*Korea Open 2008* : posting moderation level: HIGH

[kwun]

as we all know that there have been a controversial event at the MS final in the just concluded Korea Open 2008.

naturally, the quantity of discussion has risen by a lot. the nature of the incident can easily cause discussion to go out of control (kinda like LD's temper, really.. ;) ). so as a result, we are going to raise the moderation level to HIGH. if anybody makes any insensitive, non-sensical, inappropriate comments in these discussions, we will not hesitate to moderate the posting and if we see a repeating pattern from some members, we will not hesitate to ban.

so please pay attention and think before you post.

having said that, discussion so far has been very good. rational and civil. let's keep it that way! :)

[huangkwokhau]

as we all know that there have been controversial event at the MS final in the just concluded Korea Open 2008.

naturally, the quantity of discussion has risen by a lot. the nature of the subject can easily cause discussion to go out of control (kinda like LD's temper, really.. ;) ). so as a result, we are going to raise the moderation level. if anybody makes any insensitive, non-sensical, inappropriate comments in these discussion, we will not hesitate to moderate the posting and if we see a repeating pattern from some members, we will not hesitate to ban.

so please pay attention and think before you post.

having said that, discussion so far has been very good. rational and civil. let's keep it that way! :)

So it keeps you awake to monitor us......??:D:D

[kwun]

So it keeps you awake to monitor us......??:D:D

you know this is a tough job. :mad:

[huangkwokhau]

you know this is a tough job. :mad:
we have behaved much much better lately........:D:D

[Cheung]

Because no Malaysian interest;)

[alfa-2]

Yeah, wonder what will happen to BC if it wasnt LD but LCW in the final.............hehehehehe............

[eaglehelang]

you know this is a tough job. :mad:


Because no Malaysian interest;)

One minor request, maybe the threads that have similar topics can be combined? 3 to 4 threads have cropped up just on this issue alone. TQ, yup, ya all have tough job:D

[Louisa]

Because no Malaysian interest;)
sorry Cheung, but i felt abit offended here....does that mean that, we Malaysian like to argue heatedly without using our brain???? or all of us here, when come to support our own player, will lose our rationality?

please forgive me for questioning like this, but, i m offended indeed...may be, CAT is abit sensitive here...:)

[Dreamzz]

let the flaming begin!
:)

actually, it's been civilised so far, which is good to see. but yeah, i do agree, if it were LCW or TH in the final against LD, the discussions would have been more ... eerrrmmm ... extreme.

[xsakurax]

Yeah, wonder what will happen to BC if it wasnt LD but LCW in the final.............hehehehehe............

i think world war II is going to take place in bc..hehe :p

[eaglehelang]

Yeah, wonder what will happen to BC if it wasnt LD but LCW in the final.............hehehehehe............

;) He he, Alfa, Just for the fun of it, if it was LCW vs LHI in KO Finals(everyone else - this theory only ah) :
1) LCW would have been calmer - CO was worse.

2) LCW & Li Mao have very good r/ship(as described in huggies aft MO finals), LCW wouldnt have thrown racket at human being's direction intentionally.
If so happen racket accidently landed in Li Mao's direction, LCW would have said sorry to his ex-coach. Li Mao would have forgiven & later said "Why you lose temper? I didnt teach you to be like that." or "I told you bf dont be bad tempered like me."

3) If LCW really really got angry, the cool & calm Misbun would have quickly calmed LCW or pulled LCW back, no pushing & shoving with Li Mao(Misbun was super calm in CO, some BCers think Misbun was too calm).
Misbun no understand Chinese, whatever Li Mao say also Misbun wouldnt know. At most, LCW would have been airing his frustration to Misbun.
Yap Kim Hock would gotten to the scene too, also a cool personality.

4) Or if Misbun that day was really really not his usual self & got angry,he would have just glared at Li Mao, since Misbun cant speak Chinese & Li Mao cant speak Malay. Me not sure if Li Mao can speak Eng well.

[Cheung]

sorry Cheung, but i felt abit offended here....does that mean that, we Malaysian like to argue heatedly without using our brain???? or all of us here, when come to support our own player, will lose our rationality?

please forgive me for questioning like this, but, i m offended indeed...may be, CAT is abit sensitive here...:)
Sensitive? Perhaps or perhaps not. We've noticed some get so passionate that personal attacks occur. Perhaps it is by coincidence that many are (but not limited to) Malaysians .

[alfa-2]

;) He he, Alfa, Just for the fun of it, if it was LCW vs LHI in KO Finals(everyone else - this theory only ah) :
1) LCW would have been calmer - CO was worse.

2) LCW & Li Mao have very good r/ship(as described in huggies aft MO finals), LCW wouldnt have thrown racket at human being's direction intentionally.
If so happen racket accidently landed in Li Mao's direction, LCW would have said sorry to his ex-coach. Li Mao would have forgiven & later said "Why you lose temper? I didnt teach you to be like that." or "I told you bf dont be bad tempered like me."

3) If LCW really really got angry, the cool & calm Misbun would have quickly calmed LCW or pulled LCW back, no pushing & shoving with Li Mao(Misbun was super calm in CO, some BCers think Misbun was too calm).
Misbun no understand Chinese, whatever Li Mao say also Misbun wouldnt know. At most, LCW would have been airing his frustration to Misbun.
Yap Kim Hock would gotten to the scene too, also a cool personality.

4) Or if Misbun that day was really really not his usual self & got angry,he would have just glared at Li Mao, since Misbun cant speak Chinese & Li Mao cant speak Malay. Me not sure if Li Mao can speak Eng well.

i just assumed, and you cracked your brain to analyse all these.............:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D good, good, good.

[alfa-2]

did i smell of some racism here???

[Louisa]

Sensitive? Perhaps or perhaps not. We've noticed some get so passionate that personal attacks occur. Perhaps it is by coincidence that many are (but not limited to) Malaysians .
can't agree more Cheung, u r right...personal attacks did occur, alot of times, but, not all Malaysian in this forum like to attack personally....that's what i feel:)...settle.

[vching]

Yeah, wonder what will happen to BC if it wasnt LD but LCW in the final.............hehehehehe............

There would have been smackdown in the forums instead of being on court:D:D:D

[robin7]

Because no Malaysian interest;)
Care to explain?:confused:

[vching]

its a good thing la AUNTY CAT!!! we malaysians are PASSIONATE and love to support our players!

[drifit]

Because no Malaysian interest;)


Care to explain?:confused:

interesting...........:rolleyes:

[alfa-2]

There would have been smackdown in the forums instead of being on court:D:D:D

smackdown in forums............:D:D:D:D:D

[eaglehelang]

i just assumed, and you cracked your brain to analyse all these.............:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D good, good, good.

Nahhhh, no cracking of brain involved, was downloading the vids from Horizon's sharekey, while waiting, just analyse a bit. Sup sup water lah

Oh yeah, if Taufik also not that dramatic, Taufik & coach I think dont understand Chinese. Maybe walk off like HK Open 2006 ?

[george@chongwei]

ok, yes sir, kwun!
:D

[wilfredlgf]

I see that Malaysians have not quite been able to differentiate between banter and humour bypass.

[huangkwokhau]

Nahhhh, no cracking of brain involved, was downloading the vids from Horizon's sharekey, while waiting, just analyse a bit. Sup sup water lah

Oh yeah, if Taufik also not that dramatic, Taufik & coach I think dont understand Chinese. Maybe walk off like HK Open 2006 ?
In HKO 2006, The referee which was from China said to TH: " if you do not like it, dont play" thats why TH walked out....

[kwun]

in Cheung's defense..

- for those who don't know, Cheung is also Malaysian.
- much of what has mentioned is not racism, it is simply statistics.

[ctjcad]

as we all know that there have been a controversial event at the MS final in the just concluded Korea Open 2008.

naturally, the quantity of discussion has risen by a lot. the nature of the incident can easily cause discussion to go out of control (kinda like LD's temper, really.. ;) ). so as a result, we are going to raise the moderation level to HIGH. if anybody makes any insensitive, non-sensical, inappropriate comments in these discussions, we will not hesitate to moderate the posting and if we see a repeating pattern from some members, we will not hesitate to ban...
..and looks like this yr's KO sub-forum is on the way of equalling the same amt. of posts that have been garnered in this yr's M'sian Open sub-forum..and if the newer posts are all related to this LiMao & LinDan incident..:p
Btw, i like the new moderating level rating system..:cool:

[Birdwood]

did i smell of some racism here???


in Cheung's defense..

- for those who don't know, Cheung is also Malaysian.
- much of what has mentioned is not racism, it is simply statistics.

A little far fetched. No one said or implied anything about race, only nations. I thought Asian people are the same race, am I wrong? In US, we count races as black, white, Asian, ..., no where to find separate categories for Msia, Ina, Chinese ... :D

[Birdwood]

...Li Mao would have forgiven & later said "Why you lose temper? I didnt teach you to be like that." or "I told you bf dont be bad tempered like me."


Thanks and enjoyed your rare humor. But I have to respectfully disagree with you on one point. I am not sure LM was in any position to teach LCW manner as we all witnessed in the video clip of MSF KO 08. Since he's a coach and LD only a player, I think he should know better not to worsen the situation. His behavior was not any better than LD in my opinion. If what he did to LD was on purpose, then we may see that more from his team in the future :mad:

[Birdwood]

...so as a result, we are going to raise the moderation level to HIGH. if anybody makes any insensitive, non-sensical, inappropriate comments in these discussions, we will not hesitate to moderate the posting and if we see a repeating pattern from some members, we will not hesitate to ban.



So it keeps you awake to monitor us......??:D:D



...
Btw, i like the new moderating level rating system..:cool:

Does this mean when the moderation level goes back down we can have more room to make those comments :confused:;)

Since kwun just went to sleep, ctjcad, are you ready for my punch .. coming..:eek:

btw, I thought it's always the case that "we will not hesitate to moderate the posting and if we see a repeating pattern from some members, we will not hesitate to ban" :D

[kwun]

Does this mean when the moderation level goes back down we can have more room to make those comments :confused:;)

...

btw, I thought it's always the case that "we will not hesitate to moderate the posting and if we see a repeating pattern from some members, we will not hesitate to ban" :D

well, true, it is always the case, but raising it to high means we will be paying extra attention and be extra strict.. ;)

[ctjcad]

Does this mean when the moderation level goes back down we can have more room to make those comments :confused:;)

....

btw, I thought it's always the case that "we will not hesitate to moderate the posting and if we see a repeating pattern from some members, we will not hesitate to ban" :D

well, true, it is always the case, but raising it to high means we will be paying extra attention and be extra strict.. ;)
..before, a LOW level discussion might require a pair of eyes to moderate...But a HIGH level discussion will require extra attention and be extra strict.
Meaning, 3-4 pairs of eyes are needed; that of kwun's, Cheung's and Oldhand's and possibly jamesd20's ;):cool:

[eaglehelang]

Thanks and enjoyed your rare humor. But I have to respectfully disagree with you on one point. I am not sure LM was in any position to teach LCW manner as we all witnessed in the video clip of MSF KO 08. Since he's a coach and LD only a player, I think he should know better not to worsen the situation. His behavior was not any better than LD in my opinion. If what he did to LD was on purpose, then we may see that more from his team in the future :mad:

My fellow bird friend, that was meant as as humor - LCW & Li Mao have good relationship till now, as seen & confirmed by both. That was based on what Li Mao said to LCW aft MO finals -"Why look tense, uncomposed?"
A teacher can teach a student how to be prof(the theory), but teacher dont follow,still teacher's job to teach the good values. He he maybe change to "This is example of what NOT to do."

Many observed LHI was calm, composed while his coach was hopping mad. LCW was still LCW when Li Mao was coaching him.

Unfortunately, we may see more, but if it's LCW vs Korea MS, due to Misbun's coolness & good r/ship between LCW & Li Mao, it would not esscalate to the extent of KO scenario.

Worse case would be - LCW tells Misbun he cant take it anymore, tells umpire, walks off the court, Misbun if really pissed off on the day, agree & both just walk back to locker room, shaking their heads along the way.;);)

[yen_saw]

so as a result, we are going to raise the moderation level to HIGH. if anybody makes any insensitive, non-sensical, inappropriate comments in these discussions, we will not hesitate to moderate the posting and if we see a repeating pattern from some members, we will not hesitate to ban.


If that's what you meant kwun, the following comment falls in that category, and such comment coming out from a Malaysian and being a moderator here is not encouraging.

Originally Posted by Cheung http://www.badmintonforum.com/vb/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.badmintonforum.com/vb/showthread.php?p=781594#post781594)
Because no Malaysian interest;)

[wilfredlgf]

in Cheung's defense..

- for those who don't know, Cheung is also Malaysian.
- much of what has mentioned is not racism, it is simply statistics.Not to mention the lack of practical knowledge in the term 'racism' itself.

[tjl_vanguard]

i think world war II is going to take place in bc..hehe :p

o u tryin to say world war III??? :D :D :D

[vching]

oh for god's sake!

Insensitive? Non-sensical? Non-appropriate?

RACISM!?!?!?!?!

how was Cheung's comments be insensitive, non-sensical, not-appropriate or even RACIST??? When he read it I laughed softly..... Typical Cheung... Its a joke!

Go search the dictionary for Racism... *sigh*... some people are so sensitive...

[Cheung]

did i smell of some racism here???Haha. I can't tell what you smell.:D

As explained here (http://www.badmintoncentral.com/forums/showpost.php?p=781636&postcount=12)

I notice your post was 8 minutes after mine - short enough that you may have not seen my explanation before the smell comment went up.

Since the original comment of "No Malaysian interest" seems to have created some problems, let's see if I can explain the comment even better.

1) Malaysians are very passionate about their players
2) A number of posts from Malaysian supporters in the past have degraded into personal attacks.
(Remember, not limited to this country only)
3) These posts have an association to tournaments where controversy exists with matches involving Malaysian players
4) Korean Open 2008 has no Malaysian players in the final
5) Korean Open 2008 has controversial line calls
6) Hau-ge says all posts over the line call issue have been pretty good
7) I, personally, say that is because no Malaysian players are in the final.
8) Therefore, Malaysian supporters have less reason for issues this time.

:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

I hope the explanation can remove the perception of smells.:)

This issue must be the reason why another BC member tried to ring me at 11.30pm last night. Sorry I couldn't take the call.

[Cheung]

I see that Malaysians have not quite been able to differentiate between banter and humour bypass.Well, Wilfredlgf, I wouldn't put any fault on anybody here. Everybody can have different interpretations. To be honest, my original comment was not clear enough for some people. That's OK by me.

Again, I know that if you go to school in Malaysia, you get exposed to many different languages. However, a person may not be fully conversant with all the nuances and subtleties in each of those languages. This may occur in other countries - people from North America use the term "line up" rather than "queue". One friend of mine recounted explaining to Canadians that the word "queue" did actually exist.

One rather cute example is if you ask for the time using the expression, "What time do you make it?"

[george@chongwei]

the moderator will be very busy in this forum!!...

[yen_saw]

Again, I know that if you go to school in Malaysia, you get exposed to many different languages. However, a person may not be fully conversant with all the nuances and subtleties in each of those languages. This may occur in other countries - people from North America use the term "line up" rather than "queue". One friend of mine recounted explaining to Canadians that the word "queue" did actually exist.


Yes i can see language being a problem here, but trust me there is a thin line between good humor and bad humor. I live in USA now but brought up in Malaysia, still, i don't see people would appreciate such comments, especially people who doesn't know you, and here in the forum there are new people like me everyday visiting the forum.

[cyclone9]

I think we should look in the future ... the more argue the more stress into the badminton game.. LETS look forward GERMAN OPEN

[chris-ccc]

.
Thank God that no Malaysians are involved with this one. :D:D:D

But on a serious note, please refer to this serious thread located at:
http://www.badmintoncentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=50303

The main objective of that thread is to discuss issues that could help to improve our beloved matches of Badminton at International events. :):):)
.

[Cheung]

Yes i can see language being a problem here, but trust me there is a thin line between good humor and bad humor. I live in USA now but brought up in Malaysia, still, i don't see people would appreciate such comments, especially people who doesn't know you, and here in the forum there are new people like me everyday visiting the forum.I refer you back to the 2nd part of Kwun's post (http://www.badmintoncentral.com/forums/showpost.php?p=781801&postcount=25).

And because the explanation seems to have been missed, I refer back to this post (http://www.badmintoncentral.com/forums/showpost.php?p=782019&postcount=37). I'm afraid I really cannot explain it any simpler so I apologise for that.

[takeshi]

I suggest playing at Papua New Guinea, Mauritius, or some neutral country.

Or sack IBF president & top management for not doing their job.

Taufik already complain about that long time ago, but no action taken by IBF.

[chris-ccc]

I suggest playing at Papua New Guinea, Mauritius, or some neutral country.



.
It's not where International Badminton should be held, takeshi,

But it is how International Badminton should be staged. :):):)
.

[chris-ccc]

.
Hey kwun & Cheung... How could we disclose that Cheung is Malaysian ? :D:D:D
.

[Pemuda]

as we all know that there have been a controversial event at the MS final in the just concluded Korea Open 2008.

naturally, the quantity of discussion has risen by a lot. the nature of the incident can easily cause discussion to go out of control (kinda like LD's temper, really.. ;) ). so as a result, we are going to raise the moderation level to HIGH. if anybody makes any insensitive, non-sensical, inappropriate comments in these discussions, we will not hesitate to moderate the posting and if we see a repeating pattern from some members, we will not hesitate to ban.

so please pay attention and think before you post.

having said that, discussion so far has been very good. rational and civil. let's keep it that way! :)

I enjoyed the men singles final tremendously. Finished an entire packet of Doritos. ;)

[Cheung]

.
Hey kwun & Cheung... How could we disclose that Cheung is Malaysian ? :D:D:D
.You know, home can mean many places. Malaysia is very close to my heart.

[huangkwokhau]

I thought all this time Cheung is from Hong Kong........hehe

[taufik-ist]

You know, home can mean many places. Malaysia is very close to my heart.

so..you will tend to 'defend' malaysia(n) if there's a 'dispute' between malaysia(n) and other countries here in BC :rolleyes: :D..he..he

[cooler]

I enjoyed the men singles final tremendously. Finished an entire packet of Doritos. ;)
u reminded me of wood_22_chuck;)

[Birdwood]

If that's what you meant kwun, the following comment falls in that category, and such comment coming out from a Malaysian and being a moderator here is not encouraging.

Originally Posted by Cheung http://www.badmintonforum.com/vb/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.badmintonforum.com/vb/showthread.php?p=781594#post781594)
Because no Malaysian interest;)


Yes i can see language being a problem here, but trust me there is a thin line between good humor and bad humor. I live in USA now but brought up in Malaysia, still, i don't see people would appreciate such comments, especially people who doesn't know you, and here in the forum there are new people like me everyday visiting the forum.

Dera yen_saw, I can understand your desire for us to have more sensitivity training so you wouldn't be offended by our comments. But unfortunately, the forum is not just for you or "new people like me", "who does't know Cheung". I don't know any of the BCers either, but that did not stop me from thinking, posting, and knowing more about each other. In my opinion, no where in BC, there is such a requirement that everything being said has to be encouraging and it's not everyone's responsibility to change because you have different standards. If you find any offending remarks, please bring it up. Simply being "not encouraging" and "who doesn't know you" are no excuses. You made a demand for us to accommodate you because you are new, were you being insensitive to us too? Let me think :confused:

[Birdwood]

A teacher can teach a student how to be prof(the theory), but teacher dont follow,still teacher's job to teach the good values. He he maybe change to "This is example of what NOT to do."

Many observed LHI was calm, composed while his coach was hopping mad. LCW was still LCW when Li Mao was coaching him.


The first argument does not exist. How can a teacher teach students good values which himself does no follow or believe? and expect students to follow? Who is the role model for students if he only tells students what not to do. If that's the case, would criminals have been the best teachers :eek::confused:

If LCW or LHI behaved better than LM, it's not because they learned from LM for sure :rolleyes:

[Cheung]

so..you will tend to 'defend' malaysia(n) if there's a 'dispute' between malaysia(n) and other countries here in BC :rolleyes: :D..he..heDepends on the dispute and validity of the statements. Do remember, it could easily go the other way. And of course, within the principles of being a moderator.:)

Crafty taufik-ist. Trying to spin a trap for me, eh:D


I thought all this time Cheung is from Hong Kong........hehe I am a person of many guises;). Believe, it's .... complicated:(

[chris-ccc]

The first argument does not exist. How can a teacher teach students good values which himself does no follow or believe? and expect students to follow? Who is the role model for students if he only tells students what not to do. If that's the case, would criminals have been the best teachers :eek::confused:

If LCW or LHI behaved better than LM, it's not because they learned from LM for sure :rolleyes:



.
I might be assumed to be defending LM... but from what I've observed in this event, LM was only trying to tell LD to obey the umpire's decision.
.

[yen_saw]

Dera yen_saw, I can understand your desire for us to have more sensitivity training so you wouldn't be offended by our comments. But unfortunately, the forum is not just for you or "new people like me", "who does't know Cheung". I don't know any of the BCers either, but that did not stop me from thinking, posting, and knowing more about each other. In my opinion, no where in BC, there is such a requirement that everything being said has to be encouraging and it's not everyone's responsibility to change because you have different standards. If you find any offending remarks, please bring it up. Simply being "not encouraging" and "who doesn't know you" are no excuses. You made a demand for us to accommodate you because you are new, were you being insensitive to us too? Let me think :confused:

I don't recall requesting anyone here to accommodate me like what you said, I merely stated that poor statement/humor shouldn't be tolerated, am i wrong to request a nicer respond? so by different standards here you mean everyone can take a shot at anyone at will? I don't know you and you have no idea who the heck am i either, but the limit is breached when poor comments is directed to a certain group.

[madbad]

Well, I've gotta side with Cheung on this one. His initial response had the winking emoticon the end, implying he made the statement with tongue in cheek. I guess some members glossed over that little part. Boy, sensitivities are running high.

[Birdwood]

.
I might be assumed to be defending LM... but from what I've observed in this event, LM was only trying to tell LD to obey the umpire's decision.
.

So funny to hear such an argument coming from my knowledgeable friend. In MSF KO 08, LD was given numerous bad line calls, constant bothering from LM, and finally another bad line call at a critical point, when LD went to umpire to complain, LM stood up and moved 2 steps forward only trying to tell LD to obey the umpire's decision? Who gave the right for LM to tell LD what to do when Kor linesmen were making biased calls and himself was one of the factors contributing to the conflict :confused::mad:


In LM's own word, he stood up to defend linesmen's call because he wanted to put pressure on the umpire, and worst of all he did not even see where the shuttlecocks landed. If you care for some facts and what he said afterward, please read: http://www.badmintoncentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51838 :eek:

[Cheung]

Hmm, I think we've gone far enough. Certainly, not everybody can be happy with the forum. As for the comment that the mods themselves are giving poor statements, I will point out three things:

1) I acknowledge that my statement can be misinterpreted. I attempted to give a step by step explanation of the logic but that seems to have failed.

2) Complaints can be directed to the mods. I see this issue as being difficult to resolve in this thread. I will leave it individual forum members to decide wether to lodge a complaint to the other mods who can decide on the appropriate action.

3) Poor comments can never be totally avoided. Interpretations differ - one or many persons may regard the comments as innocuous yet other find it totally insulting. The mods will discuss and delete posts which fall into grey areas.

Disclaimer - for the potential conflict of interest, if there is a complaint about me, the other mods can decide what action to take, without me partaking in the discussion.:)

Thread closed