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"Faster" swing = more power? opinions please

Discussion in 'Techniques / Training' started by Boaster, Feb 24, 2010.

  1. stumblingfeet

    stumblingfeet Regular Member

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    Yes, a faster swing speed will result in more power. That can't really be disputed.

    However, in practice focusing your attention on trying to swing as fast as possible can possibly lead to decreased performance. Here an example:

    tell a beginner/intermediate to swing as hard as possible, and you will see someone put a lot effort into what amounts to an average amount of power. For any human movement, there are muscles that contribute to the movement, others that absorb/slow down the movement, and others positioned laterally that absorb excess forces from the first two types. You need to get the right muscles to fire or release at the right time; if you can't do this, it's like pressing the accelerator down while pressing the brakes.
     
  2. pBmMalaysia

    pBmMalaysia Regular Member

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    as druss and cooler puts it scientifically, yes the equation and explanation is there but i think its very hard for most readers to understand...

    what kwun and stumblingfeet puts in is easier to understand for most readers and yes, i agree:

    1/ at the end the player has to find out the suitable maxima point (kwun) and

    2/ a clear explanation and a good example - 'You need to get the right muscles to fire or release at the right time; if you can't do this, it's like pressing the accelerator down while pressing the brakes' (stumblingfeet).

    in theory faster speed more power but in real world its the player's ability...understand first then practice and try it out...
     
  3. cooler

    cooler Regular Member

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    my reply was to only answering the 'what' of the thread title subject. I did not went into the when, where and how to use speed. The real answer can be said in 1 line or a whole thesis, it depend on what one is really asking for. The math part was only to clarify the limitation of momentum conservation.
     
  4. ixoye

    ixoye Regular Member

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    This is the formula:
    F=ma

    F - force
    m - mass (a portion of body weight)
    a - acceleration (of the racket head)

    But speed is different:
    V=d/t

    V - velocity or speed
    d - distance
    t - time

    What we need is high acceleration:
    a=V/t

    a - acceleration
    V - velocity
    t - time

    Something like that. ;)
     
    #44 ixoye, Mar 10, 2010
    Last edited: Mar 10, 2010
  5. stansilas4

    stansilas4 New Member

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    no doubt faster swing= more power... but that itself is counterintuitive... a faster swing speed is related to many factors (technique)...
     
  6. cooler

    cooler Regular Member

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    i like correct myself, the real answer can be said in 1 word or a whole thesis.
    That one word to this thread is, 'yes'.
     
  7. pBmMalaysia

    pBmMalaysia Regular Member

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    it depends..in theory yes, in practical i wish it can just be true so my coaching easier.
    2-3 years ago a man came to see me with his racket as he thought he has a problem with it. this man has arm bigger than my calf and he said 'the ball just don't move'. i took a look at his racket, tension, string and speed of shuttle and everything looks fine so in the end i decided to take a look at how he play.

    whenever he lobs he makes a thunderous sound and it was true, the ball didn't move lol. he got a pan grip and he strikes the shuttle with a slice!

    what do you think of that?:D
     
  8. pBmMalaysia

    pBmMalaysia Regular Member

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    yes, you are right and you must have experienced that!:D
     
  9. NoRice4U

    NoRice4U Regular Member

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    its about equilibrium, obtain a balance between Speed and Power, if you have balance you need to enhance your Speed and Power to perform more powerful shots
     
  10. Addict123

    Addict123 Regular Member

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    To bring up some points not mentioned yet:

    * Except in pro levels, I believe working on technique (i.e., how exactly to hold or turn the racket, and where exactly to hit the shuttle, and consistency from one smash to the next) has much more influence than the bare swinging speed. As mentioned above, the speed matters only near the tiny time slot of the actual hit, not before and not after.

    * For example, people say that you should relax your grip at most times, but tighten it just at the impact point. Aside from letting you play longer, this means that at the point of impact, the resistance your racket offers to the ball is much larger - not only the weight of the racket influences the shuttle, but also your wrist-arm-body as that system is rather tight (just at the impact point). Mental experiment: hit just at fast, but *relax* your fingers to the extreme, at the point of impact, and you'll notice that the smash will be very weak indeed as much less force is transfered to the shuttle (instead, the racket will be braked much more).

    * Even under the assumption that the racket speed matters much, for practical reasons, it does not help in any way since it does not tell you how to achieve that speed. I.e., which of the parts of the system should be involved most (shoulder, upper arm, lower arm, wrist).
     
  11. Gollum

    Gollum Regular Member

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    Ultimately, generating power is all about two things:

    • Racket head speed on impact
    • A clean contact (non-sliced)

    The trouble is that what feels to the player like a fast movement of the racket often is actually quite slow. We're also not really built for generating speed through a linear movement: good technique relies on rotating the racket head during the swing, which converts angular momentum of the racket head into linear momentum of the shuttle.

    So it's all about racket head speed, but this isn't necessarily a useful coaching point. When you tell a player to swing the racket as fast as he can, the racket head speed often does down (as stumblingfeet explained). ;)
     
  12. pBmMalaysia

    pBmMalaysia Regular Member

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    gollum, those 2 things can be classified under physical & skill?
     
  13. cooler

    cooler Regular Member

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    My answer is same as before: Yes
     
  14. pBmMalaysia

    pBmMalaysia Regular Member

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    yes, you are right, theory-man! absolutely correct!:)
     
  15. cooler

    cooler Regular Member

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    nope, in real life too, up to speed of light before i change my answer.
     
  16. pBmMalaysia

    pBmMalaysia Regular Member

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    faster swing = more power, would this create a higher impact sound than slower swing = little power?:D
     
  17. cooler

    cooler Regular Member

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    nice try there to bait me into an off topic debate.
    no can do lah.
    u should spread your enquiries around to other members as well since my answer after your downgrade rating might not meet your high standard.:p
    try here http://www.badmintoncentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=74716&highlight=sound
     
  18. pBmMalaysia

    pBmMalaysia Regular Member

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    well, as you put it your way of telling me it's gonna be a boom sound for a faster swing then i presumed the guy with hands bigger than my calf was actually farting as he hit or just pure boom sound..but funny as i still remember he said 'the ball don't move'...:p
     

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