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camera/lens restrictions at olympics

Discussion in 'Badminton Photography' started by Mini Me, Dec 13, 2007.

  1. Mini Me

    Mini Me New Member

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    i managed to get some tickets to the olympics badminton :D so now i need to worry about which camera/lenses to bring (or buy in the next 8 months :p). does anyone know what the stadium/olympic restrictions are, or what they were at previous olympics?

    in melbourne i've found that i can bring a 300mm f/4 to the football, but at the australian open tennis and f1gp they had a maximum limit of 200mm and wouldn't let me bring my cheapo 70-300mm although other people were allowed to bring their nice 70-200/2.8 lenses :confused: i would hate to carry a lot of heavy camera equipment all the way to the stadium only to be told that i'm not allowed to use them :mad:
     
  2. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    Put a teleconvertor and D300 on your wishlist.;) Bring in the 70-200/2.8 VR and you are set!!
     
  3. kwun

    kwun Administrator

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    if 200mm is the limit, then go all the way, buy the 200/2, and then get a 1.4x and a 2x TC. so you can have 200/2, 280/2.8 and 400/4 all in one lens!

    make sure your seat is good for badminton though, otherwise it will be all wasted.
     
  4. red00ecstrat

    red00ecstrat Regular Member

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    kwun, they won't actually judge by the focal length. they will in fact judge by the size!;) hehe....:D
     
  5. Mini Me

    Mini Me New Member

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    the nikkor 200/2 is worth more than my car :eek: d300 looks nice but it's not enough of an improvement on d200 to make it worthwhile upgrading yet. i'll be waiting for d400 or d500 :D

    i'm planning to bring a d200, 70-200 and 2x tc but that depends on whether i'll be allowed to bring them into the stadium. can anyone remember whether the general public was allowed to bring this type of equipment to the badminton in the last few olympics?
     
  6. manabu

    manabu Regular Member

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    Minime, have you tried to d300 yet? Its really a nice upgrade compared to the d200, take special notice in the noise under low light conditions, you will be amazed how well the Nikon now have caught up with Canon in that respect. Plus there wont b any d400 before the games I can assure you, so why not get yourself some USEFUL christmas present? hehhe (evil grin)
     
  7. Mini Me

    Mini Me New Member

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    i haven't touched a d300 yet and i don't want to, in case it infects me with buy-buy-buy syndrome :p besides, i already spent my xmas money on a 2nd hand 17-55/2.8. i can't afford any more camera goodies unless the lotto gods shine on me :p
     
  8. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    I thought you still had the D70.

    2x tele? You are losing 2 stops with that. I think it will be difficult if you have it on.
     
  9. Oldhand

    Oldhand Moderator

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    This Is A Painful Read (You Have Been Warned)

    I wouldn't worry too much about the available light levels.
    {kwun, cheung and Achan (and red too?) had an abundance of light at the Hong Kong Open, didn't they?} :p

    Typically, indoor stadia have around 1,000 lux general lighting and about 1,400 lux on the FOP (Field Of Play) as a requirement for live television.
    (Contact events like martial arts and fencing require at least 1,600 lux :))

    The lighting equation is different for the 2008 Beijing Olympic Games.
    This time, a much higher level of lighting has been planned.

    The main reasons are:
    1. Live TV coverage will be in High-Definition (HD cameras need plenty of well-directed light).
    2. The new super slow-motion cameras require brighter and very even lighting.
    3. Higher contrasts are required (spectator areas vs. action areas) for fine modelling (so that the action doesn't look flat).
    4. The ECU cameras (those dedicated to extreme close-ups) usually use range-extenders, which calls for an extra-extra dose of light (note that they are HD lenses too).

    Apologies for the long lesson :D
    Simply put, Mini Me's work plans sound quite OK :cool:

    However, the primary question still remains:
    Will they allow the photographic gear in? :(
    (...especially with those long, pokey lenses :p)
     
  10. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    Actually, no.

    There are some areas using ISO1600 with f2.8 only giving 1/320th sec.

    Let's assume the lighting is better in Beijing, then probably it will be at least 1 stop difference. Can it go to 2 stops difference? - I'm not sure how much light is needed.
     
  11. Oldhand

    Oldhand Moderator

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    I confess to knowing absolutely nothing about still cameras. :crying:
     
  12. kwun

    kwun Administrator

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    very interesting info!

    but how much is "much higher"?
     
  13. kwun

    kwun Administrator

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    i did some research on the net.

    1000 lux ~= 9EV.

    9 EV means we can get: ISO1600, f/2.8, 1/500s.

    for each EV (stop), we need double the Lux, so for one stop, we need 2000 lux, and for 2 stops, we need 4000 lux.
     
  14. Oldhand

    Oldhand Moderator

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    More...

    Alright, you asked for it... :p

    It greatly depends on the sport and its FOP.

    For instance, badminton's activity area is much much larger compared to that of, say, boxing or gymnastics (except the floor routines). Also, the pace of action in badminton is critically different from that in, say, wrestling.

    The lighting director for the sports venues (and, today, this is always a television guy) will typically have three different lighting arrangements, all of them tailored to meet TV coverage specifications:
    1. Normal Lighting - this is for spectator areas - all you need is to see the people and their reactions clearly - a single spectator's face is taken as the intensity guide
    2. Action Lighting - this is for the Field Of Play - the lighting must be sufficient to allow swift panning and must clearly define the features of the competitors and the principal referee
    3. High-Lighting - this is for the defining areas within the FOP - simply put, these are the spots that generate the majority of action-replays - e.g., the net in volleyball, within the 3-point line and the key (the free-throw lane) in basketball, the tunnel (the dive trajectory) in diving, etc

    800 lux is standard for spectator fills, 1000-1200 is the norm for the arena (the FOP), 1,200-1,400 is the norm for low-slow-mo (e.g., swimming, wrestling, the balance beam) and 1400-1600 is the minimum for high-slow-mo (e.g., badminton, fencing, basketball). Of course, these levels are for SD (Standard Definition) cameras.

    Since HD requires at least 1.5 times the SD intensity to achieve a clean, fluid picture without motion artifacts and edge blurs, anything less than 2,500 lux in the defining areas is bound to be less than satisfactory for fast-action sports.

    Given that higher intensities might interfere with the conduct of the sport and the performance of the competitors, HD cameras with range extenders might be out of the question in indoor arenas. :)

    In any case, I'd be surprised if they provide 3,000 lux indoor, much less 4,000. :cool:
     
  15. Mini Me

    Mini Me New Member

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    i switched from d70 to d200 about 18 months ago :D i've got 2x tc but i found that usually i can only use 1.4x tc when indoors. i lost too much light with 2x.
     
  16. Mini Me

    Mini Me New Member

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    malaysian open 2005 was the same - correct exposure was iso1600 f2.8 1/320s. i had to deliberately underexpose to get 1/400s and adjust the exposure in photoshop.
     
  17. viver

    viver Regular Member

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    D300 review. Read at your own risk ... :D

    http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/nikon/d300-review/index.shtml


     
  18. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    Yeah, look at the ISO3200 performance;) That's what you need!
     
  19. kwun

    kwun Administrator

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    4000 Lux will be at least 2 stops brighter than HK Open. that will be quite something. i cannot imagine taking badminton photos at 1/1000s and then at the same time go as slow as ISO400.

    but wouldn't we know already? have they already installed the lighting system? they had a test event in the stadium a few months ago, right?
     
  20. taneepak

    taneepak Regular Member

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    Oldhand, do you know what types of lighting are being used in badminton avenues? Is it fluorescent or other types? For really good colour reproduction when taking photos, the stadium's colour rendering index from the lighting must be close to Ra 100, which I don't believe fluorescents can deliver. For HDTV does the small size of a badminton court require 2,000 lux for one court?
     

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