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counter against good fast drop?

Discussion in 'Techniques / Training' started by delmonk, Jul 26, 2014.

  1. delmonk

    delmonk Regular Member

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    I'm a mid level doubles player, my style is consists of a consistant short serve when I'm in front, and consistant heavy smashing mixed in with drops to the center of the court when I'm in back. I would smash twice at a player then drop to the center. When they lob my drop I would smash it at one of the player that is backing up. This is a pretty strategy and I can score alot of points just off my smash. The problem now is that
    my opponents got smarter, rarely clear to me play fast drops all day which are not my strong points.
    At first these fast drop would be outright winners, then I start trying to practice the split step. I would try to return their drop with net shot but this is difficult because the drop is fast and my net shot end up too high or hit the net if I try to slice it. The net player in front can kill it.
    Then I try lifting all drops but sometimes i lift it out, or the lift is too shallow and they can smash it. Or they can clear it at my partner which may not have a solid back game.
    Whats a good way to defend against this type of fast drop?

    Also what is a good way to train playing in the front? The bird flies so fast that all I can do is either a net block or a lift, if I try to intercept it I either mishit it or it goes out.
     
  2. visor

    visor Regular Member

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    If they're able to play a fast drop, that means your side must have lifted. So first off try not to lift, and if you do, it has to be high and deep to baseline.
     
  3. visor

    visor Regular Member

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    If you do have to lift, best to approach it so that you can lift with your backhand. Much faster, more powerful, and higher than forehand lift.

    Practice drills with your partner so that he's doing fast drops at you and you're lifting high and deep without going put. Do that a few hundred times and both of you will benefit from it. Then reverse it so that you're doing the fast drops and he's doing the lifts.
     
    #3 visor, Jul 26, 2014
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2014
  4. mater

    mater Regular Member

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    Exactly, visor is often more correct than not. What the OP posted, only suggest that practice and practice and practice, can only help. Just keep at it to improve your game, somewhere along the lines of practicing and more playing, you will find little gaps in the opponents' defense.
     
  5. alien9113

    alien9113 Regular Member

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    Besides lifting, there may be other issues to look at.

    1. Footwork and recovery. Being bad at either footwork or recovery will open up areas for exploits. You might want to get someone to observe your footwork and recovery and correct some habits and mistakes.

    2. Positioning. Such drops usually work because both players are not anywhere near the front court and may be fairly deep into the back court.

    3. Racket preparation. In a lot of casual play, players don't prepare at all. It opens up the front court for exploits. Either the shuttle is taken too low, or if an ambitious shot is attempted (e.g. netting), the chances of errors are higher. If you watch pros play, be it singles or doubles, you will notice that if they anticipated a shot to their fore court, when getting to the shuttle, their racket is already taking aim at the shuttle, ready to lift or net back.

    Try taking a video of you and your partner playing and review it to improve. If you can't spot any issues, you can get someone to look at it and comment.
     
  6. MSeeley

    MSeeley Regular Member

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    Not sure I can completely agree with this - against a well positioned opponent, doing a fast drop will still do its job - to maintain the attack, normally forcing a lift. You are right though - it won't be a winner unless people are at the back court.

    To the original poster - a fast drop is a very good shot at all levels of play. It will be too fast and too far away from the net to play a good net shot - thats why they are doing it. If you are unable to lift their shot properly, then you need to practice. The best way to deal with these shots however, is to try to take them early in the mid court/around the service line, and play a push to your opponents mid court in the straight tramline. This means the front court player will not intercept it, and will force the back court player to come forwards and is faced with a tough shot.

    If you take the fast drop too late, you don't have much option other than to lift - the whole point of the fast drop is that it limits your opponent - difficult to counter hit (as no pace to work with), and difficult to play to the net. The push is risky if taken too late, so the only option left is to lift it.

    Worth noting - fast drops ONLY work, if your opponent has a good smash and uses it often (or a good punch clear). If they only play drops, then just stand at the front and kill them when they come. Easy :)

    Good luck!
     
  7. delmonk

    delmonk Regular Member

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    A midcourt push to the sidelines, the trajectory will have to be upward since the drop is fast and already going downward when it crosses the net. This will work against a lower level front and back pair. It is a OK tactic to use against a mid level pair, whose response would generally be to block it over the net( this is the level where I am at and my preferred response). Against higher level opponent I found this to be a terrible idea as they are actually fast enough to be able to smash these. Its too hard to be able to return a smash from mid court.

    Netshotting a fastdrop is out of the question, it will be too high and the net opponent can pounce on it.

    Crosscourt netshots aren't my specialty and also tend to be too error prone.

    I found a crosscourt lift to be a bad idea too against a fast opponent. It also tends to be more error prone, can end up going to the middle instead or being too shallow/going out. Also your partner may not be ready for it and get smashed at.

    A lift to the middle gives the opponent too many attacking options.

    Generally when faced with a fast drop against a well positioned opponent, it seems that the safest and only shot available is a deep high lift down the line. I will be lifting directly back at them, and this will allow them to play any shot of choice, they can hit another fast drop which will force me to lift back at them again. Or they can hit a cross court fast drop which will force my partner into the same predicament as me. Or if the lift is too shallow they can smash at me.
     
  8. amleto

    amleto Regular Member

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    wait, what shot is being smashed by better level players? The fast drop or the block reply? In either case these shot's can't be smashed unless the shot is more like a poor clear/lift :confused:
     
  9. DuckFeet

    DuckFeet Regular Member

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    Isnt the trajectory same as low serve, so push to sides, net to middle or a good lift if you have to/want to practice smash defense?
     
  10. delmonk

    delmonk Regular Member

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    When I push a shot to the mid court sidelines in response to a fast drop. Sometimes the front or rear court opponent is fast enough to smash these.
     
  11. delmonk

    delmonk Regular Member

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    The trajectory of a good fast drop is the same as a low serve. However the pace is much faster so a net the middle will be too high and result in a net kill by opponents. Push to the side is better but against fast opponents they can smash these. Lift is only option.
     
  12. visor

    visor Regular Member

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    Yep, if you watch the pros, if they feel they can't do any good block or push reply to the fast drop, they would just hit a high deep lift to "reset" the play. This would at least give them another opportunity to look for a counterattack.

    Of course, if as Matt says all your opponent does is only fast drop, then you can easily anticipate to intercept and counterattack with a drive to the opposite corner.

    Meanwhile, practice those high deep lifts! Imo they are very useful and are not practiced enough.
     
  13. amleto

    amleto Regular Member

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    that's a net kill, not a smash.
     
  14. visor

    visor Regular Member

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    He did say push to midcourt sidelines... so I'd say midcourt smash.
     
  15. amleto

    amleto Regular Member

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    push doesn't go high enough for a smash...
     
  16. visor

    visor Regular Member

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    Well... most likely his shot is a very poor push from a low position. He's probably replying to the fast drop when it's only a foot off the ground.
     
  17. alien9113

    alien9113 Regular Member

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    More practice would be good. A lack of variation in your games won't help... once you can vary your shots, your opponents will be much more wary of playing such a shot.
     
  18. amleto

    amleto Regular Member

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    When playing at club you can get very familiar with people's games and technique. There is a way to counter faster drops without even improving your defensive technique against them: Watch, study & analyse when & how others play this shot against you. Then when you predict this shot move your base forward, or just take up a central-ish front player's position. If any kind of drop is played then you're there for the net kill! Of course you're now in front/back positioning so your partner has a lot of court to cover for a smash/clear.

    This is not an objectively good thing to do, it's a mind game/mix-it-up-at-club-night tactic.
     
  19. delmonk

    delmonk Regular Member

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    I've tried this and I do it all the time, especially when I'm the cross court defender on the right side. I would stand closer to the neck so I can netkill any crosscourt fast drop. But that is much easier said than done. A good crosscourt fast drop comes fast and at an angle already going downward below the net after passing it, that I find if I try to netkill it I would hit it into the net half the time.

    My usual and safest response to this would be a forehand lift to opponent's backhand corner.
     
    #19 delmonk, Jul 28, 2014
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2014
  20. delmonk

    delmonk Regular Member

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    Regardless of whether its a smash or netkill, the point is the back or usually the front opponent is able to come out of nowhere and hit a fast shot straight me from midcourt while I am still moving back to ready position.
     

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