All China team decided to skip SS Final as well as LYD/LHJ, also JJS/LYD and Hwang Hye Yun.
Also Den's Jonas/Passke....and Japanese Maede/Suetsuno..

The lucky ones are WMC, WCH,Saina, Yu Hirayama.Jo/Greys,Flandy/Vita,
Nicole/Reid..

Also reported that TH may withdraw due to waist pain...if he does, he will replaced by NW

Already expected China would not participate in SS final and too bad to hear that LYD/LHJ, LYD/JJS and Jonas/Passke also not taking part

well...so...good result for mas in ss final is not tat meaningful anymore...

why? China always like that?

too many money liao....so no need play this one...

too many money liao....so no need play this one...
haha, yaya too much money already :p Chinese are so good because they give way for others to win the money, they are so kind, haha..... :D;)

haha, yaya too much money already :p Chinese are so good because they give way for others to win the money, they are so kind, haha..... :D;)

totally agree....:p....

i think they're already working on building ranking points for 2012, and this SS Final doesn't boast any olympic qualifying points? or just taking a nice christmas break ;)...they're planning to skip MO/KO aren't they?

why the chinese team always like tht wan...no wander badminton is still unpopular...they should learn from tennis.....wta finals all top player participate....atp finals roger federal all those ppl participate....dont no y the chinese always like tht wan

i think they're already working on building ranking points for 2012, and this SS Final doesn't boast any olympic qualifying points? or just taking a nice christmas break ;)...they're planning to skip MO/KO aren't they?

OG points for 2012 only starts from mid 2011, dont have to rank up points so early ;);). They're ehem... busy.... as posted in other threads.

Maybe it's the location that's put them off :D

i hope no one else will withdrew just because china cancel the event...

i expect this to be happen since earlier:rolleyes:

their excuse is they need to shift their hostel, winter training also change to spring training! anyway, such a lousy reason!:p

Is there any confirmation?

If this is true, it is an appalling decision:mad: This is not even about the money. Being the preeminant badminton nation, China has the obligation to support anything that promotes the game.

Also reported that TH may withdraw due to waist pain...if he does, he will replaced by NW

Simple, just rename the Super Series Final to Grand Prix Gold Final should solve all the issues :D

oooohh... :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

is china had been planned to move on before the SSF date?? :confused::confused:

why iss the Korean also withdrawal???? oooohh..

agreee.. this is GP...

why the chinese team always like tht wan...no wander badminton is still unpopular...they should learn from tennis.....wta finals all top player participate....atp finals roger federal all those ppl participate....dont no y the chinese always like tht wan

Is there any confirmation?

If this is true, it is an appalling decision:mad: This is not even about the money. Being the preeminant badminton nation, China has the obligation to support anything that promotes the game.


Let's look at ourselves before pointing finger to others. A sport needs to get popular, not by 1 nation or 1 region. It needs everyone to be competitive, to make it to be fun.

You can not blame any NBA team, if they choose not to participate in NCAA finals, right? To promote a sport, it needs everyone's effort. Once everyone becomes to the same level, it will be much more fun to watch.

Let's not to put CHN in the hot seat once there's any badminton related news coming up. They come, you will say, they do not play hard, they match fix, they are too dominate, not good for the sports. They do not come, you say they are not supportative. What you want them to do then? :rolleyes:

Let's look at basketball. In OG 92, NBA dream team won the gold by average 30+ points. However, just after 10 years, tons of other nations catch up, and getting W in matches here and there. During the years, I don't see any nation / region crying about why NBA did not participate in whatever tournament they are holding. I do not hear any teams complain they need coaches or all star players to join them in order to improve. So, if basketball as a sport, can improve in general by each individual's own hardwork, why badminton as a sport need to rely on 1 nation?

You can not tell others what to do, but you surely can tell yourself what to do. Instead of wasting the time and effort to blame others, try to train harder and make yourself a better player.

Upon further review, it seems the Grand Finale was put together late, haphazardly. It may be an ordeal for the players, especially those who went deep in many competitions, to just show up for another meet.

Hope the next one will be put together properly, with full respect and full support from all sides.

I think they should just combine the Super Series Final and World Championship into one and call it Super Series World Championships.

Just have it at the end of the year as a grand finale, and they should receive points as well.

Let's look at ourselves before pointing finger to others. A sport needs to get popular, not by 1 nation or 1 region. It needs everyone to be competitive, to make it to be fun.

You can not blame any NBA team, if they choose not to participate in NCAA finals, right? To promote a sport, it needs everyone's effort. Once everyone becomes to the same level, it will be much more fun to watch.

Let's not to put CHN in the hot seat once there's any badminton related news coming up. They come, you will say, they do not play hard, they match fix, they are too dominate, not good for the sports. They do not come, you say they are not supportative. What you want them to do then? :rolleyes:

Let's look at basketball. In OG 92, NBA dream team won the gold by average 30+ points. However, just after 10 years, tons of other nations catch up, and getting W in matches here and there. During the years, I don't see any nation / region crying about why NBA did not participate in whatever tournament they are holding. I do not hear any teams complain they need coaches or all star players to join them in order to improve. So, if basketball as a sport, can improve in general by each individual's own hardwork, why badminton as a sport need to rely on 1 nation?

You can not tell others what to do, but you surely can tell yourself what to do. Instead of wasting the time and effort to blame others, try to train harder and make yourself a better player.


I totally agree. The fans needs to contribute to popularity of the sports as well as the player. Staying at home and live streaming the matches will not make the sport anymore popular.

It's definitely a bad thing that top team/top players choose not to participate. The basketball example is not appropriate though. Basketball is already a very very popular sport, so it doesn't matter whether NBA is dominant or not. Countries which suck in basketball still put big money in this sport. Furthermore in the case of basketball, the dominant country (USA) is very supportive to the sport (not because they are LeiFeng of course, but because of money -- the blood of modern societies). Anyone from any country has chance to join NBA.

For badminton the situation is totally different. Given the current situation, maybe the only hope is that one day a good league (like NBA) will appear in China.

Btw, I think it's not fair to say those non-Chinese players haven't trained hard enough. t's like saying France is not as good as Brazil in soccer because French players do not train as hard. Smaller countries have less talents and are therefore less consistent than bigger ones.

In fact, if we look at say top 10 MSs, I would say the Danish players have already trained too hard. :D

Let's look at ourselves before pointing finger to others. A sport needs to get popular, not by 1 nation or 1 region. It needs everyone to be competitive, to make it to be fun.

You can not blame any NBA team, if they choose not to participate in NCAA finals, right? To promote a sport, it needs everyone's effort. Once everyone becomes to the same level, it will be much more fun to watch.

Let's not to put CHN in the hot seat once there's any badminton related news coming up. They come, you will say, they do not play hard, they match fix, they are too dominate, not good for the sports. They do not come, you say they are not supportative. What you want them to do then? :rolleyes:

Let's look at basketball. In OG 92, NBA dream team won the gold by average 30+ points. However, just after 10 years, tons of other nations catch up, and getting W in matches here and there. During the years, I don't see any nation / region crying about why NBA did not participate in whatever tournament they are holding. I do not hear any teams complain they need coaches or all star players to join them in order to improve. So, if basketball as a sport, can improve in general by each individual's own hardwork, why badminton as a sport need to rely on 1 nation?

You can not tell others what to do, but you surely can tell yourself what to do. Instead of wasting the time and effort to blame others, try to train harder and make yourself a better player.

If this is true, it is an appalling decision. :mad: This is not even about the money. Being the preeminent badminton nation, China has the obligation to support anything that promotes the game.






Let's look at ourselves before pointing finger to others. A sport needs to get popular, not by 1 nation or 1 region. It needs everyone to be competitive, to make it to be fun.



.
I have indicated in other threads that perhaps we have made a 'wrong' move in our current development for Badminton. We have paid too much attention on the big prize money (the US$500,000.00). Furthermore, rich sponsors are not easy to find, so it has made the SS Finals more difficult to organise.

IMHO, under our current situation, we cannot make Badminton more popular by just offering big prize money.

Yes, Badminton is trying to follow Tennis. We are thinking that by offering big prize money, more interest and participation could be achieved. But Badminton has missed out the one important thing that Tennis has done some 40 years ago. Tennis organised to recruit players to be professionals. Tennis arranged for players to sign contracts, to get them committed to appear in tournaments.

Currently, I would not call our top players in Badminton as 'Professional Players'. They are actually 'National Team Players'. Our top players have no choice but to obey instructions issued by their National Associations.

:):):)
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Currently, I would not call our top players in Badminton as 'Professional Players'. They are actually 'National Team Players'. Our top players have no choice but to obey instructions issued by their National Associations.

.

QFT. Unless the players can decide for themselves, they'll be always at the mercy of the corresponding National Associations.

The one really got screw are the organizers/sponsors, is not easy to come out with US$500K and now the main attraction Team China decided not to attend ... It will be much harder to sell those expensive seats. For those who already bought the tickets in advance, just go there and have fun.
I think it will be very hard to find any organizers/sponsors for the future Super Series Final. I don't blame the Chinese players but screw those Chinse coaching staff for making such ill decision, shame on them!

I am also very disappointed at their decision of no-go.

However, the BWF has not had very good track record either. No one knew for sure that this will go ahead. There is also virtually no break between the grand finale and MO/KO.

If the Chinese league goes ahead next year, I don't know how many more no- shows we will see.

There must be a coordinated effort to put the competitive schedule together better.

The one really got screw are the organizers/sponsors, is not easy to come out with US$500K and now the main attraction Team China decided not to attend ... It will be much harder to sell those expensive seats. For those who already bought the tickets in advance, just go there and have fun.
I think it will be very hard to find any organizers/sponsors for the future Super Series Final. I don't blame the Chinese players but screw those Chinse coaching staff for making such ill decision, shame on them!


Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't it a fact that most Malaysian fans on this forum claim that they prefer to watch matches without Chinese players especially China vs China???:confused: Now their wishes have came true... and nobody is happy.:rolleyes:






To everyone who thinks badminton can be more popular by having bigger prize money tournament and China participate in every one of them... LOL... that's not going to work.

If you want badminton to be popular... DON'T HOLD over 70% of tournaments in ASIA!!! Especially the so-called special events.:mad:
Change the image of the sport from being a sissy sport(or Asian sport), by not having so many short/skinny/chubby/tomboy players, and replace with some well build male, and prettier female players instead... Then maybe badminton won't be look down so badly in most western societies.

Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't it a fact that most Malaysian fans on this forum claim that they prefer to watch matches without Chinese players especially China vs China???:confused: Now their wishes have came true... and nobody is happy.:rolleyes:

Hehehehe...:D:D quite a funny comment. However I'm sure they want to see some Chinese presence, not necessarily CHN v CHN

To everyone who thinks badminton can be more popular by having bigger prize money tournament and China participate in every one of them... LOL... that's not going to work.

This event provides the strongest evidence. The main people thinking that money can buy popularity is the BWF. They need to rethink how they can use they available money better. That or get some people who can actually THINK constructively :rolleyes:

If you want badminton to be popular... DON'T HOLD over 70% of tournaments in ASIA!!!

Yes, bring some tournaments to North America (read Canada) :)

Especially the so-called special events.:mad:
Change the image of the sport from being a sissy sport(or Asian sport), by not having so many short/skinny/chubby/tomboy players, and replace with some well build male, and prettier female players instead... Then maybe badminton won't be look down so badly in most western societies.

Man, you were rolling along so nicely until this stupid comment :cool:



...................................

the grande finale would look great at SBP in Ottawa XD...i'd buy so many tickets..lol...

...................................
Please do not reply like this.

When you insert your responses in a quoted post, others wishing to reply are unable to correctly use the Quote function :o

Also reported that TH may withdraw due to waist pain...if he does, he will replaced by NW

Yup, I read through ANTARA News Agency yesterday that reported TH decided to pull out from Masters Finals due to waist injury.

Please do not reply like this.

When you insert your responses in a quoted post, others wishing to reply are unable to correctly use the Quote function :o

Apologies Mr. Mod :)

with or without China...this is a good opportunity for other players to get easy money....when else?

The most important at this moment in time is get the money....so..other players must "celebrate" and be happy for the Chinese team's non-participation...

If China team decided not to participate in MO and KO, wow.....that's better and it's a good opportunity for other players to collect more dollars...:D:D

with or without China...this is a good opportunity for other players to get easy money....when else?

The most important at this moment in time is get the money....so..other players must "celebrate" and be happy for the Chinese team's non-participation...

If China team decided not to participate in MO and KO, wow.....that's better and it's a good opportunity for other players to collect more dollars...:D:D

I think its not going affect the tournament even without team China.......no big deal.....if they dont want to play no body can force them to..........:p:p

I will still enjoy this touney and up coming MO in Jan 09.......cant wait....:D:D:D

Yup, I read through ANTARA News Agency yesterday that reported TH decided to pull out from Masters Finals due to waist injury.
Do you know where is Simon Santoso?

Maybe it's the location that's put them off :D
More the tournament format makes it very difficult for CHN to win.I remember reading CHN was offered the opportunity to host SSF through Lining as the sponsor but it fell through.What to do? Even at their doorstep, they rejected it.
But I believe CHN's need for proper preparations.CHN team has to work twice as hard as others to win. And compete in a big enough group per event to enable their LYB strategy for increased chances.

I don't read all posts before... So can anyone help me to inform the final participants of this SS Finale after TH and all CHN team withdrew? Thanx!!

LOL. I read before in here many for the devate about the Quote given to players for countries, especially against the china.
Arguing need to to continue now as China officially withdraw from this tounament.
A big slap in the face to BWF.
They might as well forfeit it for next year.
Unless they awarded the host for china LOL

with or without china team participate in this tournament, the tournament and the excitement must goes on for sure..
nothing big deal although china whole team withdrew from this tournament..:rolleyes:

LOL. I read before in here many for the devate about the Quote given to players for countries, especially against the china.
Arguing need to to continue now as China officially withdraw from this tounament.
A big slap in the face to BWF.
They might as well forfeit it for next year.
Unless they awarded the host for china LOL
yeah, i wonder will china withdrew their whole team too if the SS FINAL is held in china??LOL:rolleyes:

Men’s singles: Lee Chong Wei (MAS), Sony Dwi Kuncoro (INA), Joachim Persson (DEN), Peter Gade (DEN), Chan Yan Kit (HKG), Andrew Smith (ENG), Wong Choong Hann (MAS), Ng Wei (HKG).

Women’s singles: Zhou Mi (HKG), Tine Rasmussen (DEN), Wang Chen (HKG), Pi Hongyan (FRA), Xu Huaiwen (GER), Wong Mew Choo (MAS), Saina Nehwal (IND) and Yu Hirayama (JPN).

Men’s doubles: Markis Kido-Hendra Setiawan (INA), Zakry Abdul Latif-Mohd Fairuzizuan Tazari (MAS), Lee Yong Dae-Jung Jae Sung (KOR), Mathias Boe-Carsten Mogensen (DEN), Candra Wijaya-Tony Gunawan (INA-USA), Koo Kien Keat-Tan Boon Heong (MAS), Simon Mollyhus-Anders Kristiansen (DEN) and Cho Gun Woo-Yoo Yeon Seong (to be confirmed).

Women’s doubles: Wong Pei Tty-Chin Eei Hui (MAS), Lilyana Natsir-Vita Marissa (INA), Kamilla Rytter Juhl-Lena Frier Kristiansen (DEN), Ha Jung Eun-Kim Min Jung (KOR), Charmaine Reid-Nicole Grether (CAN-GER), Duang Anong Aroonkesorn-Kunchala Voravitchitchaikul (THA), Jo Novita-Greysia Polii (INA) and Judith Meulendijks-Yao Jie (NED).

Mixed doubles: Nova Widianto-Lilyana Natsir (INA), Thomas Laybourn-Kamilla Rytter Juhl (DEN), Anthony Clark-Donna Kellogg (ENG), Robert Blair-Imogen Bakier (ENG-SCO), Sudket Prapakamol-Saralee Thoungthongkam (THA), Songphon Anugritayawon-Kunchala Voravitchitchaikul (THA), Yoo Yeon Seong-Kim Min Jung (KOR, to be confirmed) and Flandy Limpele-Vita Marissa (INA).

LOL. I read before in here many for the devate about the Quote given to players for countries, especially against the china.
Arguing need to to continue now as China officially withdraw from this tounament.
A big slap in the face to BWF.
They might as well forfeit it for next year.
Unless they awarded the host for china LOL

No big slap at all...no need to forfeit the Finale SS, if no top player participates...I am more than happy to substitute them as long as return airfare tickets, hotel, daily allowance, participation fee provided....:D

It is regrettable that China pulled out of the SSF. The coaches of Team China showed little respect to the BWF and Chinese badminton fans, and undermined the developement of badminton.

However, maybe one of the reason of the withdrawal is the format of the competition. In SSF, the payers will have to play 3 to 5 games in 4 days, all against top players in the world. Maybe the coaches think it is too much for the players after they completed an exhausting Olympic year.

If the group format is changed to a normal play off format, so that players would play 3 games at most, then Chinese coaches would consider participating the tournament more favourably.

And BWF should include the SSF in the ranking system (same ranking points as other regular SS), in order to give top player more incentive to take part.

Men’s singles: Lee Chong Wei (MAS), Sony Dwi Kuncoro (INA), Joachim Persson (DEN), Peter Gade (DEN), Chan Yan Kit (HKG), Andrew Smith (ENG), Wong Choong Hann (MAS), Ng Wei (HKG).

Women’s singles: Zhou Mi (HKG), Tine Rasmussen (DEN), Wang Chen (HKG), Pi Hongyan (FRA), Xu Huaiwen (GER), Wong Mew Choo (MAS), Saina Nehwal (IND) and Yu Hirayama (JPN).

Men’s doubles: Markis Kido-Hendra Setiawan (INA), Zakry Abdul Latif-Mohd Fairuzizuan Tazari (MAS), Lee Yong Dae-Jung Jae Sung (KOR), Mathias Boe-Carsten Mogensen (DEN), Candra Wijaya-Tony Gunawan (INA-USA), Koo Kien Keat-Tan Boon Heong (MAS), Simon Mollyhus-Anders Kristiansen (DEN) and Cho Gun Woo-Yoo Yeon Seong (to be confirmed).

Women’s doubles: Wong Pei Tty-Chin Eei Hui (MAS), Lilyana Natsir-Vita Marissa (INA), Kamilla Rytter Juhl-Lena Frier Kristiansen (DEN), Ha Jung Eun-Kim Min Jung (KOR), Charmaine Reid-Nicole Grether (CAN-GER), Duang Anong Aroonkesorn-Kunchala Voravitchitchaikul (THA), Jo Novita-Greysia Polii (INA) and Judith Meulendijks-Yao Jie (NED).

Mixed doubles: Nova Widianto-Lilyana Natsir (INA), Thomas Laybourn-Kamilla Rytter Juhl (DEN), Anthony Clark-Donna Kellogg (ENG), Robert Blair-Imogen Bakier (ENG-SCO), Sudket Prapakamol-Saralee Thoungthongkam (THA), Songphon Anugritayawon-Kunchala Voravitchitchaikul (THA), Yoo Yeon Seong-Kim Min Jung (KOR, to be confirmed) and Flandy Limpele-Vita Marissa (INA).

Thank you..... :)

Men’s singles: Lee Chong Wei (MAS), Sony Dwi Kuncoro (INA), Joachim Persson (DEN), Peter Gade (DEN), Chan Yan Kit (HKG), Andrew Smith (ENG), Wong Choong Hann (MAS), Ng Wei (HKG).

Women’s singles: Zhou Mi (HKG), Tine Rasmussen (DEN), Wang Chen (HKG), Pi Hongyan (FRA), Xu Huaiwen (GER), Wong Mew Choo (MAS), Saina Nehwal (IND) and Yu Hirayama (JPN).

Men’s doubles: Markis Kido-Hendra Setiawan (INA), Zakry Abdul Latif-Mohd Fairuzizuan Tazari (MAS), Lee Yong Dae-Jung Jae Sung (KOR), Mathias Boe-Carsten Mogensen (DEN), Candra Wijaya-Tony Gunawan (INA-USA), Koo Kien Keat-Tan Boon Heong (MAS), Simon Mollyhus-Anders Kristiansen (DEN) and Cho Gun Woo-Yoo Yeon Seong (to be confirmed).

Women’s doubles: Wong Pei Tty-Chin Eei Hui (MAS), Lilyana Natsir-Vita Marissa (INA), Kamilla Rytter Juhl-Lena Frier Kristiansen (DEN), Ha Jung Eun-Kim Min Jung (KOR), Charmaine Reid-Nicole Grether (CAN-GER), Duang Anong Aroonkesorn-Kunchala Voravitchitchaikul (THA), Jo Novita-Greysia Polii (INA) and Judith Meulendijks-Yao Jie (NED).

Mixed doubles: Nova Widianto-Lilyana Natsir (INA), Thomas Laybourn-Kamilla Rytter Juhl (DEN), Anthony Clark-Donna Kellogg (ENG), Robert Blair-Imogen Bakier (ENG-SCO), Sudket Prapakamol-Saralee Thoungthongkam (THA), Songphon Anugritayawon-Kunchala Voravitchitchaikul (THA), Yoo Yeon Seong-Kim Min Jung (KOR, to be confirmed) and Flandy Limpele-Vita Marissa (INA).

The MS field is weak and disappointing. WS field is not bad. MD field is the strongest. WD field not great. XD field OK.

Do you know where is Simon Santoso?

Don't know exactly where he is, probably back to his club.

Not only is China withdrawing from this year's SS Final, China has also withdrawn from next year's SS in Malaysia and South Korea. All these 3 SS are being dumped by China on the pretext of their own internal training program smells fishy.
I think something is going on here. China is obviously pissed off, but over what?

Not only is China withdrawing from this year's SS Final, China has also withdrawn from next year's SS in Malaysia and South Korea. All these 3 SS are being dumped by China on the pretext of their own internal training program smells fishy.
I think something is going on here. China is obviously pissed off, but over what?

Only GOD Knows....! :cool:..but who cares..?

Maybe is the tourney format....! :rolleyes:...Hmm....makes them difficult to ...'fix'.....?????..:rolleyes:....:D:D:D

Men’s singles: Lee Chong Wei (MAS), Sony Dwi Kuncoro (INA), Joachim Persson (DEN), Peter Gade (DEN), Chan Yan Kit (HKG), Andrew Smith (ENG), Wong Choong Hann (MAS), Ng Wei (HKG).

Women’s singles: Zhou Mi (HKG), Tine Rasmussen (DEN), Wang Chen (HKG), Pi Hongyan (FRA), Xu Huaiwen (GER), Wong Mew Choo (MAS), Saina Nehwal (IND) and Yu Hirayama (JPN).

Men’s doubles: Markis Kido-Hendra Setiawan (INA), Zakry Abdul Latif-Mohd Fairuzizuan Tazari (MAS), Lee Yong Dae-Jung Jae Sung (KOR), Mathias Boe-Carsten Mogensen (DEN), Candra Wijaya-Tony Gunawan (INA-USA), Koo Kien Keat-Tan Boon Heong (MAS), Simon Mollyhus-Anders Kristiansen (DEN) and Cho Gun Woo-Yoo Yeon Seong (to be confirmed).

Women’s doubles: Wong Pei Tty-Chin Eei Hui (MAS), Lilyana Natsir-Vita Marissa (INA), Kamilla Rytter Juhl-Lena Frier Kristiansen (DEN), Ha Jung Eun-Kim Min Jung (KOR), Charmaine Reid-Nicole Grether (CAN-GER), Duang Anong Aroonkesorn-Kunchala Voravitchitchaikul (THA), Jo Novita-Greysia Polii (INA) and Judith Meulendijks-Yao Jie (NED).

Mixed doubles: Nova Widianto-Lilyana Natsir (INA), Thomas Laybourn-Kamilla Rytter Juhl (DEN), Anthony Clark-Donna Kellogg (ENG), Robert Blair-Imogen Bakier (ENG-SCO), Sudket Prapakamol-Saralee Thoungthongkam (THA), Songphon Anugritayawon-Kunchala Voravitchitchaikul (THA), Yoo Yeon Seong-Kim Min Jung (KOR, to be confirmed) and Flandy Limpele-Vita Marissa (INA).

I didn't know that Flandy Limpele and Vita Marissa are back playing together :confused:

LCW must be real happy to see LD not joining.:p

Any ideas why Japanese players aren't participating? :(

..boy, with the news of CHN's team fully withdrawing from this SS Finale and now Taufik most likely bowing out, hmm, it almost takes the air out of this event. Not to undermine the other participating players, but from a fan's perspective of looking forward to top players playing, that's almost half of the show is gone. Will there be any more last minute pull-outs/withdrawals??..:confused:..I certainly hope not, just for the sake of the people planning to go and watch the event..

On that note, I just hope all of you guys who are going there will enjoy the rest of the matches; and as Han mentioned earlier, "just have fun!"..;):cool:

LCW must be real happy to see LD not joining.:p
LD's real happy not to have to play LCW since LD would not have enough escorts in SSF.

LOL. I read before in here many for the devate about the Quote given to players for countries, especially against the china.
Arguing need to to continue now as China officially withdraw from this tounament.
A big slap in the face to BWF.
They might as well forfeit it for next year.
Unless they awarded the host for china LOL
CHN was offered to host it but maybe the format was unfavourable to them so it was not taken up.
What big slap? BWF expected CHN's withdrawal.CHN threatened boycott 2 years in a row.This year, BWF got wise and decided to go ahead with the SSF,regardless of CHN.
Finally, BWF acted right.But what it should have added is bonus ranking points like the Tennis Masters.Big ranking points to go with big money.

It is regrettable that China pulled out of the SSF. The coaches of Team China showed little respect to the BWF and Chinese badminton fans, and undermined the developement of badminton.

However, maybe one of the reason of the withdrawal is the format of the competition. In SSF, the payers will have to play 3 to 5 games in 4 days, all against top players in the world. Maybe the coaches think it is too much for the players after they completed an exhausting Olympic year.

If the group format is changed to a normal play off format, so that players would play 3 games at most, then Chinese coaches would consider participating the tournament more favourably.

And BWF should include the SSF in the ranking system (same ranking points as other regular SS), in order to give top player more incentive to take part.
You brought up very well thought out points.
Agree that playing 5 matches over 4 days is not ideal.This is the SSF. No player should have to play 2 matches in a day. That means the outcome may be partially determined by blatant scheduling.Imagine a player having a gruelling morning match and then facing a tough opponent in the evening.
And yes, ranking points should have been included to make SSF a year end bonus worth working for.

Yes, the scheduling could have been extended at least another day to reduce the impact of playing 2 matches per day. But that would eat up in terms of cost.

Like it or not, BWF hasn't really been able to attract huge sponsorships.

Not only is China withdrawing from this year's SS Final, China has also withdrawn from next year's SS in Malaysia and South Korea. All these 3 SS are being dumped by China on the pretext of their own internal training program smells fishy.
I think something is going on here. China is obviously pissed off, but over what?

Smell fishy? I doubt.

It's not a secret that most players (CHN or not) admit that CHN internal matches are more competitive and the training is intensive. Since this is not OG year, the ranking point is not as important. It's a better idea to get the young guns to be ready (as quite a few retired), rather than simply dumping them to the big stage. :rolleyes:

It's definitely a bad thing that top team/top players choose not to participate. The basketball example is not appropriate though. Basketball is already a very very popular sport, so it doesn't matter whether NBA is dominant or not. Countries which suck in basketball still put big money in this sport. Furthermore in the case of basketball, the dominant country (USA) is very supportive to the sport (not because they are LeiFeng of course, but because of money -- the blood of modern societies). Anyone from any country has chance to join NBA.

For badminton the situation is totally different. Given the current situation, maybe the only hope is that one day a good league (like NBA) will appear in China.

Btw, I think it's not fair to say those non-Chinese players haven't trained hard enough. t's like saying France is not as good as Brazil in soccer because French players do not train as hard. Smaller countries have less talents and are therefore less consistent than bigger ones.

In fact, if we look at say top 10 MSs, I would say the Danish players have already trained too hard. :D

Great, so you tell me basketball players have the motivation, regardless their current performance / ranking, then I ask you why badminton players have to cry for help from others? Aren't we are all adults, who should be self-motivated, rather than keeping looking for big brothers? :eek: Yes, NBA did help. So as CHN for badminton. You tell me which nation currently do not have CHN coaches in their competitive clubs or even national teams? Quite a few ex-CHN players joined other teams, and helped them to be very competitive in both individual and team events.

Less population means less talent. If so, US should have no excuses for not produce local competitive players. It has much larger population than MAS, IND, DEN, etc. So, don't not put your own failure into whatever excuses. If you judge by population, India should over take CHN long time ago. US, RUS, etc should be 1 of the top houses. MAS, IND and DEN should be no where to be found. It's about the system, not just bean counting of heads. :cool:

By the way, I thought your soccer example just proved "less population" theory to be wrong. Otherwise, CHN and India should meet in FIFA world cup final each time. It's not about the population, not all about the hard work. It's about the system, the way of working smart. ;)

Less population means less talent. If so, US should have no excuses for not produce local competitive players. It has much larger population than MAS, IND, DEN, etc. So, don't not put your own failure into whatever excuses. If you judge by population, India should over take CHN long time ago. US, RUS, etc should be 1 of the top houses. MAS, IND and DEN should be no where to be found. It's about the system, not just bean counting of heads. :cool:

By the way, I thought your soccer example just proved "less population" theory to be wrong. Otherwise, CHN and India should meet in FIFA world cup final each time. It's not about the population, not all about the hard work. It's about the system, the way of working smart. ;)
Er, FYI, Indonesia's national population is above 200 million... ;)

Er, FYI, Indonesia's national population is above 200 million... ;)

IND = India

INA = Indonesia

i think CHN is probably doing the right thing in terms of peaking...they correctly trained and peaked for the OG, albiet maybe selective in which SS they played in...when LD came back from OG, he had trained enough to peak for the next few SS and he had good results...maybe they're planning the team's next big peak (after MO/KO)...if you wondered why LCW isn't doing as well, he's kinda been playing non-stop, and there aren't time in between to train and rest to properly prepare and peak...:P

No big slap at all...no need to forfeit the Finale SS, if no top player participates...I am more than happy to substitute them as long as return airfare tickets, hotel, daily allowance, participation fee provided....:D
If Indra substitute the top players...err! I am not sure the stadium will be even quarter-full even if Indra plays in your underwear and soaking wet LOL...:p:D

I think its not going affect the tournament even without team China.......no big deal.....if they dont want to play no body can force them to..........:p:p

I will still enjoy this touney and up coming MO in Jan 09.......cant wait....:D:D:D

SSF is intended for the world's best to compete...sure, it is CHN's decision to pull out and nobody can force CHN...but w/o LD, CJ and TH, the locals will probably still attend especially LCW fans, but for baddy fans flying in from other countries just to see the first ever SSF tourney, I am not sure how many would go for it, therefore it is a BIG deal with CHN missing...BTW, the way LD has been playing lately and the ease LD took care of LCW in OG and CO, one more spanking could be a mental block to LCW who used to previously extend LD to 3-setters, now there really is no competition to LD and someone say LYB pull out is fear of losing, I don't think so...perhaps, the obstacle to stopping LD is from CHN, ie if LD meets CJ in final, with no ranking points and gold medal at stake, it will be an open competition and LD could lose to CJ.

Whether some players compete or not, badminton is, or is supposed to be, bigger than any player or any dominant nation whatsoever.

Anyway, having been converted from a fanatical fan to an, ahem, almost neutral supporter, I am there for the game, and also to take a break from a hectic schedule of work and meet friends.

http://www.badzine.info/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1472:editorial--china-out-of-ss-finals--shooting-itself-in-the-foot-&catid=19:main-feature&Itemid=51

EDITORIAL – China out of SS Finals : Shooting itself in the foot
EDITORIAL – China out of SS Finals : Shooting itself in the foot (http://www.badzine.info/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1472:editorial--china-out-of-ss-finals--shooting-itself-in-the-foot-&catid=19:main-feature&Itemid=51)http://www.badzine.info/templates/rt_terrantribune_j15/images/pdf_button.png (http://www.badzine.info/index.php?view=article&catid=19%3Amain-feature&id=1472%3Aeditorial--china-out-of-ss-finals--shooting-itself-in-the-foot-&format=pdf&option=com_content&Itemid=51) http://www.badzine.info/templates/rt_terrantribune_j15/images/printButton.png (http://www.badzine.info/index.php?view=article&catid=19%3Amain-feature&id=1472%3Aeditorial--china-out-of-ss-finals--shooting-itself-in-the-foot-&tmpl=component&print=1&page=&option=com_content&Itemid=51) http://www.badzine.info/templates/rt_terrantribune_j15/images/emailButton.png (http://www.badzine.info/index.php?option=com_mailto&tmpl=component&link=aHR0cDovL3d3dy5iYWR6aW5lLmluZm8vaW5kZXgucGhwP 3ZpZXc9YXJ0aWNsZSZpZD0xNDcyJTNBZWRpdG9yaWFsLS1jaGl uYS1vdXQtb2Ytc3MtZmluYWxzLS1zaG9vdGluZy1pdHNlbGYta W4tdGhlLWZvb3QtJm9wdGlvbj1jb21fY29udGVudCZJdGVtaWQ 9NTE=)
http://www.badzine.info/images/stories/News_bzi/edito-china3.jpgBadminton has a clear paradox. Its strongest nation, China, relying on amazing shuttlers, on superb crowds and great venues with high standard of organization, seems to be shooting itself in the foot.

Editorial by Raphael Sachetat, Badzine's Chief Editor. Photos : Badmintonphoto (archives)
As if admitting few months ago that China had been fixing matches in an Olympic Game semi final was not enough to dilute the sport’s credibility - China’s head coach Li Yongbo (photo, left) has made known publicly that Zhou Mi was “asked” to lose to Zhang Ning in 2004 Olympic Games’ semi final - Chinese officials have recently once again, in some ways, given a tough hard time to those trying to develop the sport. In spite of the remarkable effort from the BWF to promote a new circuit and pulling out a last minute deal to hold its Grand Finale at last – a tough task in this time of crisis – China simply withdrew all its shuttlers from the event. Citing injury, a tough calendar and training camp…
There is something that I must be missing, here. Chinese badminton is, no question asked, the best in the world. Its shuttlers are so dedicated; the crowds that fill the badminton venues are such enjoyable fans. The entire population lives and breaths badminton. The recent Olympic Games were a justifable proof of China’s ability to hold extraordinary events and the success was mainly thanks to the hardworking volunteers and staff, the media covering all sports with impressive competence, and of course, thanks to the incredible Chinese athletes amongst which badminton players.
Today, once again, the decision to withdrawal the entire Chinese team from the BWF’s top and most prestigious competition sounds like a challenge given to the governing world body and the sport of badminton worldwide as if to show that China doesn’t need anyone else to make the sport grow. In other words, a slap in the face of the BWF. This is obviously harming the sport and causing a lot of frustration for a lot of people. Even shuttlers from other nations, who could simply think they’d enjoy better prize money, but instead, voice a concern for the sake of the sport. Of course, Chinese players have had a tough year and are tired. And the schedule is hard on everyone. But compromise must be found, sometimes.
So many people have worked endless days and nights to try to get money into the sport and promote the sport on a global scale. And when they succeed, their only reward is to see the world’s best turn their noses up at those efforts and walk away with their backs tuhttp://www.badzine.info/images/stories/News_bzi/edito-china.jpgrned. Not really motivating, if you ask me. The players themselves are not to blame – they are probably the first one’s to be frustrated, to participate in Super Series all year long, to only learn that they’re forbidden to play in the finals – the icing on the cake, the pinnacle of their season.
Cultural clash with sport values
There is a cultural clash between the Chinese interest seen by some of China badminton officials and the sport’s values in the way things have been handled for the past few years. Match fixing has been one of them, but not the least.
Defending patriotic values can be understood and has to be respected. Everyone has the right to feel proud when they see a compatriot on the highest stand of the podium. And if China sees it as its main goal – to put the Chinese flag on top rather than any individual – this is a cultural thing and once again, it has to be respected. All involved in the badminton world, and elsewhere, have their own thoughts, beliefs, rights and wrongs. China can not be, in any case, blamed for willing to get medals and put their general interest in front of the individuals.
However, badminton is a world wide sport with rules, ethics and values. Fairness is one of them and match fixing between compatriots obviously goes against all three notions. Not to mention a lack of respect towards the TV viewers, the live spectators, who have paid to see Athletes give their very best on court. When my compatriot Pierre de Coubertin gave birth to modern Olympic era, he clearly stated that the main thing was to participate and give its best. That was the rule, the ethics. It is again stipulated in the BWF rules that all athletes should compete at their best and not yield to compatriots because of strategic plans. Badminton is – apart from few events – an individual sport.
http://www.badzine.info/images/stories/News_bzi/edito-china2.jpgChinese athletes are amazing. They don’t deserve to be told to win or lose on demand. They don’t deserve to be deprived from an amazing competition after a year of sacrifices. The Chinese population doesn’t deserve to see one of the top events being played without the chance to bring back a medal from the first ever Super Series Finals.
Chinese officials have done a wonderful job bringing up the game in their own country and showing how talented and hard working their shuttlers are. It is now time to work together with the outside world and the international community, to make the sport grow as one or risk loosing contact with the outside world altogether. To “play by the rules” and enter such events as the Super Series finals. If not everyone as some may be tired or injured, but at least show some support and send some of the top class badminton players.
They should make compromise as everyone does on a global scale for the ultimate good of the sport on our planet not just within our individual countries so that the sport, as a whole, grows and benefits everyone. If only Chinese Badminton does benefit from its own growth, the sport might simply be taken out of the Olympic Program, someday. Sponsors will then vanish and the few money coming in will be gone for a while. That’s what is called shooting oneself in the foot…

I think China is trying to send a strong message to the BWF by withdrawing from 3 consecutive super series, the 2008 SS Final, the 2009 Malaysian SS, and the 2009 Korean SS. Someone in the BWF must have insulted or hurt the feelings of the Chinese. Maybe the change in personnel in the BWF has something to do with it.

I just think badminton future is heading nowhere, such a sad thing taking one small step forward and 2 big ones backward!

I just think badminton future is heading nowhere, such a sad thing taking one small step forward and 2 big ones backward!
And badminton future in Olympics will be in jeopardy as well?
Perhaps safe till 2016. After that? :confused:

.
After reading the last few posts, I have to admit that, even at Badminton Central, many of our members here are still considering that our top players and/or nations are BIGGER that our sport itself. :(

The truth is there is no correct answer, because...
Without Badminton, our top players/nations cannot show off their excellence, and
Without our top players/nations, our Badminton still needs developing and/or is still underdeveloped as it is.

To me, Badminton is only a Sport/Game.

We, as 'Friends of Badminton', can only hope that our sport can become more popular worldwide. It's as simple as that.

IMHO, to say that we have to miss out from participating in some world events, because we have to train in order to maintain our supremacy over the sport, is just not the right thing to do.
.

As Badzine's Chief Editor, I took the occasion to explain how we, at Badzine, feel like about this decision not to send any players.



http://www.badzine.info/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1472:editorial--china-out-of-ss-finals--shooting-itself-in-the-foot-&catid=19:main-feature&Itemid=51

As Badzine's Chief Editor, I took the occasion to explain how we, at Badzine, feel like about this decision not to send any players.



http://www.badzine.info/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1472:editorial--china-out-of-ss-finals--shooting-itself-in-the-foot-&catid=19:main-feature&Itemid=51
One of our members earlier posted your excellent take on the situation.
It's a few posts before yours :)

As Badzine's Chief Editor, I took the occasion to explain how we, at Badzine, feel like about this decision not to send any players.

http://www.badzine.info/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1472:editorial--china-out-of-ss-finals--shooting-itself-in-the-foot-&catid=19:main-feature&Itemid=51
As expressed in an earlier post, I don't like this decsion at all. I already posted to Chinese website to condemn this act. However, there are two sides to a coin.

How can the "top and most prestigious competition" come to nothing repeatedly and only put together at the last minute? Full credit for the great effort at the end but this is not how it should be done. By the way, where is this "top and most prestigious competition" on the 2009 schedule?

With the Olympics, this has been a particularly draining year for the top players and teams, starting from the start of qualifying period last year. You can't just throw in something at end to extend this grueling season even more. Give the players a break to recuperate, they are the biggest assets of BWF.

There have been many rule changes that are unfriendly to the Chinese team. Some are probably necessary evils to bring more parity. Some are just hostile and unnecessary such as two-participant limit for the grand finale. There got to be a boomerang somehow, somewhere. I am not saying this is it. You can interpret it on your own.

On the topic of match fixing, in an Olympics setting, there are forces even more powerful than LYB. Team order is not unheard of in sports in general. The Chinese badminton team is not only an accomplice, but also a victim to greater forces. Away from the Olympics, I am hopeful that fair competition can be realized. The Olympics is a political event as much as a sporting event. That is what makes it great, and ugly.

As the individual rights improve in China, hopefully the players' rights will be respected. The Chinese badminton team must treat her players fairer. If Chinese teammates are free to go hard at each other, the CHN vs CHN matches should provide just as much excitement, although understandably short of a LD vs TH duel at their prime. This should also alleviate the urge to water down a competition to avoid CHN/CHN match-ups.

I would urge Chinese badminton to do more to promote the game worldwide. It would be interesting to see of the new Chinese league can help nurturing foreign players as their ping pong league.

It would also be interesting to see if BWF can put its own political baggage behind and work with all sides to bring this great sport forward.

Now, if there will be a "top and most prestigious competition" for 2009, it is time to put it on the schedule and do something about it.

the grande finale would look great at SBP in Ottawa XD...i'd buy so many tickets..lol...
:):):) Bringing the game 2 canada won;t change a single thing look at soccer 4 example it's a global sport everywhere except north america now tell us where it went wrong u can have all the super series there and it still won't change anything accept it or join in
:):):)

On a worldwide scale I think badminton maybe one of the most underdeveloped sports out there. It maybe strong in Asian countries but the talent from both coaching and playing is not as evenly spread as say tennis. I agree that players need to become full time pros with managers for the sport to become developed. China not participting in a tournament is a result of the Association making the decision. I'm sure some of the players individually would have liked to play and could have used the money. So if Badminton follows other sports and individual players are sponsored and have their own managers it will eventually move into being classified as a professional sport. For this to happen there would need to be a huge change to the way Associations are run currently.

I think China is trying to send a strong message to the BWF by withdrawing from 3 consecutive super series, the 2008 SS Final, the 2009 Malaysian SS, and the 2009 Korean SS. Someone in the BWF must have insulted or hurt the feelings of the Chinese. Maybe the change in personnel in the BWF has something to do with it.
i doubt it..
no such thing happened AFAIK;)

hm.... I'm kinda disappointed that China withdrew from the tourney... really, all the reasoning/ excuses i read are not that convincing... too much for the players? i mean, if the SS final would be such a drain for them, why bother participating in all of the SS matches right after OG? for a team whose has been talked about arranging matches, surely China could arrange better schedule to actually have healthy and more prepared players at the SS final.. like wat some of the qualifiers did, like sony.. he has ample time to rest and train since he earned enough for the SS final... so, saying it's been a hard year for the china team, really didnt make any sense as i bet every players is exhausted... and not only for OG year... but please, for the sake of the sports, dont stop your players from competing...

furthermore, if they claim that their local tourneys are more competitive that the international tourney, then china shud just create their own world of badminton and keep on playing among themselves... stop playing for SS... and definitely forget about playing for more olympics. cause with this kind of behaviour, badminton wont last long in olympic. and i believe the fans also dont need that kind of sportsmanship...

remember, this is not gambling... it's a sport where people plays for what they believe in, for their passions... the only great thing for their country to do is to fully support them and not hamper their efforts and hardworks.


peace! :cool:

.
After reading the last few posts, I have to admit that, even at Badminton Central, many of our members here are still considering that our top players and/or nations are BIGGER that our sport itself. :(
...
.
..i think there is a mixture, as the fans, us/BCers will of course have different takes/opinions on this yr's SS Finale. Some do care about the participation or lack of participation from some of the top players. Some don't really care either way (probably will just enjoy the festivities and atmosphere). While some are even "relieved" after learning CHN players are not participating (as brought up in the other thread).
But bottomline, i think badminton and to an extent BWF, is still bigger than those players who've decided to withdraw/not-participate.
As a proof, the SS Grand Finale will still be held.;):cool:
...
How can the "top and most prestigious competition" come to nothing repeatedly and only put together at the last minute? Full credit for the great effort at the end but this is not how it should be done. By the way, where is this "top and most prestigious competition" on the 2009 schedule?

With the Olympics, this has been a particularly draining year for the top players and teams, starting from the start of qualifying period last year. You can't just throw in something at end to extend this grueling season even more. Give the players a break to recuperate, they are the biggest assets of BWF.
...
As the individual rights improve in China, hopefully the players' rights will be respected. The Chinese badminton team must treat her players fairer. If Chinese teammates are free to go hard at each other, the CHN vs CHN matches should provide just as much excitement, although understandably short of a LD vs TH duel at their prime. This should also alleviate the urge to water down a competition to avoid CHN/CHN match-ups.
...
Now, if there will be a "top and most prestigious competition" for 2009, it is time to put it on the schedule and do something about it.
..just to chime in my couple sens on the points above:
- BWF's arrangement/preparation for this SS Finale has been somewhat discussed/brought up in the other thread. From a lack of sponsorship? to a lack of qualified host cities/venues?..As for the scheduled SS Grand Finale in 2009, i've double checked and i don't see it being mentioned/published.:p

- Somewhat concur on the grueling BWF schedule this yr, especially post Olympics. As a proof, many top players, not only from CHN, had been absent due to many reasons (e.g. injuries, doing post-OG invitations etc.).

- Now, on the issue of having individual players participating/not participating in a tourney like this, barring any reason of nursing an injury, I also feel the players should be able to participate even without the blessing of the association. If the association doesn't want to sponsor the players, then the players could incur the cost themselves. In this case, this yr's SS Grand Finale's organizer, if not mistaken, is actually sponsoring the players' participation cost. But i guess, even with that & a bigger prize money as enticements, those are still not enough to attract some of the world's top players.

Btw, a few CHN players also recently withdrew from the upcoming Copenhagen Masters (an invitation type event); thus it shows they are true to their commitment for this winter training and not so much to a pre-notion thinking that they are selecting certain tourneys/events to participate in. As to the reason for the prolonged winter training camp, that only the CHN team knows.

- Last point, the answer would be no. BWF hasn't put anything regarding next yr's SS Grand Finale or "a top and most prestigious competition" on its schedule. I guess they've realized how difficult it is to secure this type of event, thus they've decided not to pre-announce anything. But who knows, they might announce it, but probably at the last minute.:p

.............I guess they've realized how difficult it is to secure this type of event, thus they've decided not to pre-announce anything. But who knows, they might announce it, but probably at the last minute.:p

You might want to add in the word ..... at the last minute again.........;):p:p

Maybe the Chinese team is not confident of doing well in KK. Since the Olympics, their tope seeds (Lin Dan, Xie Xingafang) have not played much, and only been really successful on home ground (HK is considered home gound for the Chinese).

Maybe the Chinese team is not confident of doing well in KK. Since the Olympics, their top seeds (Lin Dan, Xie Xingfang) have not played much, and only been really successful on home ground (HK is considered home ground for the Chinese).



.
matthewteng ... You could be correct because the reason for the Chinese team to skip the 2008 SSF, the 2009 MO and the 2009 KO is for their training.

But from what I see, many of us at Badminton Central are saying that 'WINNING should be of lesser importance than PARTICIPATION'.

Anyway, let's hope that CHN can show us better performances after their training.
If it can help to promote Badminton, I am all for it.

:):):)
.

http://www.badzine.info/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1472:editorial--china-out-of-ss-finals--shooting-itself-in-the-foot-&catid=19:main-feature&Itemid=51



This is a typical article written by people who has no idea about CHN team / system / culture. To be worse, it's just a one sided slapping, without carefully thinking about the other side of the story.

Sure, you can use 10 pages to blast CHN athletes do not deserve this or that treatment within the team, but what about the "OG rules" (yeah, I mentioned that in 2000 threads, and i will continue to mention, until it's changed). You want all the good players to play this open or that final, but at the end, you strip their rights to even participate OG. How strong an argument you can support? At least there's KO or MO every year. But the OG is every 4 years.

Sure, Zhou Mi might only got a Broze in 2004. Ask XXF and XXZ, they did not even get to Athens to play. All they can do is to watch the matches between ranking 50+ players on stage. Ask Chen Yu, this poor guy was never even in the "selection process". If you think CHN got treat unfairly in their team, what you think they face in the "wonderful, honest, fair" "outside world"? :rolleyes:

Wonderful world... :p

If I have $500K and want to set up a tournament in San Jose and want to see LD, TH and LYD play, I can't ask BWF to punish them if they are not interested. Isn't it the organizers' job to find a way to attract the best players? Sure the sponsors may think twice next year before sponsoring this tournament. But if the players don't care, why we care. If there is no SS Final next year, will it hurt badminton? Probably not much as long as there are AE, OG and World Champion that players are eager to win. Just like Tennis Master Cup, most top players want to take a rest at the end of the year - end up making excuse or just treat it as an exhibition.

Personally I believe that the decision to withdraw all of the Chinese players from the SS finals is disgraceful and the Chines Badminton Federation should be fined a large sum of money.

There should be no penalties imposed upon the players as they are clearly under orders.

Whn the SS were set up some 2 years or more ago it was well advertised at the time that it was the intention to hold the 12 events followed by a Final involving the top players.

A major sponsor was found by BWF and they financed the first 6 events of the 2007 SS events. For reasons unknown to me they pulled out without much notice leaving BWF with a decision to make.

1. Continue with the other 6 events paying the prize money to players from BWF funds while seeking to find a further sponsor.

2. Scrap the events

BWF took the decision to hold the rest of the events durring 2007 as much of the preliminary work had already been done by the respective Federations towards organising the Events. However a decision was made to not hold the 2007 SS Finals.

A the start of the 2008 year BWF once again funded the first few of the SS Events and continued to seek a major sponsor for the rest of the year and the subsequent SS Finals.

Presumably a sponsor was found and part of the reason why a sponsor was found was that the World's top players would be taking part i.e. including the Chinese players who have qualified.

Can you imagine that this sponsor would have agreed to provide the funds withot the Chinese taking part?? I cannot.

Given that the Chinese Federation must have known what was going to be expected of their players well before the withdrawal of the team and to leave the decision to pull out until the last minute is disrespectful to BWF and other players who have been asked to complete at the last minute.

Choo Wong Hann from Malaysia was winning a European circuit in Italy on Friday and suddenly finds that he has to be back in Malaysia by Tuesday as he has now qualified to take part in the SS!!!!!!!!!!!! Great preparation.

The Chinese Federation cannot even come up with the excuse of lack of funds as BWF were going to pay Air Fares etc to all competitors who attend the event.

If I have $500K and want to set up a tournament in San Jose and want to see LD, TH and LYD play, I can't ask BWF to punish them if they are not interested. Isn't it the organizers' job to find a way to attract the best players? Sure the sponsors may think twice next year before sponsoring this tournament. But if the players don't care, why we care.

The problem is not that the players don't care....its the national association that "don't care" and decree that none of their player should participates. Big difference there.

Be fair, people. Neither BWF nor the Chinese Team is blameless here.

You can't just demand Chinese Team participation while scheming to death to limit their success. Switch position and see how you feel. Talk about respect :confused:

While I think the Chinese team should make a better effort to attend, given that most players are either more-or-less injured or already going into shut-down mode, avoiding further injury is not an unreasonable explanation.

Winter training is a long time tradition for Chinese athletes. It is not an excuse in any way. Their participation during this period is more exception than the rule.

As I said, if the grand finale is so damned important, put it on the table early and work towards it. Don't make it a last minute thing. How respectful does it look? Also, either make this a paid vacation with some exhibition matches or make this a proper competition with big money and ranking points.

Personally I believe that the decision to withdraw all of the Chinese players from the SS finals is disgraceful and the Chines Badminton Federation should be fined a large sum of money.

There should be no penalties imposed upon the players as they are clearly under orders.


There is a system of fining players/authorities for late withdrawals. Has CHN broken these rules. If not I cannot see how they can be punished. They are not compelled to competing in these events - it is optional.

As for the badzine article I tend to agree with LB partially. The article is one sided. As I and we have mentioned over and over badminton is a subsidised sport wherby governments/businesses support players with funding to train, live & play. If they decide not to fund these people then the players cannot play. The chinese players are tremendous athletes & the best players as badzine states, but who made them this - the CBA and authoritarian as it may be they have the right to not enter them and/or pull out.

Until badminton offers prize money or individuals can get personal sponsorships to control their own affairs we will just keep discussing these things.

why don't they just put the WC back in Bi-annual and use that space to put the grand final every other year, that way it still makes it more prestigious, and at the same time, create space for it with plenty of notice and time for athletes to prepare and train =\

Instead of holding a grand finale, spend the money on a goodwill tour of top players and local players to various parts of world. This will do more to promote the game than holding another tournament in places where badminton is already popular.

This would also demand extra efforts from the players. But the benefits should be easy to understand for players, associations, and sponsors.

I don't even understand how it can make badminton more popular by having this so-called big event SSF???

The event is hosted in Asia, only broadcasted in Asia(may be Denmark, but that's about it)...
Other oversea fans have to watch it through livestream or download... so if you are not already a fan of badminton(oversea), you are not going to go through all of that trouble, just to watch something that you are not already interested in, right???:confused::confused::confused:

So people who blame China for not helping to make badminton more popular by competing in this event are just looking for an excuse to bad mouth China as usual... This event is not going to make badminton any more popular outside of Asia at all. China can even send Li YongBo to compete in this event, and it is not going to make any difference to anybody who is not already a fan of badminton.

Badminton will forever remain as an Asian sport, unless they actually do something to change its image from being a sissy sport to a mainstream sport whether you people like it or not.

If you don't believe me, just ask people from some European countries(except Denmark), any African, and any North/South American countries, how they feel about a badminton player with say a football player.:rolleyes:

For the ppl who's yelling their lungs out about "CHN not promoting badminton", and asking LYB / BWF, etc to learn from basketball, tennis, etc...

Let me ask you, did you voice your concern when almost no top tennis stars care about playing OG tennis, simply because there's no $$$ and no ranking point awarded? Did you blame Kobe, KG, etc who previously decide not to play for Team USA, because they are married, being sued, injured, not interested, busy doing their own trade, etc? :rolleyes:

So, if the mega stars in other sports can pick and choose (so do their coaches, as the NBA coaches blame their stars are worned out or even injuried during international basketball), then why CHN is single handed being picked here for not participate in certain events? :rolleyes: If other sports stars carefully value their own interests over others, why CHN badminton team has to be judged by the god standard?

Personally I believe that the decision to withdraw all of the Chinese players from the SS finals is disgraceful and the Chines Badminton Federation should be fined a large sum of money.




I never heard any tennis stars or basketball stars being fined, if they decide not to participate in OG (which offers no ranking point or $$$, and have a chance to be injured and put their $$$ contract and career on the line), for example. So, why you want to fine CHN?

I never heard tennis fans blaming xxx or yyy about how they "not promoting tennis" (in OG) despite being world rank top 10. Remember, promoting a sports take everyone's effort, not 1 player, 1 team or 1 event. :cool:

This is a typical article written by people who has no idea about CHN team / system / culture. To be worse, it's just a one sided slapping, without carefully thinking about the other side of the story.

Sure, you can use 10 pages to blast CHN athletes do not deserve this or that treatment within the team, but what about the "OG rules" (yeah, I mentioned that in 2000 threads, and i will continue to mention, until it's changed). You want all the good players to play this open or that final, but at the end, you strip their rights to even participate OG. How strong an argument you can support? At least there's KO or MO every year. But the OG is every 4 years.

Sure, Zhou Mi might only got a Broze in 2004. Ask XXF and XXZ, they did not even get to Athens to play. All they can do is to watch the matches between ranking 50+ players on stage. Ask Chen Yu, this poor guy was never even in the "selection process". If you think CHN got treat unfairly in their team, what you think they face in the "wonderful, honest, fair" "outside world"? :rolleyes:

Wonderful world... :p

CHN has no problem in Table Tennis...also US or Rusia has no problem with 2 ppl max in ice skating/Boxing....for OG...China has the most participants in Badminton compare to others who can field 1 but cant firled 2, let alone 3 players...it is not ony China, Mas and INA has suffered also but they accepted the rules in OG...why cant CHN accept the rule also?.,.US/Aus/Rus are strong in swimming...they accept the rule of max of 2 swimmers...pls think about it...again as I mentioned..CHN is also responsible to promote the sport like others ( INA/MAS/DEN/KOR), at least to show their support.
Again..do you think CHN is the only country that his players train all the time?...KOR/INA/MAS/HKG have his shuttlers train hard...(ZM is one of example...how many tournaments that she has played this year?)

Sometimes, we have to accept the rules...I do not see CHN complaining it in Table Tennis...they win it all the time....I do not see CHN cancelling its players at the recent WC as well ( take a look at the schedukle of Table Tennis)...I do not see any long training for CHN table tennis players either.

Can you imagine if LI NIng is the sponsor for this SSF in China and certian country pull out also?....how does Li Ning, as sponsor feel? or CHN as a host feel ?....please think about it too...in this current economic situation, sponsoring a tournament with US$ 500K is not easy...we should be grateful....

At the end, all badminton powerhouse should show support and help badminton grow...it is good for everybody.

Also I think the winter training starts at Dec 20..it should not be a problem if some players are late for few days after attending SSF..I just wished CHN, at least, send some of them..

Given that the Chinese Federation must have known what was going to be expected of their players well before the withdrawal of the team and to leave the decision to pull out until the last minute is disrespectful to BWF and other players who have been asked to complete at the last minute.

Use your same tone, and try to read this:

Given that the BWF must have known who was a better player, well before OG, and leave the ranking 70 or even 100 players on stage, but kicking out players like XXF, XXZ, CH, CY, WYH, WL, ZTT, etc from OG participation list, is very dispectful for the players, their respect teams, and the sports in general. :mad:

I never heard any tennis stars or basketball stars being fined, if they decide not to participate in OG (which offers no ranking point or $$$, and have a chance to be injured and put their $$$ contract and career on the line), for example. So, why you want to fine CHN?

I never heard tennis fans blaming xxx or yyy about how they "not promoting tennis" (in OG) despite being world rank top 10. Remember, promoting a sports take everyone's effort, not 1 player, 1 team or 1 event. :cool:
I agree that BWF cant fine CBA.....

I don't even understand how it can make badminton more popular by having this so-called big event SSF???

The event is hosted in Asia, only broadcasted in Asia(may be Denmark, but that's about it)...
Other oversea fans have to watch it through livestream or download... so if you are not already a fan of badminton(oversea), you are not going to go through all of that trouble, just to watch something that you are not already interested in, right???:confused::confused::confused:

So people who blame China for not helping to make badminton more popular by competing in this event are just looking for an excuse to bad mouth China as usual... This event is not going to make badminton any more popular outside of Asia at all. China can even send Li YongBo to compete in this event, and it is not going to make any difference to anybody who is not already a fan of badminton.

Badminton will forever remain as an Asian sport, unless they actually do something to change its image from being a sissy sport to a mainstream sport whether you people like it or not.

If you don't believe me, just ask people from some European countries(except Denmark), any African, and any North/South American countries, how they feel about a badminton player with say a football player.:rolleyes:

It is true and sad that Badminton is known as Asian sport...but also remember that PingPong is also known as Asian sport too but somehow is popular , even in South America/Central America...and prize money is not as big as in Badminton..all of us should help promote this sport..some take longer time than others...

CHN has no problem in Table Tennis...also US or Rusia has no problem with 2 ppl max in ice skating/Boxing....for OG...China has the most participants in Badminton compare to others who can field 1 but cant firled 2, let alone 3 players...it is not ony China, Mas and INA has suffered also but they accepted the rules in OG...why cant CHN accept the rule also?.,.US/Aus/Rus are strong in swimming...they accept the rule of max of 2 swimmers...pls think about it...again as I mentioned..CHN is also responsible to promote the sport like others ( INA/MAS/DEN/KOR), at least to show their support.
Again..do you think CHN is the only country that his players train all the time?...KOR/INA/MAS/HKG have his shuttlers train hard...(ZM is one of example...how many tournaments that she has played this year?)

Sometimes, we have to accept the rules...I do not see CHN complaining it in Table Tennis...they win it all the time....I do not see CHN cancelling its players at the recent WC as well ( take a look at the schedukle of Table Tennis)...I do not see any long training for CHN table tennis players either.

Can you imagine if LI NIng is the sponsor for this SSF in China and certian country pull out also?....how does Li Ning, as sponsor feel? or CHN as a host feel ?....please think about it too...in this current economic situation, sponsoring a tournament with US$ 500K is not easy...we should be grateful....

At the end, all badminton powerhouse should show support and help badminton grow...it is good for everybody.


For over 2000 times, I never said CHN is the only victim of the OG rules. Thanks for your example, now we know even more. So, isn't that's exactly the point I am trying to give, as such rules should be removed, if that impact such a lot of players / teams, and in such many sports? :rolleyes:

Remember, if a victim decides to shut his mouth, and swallow the pain for whatever reason, does NOT mean the crime never happens. You might be ok with the rule, but others might not. Yeah, you can mention that whatever team (in badminton) also got effected, but clearly, CHN got the most impact at least for the recent OGs. I can not remember any other team, have their WC champion and runner up and 1 or 2 top 10 players / pairs being shut out of the OG in recent years.

Yeah, we should feel great if we can attract more sponsorship. However, the players / teams are not slaves. If they do not feel like to participate (whether by a vote, or 1 person's voice), they have the rights to do so. You can not use 1 team to compare to another. Same as i do not want to use team CHN's recent years of success to poke others nerves.

Again, if we do not blame mega stars from tennis or basketball to not participate OG, why do we have rights to blame the badminton players for any given event? :rolleyes:

The Chinese Federation cannot even come up with the excuse of lack of funds as BWF were going to pay Air Fares etc to all competitors who attend the event.


This is getting ridiculous.

So, if I tell Kobe, KG, LBJ that I can pay for their air fare to play my local club tournament, they have to show up? Because, they have tons of $$$, and they need to help to promote basketball as a sport? If they do not, I can fine their NBA teams, blasting them on internet, as they did not "take the responsibility"??? :eek:

Having $$$ is 1 thing, how to spend it or whether to spend it on task x or y or z, it's none of your business, right? :cool:

For over 2000 times, I never said CHN is the only victim of the OG rules. Thanks for your example, now we know even more. So, isn't that's exactly the point I am trying to give, as such rules should be removed, if that impact such a lot of players / teams, and in such many sports? :rolleyes:

Remember, if a victim decides to shut his mouth, and swallow the pain for whatever reason, does NOT mean the crime never happens. You might be ok with the rule, but others might not. Yeah, you can mention that whatever team (in badminton) also got effected, but clearly, CHN got the most impact at least for the recent OGs. I can not remember any other team, have their WC champion and runner up and 1 or 2 top 10 players / pairs being shut out of the OG in recent years.

Yeah, we should feel great if we can attract more sponsorship. However, the players / teams are not slaves. If they do not feel like to participate (whether by a vote, or 1 person's voice), they have the rights to do so. You can not use 1 team to compare to another. Same as i do not want to use team CHN's recent years of success to poke others nerves.

Again, if we do not blame mega stars from tennis or basketball to not participate OG, why do we have rights to blame the badminton players for any given event? :rolleyes:

Actually some of CH Ntable tennis players do get shut out, like you mentioned, after nwinning WC or even National champion...we all know that Olympic is originally, intended for frienship...if you say CHN get the most affected, I did not agree...US/RUS also get affected also on others sports...if CHN really get the most affected , how can CHN has the most GOLD medal in recent OG?:rolleyes:

For over 2000 times, I never said CHN is the only victim of the OG rules. Thanks for your example, now we know even more. So, isn't that's exactly the point I am trying to give, as such rules should be removed, if that impact such a lot of players / teams, and in such many sports? :rolleyes:

.Again, if we do not blame mega stars from tennis or basketball to not participate OG, why do we have rights to blame the badminton players for any given event? :rolleyes:

But you always mention chinese players name all the time as victims in this thread.. in WS, INA or KOR has 1 only, Firdasari/HWY or Simon cant even compete in OG...remember CHN has 3 WS/MS/WD, so how come CHN is the most affected because of OG rule...

Instead of holding a grand finale, spend the money on a goodwill tour of top players and local players to various parts of world. This will do more to promote the game than holding another tournament in places where badminton is already popular.

This would also demand extra efforts from the players. But the benefits should be easy to understand for players, associations, and sponsors.



.
RedShuttle ... It's a great idea to organise a Badminton goodwill tour to various parts of the world.

IMHO, the reality is:
(1) National players: They play Badminton because they enjoy it. They would probably wish to share their enjoyment with the rest of the world.
(2) National associations: They are formed to support their national teams and to promote their home Badminton. They would probably not support a goodwill tour if it is not played at their own home grounds.
(3) Sponsors: As long as they can get exposure, they would probably be willing to fund the tour.
(4) Spectators: They would be looking forward to watch higher quality live matches.

So in my opinion, a Badminton goodwill tour would most likely be supported by players, sponsors and spectators, but not by national associations, unless the tour is played at their home grounds.

This is only from my own observations.

:):):)
.

I hope that we do not talk about OG rule here...as a matter of fact, CHN got the most benefits out of it as a OG host...as a host, CHN got so many exemptions to filed its players on some sports that they are not good at it...form running to boxing...even in tennis, CHN could field 4 men singles while others could have max of 3....I do not see CHN as a victim here due to OG rule....

Anyway, we are all badminton lovers...lets promote this sport and help BWF to make it as popular as Table Tennis....

Anyway, we are all badminton lovers...lets promote this sport and help BWF to make it as popular as Table Tennis....



.
Agree totally. We should support Badminton in general, not just supporting a player, a team or a nation that we love.

Sometimes, some of us are treating Badminton so much smaller than the player, the team or the nation that we support, that I wonder if we really love Badminton at all.
.

... Also, either make this a paid vacation with some exhibition matches or make this a proper competition with big money and ranking points.
..i believe out of those items, most of the issues have been addressed (2 out of 3).
- Yes, it's essentially a paid vacation with exhibition matches (see below, i don't know if it doesn't get any more "FREE" than this).
- Yes, it's a "Proper" competition (at least it's BWF sanctioned) with "big" (at least it's bigger than before) money prize (for the winners).
- Unfortunately, there are no ranking points; thus making it more like an exhibition/invitational event.

Here are some references, unless otherwise amended:
http://www.badmintoncentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=61269&page=16 (post #272)
http://internationalbadminton.org/Key.pdf
http://www.internationalbadminton.org/Super%20Series%20Final/index.html
http://www.internationalbadminton.org/Super%20Series%20Final/Super%20Series%20Finals%20-%20Overview%20-%20%20Information.doc
http://www.internationalbadminton.org/Super%20Series%20Final/Super%20Series%20Finals%20-%20Over%20Information%202.doc

Invited Players

All invited players will get the following:

o airfare (economy class) provided
o free hotel accommodation
o transport to and from the airport and to the competition venue
o a daily allowance
o a chance to compete for a price pool of US$500,000
why don't they just put the WC back in Bi-annual and use that space to put the grand final every other year, that way it still makes it more prestigious, and at the same time, create space for it with plenty of notice and time for athletes to prepare and train =\
...that's quite possible. Heck, instead of every two yrs, let's assign this SS Grand Finale to a once every three yr event; it'll make it more prestigious while at the same time will give ample time for BWF to find sponsors and a place/host city.. ;):cool:

This is getting ridiculous.

So, if I tell Kobe, KG, LBJ that I can pay for their air fare to play my local club tournament, they have to show up? Because, they have tons of $$$, and they need to help to promote basketball as a sport? If they do not, I can fine their NBA teams, blasting them on internet, as they did not "take the responsibility"??? :eek:

Having $$$ is 1 thing, how to spend it or whether to spend it on task x or y or z, it's none of your business, right? :cool:

But in this instance, you can't even ask KG, LBJ or Kobe since the Natl.Association already put their foot down and said no.

And yes, there're lots of disgrace, finger pointing and whatever you want to call it when team USA "falls" from grace since some of the best NBA players choose to opt out from participating. Why else do you think the OG 08 squad is pretty much loaded with all the top-ranked stars... multi-millionaires who all "graciously" spent the summer months practicing for the event?

Unfortunately, there's no ranking points; thus making it more like an exhibition/invitational event.



.
IMHO, there should be no ranking points given at any event where most players cannot participate/qualify.

If the SSF were to give ranking points, then many players, who are unable to participate/qualify, would suffer dearly.

It's like 'The rich get richer and the poor get poorer'.

:):):)
.

Anyway, we are all badminton lovers...lets promote this sport and help BWF to make it as popular as Table Tennis....



.
Agree totally. We should support Badminton in general, not just supporting a player, a team or a nation.

Sometimes, some of us are treating Badminton smaller than the player, the team or the nation that we support.

And I wonder if we really love Badminton at all.
.

I never heard any tennis stars or basketball stars being fined, if they decide not to participate in OG (which offers no ranking point or $$$, and have a chance to be injured and put their $$$ contract and career on the line), for example. So, why you want to fine CHN?

I never heard tennis fans blaming xxx or yyy about how they "not promoting tennis" (in OG) despite being world rank top 10. Remember, promoting a sports take everyone's effort, not 1 player, 1 team or 1 event. :cool:

CHN and any nations has the right to or not to participate, it is a free world...knowing that LD and company are not in, if I am flying to KK to watch, I would not do it...if I happen to be in KK, I might simply for the love of the sport. LD and the bevy of female players ;) to me is the attraction of SSF, I would pay to watch LD, LCW and TH play. Sure baddy is bigger than CHN, baddy has endured and survived long before CHN rejoin BWF, but baddy is so much better of with CHN blessing us with ZJH, SJ, DJ, LD and their lady players...as for penalizing CHN restricting the # of players, BWF concludes dominance cannot grow the sport...like ping pong, same players restriction rules applies and the ping pong ball was increased in size after Liu Ko Liang won the last OG, to slow the game down so that other nations can compete against CHN...but guess what, CHN still prevails and clean OG, while the rest of the world has the same ancient player lineups like Samsonov, Kreanger, Timo and the same female players while CHN has a young Wang Hui, Ma Long and a whopper lists of fantastic female players....talking about 'respect' in your earlier posts, I think the world has so much respect and 'fear' for CHN that to able to compete against CHN need rules to hold her back a little...out it this way, CHN is simply too good...now, you can't blame a ticket paying fan wanting to see the best and the best now is LD.;)

But you always mention chinese players name all the time as victims in this thread.. in WS, INA or KOR has 1 only, Firdasari/HWY or Simon cant even compete in OG...remember CHN has 3 WS/MS/WD, so how come CHN is the most affected because of OG rule...
INA and KOR just have 1 participant and you said that INA and KOR are victims?????? LOL LOL LOL....
if INA and KOR have 7 good players and cannot qualified u also said that it's a victim???? what a comment from you sir:confused::confused::confused:
CHN has 3 WS and 3 WD but how about CHN WS and WD no 4 are their skills not good enough to go to olympic???
I hope that we do not talk about OG rule here...as a matter of fact, CHN got the most benefits out of it as a OG host...as a host, CHN got so many exemptions to filed its players on some sports that they are not good at it...form running to boxing...even in tennis, CHN could field 4 men singles while others could have max of 3....I do not see CHN as a victim here due to OG rule....


Anyway, we are all badminton lovers...lets promote this sport and help BWF to make it as popular as Table Tennis....
if tennis can allow 4 players to play in olympic??? than why badminton cannot??? sick of Chinese domination????? look at table tennis... they are dominating more than in badminton but the sport still can be pupular??? why badminton cannot??? it's a double standart .....


AFTER ALL... I"M SO HAPPY THAT CHINESE TEAM not coming to this Super series Grand Final....
it's ENOUGH for Quota limitation rule in OLYMPICS AND WC.... not in Super series final.....

LD's real happy not to have to play LCW since LD would not have enough escorts in SSF.
Lady,,, u should be happy here coz there will be no CHN match fixing again..

INA and KOR just have 1 participant and you said that INA and KOR are victims?????? LOL LOL LOL....
if INA and KOR have 7 good players and cannot qualified u also said that it's a victim???? what a comment from you sir:confused::confused::confused:
CHN has 3 WS and 3 WD but how about CHN WS and WD no 4 are their skills not good enough to go to olympic???

if tennis can allow 4 players to play in olympic??? than why badminton cannot??? sick of Chinese domination????? look at table tennis... they are dominating more than in badminton but the sport still can be pupular??? why badminton cannot??? it's a double standart .....


AFTER ALL... I"M SO HAPPY THAT CHINESE TEAM not coming to this Super series Grand Final....
it's ENOUGH for Quota limitation rule in OLYMPICS AND WC.... not in Super series final.....

What are you talking about?? Look at the previous posts...they said that CHN is victim of this rule....
In Tennis, only CHN can have 4 players, the rest can have 3...anyway..CHN has the most participants in badminton...

What are you talking about?? Look at the previous posts...they said that CHN is victim of this rule....
In Tennis, only CHN can have 4 players, the rest can have 3...anyway..CHN has the most participants in badminton...
wow... look at the beijing official website:
WS tennis
Gold ELENA DEMENTIEVA
silver Dinara safina
Bronze Vera zvonareva...

plus Svetlana kuznetsova ( lost to LI NA in 2nd round)

is that just three????

only CHINA can have 4 players??? LOL:p:p

.........

Again, if we do not blame mega stars from tennis or basketball to not participate OG, why do we have rights to blame the badminton players for any given event? :rolleyes:

hmm, since this is a badminton forum, how would one know if ppl did not "blame mega stars from tennis or basketball "on the OG thingy ?? There's a thread on tennis in the chit chat section, that's abt it. Unless you actively follow the tennis/basketball forums too ;)
Even I'm not a tennis/basketball fan, I've read were some critical articles to that effect.

In terms of China, as you know very well, it's the association that said no, not the individual players. The players could had wanted to come, that's the difference.
AND the fact that press put it as slap to BWF's face or snubbing BWF, depending on which press one reads.

What are you talking about?? Look at the previous posts...they said that CHN is victim of this rule....
In Tennis, only CHN can have 4 players, the rest can have 3...anyway..CHN has the most participants in badminton...
it becoz they deserved it....
should be more than 3 players for CHINA....
if INA or KOR cannot reach maximum 3 players in quota limitation then why you use INA and KOR women singles ,,, also SIMON SANTOSO as example of victim to???

it becoz they deserved it....
should be more than 3 players for CHINA....
if INA or KOR cannot reach maximum 3 players in quota limitation then why you use INA and KOR women singles ,,, also SIMON SANTOSO as example of victim to???

... due to the 2 player limit - only 2 players from each country if in top 16. Simon S was in top 16 but Indonesia had 3 MS in top 16, could only choose 2. Sony K & Taufik were chosen, so........ Simon have to wait for 2012.
Msia also had same problem with 3 MD pairs in top 16, only 2 could go.
They qualified, but quota limitation, i.e. other countries also effected by this rule. Please read thru the OG 2008 thread 1st

3 players quota only if they're ranked top 4 at the end of the OG qualifying period.

Btw, as for your reply in #112, Huang mentioned 4 men's singles max for CHina in post 102, not women's singles. Elena should be a lady right? hehe

Tennis playing character is different with badminton playing.
Almost all Single Tennis players can play as Double players. Williams sisters and Roger Federer failed in Single then they got gold medal in double.

If Badminton followed the Tennis to allow 4 Single players in nation, the number of players will be increase exception LD, CJ, LCW, TH also play in Double.

Every sport has different way
Remember, XD held only in badminton

Table tennis didn't hold double in Beijing but added team's event. They ever held controversy rule too, in past OG they only limited 2 players in every nation and placed in same part of draw. Wth if the rule was happened in badminton.

... due to the 2 player limit - only 2 players from each country if in top 16. Simon S was in top 16 but Indonesia had 3 MS in top 16, could only choose 2. Sony K & Taufik were chosen, so........ Simon have to wait for 2012.
Msia also had same problem with 3 MD pairs in top 16, only 2 could go.
They qualified, but quota limitation, i.e. other countries also effected by this rule. Please read thru the OG 2008 thread 1st

3 players quota only if they're ranked top 4 at the end of the OG qualifying period.
wahhhh sorry sir but u don't understand what i meant...
they are not qualified becoz they cannot reach the world top 4 rank,,, and he uses this as an example of victim???
it's not same with China WS coz china has 4 ws in top 4 rank..
why Simon and all INA players cannot reach top 4 position and go to olympic??? blame China ??? or said that we're same with china as a victim or said that SIMON is a victim too???? SIMON is not a victim coz he can go to olympic if He and the others countryman stand in top 4...
meanwhile in WS Zhu Lin cannot go becoz the limitation rules. even she stay in top 4 rank,,,
u see the different now???
if they cannot go to olympic when they're in top4 is called VICTIM,, but
if they cannot go to olympic coz they were out from top 4 rank is not VICTIM,, but lack of good result to stay in top rank...

What are you talking about?? Look at the previous posts...they said that CHN is victim of this rule....
In Tennis, only CHN can have 4 players, the rest can have 3...anyway..CHN has the most participants in badminton...

... due to the 2 player limit - only 2 players from each country if in top 16. Simon S was in top 16 but Indonesia had 3 MS in top 16, could only choose 2. Sony K & Taufik were chosen, so........ Simon have to wait for 2012.
Msia also had same problem with 3 MD pairs in top 16, only 2 could go.
They qualified, but quota limitation, i.e. other countries also effected by this rule. Please read thru the OG 2008 thread 1st

3 players quota only if they're ranked top 4 at the end of the OG qualifying period.

Btw, as for your reply in #112, Huang mentioned 4 men's singles max for CHina in post 102, not women's singles. Elena should be a lady right? hehe
hmmm
sir,, You and Huangkwokhau should read carefully before spread Gossip here,,, in tennis
http://results.beijing2008.cn/WRM/ENG/Schedule/TE.shtml
look at that page and you will find that not only china can have 4 representatives..
SPAIN:
1. Rafael NADAL
2. David FERRER
3. Nicholas ALMAGRO
4. Tommy ROBREDO
also RUSSIA :
1. Dimitry TURSUNOV
2. Nicolay DAVIDENKO
3. Mikhail YOUZHNY
4. Igor ANDREEV

what u wanna say now???? just China can have 3 players ??
LOL:p:p:p

This is getting a little off topic.

Of course the Olympic host has the privilege to have free passes to OG in many sports. This has nothing to do with China and even less to do with badminton.

The extra spots for China in OG badminton were hard earned. The same opportunity was there for all nations.

..sorry, i don't mean to get tangled up here but i'm a bit confused with the last few off-topic posts. I may be wrong, but from what i can digest from LazyBuddy's and Hau-ge's bantering (which both had brought up before), they are discussing about the "fair treatment" of CHN's team:

LazyBuddy's point of contention :
- Feels CHN is being short-changed in the recent Olympics Games (2004 & 2008) pointing to some of their players not being included in the Olympics squad.
- Wants more representation, esp. in badminton. Why put a limit?
- Argues & contends the Olympics rulings are the main reason.

Hau-ge's point of contention :
- Feels CHN, esp. in this yr's Olympics, has gotten more than what it deserved even more than any other countries.
- He is basing CHN's **overall** Olympics representation this yr, which is more than any other country, as a sign that they've been treated "fairly"; he brought up tennis & other sports as examples (he might not know the exact details, but i believe he's referring to them **in general**). Their overall Gold medal tally reflects it all (which also can be argued that they did deserve them not because of how many athletes they had but how well they performed).
- Defends the Olympics qualifying rulings.

and

Ajaib's point of contention : ??? :confused:

Btw, regarding the BWF/IBF's qualification ruling for this yr's Olympics, it had been set in stone since 2005. Every country knew it but yes, CHN deserved it as they were able to secure 3 MS in the top 4. News below:
http://www.badmintoncentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24375 ;)

Btw, regarding the BWF/IBF's qualification ruling for this yr's Olympics, it had been set in stone since 2005. Every country knew it but yes, CHN deserved it as they were able to secure 3 MS in the top 4.



.
Anyway, if winning is our only objective in our Olympic Games, then the reason to hold our Olympics would be lost.
.

This is beginning to resemble one of the umpteen discussions of August 2008.
Could we steer this back to Kota Kinabalu and the Super Series Final? :p

..i'd have to say the aim is for friendship, camaraderie, sportsmanships......But then of course, there come a bevy of other reasons: making money/marketing/doing advertisement.....winning medals...and making more money after an athlete wins a Gold medal.....
This is beginning to resemble one of the umpteen discussions of August 2008.
Could we steer this back to Kota Kinabalu and the Super Series Final? :p
..agree (although i wasn't around much, in BC, during that period)..:p

i think this thread is getting hotter and hotter now..
lets have peace here..:cool:
or else, the mod or kwun will do something about it i believe..:rolleyes:

hmmm
sir,, You and Huangkwokhau should read carefully before spread Gossip here,,, in tennis
http://results.beijing2008.cn/WRM/ENG/Schedule/TE.shtml
look at that page and you will find that not only china can have 4 representatives....


what u wanna say now???? just China can have 3 players ??
LOL:p:p:p

That's for you & Huang to banter about, since I'm not tennis fan ;);), I was just refering that particular post. And.. we are getting off topic since the last 2 pages. THe OG qualification, etc have been discussed numerous times in the 2008 OG threads.

Same goes with the quota limit, whether 2 from top 16, or 3 from top 4, somebody didnt get to go due to the limit per country ruling, while those WR >50 got to go. How is it then top 4 is victim, top 16 dont get to go not victim? They still got effected by this rule.
China XD, Xie/Zhang Yawen didnt get to go due to the 2 in top 16 rule. THey didnt make it to top 4, after slogging so hard, missed by just by 1 placing (5th).

We do need to get back to this SS finals, hehe. Good to see Taufik's coming.

I hope that we do not talk about OG rule here...as a matter of fact, CHN got the most benefits out of it as a OG host...as a host, CHN got so many exemptions to filed its players on some sports that they are not good at it...form running to boxing...even in tennis, CHN could field 4 men singles while others could have max of 3....I do not see CHN as a victim here due to OG rule....

Anyway, we are all badminton lovers...lets promote this sport and help BWF to make it as popular as Table Tennis....

I believe badminton is more popular than table tennis in the world.

In China, where TT has been known as the "National Ball", more and more people are becoming badminton fans, while TT's popularity is in decline (only old people and kids love to play TT). In my chinese university, undergraduate students like playing basketball and football, while postgraduate students and teachers love to play badminton. Badminton is also very popular among Chinese white collar workers.

When I was studying in UK, a lot of people play badminton everyweek, it's not easy to book a court (4 courts in total) on evening sessions, while very few play TT, only one TT table.

And I am very optimistic that badminton will never be kicked out of Olympics, no matter what. I think badminton is among the top 20 safe sports in OG. The sports in danger are taewondo, modern pentathlon and esquestrian(dressage).

.
Anyway, if winning is our only objective in our Olympic Games, then the reason to hold our Olympics would be lost.
.
The Olympic motto is "higher, faster, stronger". That sounds like winning to me.

Some opinions in this thread may be a little extreme. They serve to balance the equally extreme opinions of the Badzine editorial.

Badzine is doing a great job for badminton. However, that editorial is too one sided.

Alright then, "kinder, gentler, friendlier".

Read the thread's title before you post.
And stay off the Olympics, please :(

But in this instance, you can't even ask KG, LBJ or Kobe since the Natl.Association already put their foot down and said no.




They are not related to their National Association. I assume they are contracted to their team - I doubt their team would let them go either.

China players are contracted to their National Association in the same way.

The BWF are at fault also here as their rules stipulate that the national association must approve a player wishing to represent its country in a tournament - Thus BWF recognises that Any National associations have executive power over any player. If there was not this rule then any players who rebelled and wanted to play would be able too as they could enter themselves.

But in this instance, you can't even ask KG, LBJ or Kobe since the Natl.Association already put their foot down and said no.



Not try to going into an off topic, but... :D

Why NBA says no? Because they evaluate their business (players' performance and health in THEIR OWN games) over other things. So, there you go. If that organization has every rights to evaluate what's "good" or "bad" for their players, why CHN team can NOT do so? :rolleyes:

now, you can't blame a ticket paying fan wanting to see the best and the best now is LD.;)


Ok, then I want to ask, if BWF really want to see the best and the best, why SSF has limited entries per nation? If the event is setup purely to promote the sport and purely based on individual, why it limited the entries? In that way, players like BCL can not participate. If you go with current ranking, CHN should field 4 in WS, instead of 2 in SSF. Aren't they are better players? Do you just said you want to see the best? Then, why settle for the less simply because of the flags? :eek::confused:

Given that the Chinese Federation must have known what was going to be expected of their players well before the withdrawal of the team and to leave the decision to pull out until the last minute is disrespectful to BWF and other players who have been asked to complete at the last minute.

Choo Wong Hann from Malaysia was winning a European circuit in Italy on Friday and suddenly finds that he has to be back in Malaysia by Tuesday as he has now qualified to take part in the SS!!!!!!!!!!!! Great preparation.

The Chinese Federation cannot even come up with the excuse of lack of funds as BWF were going to pay Air Fares etc to all competitors who attend the event.


If I am WCH, I will be very happy, consdier now I have much better chance to compete for the grand prize, to face players like NG, or Smith, but not CJ or LD. I will be very happy with my chance to receive a nice pay check, with much less sweat.

Just as some OG players. Do they curse XXF, XXZ, CY, etc, because now they have to play OG, to sweat, to be booted out of the 1st round? Or, do they laugh and cry in joy, and jumping up and down to be given a chance to perform? :rolleyes:

Note: no offense for any players listed above. I am just stating the fact that their performance level is not on the par of LD, CJ, XXF, XXZ, etc

Ok, then I want to ask, if BWF really want to see the best and the best, why SSF has limited entries per nation? If the event is setup purely to promote the sport and purely based on individual, why it limited the entries? In that way, players like BCL can not participate. If you go with current ranking, CHN should field 4 in WS, instead of 2 in SSF. Aren't they are better players? Do you just said you want to see the best? Then, why settle for the less simply because of the flags? :eek::confused:

My question is if the quota rules for the SS Finals were set when this event was conceived (someone had mentioned 2005 earlier in this thread but I can't remember), did CHN not work with the BWF towards finding an equitable solution? Right or wrong, it just paints CHN badminton in a bad light to pull this stunt this late. Regardless of their intentions, perceptions are often stronger than the truth.

Not try to going into an off topic, but... :D

Why NBA says no? Because they evaluate their business (players' performance and health in THEIR OWN games) over other things. So, there you go. If that organization has every rights to evaluate what's "good" or "bad" for their players, why CHN team can NOT do so? :rolleyes:

You misunderstood what I'm trying to say. I was using your example of NBA players but substitute NBA with Chinese Badminton Federation. You can't even ask or let the players decide for themselves since the Federation already put their feet down and saind "NO".

And no, NBA doesn't have any restriction for players to represent their country. Stern loved seeing high-flying NBA stars dominate the competition in international venue.

Ok, then I want to ask, if BWF really want to see the best and the best, why SSF has limited entries per nation? If the event is setup purely to promote the sport and purely based on individual, why it limited the entries? In that way, players like BCL can not participate. If you go with current ranking, CHN should field 4 in WS, instead of 2 in SSF. Aren't they are better players? Do you just said you want to see the best? Then, why settle for the less simply because of the flags? :eek::confused:[/quote]

The frequency of your postings you would gather enough frequency flyer miles to fly to watch a SS before you turn 31 years old:p I said "I want to see the best play baddy if I am to take time of to fly in to watch a game...I did not say BWF want to see the best and the best". If I am paid to work for BWF, then I will answer your question. BWF put on a show, if I pay to watch and not just free dl, I wanna see the best player play, fair demand.
You are 30 yrs old, have you ever take 2 weeks vacation time, book online and gather 16 people, book cars, book hotel rooms, to go see a WC or SS, , wait in airport fly from one continent to another, organize my workload and delegate work to keep my staff busy for the next 10 days, spent 9-10 hrs a day for 7 straight days in a stadium eating burgers and coke, no time to pee just in case you miss LD or some big shot players play, eat dinner at 11.00 pm at night after game finishes in a foreign land or are you one of those free downloader sitting at home in your underwear or butt naked, scratching your butt or balls and watching/posting in computer and not caring the stadium is less than 1/2 full" Now, to top it all, what if the game results are fixed and you pay to watch a fixed game? It is a free world, you can make your choice.
BWF has a tough job and i.e. to grow baddy into a mainstream sport, not an Asian sport...baddy is already the second most played (not most spectator watched or $$$ rewarding sport to play - tennis is);)

The frequency of your postings you would gather enough frequency flyer miles to fly to watch a SS before you turn 31 years old:p I said "I want to see the best play baddy if I am to take time of to fly in to watch a game...I did not say BWF want to see the best and the best". If I am paid to work for BWF, then I will answer your question. BWF put on a show, if I pay to watch and not just free dl, I wanna see the best player play, fair demand.
You are 30 yrs old, have you ever take 2 weeks vacation time, book online and gather 16 people, book cars, book hotel rooms, to go see a WC or SS, , wait in airport fly from one continent to another, organize my workload and delegate work to keep my staff busy for the next 10 days, spent 9-10 hrs a day for 7 straight days in a stadium eating burgers and coke, no time to pee just in case you miss LD or some big shot players play, eat dinner at 11.00 pm at night after game finishes in a foreign land or are you one of those free downloader sitting at home in your underwear or butt naked, scratching your butt or balls and watching/posting in computer and not caring the stadium is less than 1/2 full" Now, to top it all, what if the game results are fixed and you pay to watch a fixed game? It is a free world, you can make your choice.
BWF has a tough job and i.e. to grow baddy into a mainstream sport, not an Asian sport...baddy is already the second most played (not most spectator watched or $$$ rewarding sport to play - tennis is);)


The description of this post is too graphical, not suitable for anyone under the age of 18. Reader discretion & parental guidance is strongly adviced.:eek:.

... Right or wrong, it just paints CHN badminton in a bad light to pull this stunt this late. Regardless of their intentions, perceptions are often stronger than the truth.
The perceptions are just wrong. Thanks to information such as the Badzine editorial.

This is no late stunt. LYB has been consistently lukewarm to the idea. For the longest time, there was no competition to withdraw from. It did not exist.

Again, I think the Chinese Team should support this event anyway. However, their no-show, while very disappointing, is not a stunt and is not totally without reasons.

The description of this post is too graphical, not suitable for anyone under the age of 18. Reader discretion & parental guidance is strongly adviced.:eek:.
I know...thx for reminding me;)

LazyBuddy : As pertaining to your question (post #131), it is indeed a two-way issue: How to showcase the best of the best while at the same time promote & showcase enough players from other countries?
The reason BWF gave in proposing such regulation is "in a bid to bring more countries and regions into the Olympic competition." In a way their thought is "how to provide equal opportunity for all".
Badminton is afterall an international sport. And as is the Olympics, BWF has to provide an avenue to promote/showcase the game and at the same time for those international players to compete. Of course, BWF would like to see "the best of the best", but at what cost, considering there are only certain amt of spots in each event? Even other events (the Doubles events) had to be sacrificed/reduced from 19 to 16 pairs to accommodate the extra Singles players. So, compromise had to be done.
Perhaps BWF can arrange qualification rounds in the next Olympics to accommodate more players, but if they're to open more spots, as you suggested, how much is enough?? 5 spots? 6 spots?...And is it even feasible??..Let alone a possibility of other countries who'll complain about not having enough spots given etc..:p

madbad : the post you were referring to is the one all the way at the top, on the previous page..;)

OTB (OneToughBirdie) : sounds like you had a grand ole time during your visit to Anaheim for the 2005 WC.:);)

OTB (OneToughBirdie) : sounds like you had a grand ole time during your visit to Anaheim for the 2005 WC.:);)[/quote]
It was a great dream SF lineup, and for those who have not watch LD or LCW play while they are still at their best, or even TH and PG even though they are not at their prime, should go. It is different than seeing on video. But really sad to see <1/2 empty stadium even on final night, especially when the admission is so darn cheap compared to say, ice hockey, football, basketball. For US$179 for 9 separate admissions, I figured it costs <US$2.50 per hour and that is cheaper than McDonald 6-piece chicken, minus the coke and fries:p:D. I am not optimistic the game will come back to North America, in my lifetime, with the dismal attendance. For those bcers who so often express admiration and worship those chinese lady players in this forum, seeing those long-legged, fair-skinned players live would fulfill many a dream:p:D:p:D;)

doesn't the china badminton team hold a pretty intensive 1-2 month winter training every year? i think it was in zuhai(correct me if i'm wrong) last year.
i'm also pretty sure that the team announced a few months ago that they were going to do this again for this year, at which time we didn't even know if the super series final was a go or not.
so why is everybody complaining that the team withdrew? if this Super Series final is so prestigious and important, the world badminton federation would have started to promote it at the beginning of the year, not one month before the actual event.
if they knew that the SS finals were going to be a disaster, the BWF would have been better off using that $500000USD to try and promote the game, not organize a tourney that none of the worlds top players go to.

i highly doubt that team china has a "grudge" against the BWF and therefore withdrew from 3 superseries tourneys. I think that poor organizing by the world federation and the fact that the chinese team is pretty much battered up/not in top form are the main reasons why this is happening.

doesn't the china badminton team hold a pretty intensive 1-2 month winter training every year? i think it was in zuhai(correct me if i'm wrong) last year.
i'm also pretty sure that the team announced a few months ago that they were going to do this again for this year, at which time we didn't even know if the super series final was a go or not.
so why is everybody complaining that the team withdrew? if this Super Series final is so prestigious and important, the world badminton federation would have started to promote it at the beginning of the year, not one month before the actual event.
if they knew that the SS finals were going to be a disaster, the BWF would have been better off using that $500000USD to try and promote the game, not organize a tourney that none of the worlds top players go to.

i highly doubt that team china has a "grudge" against the BWF and therefore withdrew from 3 superseries tourneys. I think that poor organizing by the world federation and the fact that the chinese team is pretty much battered up/not in top form are the main reasons why this is happening.

I wouldn't give BWF so much credit BWF is so smart that BWF can really plan a disaster to occur :D:p BWF plan for success but turn into a disaster instead:p:D Now seriously, BWF did not envision CHN, INA (Maria) and KOR not showing up and as for promoting it earlier, BWF might have not found venue to host or sponsor for SSF, just my guess. Do you think BWF envision the top 8 comprises of names like Chan Yan Kit, Andrew and at one time Ng Wei, that is a nightmare:eek: Looking at the singles draw, the only MS and WS OG08 medalist attending SSF is LCW...with SSF held in baddy country MAS, maybe can get decent crowd and a get together for bcers there but with the high admission charge, I would be curious to find out attendance figure. More like a quickie easy $$$ distribution to players, may not be a bad thing.:D

I still don't get how people can call this event a "promotional" event... when it is being in the usual few "badminton" countries, attracting the exact same crowds, being broadcast by the same few countries... It is not really promoting the sport but simply maintaining the same crowd so they don't lose interest.:rolleyes:

The definition of the word "Insanity" ---> Doing the exact same thing over and over again, and expect different results.:rolleyes:

When will the BWF realize that in order to promote the sport, you don't just host more tournament in the same continent... what you need to do is to change the image of the sport from being recognized as a "SISSY" sport by most of the countries outside of Asia.

i totally agree with bananakid.
i mean, the 2007 world champs and now the SSF and the majority of the big tourneys are all held in asian countries. this is a ridiculously bad marketing plan. if you keep marketing to the same group of people, you will only go so far. the BWF needs to broaden their horizens.
IMHO, the 2005 world champs were a big sucess and one of the smartest moves made by the BWF. When compared to Madrid and Kual Lumpar, Anaheim attracted more people and caused more hype. In both of the later tourneys the stadiums were pretty bare, even during the MS final. If the BWF were smart they would go back to Anaheim (or at least a big US city) sometime soon. LD is more famous than ever now, the new and up and coming chinese girls are pretty cute haha and women seem to like lee yong dae. BWF should totally use this, especially in the US, where people would pay good money ($100USD+ for tickets) to watch top players compete.

if it holds near where i live.

i totally agree with bananakid.
i mean, the 2007 world champs and now the SSF and the majority of the big tourneys are all held in asian countries. this is a ridiculously bad marketing plan. if you keep marketing to the same group of people, you will only go so far. the BWF needs to broaden their horizens.
IMHO, the 2005 world champs were a big sucess and one of the smartest moves made by the BWF. When compared to Madrid and Kual Lumpar, Anaheim attracted more people and caused more hype. In both of the later tourneys the stadiums were pretty bare, even during the MS final. If the BWF were smart they would go back to Anaheim (or at least a big US city) sometime soon. LD is more famous than ever now, the new and up and coming chinese girls are pretty cute haha and women seem to like lee yong dae. BWF should totally use this, especially in the US, where people would pay good money ($100USD+ for tickets) to watch top players compete.

If they ever brought an event of this magnitude to Vancouver, I can almost guarantee it'd be well received.

If they ever brought an event of this magnitude to Vancouver, I can almost guarantee it'd be well received.
With proper promotion, not BWF style last minute thingy, the same could be true for many cities in North America with sizable Asian populations. Badminton Clubs are often among the largest clubs on college campus.

BWF, take note:crying:

The Super Series is a singles and doubles competition open to all badminton players from Member Associations affiliated to the BWF.

The Super Series is a 12 tournaments series designed to attract the top 32 players from around the world with a minimum of USD $ 200,000 prize money for each tournament. Hosted from January through to December each year the events are usually hosted in pairs in a similar region of the world – in mid January, the Malaysian Super Series kicks off the year followed by the Korea Super Series
http://www.internationalbadminton.org/images/pic1.jpg


The BWF introduced the Super Series format to showcase badminton at a higher level of competitiveness, to increase television coverage for the sport and to increase the star quality and popularity of the top players in the world through a wider television audience.

Players earn World Ranking Points (http://www.internationalbadminton.org/world_ranking.html) towards their World Ranking according to the special classification of those tournaments which have been nominated by the BWF.

Series Final


The BWF Super Series Masters Finals ends the series for the year and the best eight men’s and women’s singles and doubles players, as well as mixed doubles players are invited to battle it out for top prize money.



This gives the reasons for the SS and is self explanatory.

No Country can have the excuse they didn't know that the event was to be held. The reasons why the 2007 Finals were not held are explained in my previous thread on this subject.

The below is from the BWF web site

This PR thing does not help or fool anyone who is somewhat familiar with the situation.

Even BWF did not know whether, when or where the Series Final will be held, let alone the national associations. Let's put 2007 and 2008 under "growing pain" and move on.

A few things that can make the schedule better.

- A clear concept of competitive season, with a meaningful period for recuperation. A two-week break between season finale and the first SS does not make sense.

- Clearly defined SS/World/Continental period and club/national period to reduce conflicts and generate local interests through lower level competitions.

- Mandatory specific commitments from top players. For example, top athletes are put into a number of specific event, say 6. Plus 3 more optional events at their own choice. Failing to meet the full commitment will disqualify a player from sharing a bonus pool. Obviously, injury problems should be accommodated.

- Okay, the series finale. I think most people do not see how it promotes badminton in its current form. I prefer a promotional tour for which parcipants are richly compensated for their performance/participation in the past year and their participation in the tour. There may be one ore more tours with a proper mix of different players to spread the game around.

No Country can have the excuse they didn't know that the event was to be held.


Why anybody needs to provide any "excuses" to begin with? Overall, the SS and SSF are open to any participants, under their OWN willingness. If someone or some team decide to skip an event, it's their own decision. There's no contracts being signed what so ever, saying how many and when someone or teams need to show up, or not.

I am sure even 3 years old kids know when OG is, and let me ask you do you have to collect all the "excuses" from the mega stars from tennis or basketball, for "not participating"? :rolleyes:

did CHN not work with the BWF towards finding an equitable solution?

1. How you know that CHN did not try to propose any possible changes or try to work out a deal in the earlier days? :confused:

2. Even CHN did not go all out to work out a deal, why should they do that to begin with? BWF if paid to organize the event, but not CHN team. Even if they do, did BWF (or OG committee) ever listen and agree on changes?


Just put in a very simple example. Say your boss told you 3 years ahead that you may need to attend a meeting. 1 week ago, you finally received confirmation of the meeting agenda, schedule and location. However, you planned your vacation long long time ago. Now, you voiced your concern as there's no early enough notification, then your boss :mad::mad::mad: and made you feel like :crying::crying::crying:. Sure, as a boss, s/he can use (or abuse) the power to blame you, but as an individual, you have the rights to feel :cool:, right? :rolleyes:

Say your boss told you 3 years ahead that you may need to attend a meeting. 1 week ago, you finally received confirmation of the meeting agenda, schedule and location. However, you planned your vacation long long time ago. Now, you voiced your concern as there's no early enough notification, then your boss :mad::mad::mad: and made you feel like :crying::crying::crying:. Sure, as a boss, s/he can use (or abuse) the power to blame you, but as an individual, you have the rights to feel :cool:, right? :rolleyes:

Your analogy above makes me think about my part-time job as a contractual engineer for hire..very interestingly:p... If my boss give me 3 years timeline to attend a meeting, he better pay me good, and I mean real goodie as I only pick up to 6 projects a year to do that are $$$ worthwhile doing and not doing for the fun of it:D And if I someone offers me a better pay contract in between, he can take a hike and find someone else to attend such meeting :pAs if my boss abusing me, well my boss better be a 'she', young and pretty looking, then pleeeezz I am all for it:p:D

... Ok, then I want to ask, if BWF really want to see the best and the best, why SSF has limited entries per nation? If the event is setup purely to promote the sport and purely based on individual, why it limited the entries? In that way, players like BCL can not participate. If you go with current ranking, CHN should field 4 in WS, instead of 2 in SSF. Aren't they are better players? Do you just said you want to see the best? Then, why settle for the less simply because of the flags? :eek::confused:



.
LazyBuddy ... I don't think that the SSF was intended for the best of the best players.

I think the SSF was intended for the best of each nation to do battle against the best from other nations.

I think BWF is not interested in the CHN No.1 player doing battle against the CHN no.2, but for CHN No.1 to do battle against the No.1 from other nations.

CHN should perform well if they wish to participate in the SSF, since CHN is the strongest nation in Badminton.
.

yeah...too sad can't watch the entire CHN team until the next 2 SS tourney..

well..i dont have anyone to cheer up in SSF now,so whoever wins.. i will just relax and enjoy the show until December 25th when ESPN will broadcast Boston vs L.A. in the NBA Final rematch at Christmas Eve :D Beat L.A , Beat L.A!!!

I'm very late into this thread. I don't know what's all the fuss. Not not ago, BC members were so concerned about china domination, how it would suppress the sport because it doesn't allow other badminton budding countries to grow and gain experience from playing with the powerhouses. Here is just one thread i have found.

http://www.badmintoncentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46621&highlight=domination

Now, china skips a major tournament and we see all the crying about china is not helping to promote badminton and it's bad for badminton. What give?? Shame on Badzine editorial for only presenting just one side of the story. Some say china (LYB) should negotiate with BWF to come up with a workable term and schedule. HOWEVER, if china do that, people would scream bloody hell inequality for BWF is benting over to make sweet deal with china. What give??

Apologies Mr. Mod :)i got a bad wrap for starting this trend:D

Yup, I read through ANTARA News Agency yesterday that reported TH decided to pull out from Masters Finals due to waist injury.

HMMM, i thot his excuse for not coming to the toronto exhibition is that he is focusing on the master SS and MO but now he is not playing???Why don't he come to toronto, it's not too late. Injury? He could finish off any of our local canadian MS boys with just 1st gear, maybe 2nd gear max. Perfect exercise to circulate blood to his injured muscle.

No big slap at all...no need to forfeit the Finale SS, if no top player participates...I am more than happy to substitute them as long as return airfare tickets, hotel, daily allowance, participation fee provided....:D
no candu.
Only happen if canada's charmaine reid withdraw but she is a female:p

Only GOD Knows....! :cool:..but who cares..?

Maybe is the tourney format....! :rolleyes:...Hmm....makes them difficult to ...'fix'.....?????..:rolleyes:....:D:D:DLYB can fix anything. He is fixing BWF right now:p

..boy, with the news of CHN's team fully withdrawing from this SS Finale and now Taufik most likely bowing out, hmm, it almost takes the air out of this event. Not to undermine the other participating players, but from a fan's perspective of looking forward to top players playing, that's almost half of the show is gone. Will there be any more last minute pull-outs/withdrawals??..:confused:..I certainly hope not, just for the sake of the people planning to go and watch the event..

On that note, I just hope all of you guys who are going there will enjoy the rest of the matches; and as Han mentioned earlier, "just have fun!"..;):cool:i would be very surprised if BWF doesn't have a feel of what's coming. If most the all names are not coming, BWF is wasting MONEY to host this event where they could be better use somewhere else. BWF should be partly blame for this for not doing any home work to see if this event deserve the big promotion and funding.

LYB can fix anything. He is fixing BWF right now:p
wow, is that true?:eek:
can he fix my house's broken pipe and big water tank??:p:D:D:rolleyes:

i got a bad wrap for starting this trend:D

Yes, I was just copying your method and Mr/ Mod came down heavy on me. Your fault, cooler :D:D

This is a typical article written by people who has no idea about CHN team / system / culture. To be worse, it's just a one sided slapping, without carefully thinking about the other side of the story.

Sure, you can use 10 pages to blast CHN athletes do not deserve this or that treatment within the team, but what about the "OG rules" (yeah, I mentioned that in 2000 threads, and i will continue to mention, until it's changed). You want all the good players to play this open or that final, but at the end, you strip their rights to even participate OG. How strong an argument you can support? At least there's KO or MO every year. But the OG is every 4 years. Why? because the editorial is contentless without mentioning previous fixings lol.

Sure, Zhou Mi might only got a Broze in 2004. Ask XXF and XXZ, they did not even get to Athens to play. All they can do is to watch the matches between ranking 50+ players on stage. Ask Chen Yu, this poor guy was never even in the "selection process". If you think CHN got treat unfairly in their team, what you think they face in the "wonderful, honest, fair" "outside world"? :rolleyes:

Wonderful world... :pya, i don't get the reason why badzine brings up the fixing of 2004 WS to this SS withdraw discussion beside just to promote anger against china (for a different reason). Since china is withdrawing this SS, there is no fixing. Why bring up previous fixing to support a non fixing event??

wow, is that true?:eek:
can he fix my house's broken pipe and big water tank??:p:D:D:rolleyes:
yes but first he will yell at u for wasting water and poor maintenance upkeep.:p

Personally I believe that the decision to withdraw all of the Chinese players from the SS finals is disgraceful and the Chines Badminton Federation should be fined a large sum of money.

There should be no penalties imposed upon the players as they are clearly under orders.

Whn the SS were set up some 2 years or more ago it was well advertised at the time that it was the intention to hold the 12 events followed by a Final involving the top players.

A major sponsor was found by BWF and they financed the first 6 events of the 2007 SS events. For reasons unknown to me they pulled out without much notice leaving BWF with a decision to make.

1. Continue with the other 6 events paying the prize money to players from BWF funds while seeking to find a further sponsor.

2. Scrap the events

BWF took the decision to hold the rest of the events durring 2007 as much of the preliminary work had already been done by the respective Federations towards organising the Events. However a decision was made to not hold the 2007 SS Finals.

A the start of the 2008 year BWF once again funded the first few of the SS Events and continued to seek a major sponsor for the rest of the year and the subsequent SS Finals.

Presumably a sponsor was found and part of the reason why a sponsor was found was that the World's top players would be taking part i.e. including the Chinese players who have qualified.

Can you imagine that this sponsor would have agreed to provide the funds withot the Chinese taking part?? I cannot.

Given that the Chinese Federation must have known what was going to be expected of their players well before the withdrawal of the team and to leave the decision to pull out until the last minute is disrespectful to BWF and other players who have been asked to complete at the last minute.

Choo Wong Hann from Malaysia was winning a European circuit in Italy on Friday and suddenly finds that he has to be back in Malaysia by Tuesday as he has now qualified to take part in the SS!!!!!!!!!!!! Great preparation.

The Chinese Federation cannot even come up with the excuse of lack of funds as BWF were going to pay Air Fares etc to all competitors who attend the event.

why only fine china team? how about no shows from other countries?? If a policy is unfair or unworkable, should the policy maker is partly to blame??? Even if bwf fine china, so what? China team decision isn't based on money. Instead, BWF should come up with a workable schedule that agreeable by the top badminton nations.

i think this thread is getting hotter and hotter now..
lets have peace here..:cool:
or else, the mod or kwun will do something about it i believe..:rolleyes:can i come in to cool things down?:p:p

if it holds near where i live.USDis dropping daily. Ticket will be sold in euro soon:p

can i come in to cool things down?:p:p
not untill lyb comes my house and fix my damn broken pipe and big water tank:p:p:rolleyes:

not untill lyb comes my house and fix my damn broken pipe and big water tank:p:p:rolleyes:
u know that LYB is too busy to do those laborous tasks, he will send for 1 or 2 of his tomboys to fix your broken tank and pipe, is that ok??:D Caution: these tomboys don't have plumbing license, they might check the wrong water tank and pipe;):p

Folks, it helps to stay on topic :(
Let's leave Li The Plumber out of this.

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LazyBuddy ... I don't think that the SSF was intended for the best of the best players.

I think the SSF was intended for the best of each nation to do battle against the best from other nations.

I think BWF is not interested in the CHN No.1 player doing battle against the CHN no.2, but for CHN No.1 to do battle against the No.1 from other nations.

CHN should perform well if they wish to participate in the SSF, since CHN is the strongest nation in Badminton.
.

If that's the case, I wonder how come they do not set up an event like "CHN vs. world", regarding badminton. Back then, hockey has "north amercia vs. world" for all star game format, why can not do the same for badminton.

And also why BWF can not watch CHN no 1 against no 2, if they promote this as an individual event? If A and B are the 2 top performers, why we need to care which flags they carry?

In tennis world, ppl love the match between Williams sisters. I never heard any tennis organization reject 1 of the entries, say only 1 player from 1 family? Back then, Samparas and Agarssi (sorry for the mis-spelling) final matches in any grand slam is a classic. I never heard any organization says, "only 1 from each nation", or "we only want to see US no. 1 against other nation's no. 1", "we are not interested to see US no 1 against US no. 2". :confused:

after reading all 11 pages, how come no one seems to know the real reason why china **** up the fans? :confused:

after reading all 11 pages, how come no one seems to know the real reason why china **** up the fans? :confused:

1. Why we really need to know the reason? Overall, it's their rights to make a decision to attend or not. We can be happy or be sad, but we are not them, and we do not have rights to make a decision for them.

2. When tennis stars or golf stars or whatever decide to withdraw from an event (even at the last meet or on the spot), we do not call them "**** up the fans". Why we have to single them out this time? :rolleyes:

yeah.. now ld had a bad experience in east malaysia I guess... ;)

1. Why we really need to know the reason? Overall, it's their rights to make a decision to attend or not. We can be happy or be sad, but we are not them, and we do not have rights to make a decision for them.

2. When tennis stars or golf stars or whatever decide to withdraw from an event (even at the last meet or on the spot), we do not call them "**** up the fans". Why we have to single them out this time? :rolleyes:

agree with this one...

in fact..they already won 27 SS titles this year in overall...
so,let them take a rest and wait for their comeback next year and i hope they will become more stronger and stronger...

Seeing CHN Badminton team is just the same with USA Basketball team..
Almost 10 years ago,which nation who can beat the "almighty USA"??
but look at the other nation's progress in the last 6 years..one by one,they started to catch up..but USA in other hand..still proves that they are still the best in the world because they realized now that they became a target to defeat ,so they trained harder to become more stronger and stronger...(It had been proved well in the last OG, eventhough Spain & Argentina gave them a really hard time and pressure)

It's the same thing with CHN badminton..
compared to 2-3 years ago..now,many other nation has their own good player who can prevent the CHN domination to get all the titles at many tournament...

take a look...if 2 years ago,CHN can get 4 titles in WC,the next year only 3..They won 4 titles in AE 2007, this year only 2....in 2006 & 2007, CHN won 4 titles in CM SS , this year..they only won it 2.

u can see that CHN are not that kind of the dominate force in Badminton anymore as before...that's why i kinda support their decision to withdraw from this SS Final and upcoming 2 SS tourneys and because i think they need to refresh their mind and energy to think about next year big project, AE 2009 and Sudirman 2009...

If that's the case, I wonder how come they do not set up an event like "CHN vs. world", regarding badminton. Back then, hockey has "north amercia vs. world" for all star game format, why can not do the same for badminton.



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LazyBuddy ... "CHN vs The World" would be an excellent idea because there will be no CHN players doing battle against each other.



And also why BWF can not watch CHN no 1 against no 2, if they promote this as an individual event? If A and B are the 2 top performers, why we need to care which flags they carry?



When CHN players are playing against each other (in BWF tournaments), BWF and the world (including some fans of China) have less interest in watching them. This because some CHN players and coaches have told us they fixed their matches to gain maximum benefit for team members. However, it could be different when CHN players are playing each other in non-BWF tournaments, say in their internal Chinese tournaments, which do not carry BWF ranking points.


In tennis world, ppl love the match between Williams sisters. I never heard any tennis organization reject 1 of the entries, say only 1 player from 1 family? Back then, Samparas and Agarssi (sorry for the mis-spelling) final matches in any grand slam is a classic. I never heard any organization says, "only 1 from each nation", or "we only want to see US no. 1 against other nation's no. 1", "we are not interested to see US no 1 against US no. 2". :confused:



That's because we know they fight to the end, without planning the outcome of their matches.

Actually, some have found the current 2008 SSF interesting without CHN players. I just left our thread describing the matches in Day 2 of their 'Group Stage'. Lots of excitement and hope were expressed by BCers when finding their country's players making it into the Semi-Finals tomorrow.

Btw, there are ex-CHN players representing other nations in this SSF. But we know each of these players are now playing for themselves/nations, and not just for fellow ex-teammates.

Perhaps, if CHN is again not participating in next year's SSF, more fans/spectators would be thankful for it.

Cheers... chris-ccc
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I think China is very strong in Badminton and infact they are too strong but they dont have the responsibility to make themselves weak.

THE OTHERS NATIONS has the responsibilities to close the gap...

China just cant slow down and let others catch up!

haha...aiya...relax....just thanks china for giving others player big money...

yes. a blessing for other players when they don't join. Many thanks to them. Whoever in final sure appreciate it. ;)

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[/COLOR]
[COLOR=Blue]That's because we know they fight to the end, without planning the outcome of their matches.




That's true. But that might also because they do not have to worry about "god standard fans" will judge their performance based on their flags. The tennis fans cheer for the players, but not their flags.

It always need two hands to clap. If there's a fight, you can not simply blame one side. If the other side does not respond, there's no fight anyway. ;)

chris, chinese players alway fight to the end against other nation players:p
If 2 chineses don't play 100%, it should only hurt the chinese fans, not INA, MAS, or DEN fans. It is not a secret that chinese players plays for their country, not conforming to the usually format of other pro sports which focus on individualism. If u want to complain about match fixing, u should bring the matter to the chinese communist party. It is their national goal, no sports(yet), including badminton can supercede this national focus.

ok, lets go deeper into the issue. Many pro sport fans would say only by true unrestrainted open competition would the best sportsman rises to the top. They may use federer, tiger wood etc as examples. However, is this the real only end all theory of bringing the best from an athlete??? Then i ask u, how come china dominates badminton (and table tennis, diving, etc) but yet they don't conform to that individualism in sports principle? Don't tell me LYB fixed every chinese vs chinese matches to achieve today's china domination results.

Before making this matching fixing practice as the given truth, consider the LL/XXF semi-final at OG. After that tough three-game match, both lost their next matches. It would have been so tempting to put in at least the "one-game" rule. Not that LL would have beaten MKY for sure, but her odds would have been much better if the semi-final was made easier. Three Chinese flags at the medal ceremony would have been a much desired scenario. It did not happen.

That to me is an example of a match that was ripe for some "managing", but was a free fight. Unless, of course, you believe that LL was ordered by LYB to consume XXF so ZN would win gold. Well, :rolleyes:

Matches between teammates, Chinese or not, may lack the extra motivation as against other teams. That's just human nature. It does not mean the match cannot be exciting and it is not a proof that the matches are fixed.

There is an article in today's New Straits Times in which the BWF admits to being partly to blame for China's withdrawal from the SS Final.

There is an article in today's New Straits Times in which the BWF admits to being partly to blame for China's withdrawal from the SS Final.
i've already posted that article in another thread by chris@ccc:cool:

i've already posted that article in another thread by chris@ccc:cool:
why dont u post it here?:D it is more in topic

found it...

There is an article in today's New Straits Times in which the BWF admits to being partly to blame for China's withdrawal from the SS Final.
I don't understand why you have this attitude that BWF should kowtow to CHN.BWF is a world federation of badminton BAs and CHN is just one of them.CHN did not withdraw. CHN made clear in 2006 and 2007 that they would skip SSF even when Li Ning was offered to sponsor it in CHN for 2007?Why should non-CHN SSF qualifiers miss out on their year-end bonus for two years just because of CHN's boycott?This time BWF made the right decision to go ahead.Most, if not all,of the players enjoyed themselves even when they lost.Fans got tremendous value for their money.I hope they stage it again in KK next year because the organisation was smooth and the resort like atmosphere is wonderful for recharging the players. It's more like a holiday for the players rather than grind.Great work, SBA!!!
Let's face it. LYB has exacting standards and will only field CHN to win , not lose because he hates to lose face.When CHN don't participate, it just means they are not ready and prepared enough to win...for that particular tournament.
This was tested by sending CJ to DO08 and FO08? He did not even get past QF although top seeded.CJ's supposed to be a solid player and consistent in his performance.CJ said he did not prepared well that's why he lost.The other reason possibly is he missed the herd confidence that comes with a big CHN contingent.
Whatever it is,the prerequisite for winning a tournament is still comprehensive match preparations.That may vary with each player.Eg, TH the lazy one probably needs 50% effort,LCW 100%, LD 150%. No opponent owes a WR1, OG, WC, AG champion a win on account of their record.LYB is most aware of that and does not take chances hence CHN's 3-month camp to do well in AE09.
I heard there's a chance of reducing the number of SS in CHN and HK to 1. So that SSF can be held in late Nov or early Dec.See how far BWF will go to accommodate CHN and solve the problem? Just lop off the last CHN SS.

Not sure if this would make anyone feel better...

LYB just announced that the Chinese Team will skip the scheduled training camp in Sichuan, after the locals spent big bucks on renovating dormitories and buying new rubber floor mats in preparation for the training camp.

With that kind of decision making, LYB should do well being a BWF official :rolleyes:

I don't understand why you have this attitude that BWF should kowtow to CHN.

I don't understand why the need for your above comment. What attitude? FYI, all I did was to mention that there was an article in the Malaysia's newspaper, the NST, which reported that the BWF felt it was partly to blame for China's withdrawal from THe SS Final.

maybe china has informed BWF that they will not participate in any event from certain time to time?

LYB just announced that the Chinese Team will skip the scheduled training camp in Sichuan, after the locals spent big bucks on renovating dormitories and buying new rubber floor mats in preparation for the training camp.




I assume the facilities were not built / renovated just for 1 training event, right? If the facility belongs to the government (local or central), I am sure they will utilize it for other events. :rolleyes:

Not sure if this would make anyone feel better...

LYB just announced that the Chinese Team will skip the scheduled training camp in Sichuan, after the locals spent big bucks on renovating dormitories and buying new rubber floor mats in preparation for the training camp.

With that kind of decision making, LYB should do well being a BWF official :rolleyes:

LYB is getting very good at cancelling plans :D

HMMM, i thot his excuse for not coming to the toronto exhibition is that he is focusing on the master SS and MO but now he is not playing???Why don't he come to toronto, it's not too late. Injury? He could finish off any of our local canadian MS boys with just 1st gear, maybe 2nd gear max. Perfect exercise to circulate blood to his injured muscle.
:):):):) what exhibition and when:crying::crying::crying::crying:

OTB (OneToughBirdie) : sounds like you had a grand ole time during your visit to Anaheim for the 2005 WC.:);)
It was a great dream SF lineup, and for those who have not watch LD or LCW play while they are still at their best, or even TH and PG even though they are not at their prime, should go. It is different than seeing on video. But really sad to see <1/2 empty stadium even on final night, especially when the admission is so darn cheap compared to say, ice hockey, football, basketball. For US$179 for 9 separate admissions, I figured it costs <US$2.50 per hour and that is cheaper than McDonald 6-piece chicken, minus the coke and fries:p:D. I am not optimistic the game will come back to North America, in my lifetime, with the dismal attendance. For those bcers who so often express admiration and worship those chinese lady players in this forum, seeing those long-legged, fair-skinned players live would fulfill many a dream:p:D:p:D;)[/quote]
:cool::cool::cool::cool: u were in california wow:):):):):):):):):):)

It was a great dream SF lineup, and for those who have not watch LD or LCW play while they are still at their best, or even TH and PG even though they are not at their prime, should go. It is different than seeing on video. But really sad to see <1/2 empty stadium even on final night, especially when the admission is so darn cheap compared to say, ice hockey, football, basketball. For US$179 for 9 separate admissions, I figured it costs <US$2.50 per hour and that is cheaper than McDonald 6-piece chicken, minus the coke and fries:p:D. I am not optimistic the game will come back to North America, in my lifetime, with the dismal attendance. For those bcers who so often express admiration and worship those chinese lady players in this forum, seeing those long-legged, fair-skinned players live would fulfill many a dream:p:D:p:D;)
:cool::cool::cool::cool: u were in california wow:):):):):):):):):):)[/quote]
Yeah, and I brought along 15 people to bodyguard me:D...4 stayed and watched the entire tourney over 7 days and these people never followed baddy, just love playing and when it was over, they actually thanked me and said what an experience. 2 snoozed in the air-conditioned stadium, probably dreaming to be LD or TH:D:p. The other 9 came and go with the season pass and hopped over to Disneyland, shopping, etc. One actually was 'stalking' around and managed to take a pic with Sally Yeh, and that was heaven.:p
The 7-day pass costs US$179 and that is cheaper than 2 tickets to see ice hockey and still the stadium is <1/2 full if you deduct the players occupying the seats at finals.

I don't understand why the need for your above comment. What attitude? FYI, all I did was to mention that there was an article in the Malaysia's newspaper, the NST, which reported that the BWF felt it was partly to blame for China's withdrawal from THe SS Final.
Didn't you post earlier to that about how someone in BWF might have offended CHN and maybe that's why CHN gave SSF a miss? And I thought, wow,CHN's that great,huh but left it at that.
But when you brought it up again, i thought some understanding of your thinking might be illuminating.Or maybe someone else wrote the earlier post?(You can check your post history.)My memory can be bad but not that bad.Mind-boggling posts usually get moved to my longterm memory.

Didn't you post earlier to that about how someone in BWF might have offended CHN and maybe that's why CHN gave SSF a miss? And I thought, wow,CHN's that great,huh but left it at that.
But when you brought it up again, i thought some understanding of your thinking might be illuminating.Or maybe someone else wrote the earlier post?(You can check your post history.)My memory can be bad but not that bad.Mind-boggling posts usually get moved to my longterm memory.

Yes, you are right on the first para. In that context, which includes China withdrawing from, not one (SS Final), but from all 3 SS (2008 SS Final, SS Malaysia 2009, SS Korea 2009), I ventured an opinion that the BWF might have stepped on China's toe. One miss is understandable, but 3 consecutive misses does not appear to be a very friendly act. It looks a bit like a tooth for a tooth.
But the above has nothing to do with the article on the NST which says that the BWF felt it was partly to blame for China's withdrawal from the 2008 SS Final. In this case I happened to come across the article about the 2008 SS Final in the NST and was merely posting it.
The first was what I thought a reasonable assumption in the absence of more convincing reasons given for the triple withdrawals. Of course not every one will agree.
The second was merely a reference to a newspaper article, which for no reason you saw fit to rant about me having an attitude problem.
Maybe, a little care to be less trigger-happy is needed to avoid shooting innocent bystanders.

Yes, you are right on the first para. In that context, which includes China withdrawing from, not one (SS Final), but from all 3 SS (2008 SS Final, SS Malaysia 2009, SS Korea 2009), I ventured an opinion that the BWF might have stepped on China's toe. One miss is understandable, but 3 consecutive misses does not appear to be a very friendly act. It looks a bit like a tooth for a tooth.
But the above has nothing to do with the article on the NST which says that the BWF felt it was partly to blame for China's withdrawal from the 2008 SS Final. In this case I happened to come across the article about the 2008 SS Final in the NST and was merely posting it.
The first was what I thought a reasonable assumption in the absence of more convincing reasons given for the triple withdrawals. Of course not every one will agree.
The second was merely a reference to a newspaper article, which for no reason you saw fit to rant about me having an attitude problem.
Maybe, a little care to be less trigger-happy is needed to avoid shooting innocent bystanders.
ok, our views differ.
1)SSF, MO and KO are not particularly favoured grounds for CHN to win, hence LYB regarded as no loss in not participating.
2) Also coincided with their 3-mth winter training camp.First time of 3-mth duration?
3) CHN team in transition so they need intensive training? For sure, CHN MS has more work now.LCW is not the only non-CHN MS to train for.CJ ,for instance, also has two more manuals to work on: SDK and ???
I can understand why CHN require 3mth intensive training.They have to, with evidence of shakiness outside CHN tournaments.
4) CHN can't just win in many tournaments like before so they concentrate on the ones that count.Prestigious titles count more than world rankings now.Yes,urgent for CHN to consolidate now.Nothing to do with BWF.

The withdrawals have more to do with scheduling than winning or lossing.

Winter training has been a long time practice for Chinese athletes. They are just not keyed to compete during this period. With OG qualifying on the line, they will play anyway. Other than that, they choose to give up these competitions (not fully perpared or not showing up at all) and stick to their usual training cycle.

If you hold OG in January in Malaysia or Korea, you will surely see the true CHN team.

If terms of choosing tournaments to win, just ask TH. Players are not robots, they need breaks. Other teams pull out of tournaments too.

MO and KO withdrawals have nothing to do with BWF. Although I think a winter break or summer break should be good for all countries. There is already an excellent thread addressing the issue of too many events.

SS Masters withdrawal has everything to do BWF. Had BWF finalized the event well in advanced, the blame would be squarely on CHN team. As it is now, no one is blameless.

Why take cheap shots at the CHN team? If they are really that shaky, there won't be so much scheming to limit them.

...and it's Zhang Ning doing LYB's duty...see pics here courtesy of sports.cn
(now where's suetyan who usually does the picture uploading)...:confused:

http://news.sports.cn/others/badminton/photo/2009-01-07/1714195.html
http://news.sports.cn/others/badminton/photo/2009-01-07/1714164.html
http://news.sports.cn/others/badminton/photo/2009-01-06/1713748.html

The withdrawals have more to do with scheduling than winning or lossing.

Winter training has been a long time practice for Chinese athletes. They are just not keyed to compete during this period. With OG qualifying on the line, they will play anyway. Other than that, they choose to give up these competitions (not fully perpared or not showing up at all) and stick to their usual training cycle.

If you hold OG in January in Malaysia or Korea, you will surely see the true CHN team.

If terms of choosing tournaments to win, just ask TH. Players are not robots, they need breaks. Other teams pull out of tournaments too.

MO and KO withdrawals have nothing to do with BWF. Although I think a winter break or summer break should be good for all countries. There is already an excellent thread addressing the issue of too many events.

SS Masters withdrawal has everything to do BWF. Had BWF finalized the event well in advanced, the blame would be squarely on CHN team. As it is now, no one is blameless.

Why take cheap shots at the CHN team? If they are really that shaky, there won't be so much scheming to limit them.

http://www.badmintoncentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64219&highlight=buddy

note that if non-china team players withdraw, it's not a big fuss