Team INA in Thomas & UBER 2008

[newjazz]

Thomas Cup:

MS:
1. Sony Dwi Kuncoro
2. Taufik Hidayat
3. Simon Santoso
4. Tommy Sugiarto

MD:
1. Markis Kido/Hendra Setiawan
2. Joko Riyadi/Hendra A. Gunawan
3. Chandra Wijaya/Nova Widianto

(surprise surprise! Luluk/Alvent out!)

Uber:

WS:
1. Maria Kristin
2. Adriyanti Firdasari
3. Pia Zebadiah
4. Fransiska Ratnasari

WD:
1. Jo Novita/Gryesia Polii
2. Rani Mundiasti/Endang Nursugiati
3. Lilyana Natsir/Vita Marrissa


Source: detik.com (http://www.detiksport.com/index.php/detik.read/tahun/2008/bulan/04/tgl/23/time/184516/idnews/928452/idkanal/79)

[badadum]

Wow, PBSI picking Joko/AG instead of Luluk/Alvent?????
Someone high-up must really not pleased with them.....
I can't help but think this is weakening INA's team though...

[apontoh]

Two major surprises:
1. Alvent/Luluk OUT
2. Vita/Lilyana has been demoted to 3rd/back-up pair.:eek:

The second one is even more surprising...what is PBSI thinking?? Regeneration, perhaps?

[badMania]

Wow, PBSI picking Joko/AG instead of Luluk/Alvent?????
Someone high-up must really not pleased with them.....
I can't help but think this is weakening INA's team though...

Oh dear...not looking good for Luluk :mad:

BTW, can the original poster give us the source for this news? I don't think AG/Joko will get the nod over Luluk/Alvent....

[Jagdpanther]

Wow, LuVent out? And if I'm not mistaken, they're the only INA pair ever beat Koo KK/Tan BH.

They must be very upset now...

[newjazz]

Oh dear...not looking good for Luluk :mad:

BTW, can the original poster give us the source for this news? I don't think AG/Joko will get the nod over Luluk/Alvent....

hey BadMania,
it's stated there at the end of the first posting... from detik.com (http://www.detiksport.com/index.php/detik.read/tahun/2008/bulan/04/tgl/23/time/184516/idnews/928452/idkanal/79)

[jetan7485]

any idea why LuVent is out?
and I don't understand why Lily/Vita, the highest rank Indonesian pair become 3rd double?

[badMania]

any idea why LuVent is out?
and I don't understand why Lily/Vita, the highest rank Indonesian pair become 3rd double?

They cannot become WD3 because their ranking is so much higher than the other 2 pairs. If they are to be played, then they will definitely WD1, otherwise, they will not be played at all (ie: benched).

[Jagdpanther]

So, that list is not the order of play?

[badMania]

So, that list is not the order of play?

Definitely not....I can't imagine Vita/Butet not being played as WD1 against Japan and Netherlands.

[Jagdpanther]

Thomas Cup:
MD:
1. Markis Kido/Hendra Setiawan
2. Joko Riyadi/Hendra A. Gunawan
3. Chandra Wijaya/Nova Widianto
Source: detik.com (http://www.detiksport.com/index.php/detik.read/tahun/2008/bulan/04/tgl/23/time/184516/idnews/928452/idkanal/79)

Duh... Now, how's our chance against CHN, MAS, and KOR?
Are they planning to field uncles against Koo/Tan?

[badMania]

Duh... Now, how's our chance against CHN, MAS, and KOR?
Are they planning to field uncles against Koo/Tan?

Koo/Tan should rise above Choong/Lee once the points for Singapore Open 2007 are deducted.

[badadum]

Duh... Now, how's our chance against CHN, MAS, and KOR?
Are they planning to field uncles against Koo/Tan?

I'm pretty sure we can still grab 2 pts from MS against MAS and KOR, but if what badmania said is true, I can see losing both MD points to MAS (40-60) and possibly a 50-50 chances against KOR. :(

Against China....Joko/AG has been more in the losing end in their encounters against XZB/GZ, but I think they're pretty even in terms of skills... Regardless, either them or Candra/Nova, I'll rated the 2nd MD chances as 45-55.

The best thing that could happen is if reports about KOR not sending their top MS to TC really comes true. Then MAS should win the group and send KOR our way in QF, where INA should be able to take all 3 singles or at least 2 MS and 1MD.

[huangkwokhau]

It is sad that the news is true................got confirmation already even some of them were shocked about the news......

[robin7]

Shocking but interesting.....

I guess LukVent are not in good terms with the management!

[fantastic4]

Anybody from Indonesian team can give us the reason why LukVent are not chosen ?

[ye333]

Both seem wrong decisions to me.


Two major surprises:
1. Alvent/Luluk OUT
2. Vita/Lilyana has been demoted to 3rd/back-up pair.:eek:

The second one is even more surprising...what is PBSI thinking?? Regeneration, perhaps?

[Krisna]

Anybody from Indonesian team can give us the reason why LukVent are not chosen ?

I'm checking the reasons right now... I'm still wondering whether this is some sort of wrong information. Some other countries would be happy to have the #7 / #8 ranked MD pair in the whole planet as their MD2, but apparently, not INA... :confused: I thought Kido-Hendra [#1 MD], Luluk-Alvent [#7 MD], and Candra-Nova [#6 MD + #1 XD] are probably the most feared lineup INA can offer... but maybe PBSI thought otherwise... :confused: I can accept that Luvent can't play if they're injured, but if not... very wierd...


Both seem wrong decisions to me.

No no, as badMania has written, Lily-Vita are the highest ranked WD#1 from INA, they're ranked #9 in the world as of last week. Unless PBSI split them up, they cannot play after Greysia-Jo and Rani-Endang. ;)

[jimbo]

IMHO, I personally think that Candra/Nova is a better choice.

[persibmaung]

What a Decision!!!not fair for lukvent, even they still deserve to be 3rd MD than be exclued from the team. Is it possible to place CANO at 2nd MD?

[taufik-ist]

if luvent find they are treated unfairly for TC, i believe they will be retired from Pelatnas soon and go to other country

[CLELY]

I'm checking the reasons right now... I'm still wondering whether this is some sort of wrong information. Some other countries would be happy to have the #7 / #8 ranked MD pair in the whole planet as their MD2, but apparently, not INA... :confused: I thought Kido-Hendra [#1 MD], Luluk-Alvent [#7 MD], and Candra-Nova [#6 MD + #1 XD] are probably the most feared lineup INA can offer... but maybe PBSI thought otherwise... :confused: I can accept that Luvent can't play if they're injured, but if not... very wierd...
No no, as badMania has written, Lily-Vita are the highest ranked WD#1 from INA, they're ranked #9 in the world as of last week. Unless PBSI split them up, they cannot play after Greysia-Jo and Rani-Endang. ;)

Yeah, so surprising line-up! Don't think it's favourable side to dump Luluk/Alvent from the squad. First chance to take part in team competition like Thomas Cup for Joko/Hendra AG, hmm it's a risky decision...

Several local medias in today's edition (24/4) report that Lutfi Hamid (INA Thomas team Manager) said there're some criterias as consideration to include player into team such as age, performance and head-to-head record against other contestants second men's doubles. Christian Hadinata as INA Thomas-Uber Head Coach also gave standard answer, he said the goal of team composition is Thomas Cup victory and this team is the best team.

Luluk Hadiyanto delivered comment to media that he was shocked and disappointed by coach and manager decision to exclude Alvent and him. He's questioning about unlogical reason why he can't join the team.

And for Uber team as predicted earlier, INA Uber team Manager, Susi Susanti announced the team members yesterday :

WS1,WS2,WS3 -- Maria Kristin, Adrianti Firdasari, Pia Zebadiah
WS4 (substitute) -- Fransiska Ratnasari

WD1 -- Vita Marissa/Lilyana Natsir
WD2 -- Jo Novita/Greysia Polii
WD3 -- Rani Mundiasti/Endang Nursugianti

-- taken from various sources, KOMPAS/ANTARA/JawaPos Online.

[Erwin Kyoto]

Anybody from Indonesian team can give us the reason why LukVent are not chosen ?



Yeah, so surprising line-up! Don't think it's favourable side to dump Luluk/Alvent from the squad. First chance to take part in team competition like Thomas Cup for Joko/Hendra AG, hmm it's a risky decision...

Several local medias in today's edition (24/4) report that Lutfi Hamid (INA Thomas team Manager) said there're some criterias as consideration to include player into team such as age, performance and head-to-head record against other contestants second men's doubles. Christian Hadinata as INA Thomas-Uber Head Coach also gave standard answer, he said the goal of team composition is Thomas Cup victory and this team is the best team.

Luluk Hadiyanto delivered comment to media that he was shocked and disappointed by coach and manager decision to exclude Alvent and him. He's questioning about unlogical reason why he can't join the team.


For me...INA Thomas cup team without Luluk/Alvent is solid and strong enough to beat their oppenents :

1. INA has good a chance to take point from 2 MS and 1 MD if they meet the powerfull countries in QF/SF : Korea, Denmark, Malaysia.

2. In Final Match, INA will take point from 1 MS (Taufik vs Bao Cunlai) and 2 MD: Word Champion can handle Cai/Fu. Joko/Hendra won in their last meeting against Guo/Xie...and if they are Nova/Candra against the 2nd CHN MD...hhmm...60:40 for INA uncles).

I am INA supporter very happy with this INA skuad. Beside Luluk/Alvent with their unstable performances, we also need regeneration even though Joko/Hendra has lower ranking than that of their senior. I am sure this INA skuad has high probability for the victory in this Thomas Cup edition. :cool:;););)

[abedeng]

Can't say I agree or disagree with the decision, based on the ABC performance for Luluk/Alvent, they have gone down slightly compared to Korea SS.

Having said that, I can't say having Hendra AG/Joko Riyadi is good either, they have always underachieved.

Nova/Candra may be used quite significantly in this campaign .......

[badMania]

Having said that, I can't say having Hendra AG/Joko Riyadi is good either, they have always underachieved.


Certainly, they have underachieved.....and Hendra AG is already 26 yo by this year.

[Sandy]

Another unfair decision

Not sure, how many time PBSI choosed Hendra/Joko rather than Luluk/Alvent

1st Sudirman Cup 2007, Joko was ill, Hendra wasn't played.
2nd SEA Games 2007, Hendra/Joko lost to Hendra/Hendri of Singapore
3rd TC 2008

The individual's performance also can't say that Hendra/Joko are better than Luluk/Alvent,
Hendra isn't called young player anymore (26 y.o.)
maybe PBSI considered, they ever beat Xie/Guo of China. They forgot that one match record isn't enough because of the tournament's schedule is very tight this time.

[d65up2]

Well I think Hendra-Joko is fielded as 3rd doubles while 2nd doubles goes to Candra-Nova...well I hope for the best for our Indonesia..

[d65up2]

Compare to Hendra-Joko I'd go with Bona-Ahsan or one of the pratama kids....

[badMania]

Compare to Hendra-Joko I'd go with Bona-Ahsan or one of the pratama kids....

Rian/Yoke would be better than AG/Joko.

[badMania]

Another unfair decision

Not sure, how many time PBSI choosed Hendra/Joko rather than Luluk/Alvent

1st Sudirman Cup 2007, Joko was ill, Hendra wasn't played.
2nd SEA Games 2007, Hendra/Joko lost to Hendra/Hendri of Singapore
3rd TC 2008


It's the Luluk factor :mad: Sutiyoso has openly declared that he doesn't like Luluk...that's why Luluk was not selected for the Sudirman Cup and SEA Games. Alvent was still selected for both events (Alvent was fielded once with Candra, and was a non-playing member in the SEA Games Team Event).

[abedeng]

It's the Luluk factor :mad: Sutiyoso has openly declared that he doesn't like Luluk...that's why Luluk was not selected for the Sudirman Cup and SEA Games. Alvent was still selected for both events (Alvent was fielded once with Candra, and was a non-playing member in the SEA Games Team Event).

In the last 7 months, Luluk/Alvent had beaten 2 of the 3 selected MAS pairs + Lundgaard/Eriksen, Jung/Lee and Paaske/Rasmussen. Scared the wits out of Cai/Fu in Korea. Their only problem was with uncle pairs from MAS and INA.

Very impressive, INA's selection standards ....... let's hope that the decision does not bite back at Sutiyoso and crumble INA's hopes.

[huangkwokhau]

It's the Luluk factor :mad: Sutiyoso has openly declared that he doesn't like Luluk...that's why Luluk was not selected for the Sudirman Cup and SEA Games. Alvent was still selected for both events (Alvent was fielded once with Candra, and was a non-playing member in the SEA Games Team Event).
Thats the main reason......:mad: I have keep it quiet...

[newjazz]

It's the Luluk factor :mad: Sutiyoso has openly declared that he doesn't like Luluk...that's why Luluk was not selected for the Sudirman Cup and SEA Games. Alvent was still selected for both events (Alvent was fielded once with Candra, and was a non-playing member in the SEA Games Team Event).

any idea the reason why Sutiyoso doesn't like Luluk?

[huangkwokhau]

any idea the reason why Sutiyoso doesn't like Luluk?
YES...but not appropriate to post it here.....

[huangkwokhau]

Luluk and Alvernt were still pretty upset and they did not train today..I hope that they train for Olympics...

[newjazz]

YES...but not appropriate to post it here.....

u can PM me if you don't mind...

[Erwin Kyoto]

any idea the reason why Sutiyoso doesn't like Luluk?


YES...but not appropriate to post it here.....


u can PM me if you don't mind...

me too..waiting your PM..:confused: it is not unacceptable reason:(:(:(

[apontoh]

me too..waiting your PM..:confused: it is not unacceptable reason:(:(:(

me too please...

[badadum]

Well I think Hendra-Joko is fielded as 3rd doubles while 2nd doubles goes to Candra-Nova...well I hope for the best for our Indonesia..

That'll be the most likely scenario.... I failed to see how PBSI can justify fielding Joko/AG against either KKK/TBH or MAS uncles. Then again, how can you justify dropping a top 8 pair....

[Jagdpanther]

I don't know why, but something inside me tell me that we should forget winning TC this year... Am I too pessimistic?

Indeed LuVent haven't shown good achievements so far. But they've proven that they are capable to beat top pairs, plus the fact that they're permanent pair. By replacing them with this new scratch pair (based only on a tournament), is somehow unacceptable.

I hope that they won't quit Pelatnas, that's all. Our 2nd tier MDs are not too strong for now...

[indra]

That''s is the problem when we have a lot of good players and we have to choose among them...there must be pros and cons.:cool:

However, PBSI's choice of fielding the young pairs is also good in the long-term. This will also serve as a mental exercise for the young pairs ahead of the olympics.

I think PBSI has made the right decision at this stage.

Luluk/Alven, in my opinion, have been inconsistent recently and their style of play seem to be a bit easy to read.

Against KKK /TBH, It would be too risky to field the young pairs. Chandra/Nova would probably be the right pairs to face Rexy's boys.

To face the young and fast 2nd/ Korean pairs, Joko riyadi will be the right pairs to face them.

In critical (do or die) matches, I would prefer Chandra/Nova....because mental toughness will play the most important role.

We never know what PBSI will actually do until the last minute...

It is possible that Chandra will be fielded with Joko Riyadi...you never know...I guess....it is a Chandra factor here...he is indeed one of the most dangerous double player in the world...he can be paired with any player...and any pair involving Chandra will be very dangerous and it makes the opponents nervous....

[Sandy]

PBSI made risky blunder again :crying::crying:
In the past, INA won TC by secured 2 pts in MD

[Monbi]

cepek deh :D:rolleyes:

[Erwin Kyoto]

In the last 7 months, Luluk/Alvent had beaten 2 of the 3 selected MAS pairs + Lundgaard/Eriksen, Jung/Lee and Paaske/Rasmussen. Scared the wits out of Cai/Fu in Korea. Their only problem was with uncle pairs from MAS and INA.

yeah right...In Thomas Cup, Nova/Candra who could beat LuVent straight set in ABC will be expected can also beat all mentioned pairs (as abedeng`s post) plus 2nd Korean pairs...except Jung/Lee and Cai/Fu (these pairs will meet Kido/Setyawan as MD 1)...When INA vs CHN, Joko/Hendra will play as MD2..Nova/Candra will take a rest...perhaps :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

[badadum]

cepek deh :D:rolleyes:

Yep, percuma kita argue sampai kiamat, PBSI/Sulistiyo has spoken :crying:.

Best of luck to INA's TC team. We still have a strong team with the resources to beat any other team.

[ctjcad]

That''s is the problem when we have a lot of good players and we have to choose among them...there must be pros and cons.:cool:

However, PBSI's choice of fielding the young pairs is also good in the long-term. This will also serve as a mental exercise for the young pairs ahead of the olympics.

I think PBSI has made the right decision at this stage.

Luluk/Alven, in my opinion, have been inconsistent recently and their style of play seem to be a bit easy to read.

Against KKK /TBH, It would be too risky to field the young pairs. Chandra/Nova would probably be the right pairs to face Rexy's boys.

To face the young and fast 2nd/ Korean pairs, Joko riyadi will be the right pairs to face them.

In critical (do or die) matches, I would prefer Chandra/Nova....because mental toughness will play the most important role.

We never know what PBSI will actually do until the last minute...

It is possible that Chandra will be fielded with Joko Riyadi...you never know...I guess....it is a Chandra factor here...he is indeed one of the most dangerous double player in the world...he can be paired with any player...and any pair involving Chandra will be very dangerous and it makes the opponents nervous....
..an interesting train of thought, there, as i thought about the same also when they made the announcement.
However, regarding the idea of pairing Joko and Candra, well, uhm, we all saw what happened last yr during the Sudirman Cup when Markis was paired with Candra....;)
I still think, at the end, it'll come down to how the MS players perform (esp. Taufik and Sony)..If either of both should falter, it'll leave a big pressure for their MD pairs.

[Bao]

For me...INA Thomas cup team without Luluk/Alvent is solid and strong enough to beat their oppenents :

1. INA has good a chance to take point from 2 MS and 1 MD if they meet the powerfull countries in QF/SF : Korea, Denmark, Malaysia.

2. In Final Match, INA will take point from 1 MS (Taufik vs Bao Cunlai) and 2 MD: Word Champion can handle Cai/Fu. Joko/Hendra won in their last meeting against Guo/Xie...and if they are Nova/Candra against the 2nd CHN MD...hhmm...60:40 for INA uncles).

I am INA supporter very happy with this INA skuad. Beside Luluk/Alvent with their unstable performances, we also need regeneration even though Joko/Hendra has lower ranking than that of their senior. I am sure this INA skuad has high probability for the victory in this Thomas Cup edition. :cool:;););)

Absolutely Agree, I think Joko/Hendra only played in Group Match same with Tommy Sugiarto IN MS (just for experience), (hopefully INA be #1)
IN QF if againts KOR ina will get 2MS (Sony and Taufik) and 1 MD (from Uncles in 2 MD)
if againts MAL 2MS (Taufik and Simon) and 1 MD (Uncles)

STILL GREAT TEAM, and for me Much better than unstable LUKVENT :)

[taufikk]

Absolutely Agree, I think Joko/Hendra only played in Group Match same with Tommy Sugiarto IN MS (just for experience), (hopefully INA be #1)
IN QF if againts KOR ina will get 2MS (Sony and Taufik) and 1 MD (from Uncles in 2 MD)
if againts MAL 2MS (Taufik and Simon) and 1 MD (Uncles)

STILL GREAT TEAM, and for me Much better than unstable LUKVENT :)

Yes I agree that LUKVENT combination can be unstable and inconsistent sometimes, but they have the experience and more mature to play in a stressful tournament like the Thomas Cup:eek:..the whole badminton world will be watching..

[persibmaung]

Just wonder if this will give bad mentally effect for LUVENT since they will play in OG 08. Hopefully it will never happen..

[tjl_vanguard]

Yes I agree that LUKVENT combination can be unstable and inconsistent sometimes, but they have the experience and more mature to play in a stressful tournament like the Thomas Cup:eek:..the whole badminton world will be watching..
never discard joko pair.. they might rise to the occasion.. jus like kkk in tc 04.. nobody even think tat he was able to force ina pair into rubber set. :D

[abedeng]

Vanguard, this is the Thomas/Uber finals, not any regular tournament. Sweeping MD is the key to INA's target for success.

In 1988 a green Susi Susanti failed to kill off China's great Han Aiping despite leading one game and with 5 matchpoints. I know, I was there ......

Thus I have always had more faith in established players ...... you can experiment in the qualifiers but never in the finals. Whether Sutiyoso dislikes Luluk or not, it should not become personal to the detriment of INA's chances.

[badadum]

Vanguard, this is the Thomas/Uber finals, not any regular tournament. Sweeping MD is the key to INA's target for success.

In 1988 a green Susi Susanti failed to kill off China's great Han Aiping despite leading one game and with 5 matchpoints. I know, I was there ......

Thus I have always had more faith in established players ...... you can experiment in the qualifiers but never in the finals. Whether Sutiyoso dislikes Luluk or not, it should not become personal to the detriment of INA's chances.

But we are talking INA here, and Bang Yos is a cadidate for future Pres position :p. Powerful figures will get what they wants.

Hopefully Luluk/Alvent will show him who's the boss by doing well in OG (unless he able to stop them from going as well).

[Jagdpanther]

No way he will stop them from competing in OG. Is he trying to give all the burden to MK/HS? Nonsense.

Talking about politics, I wonder if Bang Yos will mention anything about badminton in his campaign. Will he even spare several percents from APBN to strengthen INA badminton if he DOES become RI 1?

[abedeng]

But we are talking INA here, and Bang Yos is a cadidate for future Pres position :p. Powerful figures will get what they wants.



It's about the same here too in Malaysia, except that the jostling of positions is with regards of officials and coaches, not players. Our best and most forsighted BAM President ever was knocked out of office, remember? Not just that, witness the reasons for resignation of Morten Frost, Prof Park etc.

Does Bang Yos think that his candidacy will be enhanced if INA TC squad underperforms?

We need more transparency and removal of Politicians from heading sports bodies. What do they know, anyway?

[vching]

I remember Rexy once said in a WC06 interview every Friday during training, the doubles can choose to pair with anyone. Hence, the Indonesian doubles players know each other inside out, and can be paired with anyone. He further said that in the 2000TC semis (I think, I am going off memory here) Rexy was paired with Tony, and the Danes were really happy because they have 2 frontcourt-men paired together. Rexy and Tony ended up owning them.

[reiko80]

we must escape to play with ina ......better play with japan....therefor must beat korea in group match....

[jasonmarc]

we must escape to play with ina ......better play with japan....therefor must beat korea in group match....

If MAS able to avoid INA....in last 8.....they will have to face Chn in last 4.........;).........MAS have 2 strong team in their path to final..........:rolleyes:

[d65up2]

Well if I am to choose INA's lineup against China I would just do a bit of a gamble...here it goes....

TH v Lin Dan
Simon Santoso v Bao
Markis Kido-Hendra Setiawan v Cai Yun-Fu Hai Feng
Candra Wijaya-Nova Widianto v Guo Zen Dong-Xie Zongbo
Tomy Sugiarto v Chen Jin

INA to win 3-1.....well Simon has a chance against Bao

[demolidor]

I don't know if anyone has mentioned it but Sony is the no.1 MS player for INA ;):cool:. Taufik withdrew from the BAC/ABC on purpose so Sony could pass him on the ranking and make Taufik INA's no.2 MS player :cool::cool::cool:

[demolidor]

I don't know if anyone has mentioned it but Sony is the no.1 MS player for INA ;):cool:. Taufik withdrew from the BAC/ABC on purpose so Sony could pass him on the ranking and make Taufik INA's no.2 MS player :cool::cool::cool:

:D:o Indeed it has in the very first post even ...

This mislead me into thinking it was not known yet:

d65up2 Well if I am to choose INA's lineup against China I would just do a bit of a gamble...here it goes....

TH v Lin Dan
Simon Santoso v Bao
Markis Kido-Hendra Setiawan v Cai Yun-Fu Hai Feng
Candra Wijaya-Nova Widianto v Guo Zen Dong-Xie Zongbo
Tomy Sugiarto v Chen Jin

INA to win 3-1.....well Simon has a chance against Bao

Interesting lineup but why like that? What will be the 1 loss?

[taufik-ist]

Well if I am to choose INA's lineup against China I would just do a bit of a gamble...here it goes....

TH v Lin Dan
Simon Santoso v Bao
Markis Kido-Hendra Setiawan v Cai Yun-Fu Hai Feng
Candra Wijaya-Nova Widianto v Guo Zen Dong-Xie Zongbo
Tomy Sugiarto v Chen Jin

INA to win 3-1.....well Simon has a chance against Bao

agree... if we meet china, ina must field TH as 1st MS... Th's chance of defeating lindan is bigger than sony's..

[ye333]

I don't think Simon has good chance beating Bao. His chance against CJ is much bigger IMHO.


Well if I am to choose INA's lineup against China I would just do a bit of a gamble...here it goes....

TH v Lin Dan
Simon Santoso v Bao
Markis Kido-Hendra Setiawan v Cai Yun-Fu Hai Feng
Candra Wijaya-Nova Widianto v Guo Zen Dong-Xie Zongbo
Tomy Sugiarto v Chen Jin

INA to win 3-1.....well Simon has a chance against Bao

[CLELY]

Well if I am to choose INA's lineup against China I would just do a bit of a gamble...here it goes....

TH v Lin Dan
Simon Santoso v Bao
Markis Kido-Hendra Setiawan v Cai Yun-Fu Hai Feng
Candra Wijaya-Nova Widianto v Guo Zen Dong-Xie Zongbo
Tomy Sugiarto v Chen Jin

INA to win 3-1.....well Simon has a chance against Bao

A brave pick for FINALE but hard to see INA can win 3-1 with SDK elimination from players line-up and placing Simon as MS2.

Simon vs BCL, 0-4 (taken from BWF head-to-head statistics record)

I think PBSI certainly will play its main weapon to face CHN in final day, and the chance to win is still open for INA, line-up prediction as follows :

MS1 -- SDK vs LD
MD1 -- Kido/Setiawan vs Cai Yun/Fu Haifeng
MS2 -- TH vs BCL (best hope for INA to steal point beside 2 MD pairs)
MD2 -- Candra/Nova vs Guo Zhendong/Xie Zhongbo
MS3 -- Simon Santoso vs Chen Jin

[huangkwokhau]

Hm..just hope INA can go to final first.............anything can happen here...MAS/KOR can make our INA's life difficult....never ever underestimate your opponents...this is team event..different from individual...

[Erwin Kyoto]

A brave pick for FINALE but hard to see INA can win 3-1 with SDK elimination from players line-up and placing Simon as MS2.

Simon vs BCL, 0-4 (taken from BWF head-to-head statistics record)

I think PBSI certainly will play its main weapon to face CHN in final day, and the chance to win is still open for INA, line-up prediction as follows :

MS1 -- SDK vs LD
MD1 -- Kido/Setiawan vs Cai Yun/Fu Haifeng
MS2 -- TH vs BCL (best hope for INA to steal point beside 2 MD pairs)
MD2 -- Candra/Nova vs Guo Zhendong/Xie Zhongbo
MS3 -- Simon Santoso vs Chen Jin


hmm:cool::rolleyes:...same with my prediction in past posting as below:

this INA skuad has high probability to steal 3 points agains CHN
MS: SDK, TH, SS
MD: MK/HS, NW/CW or Joko/Hendra


For me...INA Thomas cup team without Luluk/Alvent is solid and strong enough to beat their oppenents :

1. INA has good a chance to take point from 2 MS and 1 MD if they meet the powerfull countries in QF/SF : Korea, Denmark, Malaysia.

2. In Final Match, INA will take point from 1 MS (Taufik vs Bao Cunlai) and 2 MD: Word Champion can handle Cai/Fu. Joko/Hendra won in their last meeting against Guo/Xie...and if they are Nova/Candra against the 2nd CHN MD...hhmm...60:40 for INA uncles).

I am INA supporter very happy with this INA skuad. Beside Luluk/Alvent with their unstable performances, we also need regeneration even though Joko/Hendra has lower ranking than that of their senior. I am sure this INA skuad has high probability for the victory in this Thomas Cup edition. :cool:;););)

[vching]

hmm.... TH upsetting BCL is a hard act.... 1 year ago, I would have said absolutely, but now...

[badadum]

hmm.... TH upsetting BCL is a hard act.... 1 year ago, I would have said absolutely, but now...

TH usually has problem playing Bao. The last 2 matches have been rubber though, with TH winning the 1st and losing the rest. It'll be interesting to see what he can do IF his stamina is improved.

Besides, there's always the crazy INA fans factor :D.

[samuel882]

I guess CHN will field CJ in Ms 2 and CY in MS 3 while facing INA....

[ye333]

If I remember correctly, BCL led TH 3:1 before 2006.

Then in 2006 TH beated BCL 3 times in a row. Then in 2007 BCL beated TH 3 times in a row.

So I think starting 2006, TH does not has problem playing BCL anymore, meaning TH knows what he should do to play BCL, the question is: Does he have the ability to carry out his plan?


TH usually has problem playing Bao. The last 2 matches have been rubber though, with TH winning the 1st and losing the rest. It'll be interesting to see what he can do IF his stamina is improved.

Besides, there's always the crazy INA fans factor :D.

[ye333]

IMHO that is definitely a losing line-up. Remember how Simon toyed CY in Swiss 07? :cool: Simon definitely improved in the past year, while CY IMHO stayed the same.


I guess CHN will field CJ in Ms 2 and CY in MS 3 while facing INA....

[samuel882]

IMHO that is definitely a losing line-up. Remember how Simon toyed CY in Swiss 07? :cool: Simon definitely improved in the past year, while CY IMHO stayed the same.
But CJ will be a better bet to play against TH compare with Bao who is mentally weak...

[ye333]

I disagree. IMHO BCL is a better player than CJ and don't forget after 2006, CJ is the only one among the Chinese top 3 that has been beaten by TH (2007 INA Open, 1st round, CJ lost 9:21 in the 1st game and was again totally outplayed in the 3rd -- TH reached match point 20:11 if I remember correctly).

I think in this Thomas Cup BCL vs. TH is 50:50 while CJ vs. TH is 45:55.


But CJ will be a better bet to play against TH compare with Bao who is mentally weak...

[d65up2]

I guess CHN will field CJ in Ms 2 and CY in MS 3 while facing INA....

In that case we'll steal the game from Chen Yu...I mean Andre can beat Chen Yu and I think Simon can beat him as well

[Bombat]

Go Thomas and Uber Team...:)

I think Thomas team is strong enough and has the chance to win..

And Uber team needs to play all out and just be cool..

Senayan...i'm coming...:D:D

[byelnats]

Very interesting line-up. It is surprising, but INA is known for their resourcefulness when it comes to team tournament. Candra-factor will be the greatest factor. Like somebody mentions before, any pair with Candra in it makes a fearsome pair. He is truly the most dangerous double player today. Well, I'm sure Indonesian officials have something up their sleeves. Coaches have lots of things to consider so let's not judge them just yet. They are like generals and generals don't tell their troops everything, do they? Just one quotation: You have to deceive your friends before you can deceive the enemy. As history has written in the past, Indonesian officials are master of the game when it comes to this. So, let's sit back, enjoy the tournament and cheers hard for our country ;)

[ctjcad]

...
Candra-factor will be the greatest factor. Like somebody mentions before, any pair with Candra in it makes a fearsome pair. He is truly the most dangerous double player today.
...
..did you watch or follow last yr's Sudirman Cup tourney??..Do you know what happened when INA faced CHN in the Finals??..
As far as Candra "being the most dangerous doubles players today", ehm, if that's for MD or even XD, i think one has to look at what Mr. Lee Yong Dae (or a few BCers who like to call him sunDAE Lee;)) has done recently.:cool:

[taufik-ist]

..did you watch or follow last yr's Sudirman Cup tourney??..Do you know what happened when INA faced CHN in the Finals??..
As far as Candra "being the most dangerous doubles players today", ehm, if that's for MD or even XD, i think one has to look at what Mr. Lee Yong Dae (or a few BCers who like to call him sunDAE Lee;)) has done recently.:cool:

chandra had exhausted after playing againts eng pair, it would be different if chandra/markis met cai/fu first :p

[badMania]

..did you watch or follow last yr's Sudirman Cup tourney??..Do you know what happened when INA faced CHN in the Finals??..
As far as Candra "being the most dangerous doubles players today", ehm, if that's for MD or even XD, i think one has to look at what Mr. Lee Yong Dae (or a few BCers who like to call him sunDAE Lee;)) has done recently.:cool:

Didn't Candra Wijaya/Markis Kido beat Anthony Clark/Robert Blair the previous night to secure the all-important 3rd pt in the last tie (which stretched to past midnight HKG time if I remembered correctly) that guaranteed the final spot? That's a vital pt for Team INA and Candra's contribution was massive! Remember that Markis Kido/Hendra Setiawan lost 2 consecutive times against Clark/Blair before the SF matchup. That's the reason why the coaches decided not to field Kido/Hendra.

Candra/Kido only lost to the faster and more attack-oriented Fu/Cai, nothing ashamed about that. Kido/Hendra could have lost too if they were played. I would say that pairing up Candra with any players certainly will add an element of unpredictability.

[ctjcad]

chandra had exhausted after playing againts eng pair, it would be different if chandra/markis met cai/fu first :p

Didn't Candra Wijaya/Markis Kido beat Anthony Clark/Robert Blair the previous night to secure the all-important 3rd pt in the last tie (which stretched to past midnight HKG time if I remembered correctly) that guaranteed the final spot? That's a vital pt for Team INA and Candra's contribution was massive! Remember that Markis Kido/Hendra Setiawan lost 2 consecutive times against Clark/Blair before the SF matchup. That's the reason why the coaches decided not to field Kido/Hendra.

Candra/Kido only lost to the faster and more attack-oriented Fu/Cai, nothing ashamed about that. Kido/Hendra could have lost too if they were played. I would say that pairing up Candra with any players certainly will add an element of unpredictability.
...exhausted or not or playing against a faster and more attack-oriented pair or not, that's the reality with having the current Candra...His prime time had passed..
...Candra's presence could probably add an element of surprise or unpredictability, but i don't think any "current" pairing (w/him) will be a "fearsome" pair; or him being "the most dangerous doubles player today" (as byelnats mentioned)..;)..If it was, say, 6-7 yrs ago, then yeah, i would probably say so (him and Tony)...:cool:

[badMania]

...exhausted or not or playing against a faster and more attack-oriented pair or not, that's the reality with having the current Candra...His prime time has passed..
...Candra's presence could probably add an element of surprise or unpredictability, but i don't think the pairing (w/him) will be a "fearsome" pair; or him being "the most dangerous doubles player today" (as byelnats mentioned)..;)..If it was, say, 6-7 yrs ago, then yeah, i would probably say so (him and Tony)...:cool:

Although I agree that his prime time has certainly passed, Candra Wijaya's spirit and presence in the team will definitely be an added bonus. I may not agree with his partnership with Nova Widianto, but, they have proven that they can beat Lee Jae Jin/Hwang Ji Man in the SF and nearly stole the second set in the Final match against Jung Jae Sung/Lee Yong Dae, if not for the sudden surge of points late in the game.

Let's consider who Candra might face in the Thomas Cup matches as a potential MD2:
vs Malaysia -- stand a chance against either of the 3 pairs.
vs Denmark -- Jens Eriksen/Martin Lundgaard Hansen or Mathias Boe/Carsten Mogensen (definitely beatable)
vs Korea -- Lee Jae Jin/Hwang Ji Man (beat them before as mentioned above)
vs China -- Guo Zhendong/Xie Zhongbo (high chance of winning against them, compared to Hendra A. Gunawan/Joko Riyadi)

[ctjcad]

Although I agree that his prime time has certainly passed, Candra Wijaya's spirit and presence in the team will definitely be an added bonus. I may not agree with his partnership with Nova Widianto, but, they have proven that they can beat Lee Jae Jin/Hwang Ji Man in the SF and nearly stole the second set in the Final match against Jung Jae Sung/Lee Yong Dae, if not for the sudden surge of points late in the game.

Let's consider who Candra might face in the Thomas Cup matches as a potential MD2:
vs Malaysia -- stand a chance against either of the 3 pairs.
vs Denmark -- Jens Eriksen/Martin Lundgaard Hansen or Mathias Boe/Carsten Mogensen (definitely beatable)
vs Korea -- Lee Jae Jin/Hwang Ji Man (beat them before as mentioned above)
vs China -- Guo Zhendong/Xie Zhongbo (high chance of winning against them, compared to Hendra A. Gunawan/Joko Riyadi)
..Candra was present with the INA Sudirman Cup team, last yr, in body, spirit and mind and yet, they still lost...;)
He and Nova might've beaten LJJ & HJM in that recent match, but we'll see what will happen if both pairs may meet again in the TC. There's no guarantee Nova and Candra can repeat the same success, considering the KOR pairs definitely won't be sitting all day at home and day-dream about their possible matches.:cool:

In this type of group/team matches, Candra and whoever the coaches pair him up with for the 2nd MD, if the coaches decide to use Candra, may stand a chance against those possible pairs. After all, they're paired up against the 2nd ranked pairs.;)

[bugjan72]

..Candra was present with the INA Sudirman Cup team, last yr, in body, spirit and mind and yet, they still lost...;)
He and Nova might've beaten LJJ & HJM in that recent match, but we'll see what will happen if both pairs may meet again in the TC. There's no guarantee Nova and Candra can repeat the same success, considering the KOR pairs definitely won't be sitting all day at home and day-dream about their possible matches.:cool:

In this type of group/team matches, Candra and whoever the coaches pair him up with for the 2nd MD, if the coaches decide to use Candra, may stand a chance against those possible pairs. After all, they're paired up against the 2nd ranked pairs.;)

It's very funny to read all comments from ctjcad about Candra and his presence in INA Thomas Cup Team. I don't want to make any comments.:)

Candra is used as 'agent' to bond all players and he has proven his track in the last Sudirman Cup, yes..Indonesia did not win the cup, everybody knows that but almost no one predict Indonesia can reach to the final.
I think 'Candra' factor is apllied for INA Thomas Cup team based on the current condition:
1. Luluk/Alvent: Although they are world's no 7 but their performances are not really promising and they have mental blocking (esp. Luluk) when their opponent can read their game. I think coaches do not have enough confidence to Luluk/Alvent to deliver a point.
2. Joko/Gunawan: Young players and still struggling to stamp their name in world's mens double but they must be given enough exposure in big tournament.
INA Team do not have many options if they want to depend on those two pairs.
Candra and Nova are called to create more pair variations and I'm not surprise Candra will be paired with Joko or Gunawan as well.

It is gambling and very daring step to drop Luluk/Alvent from Thomas Cup team but decision must be made.:crying:

[badMania]

Candra is used as 'agent' to bond all players and he has proven his track in the last Sudirman Cup, yes..Indonesia did not win the cup, everybody knows that but almost no one predict Indonesia can reach to the final.

2. Joko/Gunawan: Young players and still struggling to stamp their name in world's mens double but they must be given enough exposure in big tournament.
INA Team do not have many options if they want to depend on those two pairs.
Candra and Nova are called to create more pair variations and I'm not surprise Candra will be paired with Joko or Gunawan as well.


Indeed, INA coaches knew that they had absolutely no chance of winning against China if they didn't take the mixed doubles because INA already had two "sure-lose" ties in WS and WD. It was commendable enough that Team INA was through to the Final, considering that they lost their first match against Korea in the group game :cool::o

Of course, INA did lose the tie to China. Flashback to the Sudirman Cup Final, INA already had themselves in the backfoot with Flandy/Vita losing in a narrow match against Zheng/Gao. The second match was women's singles which was almost a walkover. The third match was Candra/Kido's match. Only a very optimistic guy will bet on the INA pair matching the in-form and reigning World Champion at that time (Fu/Cai won 2 straight SS titles). So, it was expected that the scratch pairing lost to the Chinese pair.

I wouldn't call Hendra AG/Joko Riyadi young since they are already past 23 yo, esp AG (26 this year).

[badMania]

..Candra was present with the INA Sudirman Cup team, last yr, in body, spirit and mind and yet, they still lost...;)


Did u actually think pairing Candra with either Alvent or Kido or Hendra would stand a chance against Fu/Cai :eek: ???

Regardless of which pair INA used in that Final (Kido/Hendra or a combination of Alvent, Candra, or Hendra AG), the chance against the Chinese pair was at best 50-50 :o

Don't forget, the target was to reach the Final, which they did. Anything beyond that will be a bonus :rolleyes:

[Erwin Kyoto]

It's very funny to read all comments from ctjcad about Candra and his presence in INA Thomas Cup Team. I don't want to make any comments.:)

Candra is used as 'agent' to bond all players and he has proven his track in the last Sudirman Cup, yes..Indonesia did not win the cup, everybody knows that but almost no one predict Indonesia can reach to the final.
I think 'Candra' factor is apllied for INA Thomas Cup team based on the current condition:
1. Luluk/Alvent: Although they are world's no 7 but their performances are not really promising and they have mental blocking (esp. Luluk) when their opponent can read their game. I think coaches do not have enough confidence to Luluk/Alvent to deliver a point.
2. Joko/Gunawan: Young players and still struggling to stamp their name in world's mens double but they must be given enough exposure in big tournament.
INA Team do not have many options if they want to depend on those two pairs.
Candra and Nova are called to create more pair variations and I'm not surprise Candra will be paired with Joko or Gunawan as well.

It is gambling and very daring step to drop Luluk/Alvent from Thomas Cup team but decision must be made.:crying:

Agree...Nova/Candra have demonstrated their best performances even though their training for ABC only in a few days. Surely, INA team would ask them become 2nd MD in SF and F matches. Even no chance to Joko/Hendra or any other Candra's variations to play in INA's crucial matches...but I just worry about their stamina if all their matches take rubber:(...Anyway...INA MD TC skuad have good chance to take point...

yeep...lets support INA skuad and say INDONESIA BISA in commemoration of 100 years of Indonesian National Awakening Day on this May 20 (two days after TC/UC 2008 finish)...:p:p:p

[ctjcad]

...
Candra is used as 'agent' to bond all players and he has proven his track in the last Sudirman Cup, yes..Indonesia did not win the cup, everybody knows that but almost no one predict Indonesia can reach to the final.
I think 'Candra' factor is apllied for INA Thomas Cup team based on the current condition:
1. Luluk/Alvent: Although they are world's no 7 but their performances are not really promising and they have mental blocking (esp. Luluk) when their opponent can read their game. I think coaches do not have enough confidence to Luluk/Alvent to deliver a point.
2. Joko/Gunawan: Young players and still struggling to stamp their name in world's mens double but they must be given enough exposure in big tournament.
INA Team do not have many options if they want to depend on those two pairs.
Candra and Nova are called to create more pair variations and I'm not surprise Candra will be paired with Joko or Gunawan as well.

It is gambling and very daring step to drop Luluk/Alvent from Thomas Cup team but decision must be made.:crying:

...
Of course, INA did lose the tie to China. Flashback to the Sudirman Cup Final, INA already had themselves in the backfoot with Flandy/Vita losing in a narrow match against Zheng/Gao. The second match was women's singles which was almost a walkover. The third match was Candra/Kido's match. Only a very optimistic guy will bet on the INA pair matching the in-form and reigning World Champion at that time (Fu/Cai won 2 straight SS titles). So, it was expected that the scratch pairing lost to the Chinese pair.
...
...the argument was not for the performance of the INA SC squad but what happened when Candra & Markis paired up, esp. when they played against CHN's top, not 2nd ranked, MD pair;). As for against the ENG MD pair, i personally don't know who were or are their legit 1st MD pair.
...for this TC squad, i would say the 2nd MD pairing for INA will have a 50-50 chance against the other top 2nd ranked MD pairings (teams mentioned by badMania above, post #80). Okay, i'll give 'em a 60-40 or even a 70-30 chance against a few others. If they play against, say, Nigeria, i'll give 'em a 100% chance of winning;). Yes, even with Candra in the mix.

Did u actually think pairing Candra with either Alvent or Kido or Hendra would stand a chance against Fu/Cai :eek: ???

Regardless of which pair INA used in that Final (Kido/Hendra or a combination of Alvent, Candra, or Hendra AG), the chance against the Chinese pair was at best 50-50 :o

Don't forget, the target was to reach the Final, which they did. Anything beyond that will be a bonus :rolleyes:
..exactly my point, as to my argument about Candra. His chance of winning pairing up with those players is 50-50. Is that a "fearsome" & "gruesome" percentage?
Although i was hoping they would give a fight, esp. as the 2nd option to give a pt, but then they lost almost so easily to Fu & Cai.
Now, to answer your question, no, i don't think any of those players, combined, would stand a chance against Fu & Cai. The only capable INA MD pair, which IMO can challenge and win against Fu & Cai is Markis and Hendra.

Agree...Nova/Candra have demonstrated their best performances even though their training for ABC only in a few days. Surely, INA team would ask them become 2nd MD in SF and F matches. Even no chance to Joko/Hendra or any other Candra's variations to play in INA's crucial matches...but I just worry about their stamina if all their matches take rubber:(...Anyway...INA MD TC skuad have good chance to take point...
..we'll see what'll happen in the TC if indeed Nova and Candra are paired up.
Again, he'll most likely be paired up playing against the other squads' 2nd ranked MD pairs.;)

Anyway, no one is arguing about Candra's factor to the TC squad. But back to the point of discussion:
In general, with the current MD pairs in the world:
Would any pair, with Candra in it, make it a fearsome pair?
And is he truly the most dangerous doubles player today?
I'll let you guys take your time & answer those 2 questions.;):cool:

[badadum]

In general, with the current MD pairs in the world:
Would any pair, with Candra in it, make it a fearsome pair?
And is he truly the most dangerous doubles player today?
I'll let you guys take your time & answer those 2 questions.;):cool:

Make it a fearsome pair? No, but better pair yes, depending the quality of the pair to begin with :)
Truly the most dangerous doubles player today? No, I'll give that title to Lee Yong Dae. ;)

[ctjcad]

...thaaaaaank you very much, for answering and................confirming.;)

[nick.h]

Didn't Candra Wijaya/Markis Kido beat Anthony Clark/Robert Blair the previous night to secure the all-important 3rd pt in the last tie (which stretched to past midnight HKG time if I remembered correctly) that guaranteed the final spot? That's a vital pt for Team INA and Candra's contribution was massive! Remember that Markis Kido/Hendra Setiawan lost 2 consecutive times against Clark/Blair before the SF matchup. That's the reason why the coaches decided not to field Kido/Hendra.

Candra/Kido only lost to the faster and more attack-oriented Fu/Cai, nothing ashamed about that. Kido/Hendra could have lost too if they were played. I would say that pairing up Candra with any players certainly will add an element of unpredictability.

yes i totally agree with you. however if i remember correctly, during thomas cup 2004, candra was paired with tri kush instead of sigit/halim and that ended very unfortunate for us (losing to eriksen-lungaard in sf). With the age factor, i wouldnt completely depend solely on candra himself; his partner has to be equally as good as him or at least someone who can control the net area. nova has proven himself to be the perfect candidate...but i still think pbsi shouldnt have dropped luluk/alvent, cos what pbsi is doing now(putting candra on the team) is not regeneration :D, yes?
but still, GO TEAM INDONESIA!ayo ayo, ayo indonesia....kuisi kita harus menang!

[Smichz]

Weird line ups..Hopefully whatever that have came out from this new management would work out...

[badMania]

In general, with the current MD pairs in the world:
Would any pair, with Candra in it, make it a fearsome pair?
And is he truly the most dangerous doubles player today?
I'll let you guys take your time & answer those 2 questions.;):cool:

I am curious about a partnership between Candra Wijaya and Hendra Setiawan. This one will be a dangerous pair to watch, because Candra, regardless of his age, can still attack from the back. Kido has the tendency to make unforced errors.

Of course Candra is NOT the most dangerous doubles player today...but, we have seen how Tony and Candra combined together and still troubled and actually beat many younger fearsome pairs last year, eg: Koo/Tan; Luluk/Alvent; Fairuz/Zakry; Lee/Hwang; Sakamoto/Ikeda; and Guo/Xie.

Even the scratch pairing of Candra/Nova still beat Japan and Korea's first and second MD pair at this moment: Sakamoto/Ikeda and Lee/Hwang.

[badMania]

...the argument was not for the performance of the INA SC squad but what happened when Candra & Markis paired up, esp. when they played against CHN's top, not 2nd ranked, MD pair;). As for against the ENG MD pair, i personally don't know who were or are their legit 1st MD pair.
...for this TC squad, i would say the 2nd MD pairing for INA will have a 50-50 chance against the other top 2nd ranked MD pairings (teams mentioned by badMania above, post #80).


What happened to Candra/Kido when they were paired up:
1. They beat the ENG no 1 pair Anthony Clark/Robert Blair (also the 2006 World Championships Silver-Medallist, in case you forgot ;)). INA pair used to have difficulties, esp when Anthony Clark is present. Kido/Hendra lost to this pair in the 2006 World Championships QF. Also note that Anthony Clark/Robert Blair beat Koo Kien Keat/Tan Boon Heong in the Sudirman Cup group match, to seat the all-important pt that saw them through to the SF. So, I would definitely say that they are not an easy pair to deal with, as they lost only to Candra/Nova in the Sudirman Cup campaign.

2. They lost to the then World No 1 pair and reigning World Champions Fu Haifeng/Cai Yun, which I fully expect.

I personally would think that Candra/Kido's performance throughout the Sudirman Cup was good enough. I expected a tough match against Anthony Clark/Robert Blair, but, it turned out that the INA pair triumphed easily.

[badadum]

I am curious about a partnership between Candra Wijaya and Hendra Setiawan. This one will be a dangerous pair to watch, because Candra, regardless of his age, can still attack from the back. Kido has the tendency to make unforced errors.


Can't agree more. Candra is still quite effective from the back. Partnering him with HS, will be quite interesting to say the least.

When in top form, MK/HS is on equal ground with any of the other nation's 1st MD (KKK/TBH will be playing 2nd MD), but considering they haven't played in international competition for awhile, not to mention the mental condition of Markis..... Maybe there'll be surprises in store @ TC. ;)

[ctjcad]

...
Of course Candra is NOT the most dangerous doubles player today...but, we have seen how Tony and Candra combined together and still troubled and actually beat many younger fearsome pairs last year, eg: Koo/Tan; Luluk/Alvent; Fairuz/Zakry; Lee/Hwang; Sakamoto/Ikeda; and Guo/Xie.
...
..thank you for the answer; that's all i'm looking for...;)

As for what happened in last yr's SC, yes, i already know. And i remember the 2006 WC silver medals for the ENG pair. No one's forgetting anything and you've already mentioned it before, in the previous page.;)

As for the scenario of Candra partnering with Hendra, yes, it crossed my mind before. It does sound wonderful and all but will they be a "fearsome" pair? Or is it all a speculation, at best. Because for that, you, me and we all don't know as we haven't seen them play together yet.
And even then, if you take that scenario in this Thomas Cup event, who will be the 2nd INA MD pair? Which player will pair up with another player to form another dependable 2nd MD pair? Markis and Joko? Markis and Nova? Joko and Nova?who else? what other combination?:confused:

As for the talk about Tony and Candra making hay by troubling or even beating the other younger MD pairs, sure, it's a great story they can still do so (with all their circumstances). The Japan Open title, last yr, was great. But anything else to offer? Where have they finished recently? Heck, eventhough Jonas and Lars and probably other older pairs haven't won any major titles recently, they have upset some younger MD pairs recently.
It's back to that age-old question: What have you done for me lately??..;)

[badMania]

As for the talk about Tony and Candra making hay by troubling or even beating the other younger MD pairs, sure, it's a great story they can still do so (with all their circumstances). The Japan Open title, last yr, was great. But anything else to offer? Where have they finished recently? Heck, eventhough Jonas and Lars and probably other older pairs haven't won any major titles recently, they have upset some younger MD pairs recently.
It's back to that age-old question: What have you done for me lately??..;)

I am sure you know better than me of how Tony and Candra fared in recent months ;)

Candra Wijaya's record since winning the Japan Open 2007:

With Tony Gunawan
China Open 2007 -- lost in R32 to Hendra A. Gunawan/Joko Riyadi in three tight-sets.

Hong Kong Open 2007 -- Final, beaten by Markis Kido/Hendra Setiawan; beat Tan Bin Shen/Ong Soon Hock, Chien Yu-Hsun/Lin Yu-Lang, Koo Kien Keat/Tan Boon Heong (a huge upset), and Luluk Hadiyanto/Alvent Yulianto en-route to the Final.

Malaysia Open 2008 -- SF and fulfilled their seeding, beaten by Markis Kido/Hendra Setiawan; beat the upcoming CT pair Fang Chieh-Min/Lee Sheng Mu, MAS no 3 pair of Mohd Fairuzizuan Mohd Tazari/Mohd Zakry Abdul Latif, and DEN no 4 pair of Simon Mollyhus/Anders Kristiansen (all in straight sets).

All-England 2008 -- beaten by Lee Jae Jin/Hwang Ji Man in R16, after beating GER no 1 pair of Kristof Hopp/Ingo Kindervater (the Russian GP Gold 2007 Winner) in R32.

Swiss Open 2008 -- QF and fulfilled their seeding, beat Lee Jae Jin/Hwang Ji Man (a revenge for the defeat in the previous week's All England), Shuichi Sakamoto/Shintaro Ikeda (who beat Koo/Tan again in the AE), all in straight-sets. Only lost out yet again to the World Champion.

India Open 2008 -- SF, lost to Chan Chong Ming/Chew Choon Eng in 3 tight-sets. Beat Robert Blair/Richard Eidstedt, POL no 1 pair of Michal Logosz/Robert Mateusiak, and Hendra Wijaya/Yoga Ukikasah.

With Nova Widianto
Asian Continental Championships -- Final, lost to Jung Jae Sung/Lee Yong Dae. Beat Shuichi Sakamoto/Shintaro Ikeda, Luluk Hadiyanto/Alvent Yulianto, and Lee Jae Jin/Hwang Ji Man en route to the Final.

Record: 17-7 (out of which 3 are to the World Champion and 1 to the AE Champion).

That's not a bad record, comparing with (from China Open onwards):
Markis Kido/Hendra Setiawan -- 20-3
Fu Haifeng/Cai Yun -- 13-5
Jung Jae Sung/Lee Yong Dae -- 27-6
Choong Tan Fook/Lee Wan Wah -- 13-6
Koo Kien Keat/Tan Boon Heong -- 8-6
Tony Gunawan/Candra Wijaya -- 13-6
Luluk Hadiyanto/Alvent Yulianto --13-7
Lars Paaske/Jonas Rasmussen -- 18-6
Guo Zhendong/Xie Zhongbo -- 15-6
Lee Jae Jin/Hwang Ji Man --15-8
Candra Wijaya/Nova Widianto -- 4-1

[badMania]

Heck, eventhough Jonas and Lars and probably other older pairs haven't won any major titles recently, they have upset some younger MD pairs recently.


Well, Lars Paaske/Jonas Rasmussen finally won their long-awaited European Championships 2008 title to their World Championships 2003 title.

[taufik-ist]

we can conclude.. though candra is aging. his skill is still there :)

[ctjcad]

...badMania, thanks for the recap stats/records of the current MDs, Candra's record etc. And thank you for providing an answer to my question, a few posts back, which was basically the crux of the initial notion of discussion.;)

I'll let you (or anyone else) continue on the speculation or possible combo mix etc. for the INA MD squad (or for Candra). All I care about is results. Yes, not just Semifinal or QF finishes/results, but whether Candra can get his hands on a title.:cool:

[ye333]

Candra/Hendra will definitely do better than Candra/Kido... But will they be stronger than Hendra/Kido? :cool:

For a whole tournament, not likely. For only one match, I think it's possible. But then INA needs to push Gunawan/Riyadi to first MD or use a scratch pair (choosing from Gunawan, Riyadi, Nova, Kido) as 2nd MD. Either way most likely one point will be lost there.


I am curious about a partnership between Candra Wijaya and Hendra Setiawan. This one will be a dangerous pair to watch, because Candra, regardless of his age, can still attack from the back. Kido has the tendency to make unforced errors.

Of course Candra is NOT the most dangerous doubles player today...but, we have seen how Tony and Candra combined together and still troubled and actually beat many younger fearsome pairs last year, eg: Koo/Tan; Luluk/Alvent; Fairuz/Zakry; Lee/Hwang; Sakamoto/Ikeda; and Guo/Xie.

Even the scratch pairing of Candra/Nova still beat Japan and Korea's first and second MD pair at this moment: Sakamoto/Ikeda and Lee/Hwang.

[huangkwokhau]

Today, INA UBER and Thomas Cup will meet INA President as well as dinner with President tonight....

[taufik-ist]

Today, INA UBER and Thomas Cup will meet INA President as well as dinner with President tonight....

i hope mr SBY won't talk about the domestic politic which is heating up :D :D

[huangkwokhau]

Today, INA UBER and Thomas Cup will meet INA President as well as dinner with President tonight....
Dinner with Sutiyoso, the nominating President...not with SBY

[Erwin Kyoto]

Today, INA UBER and Thomas Cup will meet INA President as well as dinner with President tonight....

wow...u very fast got the news....I just read INA newspaper right now...:D


i hope mr SBY won't talk about the domestic politic which is heating up :D :D

dont worry...Mr. SBY love sport and give Sony cs and Maria cs moral support and spirit....just dinner and dinner...:p:p:p

[taufik-ist]

Dinner with Sutiyoso, the nominating President...not with SBY

ooooo... kirain :D

[Erwin Kyoto]

Dinner with Sutiyoso, the nominating President...not with SBY


ooooo... kirain :D

ups...not with MR SBY??? elo sih Fik..curiga aja ama MR SBY..:D