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A good badminton photo

Discussion in 'Badminton Photography' started by kwun, Nov 14, 2003.

  1. ways2rock

    ways2rock Regular Member

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    A very nice picture indeed.

    Several questions:
    -Is there any way to optimize a 70-300mm f/4-5.6 MF lens?
    -I noticed the best speed for freezing the racket should be at least 1/320s. With a poor noise level in ISO 1600, is there any other way to be able to take a great action stance in lower shutter speed and lower ISO?

    Thank you for the answer!
     
  2. ctjcad

    ctjcad Regular Member

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    ^^Just my 4 sens worth..^^

    - "Optimize" meaning increase the aperture opening from f/4 to say, a f/2.8 or bigger?? Erm, lens-wise, no. However, you can work around that aperture with the other camera settings (shutter speed & ISO).
    - First part of your question. 1/320 is good, not the best, for "freezing" the racket or even the player. But usually, the higher the shutter speed the better. Also, w/that shutter speed, you may only freeze part of the racket as you could still get a blurred-looking racket head with that shutter speed.
    Second part of your question i'm not too clear. It depends what you mean by "great action stance". But if i do understand it, yes, you could still take pics if you want some "blurred/movement" effects, with lower shutter speed & lower ISO (one can simply take a pic of a player serving, or standing still). However, if you want to capture crisp, sharp pics of high-flying actions of players lunging, jumping, diving, moving, you'd probably need a faster shutter speed and even a fast lens (preferably one that has a fast AF). Usually for baddy pics, the lighting plays quite an important factor. The thinking is, the more light there is in the hall, the better it is for taking baddy pics or any kind of action/indoor sports pics. Simply because action/indoor sports require fast enough capture and if one is handicapped by poor lighting, then the choice of equipments (camera & lens) will be narrower & one might not get the desired results.
    On that note, yes, the sensor/chip technology in DSLRs has improved over the yrs. Thus, nowadays, an ISO higher than 1600 can still take pics w/almost no noise.

    So, my suggestion is: if you want to take the same baddy pics as you've seen above, save some money and invest in a good camera body and a few good & fast lenses (although they may not be cheap)...and become one of us "baddy photog" fanatics...muahaha:)
     
    #42 ctjcad, Jun 25, 2009
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2009
  3. ae86trueno

    ae86trueno Regular Member

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    just sharing 2cent... sometimes in indoor fluorescent lighting. if you shoot fast enough you can get weird result. its due to the refresh of the lighting.
     
  4. ways2rock

    ways2rock Regular Member

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    'Optimize' by the meaning using the lens to capture a good picture with all its... limitations *is it the correct use of word?

    Thank you very much for the tips, I am learning this section of photography by hard since it's technically a combination between two of my addiction: badminton and photography :D

    May I ask another question?
    Any recommendation of a best value f/2.8 telephoto lens for Nikon, preferably AF-S type? *my body is a Nikon D40x
     
  5. ctjcad

    ctjcad Regular Member

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    ^^Okay..^^

    - Oh, i see. Then if you want to "optimize" it, then i think the best setting would be @ 70mm because that will give you the best aperture opening @ f/4. It's probably not big enough, but you can be creative with it (w/shutter speed or ISO variations). If you zoom longer, then you'll minimize your aperture opening.
    - I didn't know you're into baddy photog.;) If so, welcome and please do read the many threads in this sub-forum. I was in your shoes also not too long ago. But i've learned so many tips & tricks from the many photog masters here. Hopefully we'll see more of your pics in the future!:cool:
    - Hmmm...hmmm..best value AF-S telephoto lens @ f/2.8 for Nikon. Well, it depends how long of a focal length you want to go with. I know fast prime lenses can be pricey but they tend to take a bit sharper pics. I only notice there are only 2 AF-S type telephoto lenses @ f/2.8 for Nikon (300mm & 400mm Nikkor; i notice there's a 200mm @ f/2!).
    But if you want to compare, you can use this site, which i've used quite a bit to get other people's inputs; check the Nikkor lenses:
    http://photosig.pcphotoreview.com/cat/lenses/35mm-primes/PLS_3111_780_50crx.aspx
    Good luck!:)
     
    #45 ctjcad, Jun 26, 2009
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2009
  6. ways2rock

    ways2rock Regular Member

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    Hontou ni arigatou gozaimasu! I'll take not of every word of your tips :)
     
  7. ctjcad

    ctjcad Regular Member

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    ^^Btw..^^

    ..here's another thread which discusses sort of the same question/dilemma as yours.
    http://www.badmintoncentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=70633

    Value lens(es) for your camera might be out there, but they're probably being carried by different brands (Tamron, Sigma etc.). However, quality and performance (AF speed) might not be up to par with Nikon or Nikkor lenses.

    Oh, and if you haven't read the 1st page of this thread, there are some very sound advices given by some pretty good photographers themselves. And one of them actually owned a D70, a sister camera as your D40.:cool:
     
  8. chrisnchips

    chrisnchips Regular Member

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    Awesome Thread! :D

    I've learned so much from this thread and love Sigit's shot in those pix below. Is that a AT800def he's using?

    I have a D60 and am learning how to use it. I'm so glad I don't have to deal with all the complications of dealing with film cameras, but also hope I can learn to be good with both digital and film.

    Thanks Kwun for making this thread! and website! Whatever happened to 16feathers.com anyways?
     
  9. demolidor

    demolidor Regular Member

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    Before (already cropped to 4:3, possibly noise removal applied):
    [​IMG]

    After:
    [​IMG]

    Large:
    [​IMG]

    Rotate? Missed opportunity?
    [​IMG]

    Tilted angle adds to the action or a missed opportunity? Original still on my laptop but probably at full 200mm (ISO1600, f2.8 1/500; D70s)
     
  10. demolidor

    demolidor Regular Member

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    [​IMG]

    Cropping: a, b or c?

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Looking at these small version B looks best to me. C looses too much of the net having been impacted and A leaves a foot in and doesn't look as good in this small size ...
     
    #50 demolidor, Nov 3, 2010
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2010
  11. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    Hi,

    nice of you to post.

    In general, it's really up to you but what consistent features to get are:

    1) the tighter you crop, the more impact of the photo

    2) good facial expression can only add

    3) shuttle in the picture adds effect but not mandatory.
     
  12. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    IMHO, C is best. I almost never leave the side post in unless it's right at the edge of the picture.
     
  13. kwun

    kwun Administrator

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    there are many classes of badminton photos.

    many badminton photos are simply a closeup of the players, this is best to show the action and facial expression of the players. these are also the easiest to compose. like the simple rule of portraits, you can have the player centered or make use of the rule of 3rds.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    these are the easiest.

    as you advance, then you start to zoom out, these are the captures of either a pair of players, or the player + the environment.

    these require more thoughts and are harder to capture.

    firstly, you need to find the right action (badminton photos are mostly action anyway), or the right moment.

    adding in other elements starts to let the photo show more than just the person, now it will start to tell a story, a story of the match, or any incidents within the match, or simply a story that tells us whom is playing with/against whom.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    however, this is the part that is hard. as you include more and more elements into the photos, the extra elements need to contribute to the photo. otherwise, it will just cause the viewer to get confused by why those extra elements are there. at the least, it should be visually pleasing, or shows the environment the subject is in. the most difficult ones are one that actually illustrate what the photographer is trying to convey to the viewer/reader. top news photos by really great photographers always have these ability to tell a story from a photos. just look at the photos accompanying headline stories.

    as a rule, the wider your zoom out, the harder it is to make a proper composition. as you will inevitably include a lot of elements outside the main action. and all those element must fit into the photo in a way that make sense. that's why i always admire photographer who can shoot badminton with a wide angle lens.

    from your choices, i would choose C. A/B includes a lot of space that neither contribute to the visual nor the story telling of the photo. at least crop C shows some action and has the essential environment.
     
  14. demolidor

    demolidor Regular Member

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    :cool: Good pointers. Shuttle can be left out indeed, still looks okay ... Maybe next year I will be a little more active and get closer up :D. This was more or less my first time out with dslr, borrowed from my brother. Filming is so much less work ;)

    (Obviously I have endlessly read the threads here for settings and techniques [​IMG])
     
  15. demolidor

    demolidor Regular Member

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    And thanks for the summary kwun :). It was harder than I thought to keep shooting after the point had been scored to capture the expressions, etc. Or "harder", it hadn't crossed my mind initially until I had some wish I had shot that moments :eek:.
    C would be the logical choice yes and was what I first did but the entire effect of the net having been hit disappeared. Obviously it doesn't show at all in the pic but this was near match point, an easy halfcourt opportunity ... and mega-blasted into the net :D. I guess perhaps I would crop it even tighter now and only have Ikeda in the pic(?). Still experimenting, nothing serious anyway ...

    Had posted some more here already http://www.badmintoncentral.com/for...Open-the-matches-starting-from-Oct-20th/page3 (to page 6). Trying out lightroom and have only used the 4:3 or 1:1 cropping at full height or width so far ... if any.
     
    #55 demolidor, Nov 4, 2010
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2010
  16. om4r_s

    om4r_s Regular Member

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    which part of the court is the best spot for photographer?
     
  17. george@chongwei

    george@chongwei Regular Member

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    Beside the court:cool:
     
  18. demolidor

    demolidor Regular Member

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    Under the net ;)
     
  19. visor

    visor Regular Member

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    From the umpire's chair. ;)
     
  20. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    Hi Demolidor,

    I've picked a couple of photos of my preferences.

    Here, the larger photo is quite OK. I decided to try to crop closer. I really prefer the shuttle to be in the shot. The player is looking towards the direction of the shuttle and the opposite side of the net which is something I look for.
     

    Attached Files:

    #60 Cheung, Dec 7, 2010
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2010

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