated up.

azabaz_ipoh

02-29-2008, 01:22 AM

Pemuda

02-29-2008, 01:44 AM

just for fun, and really i am curious to what would be your answer pemuda, why dont you answer the bold letters of badmania. let's state your prerequisites as to who could win the olympic gold medal. :)

Too many bold letters just strike me as being not polite. You want an answer, I believe you should ask nicely, Agree?? .... even if it is just for fun.

azabaz_ipoh

02-29-2008, 02:02 AM

Too many bold letters just strike me as being not polite. You want an answer, I believe you should ask nicely, Agree?? .... even if it is just for fun.

so you are not going to answer the question? too afraid to make a stand? ;) or just making sure you have a backdoor exit just in case? :) no bold letter now and i am asking you nicely....:D

Pemuda

02-29-2008, 02:11 AM

so you are not going to answer the question? too afraid to make a stand? ;) or just making sure you have a backdoor exit just in case? :) no bold letter now and i am asking you nicely....:D

My dear,

Before you jump on stage and scream about backdoor exits .... you seem fascinated with 'backdoors' and all, eh?? But anyway, lets get back on point ...

Let me reiterate that I have made my stand numerous times already in this forum. Is it possible for you to refer back to my previous postings?? Am also asking you nicely too, my dear :D

Pemuda

02-29-2008, 02:17 AM

too afraid to make a stand? ;)

My dear,

If I was ever afraid to make my stand, I would have joined the rest of Malaysia Boleh group here with " KKK/TBH still young & learning", "Give them time", "Give them more time", "Pay them more", "Should not pressure them", "Judging not fair", "TBH nervous", "We still must hope and pray" etc etc etc and etc la.

eaglehelang

02-29-2008, 02:36 AM

Damn...I have too much free time over the past 2 days to engage in the debates with Pemuda and I am not even a Malaysian fan :o:p:D

LOL my friend, you really have free time today, it has gone from pg 18 to 22 in just a couple of hours.
Most welcome to take over the debates from us so-called "Malaysian Hordes", better still you have proven some of my points, and coming from a non Msian at least will not be considered bias.:D:D

wood_22_chuck

02-29-2008, 02:41 AM

It is dismal to see everyone ganging up on Pemuda.

And I can hear the retort, "Well he deserves it."

Now, bean-counting statistics joining the fray. I'll just point out a few things here. The Malaysian players are now nowhere near the leagues of established encumbent players. Despite the high world ranking, it's so paper-thin.

Nadal will never get the accolades of Federer, for example, because Federer is in Sampras' and other greats, while Nadal is somewhere along "the best of the rest."

I find it difficult to group Lee Chong Wei along the ranks of Taufik Hidayat, Peter Gade, Lin Dan, Chen Hong for example.

I find it difficult to group Koo Kean Keat/Tan Boon Heong alongside Lars Paaske/Jonas Rasmussen (formerly), Fu Hai Feng/Cai Yun.

It's hard to hear this, Malaysian-fans, but the current state of Malaysian Badminton successes still register as statistical anomalies.

Now, statistically, you can focus on the random highs and get excited, but the huge troughs/lows are too glaring to ignore.

Pemuda, I would advise you (it's very presumptuous, but I mean it politely) to allow others a little freedom in their expressions and hopes. Many silent readers are behind you, but past experience makes it prudent to stay silent.

-dave

azabaz_ipoh

02-29-2008, 02:45 AM

sorry, there are too many back posts and i get confused by it all. could you maybe just summarize what are your prerequisites for a player to have a chance to win the OG please. something along the line...

the prerequisites are :

1.......
2.......
3.......

and i take back the statement that you are too afraid to make a stand. my bad. you surely have spoken out very clear here. sorry. :) and please humor me the above list of prerequisites so that i can better understand your reasoning.

ctjcad

02-29-2008, 03:07 AM

LOL my friend, you really have free time today, it has gone from pg 18 to 22 in just a couple of hours.
...
..if Pemuda never signed up to join BC or if he did but kept quiet, this thread would probably still sit on the 4th page...at the very least, he's entertained us..;)

azabaz_ipoh

02-29-2008, 03:08 AM

It is dismal to see everyone ganging up on Pemuda.

And I can hear the retort, "Well he deserves it."

people are not ganging up on him i think. they are just responding to his posts. as is what usually happens in a forum. and really, i just think that some people just dont understand his reasoning. that's all. and so they debate. exchanging facts from other sources and such. ganging up would be everybody attacking him personally. most of them are just disputing his posts.

Now, bean-counting statistics joining the fray. I'll just point out a few things here. The Malaysian players are now nowhere near the leagues of established encumbent players. Despite the high world ranking, it's so paper-thin.

Nadal will never get the accolades of Federer, for example, because Federer is in Sampras' and other greats, while Nadal is somewhere along "the best of the rest."

agree that malaysian players cannot really be counted as one of the greats yet since they still have much to prove. and yes nadal might always play second fiddle to federer but on a good day, nadal could beat federer convincingly and on his favourite surface those chances are better. top players are not undefeatable. and so nadal could win the OG as much as federer could. because the topic of this thread is whether a malaysian can win a gold and so, to say it is impossible is, in my opinion, kinda too conclusive. there are no sure thing in sports. favourites can lose and underdogs can win. simple as that.

I find it difficult to group Lee Chong Wei along the ranks of Taufik Hidayat, Peter Gade, Lin Dan, Chen Hong for example.

I find it difficult to group Koo Kean Keat/Tan Boon Heong alongside Lars Paaske/Jonas Rasmussen (formerly), Fu Hai Feng/Cai Yun.

It's hard to hear this, Malaysian-fans, but the current state of Malaysian Badminton successes still register as statistical anomalies.

Now, statistically, you can focus on the random highs and get excited, but the huge troughs/lows are too glaring to ignore.

again i agree that maybe LCW and KKK/TBH are not yet established enough to be considered one of the greats. i was a little disappointed by KKK/TBH's performance against korea during the TC qualifications tourney in vietnam. but to dismiss them so easily like they are nothing at all in the badminton arena due to some bad performances and signs of mental weakness is denying the fact that they have won before and against those considered as greats before. i hope they will be counted as one of the greats by the end of their career but if they dont all i would ask for is that they do their best.

Pemuda, I would advise you (it's very presumptuous, but I mean it politely) to allow others a little freedom in their expressions and hopes. Many silent readers are behind you, but past experience makes it prudent to stay silent.
-dave

no problem debating as long as it stays on course. but that is sometimes hard to do as evident by the many closed threads :) and as there are many silent readers behind pemuda, there are many silent readers against him too. all is fair i think. :D no harm done. :)

ctjcad

02-29-2008, 03:17 AM

...
no problem debating as long as it stays on course. but that is sometimes hard to do as evident by the many closed threads :)
...
..this thread won't get locked and hope someone brings a can (or 2) of WD40 cos the wheels of this threadwagon is about to spin again...maybe all the way til the OG in August..:rolleyes:

eaglehelang

02-29-2008, 03:19 AM

1) It is dismal to see everyone ganging up on Pemuda.

And I can hear the retort, "Well he deserves it."

2) It's hard to hear this, Malaysian-fans, but the current state of Malaysian Badminton successes still register as statistical anomalies.

Now, statistically, you can focus on the random highs and get excited, but the huge troughs/lows are too glaring to ignore.

1) In real life, most Msian side(+sports ministry, NSC,media, fans) have Pemuda's point of view, so, we ehem "msian hordes" fans are the minority . I already repeated this many times.
In real life, it's our views who are laughed at. They also laughed at those who dared to believe that KKK/TBH could win 2006 AG MD gold after dismal results in the team events.
So, you & the 'silent readers' are part of the majority :D.
It takes guts to be the minority, he he.

Interestingly, there are also non Msians who seem puzzled with the lack of pariotism/support for Msian players amongst the general Msian population. So, the real life situation is different, to say the least.

2) We already know this for many years & it's very often lamented in the Msian media & by the sports authorities. Stimes read it till sick of it, so, how could we ignore it. You didnt see it posted here doesnt mean it wasnt featured.

But once again, as myself & other BCers already pointed out many times, what can actually be done by ordinary fans? Launch a protest & pressure our 'beloved' decision makers ? we can choose to continue lamenting like the majority or look beyond that(no offense meant to you or the 'silent readers').

Unless I can actually change things, then only would I spend time & energy devising such strategies, if not the grouses/comments/complaints will just come to nought.

Btw, I'm sure you know Badmania is an Indonesian & an ardent Indonesia fan. Now, why would non Msians come up (Badmania wasnt the only one) & defend Msia players ?hmmmm :rolleyes::confused:
On Msia baddy statistics & comparisions with other players,I'll let a non Msian answer it.

ctjcad

02-29-2008, 03:26 AM

...
Btw, I'm sure you know Badmania is an Indonesian & an ardent Indonesia fan.
Now, why would non Msians come up (Badmania wasnt the only one) & defend Msia players ?hmmmm :rolleyes::confused:
...
..i thought badMania admitted he had too much time on his hands, thus his banters w/Pemuda??...
Btw, with a screen-name like badMania, it's not a surprise he was quite persistent w/Pemuda, wasn't he??..:cool:

eaglehelang

02-29-2008, 03:33 AM

..i thought badMania admitted he had too much time on his hands, thus his banters w/Pemuda??...
Btw, with a screen-name like badMania, it's not a surprise he was quite persistent w/Pemuda, wasn't he??..:cool:

He can do other things with his free time - like analysing German Open results where Indonesia players are entered. The fact he feels strongly enuf abt it to comment on it & this is not 1st time, as you know.

X Ball

03-02-2008, 12:21 AM

so you are not going to answer the question? too afraid to make a stand? ;) or just making sure you have a backdoor exit just in case? :) no bold letter now and i am asking you nicely....:D

Let me answer it for you - it is doom and gloom. LCW will not win AE nor will there be gold to take home in the Olympics. KKK has too many rings and the blonde does not signify he will win gold.

All hopefuls are just that - they will bite the dust and know that Malaysian badminton is just a 'put-on'. The authorities are killing the game. There is too much rantings by the hopefuls. We pamper our players and many players are millionaires and they cannot play well.

Oldhand

03-02-2008, 03:19 AM

Loh

03-02-2008, 03:30 AM

Oldhand, the way you described KKK/TBH, no wonder Rexy wants to quit! I'm sure XBall will prove you wrong! This team has announced recently that they will be in time to hit the form they produced at the last AE and retain the title. :)

Cheung

03-02-2008, 04:30 AM

..this thread won't get locked and hope someone brings a can (or 2) of WD40 cos the wheels of this threadwagon is about to spin again...maybe all the way til the OG in August..:rolleyes:
We don't really want to lock any threads but there are a lot of off topic posts and sidetracking away from 'main' issues. Let's try and keep on track.:)

koo_fan

03-02-2008, 10:21 AM

Just finished watching the MAS KOR Thomas Cup MD match: Lee Jae Jin & Jin Jae Sung Vs Koo Kien Keat & Tan Boon Heong.

For want of a sterner word, 'ordinary' would fully describe the Malaysian pair's current game. Unless they have an unopened bag of skills, court-craft and power hidden away somewhere, it's difficult to hope that they can make it to the Olympic upper draw, let alone win the gold :o

When even an unfancied, error-prone, no-big-deal pair like this Korean duo can beat them, Koo Kien Keat & Tan Boon Heong would be lucky to not be eaten alive by pairs like Markis Kido & Hendra Setiawan or Cai Yun & Fu Haifeng, not to mention the resurgent Danish pairs.

If you do have the time, count the number of errors the Korean pair made.
Subtract that from the score... and it does seem that Rexy has quite a pathetic team leading the quest for an Olympic badminton doubles gold ;)
Ur view of that game.i couldnt say it is wrong.the line to determine authencity of an opinion was too ambigous.but i couldnt agree too.Mistakes are made.bad mistakes.But kkk/tbh are still on the right track.5 months left.
They start from zero n in three months,got gold medal for malaysia in asian games after 25 years.This 5 months,find the new fresh kkk/tbh back.

I didnt watch the game.i'll say this honestly.

No matter how bad they played now,(as what u have told us here.)
i will still hope they would be better next day.next tournament.next month.N peaked in olympic.

Nothing wrong with revealing their weaknesses now.nothing is wrong with this.But i couldnt resist from bashing malaysians who said WE CANT WIN.We are in the olympic.Chances are there.why keep saying we are not going to win?
i will say malaysia can win the gold.

Oldhand

03-02-2008, 11:12 AM

Just finished watching the MAS KOR Thomas Cup MD match: Lee Jae Jin & Jin Jae Sung Vs Koo Kien Keat & Tan Boon Heong.

For want of a sterner word, 'ordinary' would fully describe the Malaysian pair's current game. Unless they have an unopened bag of skills, court-craft and power hidden away somewhere, it's difficult to hope that they can make it to the Olympic upper draw, let alone win the gold :o

When even an unfancied, error-prone, no-big-deal pair like this Korean duo can beat them, Koo Kien Keat & Tan Boon Heong would be lucky to not be eaten alive by pairs like Markis Kido & Hendra Setiawan or Cai Yun & Fu Haifeng, not to mention the resurgent Danish pairs.

If you do have the time, count the number of errors the Korean pair made.
Subtract that from the score... and it does seem that Rexy has quite a pathetic team leading the quest for an Olympic badminton doubles gold ;)

Oldhand, the way you described KKK/TBH, no wonder Rexy wants to quit! I'm sure XBall will prove you wrong! This team has announced recently that they will be in time to hit the form they produced at the last AE and retain the title. :)

We've been through quite a few announcements by now.
That's hardly going to help in Malaysia's quest for gold.

These boys have shown that when they get their act together, no one can stand in their way.
The question now is, can they get their act together again? ;)

...No matter how bad they played now,(as what u have told us here.) i will still hope they would be better next day.next tournament.next month.N peaked in olympic.

Nothing wrong with revealing their weaknesses now.nothing is wrong with this.But i couldnt resist from bashing malaysians who said WE CANT WIN.We are in the olympic.Chances are there.why keep saying we are not going to win?
i will say malaysia can win the gold.

There's no reason why Koo Kien Keat & Tan Boon Heong can't win an Olympic gold. However, there's no way they can win it playing like they are now :o

badMania

03-02-2008, 11:28 AM

There's no reason why Koo Kien Keat & Tan Boon Heong can't win an Olympic gold. However, there's no way they can win it playing like they are now :o

For my (and other INA fans) selfish reason, let's hope your words materialize :D

wilfredlgf

03-02-2008, 11:35 AM

There's no reason why Koo Kien Keat & Tan Boon Heong can't win an Olympic gold. However, there's no way they can win it playing like they are now :oA much fairer assessment than "They won't ever win it and anybody who disagrees is stupid".

X Ball

03-02-2008, 10:59 PM

A much fairer assessment than "They won't ever win it and anybody who disagrees is stupid".

That cannot be any more truthful !

There are a few who basically try to laugh us (the hopefuls) off -why ? I remember everyone once wrote LCW off before the IO and said he hadn't a chance in a million-and he won it easily. I also remember when KKK-TBH had their problems winning, they came back and won. All doubters had to 'eat crows'.

So give us a break those who think they are so smart to predict woes - we know better. Save your pessimism for yourself - we have everything to hope for but not you.

And there are a lot of 'silent' ones here who feel the same as I.

cooler

03-03-2008, 12:38 AM

A much fairer assessment than "They won't ever win it and anybody who disagrees is stupid".
the odd of certain person getting hit by lightning on certain day and time is not zero either but no one would bet real money on that. Now the question is would u bet real money on MAL getting 2 gold medals at 08 beijing? It is easy to tout and cheer hysterically in a forum because it is free and u are not accountable what u say. Even taufist, indra and TH for President are now back to sanity about taufik's odd of winning anything these days. Rexy was being realistic too when he resigned... twice.

wilfredlgf

03-03-2008, 01:13 AM

the odd of certain person getting hit by lightning on certain day and time is not zero either but no one would bet real money on that. Now the question is would u bet real money on MAL getting 2 gold medals at 08 beijing? It is easy to tout and cheer hysterically in a forum because it is free and u are not accountable what u say. Even taufist, indra and TH for President are now back to sanity about taufik's odd of winning anything these days. Rexy was being realistic too when he resigned... twice.
I won't bet money on it no, but here's to hoping - it's free. I'm fine if we don't win it in Beijing - we don't have the divine right to - but I don't totally strike out our own chances either as we do have the people to rise to the occasion and do it.

I'm adopting the "until it's impossible, I'll keep hoping" stance on this.

Everything points towards a 'no' but not an 'impossible'.

cooler

03-03-2008, 01:31 AM

I won't bet money on it no, but here's to hoping - it's free. I'm fine if we don't win it in Beijing - we don't have the divine right to - but I don't totally strike out our own chances either as we do have the people to rise to the occasion and do it.

I'm adopting the "until it's impossible, I'll keep hoping" stance on this.

Everything points towards a 'no' but not an 'impossible'.
cheering is fine and dandy and noble but there are some here that are making specific predictions.

wilfredlgf

03-03-2008, 01:37 AM

cheering is fine and dandy and noble but there are some here that are making specific predictions.They can knock themselves out; as far as I'm concerned what matters is when the event actually takes place.

Even if it doesn't happen it's not because the naysayers were right, it's because the players were unsuccessful.

eaglehelang

03-03-2008, 02:59 AM

cheering is fine and dandy and noble but there are some here that are making specific predictions.

Some Western BCers have posted that they bet real $$$, but small amounts, so it doesnt effect their pocket that much. And sports betting in Msia is actually illegal, so....:) There were bets - satay bets, soup bets, he he:D

The other points have been covered, I'll re-emphasize this point : there're already a lot of negativism about the players' chances, that's the majority Msian view. Those who still hope are the minority.
Basically, how to succeed if there's -ve mindset pervalent?
So, we choose to support & remain +ve when many naysayers say "Msia players will never hack it to win gold."

I'll give this example again : In AG 2006, after Msia lost in team event to Korea when on paper we should have won, those who dared to hope that KKK/TBH could have an ounce of chance to win gold in MD were laughed at. They, as a 2 month old stratch pair, won the gold.

Yes, for MD, KKK/TBH & oldies CTF/LWW have to beef up their mental strength. And yes, KKK/TBH cannot win if they played like the way they did against the Korean pair.

Nobody thought Kido/Setiawan had a chance to win WC 2007 due to their 'wretched form' (as Badmania calls it), they won. If Badmania had given up supporting & cheering just cos his heros were doing badly Jan - June 2007........

And btw, according to the expert observers, KKK/TBH will still be one of the favourites to win gold as WR#3 even if they dont defend AE. The top 3 MD pairs are the favourities, next are the veteran pairs(minus Tony/Chandra), dark horses = Korea, Japan, Taiwan.
Of course if Kido/Setiawan wins AE this year, they'll be the favourites.

But, as you know, at every OG, there will be surprises, that makes it very interesting.;);)

X Ball

03-03-2008, 03:42 AM

The other points have been covered, I'll re-emphasize this point : there're already a lot of negativism about the players' chances, that's the majority Msian view. Those who still hope are the minority.
Basically, how to succeed if there's -ve mindset pervalent?
So, we choose to support & remain +ve when many naysayers say "Msia players will never hack it to win gold."

Yes, for MD, KKK/TBH & oldies CTF/LWW have to beef up their mental strength. And yes, KKK/TBH cannot win if they played like the way they did against the Korean pair.

Yes, and guess what ? The people who are knocking on KKK-TBH on their mental weaknesses are actually pretty weak themselves - they cannot even believe we have a chance. Given that they don't expect the players to win, how can they then go and support the players ? Well, the truth is they won't - they will think it is a waste of money to go and cheer for their players.

It is a good thing our players have strong minded fans like us to support them at the stadium - the ones who will shout down the stadium to ensure the players win.

Please, if you are a negative fan, stay away from the stadium lest your negativity jinx the players. We don't need you.

And for people who think predicting two golds for the Olympics is a sin, let me say you are a fool. I have never ever said we would win for sure - anything can happen in life. At least I am not brave enough to say we won't win like you -- and should we win, I hope you eat your words.

koo_fan

03-03-2008, 03:47 AM

cheering is fine and dandy and noble but there are some here that are making specific predictions.
Nothing is wrong with cheer n support.it may help players.maybe not.
depend on the team.
But to keep saying,We cant win - Realistic stuff.Thats bad for the team's morale.

instead of trying to say the 'realistic' predictions.why dont just act as real fans.Support.
Taking wilfred's - its free.
When the team go home with no medals.Stand behind them.Show the loyalty.

badMania

03-03-2008, 03:51 AM

koo_fan

03-03-2008, 03:54 AM

eaglehelang

03-03-2008, 04:11 AM

Yes, and guess what ? The people who are knocking on KKK-TBH on their mental weaknesses are actually pretty weak themselves - they cannot even believe we have a chance. Given that they don't expect the players to win, how can they then go and support the players ? Well, the truth is they won't - they will think it is a waste of money to go and cheer for their players.

.

:D:D , or maybe they have not seen real life impossible situations become possible, therefore find it difficult to believe it can happen.
This is not in the impossible category yet, not for MS or MD. Our WS & WD winning gold, now, that would be a miracle.

We'll go against the majority & cheer & tell the players they have it in them to make it, he he, they need to +ve vibes.

btw, are you going to Beijing to be part of cheering team?

Badmania - so those countries save airfare & give to you so you can go cheer for your two mighties?:p;);) Maybe become their personal consultant too.

X Ball

03-03-2008, 04:13 AM

:D:D , or maybe they have not seen real life impossible situations become possible, therefore find it difficult to believe it can happen.
This is not in the impossible category yet, not for MS or MD. Our WS & WD winning gold, now, that would be a miracle.

We'll go against the majority & cheer & tell the players they have it in them to make it, he he, they need to +ve vibes.

btw, are you going to Beijing to be part of cheering team?

Going to Beijing would be a dream for now but not impossible.

koo_fan

03-03-2008, 04:13 AM

. Who can expect that Ronald Susilo of Singapore can topple the mighty Lin Dan in the first round of the Olympics? That result was one that was bordering on miracles for Ronald himself! Probably the greatest achievements of his life in beating the undisputed World No 1!

If this could happen once again,badminton rocks!!!

koo_fan

03-03-2008, 04:17 AM

Going to Beijing would be a dream for now but not impossible.
Fans like u should go to Beijing.
Fans like Pemuda should stay at home,n wait for the result.

As in politics,we need Parti-Parti Alternatif too.

badMania

03-03-2008, 04:18 AM

If Malaysians can go to the moon already, then winning the Gold medals will be easier than that :D:p

badMania

03-03-2008, 04:18 AM

Badmania - so those countries save airfare & give to you so you can go cheer for your two mighties?:p;);) Maybe become their personal consultant too.

Nah...I won't go even for the free airfare :cool: I will not stand the heat and the crowrds :o

cooler

03-03-2008, 04:28 AM

Indeed....when does the rule says that Prediction = Reality???

X-Ball is bold enough to predict that MAS can win 2 golds....that's his own personal feeling about it. To think about it, it's good to be optimistic because if you already feel that you are going to lose before even appearing on the court, then, its better the countries do not send those players and save on the airfares :o U see..no point to go lah...anyway they will lose right :o:cool: ?

Competition will produce upsets, no matter how unlikely those might be. Who can expect that Ronald Susilo of Singapore can topple the mighty Lin Dan in the first round of the Olympics? That result was one that was bordering on miracles for Ronald himself! Probably the greatest achievements of his life in beating the undisputed World No 1!
problem is, the prediction was made by a certain person who has the poorest track record of past predictions. In hope to regain his credibility/popularity, he constantly make predictions, the more outrageous the better since the general public remember the loud one and easlly forgets their many many wrong ones. So if just 1 of his prediction come true, he'll use it to redeem himself and will reference to it forever and ever. I see these type of people all the times, they are called salesman, marketers, brokers, stock analysts and con artists. Only lemmings worship them.

cooler

03-03-2008, 04:38 AM

Like what have been said in other forum,based on current performance of kkk/tbh - the chance is thin.But its not zero yet.
Dont turn the word thin to be zero.Huge difference here.

Will we win?Yes we can.Is that so shameful to be voice out?
Be malaysian,guys.

sorry, i'm not malaysian and I don't see this nor want this to be a pro malaysians versus non-malaysians thing.

also, when making prediction, it helps the readers if u provide some basis to your predictions, it would make your case stronger.

Yes, one do have the rights to predict something to occur even tho its probability is not zero but if it get repetitive, predictions turn to just...noise, a hollow noise at that.

X Ball

03-03-2008, 04:46 AM

problem is, the prediction was made by a certain person who has the poorest track record of past predictions. In hope to regain his credibility/popularity, he constantly make predictions, the more outrageous the better since the general public remember the loud one and easlly forgets their many many wrong ones. So if just 1 of his prediction come true, he'll use it to redeem himself and will reference to it forever and ever. I see these type of people all the times, they are called salesman, marketers, brokers, stock analysts and con artists. Only lemmings worship them.

Yes, I also see people like you with a 'big chip on the shoulder' who think they are fighting some evil people just because someone thinks different from you.

And you cannot stand people who are more positive that you. You have to start picking back because you have that vindictiveness in you. As I said before, a garlic smells better than you when close.

I post here for enjoyment and a sharing of information - you are sick if you think I am here for a popularity contest.

X Ball

03-03-2008, 04:49 AM

cooler

03-03-2008, 04:56 AM

when u ran out of valid points, u can't stop insulting people, even when u had swear to it before http://www.badmintoncentral.com/forums/showpost.php?p=786954&postcount=385

i dont make posts for u to read but for all 29000+ member to read and judge.
I like it when u keep talking because it save me lots of typing.
I will let members here to judge who has a garlic mouth LOL

koo_fan

03-03-2008, 05:01 AM

sorry, i'm not malaysian and I don't see this nor want this to be a pro malaysians versus non-malaysians thing.

also, when making prediction, it helps the readers if u provide some basis to your predictions, it would make your case stronger.

Yes, one do have the rights to predict something to occur even tho its probability is not zero but if it get repetitive, predictions turn to just...noise, a hollow noise at that.
For those who has MyCard -i referred to these people to be Malaysians.real Malaysians.supports with no end

N about provide some basis to predictions - 'The Basic' point is Do u want malaysia to win ?.
Whatever the situation,how bad the players now.I want them to win.
Time left is 5 months.For the time being,all we can do is to improve everything.each aspects.
Even to produce another new kkk/tbh.We did that last year.I dont understand why we must taking their spirit down now.What is the point of saying it is just not possible.