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Opinion on search function

Discussion in 'General Forum' started by Cheung, Apr 16, 2003.

  1. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    good?

    no good?

    Why no good?
    no success
    can't be bothered thinking of the correct search term,
    too many threads,
    can't be bothered reading,
    can't be bothered thinking
    easier to post up a question instead
    time management problem (explain)
    language difficulty
    too difficult to use
     
  2. bigredlemon

    bigredlemon Regular Member

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    i think it's great. One problem though, you can choose to search for a certain string in the title AND a different string in the body of a post. That would make filtering a little bit better but probably too difficult to implement by us.
     
  3. Neil Nicholls

    Neil Nicholls Regular Member

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    Generally good, but...

    How would I search for
    string AND bg AND ti AND ( 65 OR 68 ) ?

    THe search page says
    Advanced query: Join words with AND, OR and NOT to control your search in more detail.

    but...

    string AND bg AND ti AND 65 OR 68
    seems to return ( string AND bg AND ti AND 65 ) OR 68

    string AND bg AND ti AND ( 65 OR 68 )
    seems to return ( string AND bg AND ti AND 65 ) OR 68

    am I just being slow today, or will it not do what I want?
     
  4. DanielLou

    DanielLou Regular Member

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    Don't bother those complicated things, ppls aren't going to use them anyway. Think about searching the Web...... how often do you guys use the advanced searching options or compose searching string with "OR", "AND", "NEAR", "AT", or "LINK" modifiers?

    Just keep it simple, which is very important. One thing might be worth trying is to rank of search results by relative scores. Of course, to cut down the total number of threads, an ultimate solution would be automatically clustering similar posts/threads into one. Worth a PhD thesis if one does it really nicely. :D no kidding. I'd like to try some experiments, if Cheung or Mag would give me a copy of the forum.
     
  5. TheGr8One

    TheGr8One Regular Member

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    It would be nice to be able to search a phrase instead of just words.
     
  6. prophet

    prophet Regular Member

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    Overall, the search function needs some better filters. Whenever I've used the search function, the most obvious queries receive far too many threads. Any query with smash, backhand, clears, strings, etc. will receive many, many threads.

    I like the idea that TheGr8One suggested, a search with phrases instead of words i.e. sort of like (www.ask.com) or a filter that ranks the word matches in order of probability of success.

    A third suggestion is for search matches for questions that always seem to get repeatedly asked; e.g. how do I smash better, how to do backhand clears, etc. - these queries should have a seperate page, maybe a top ten of questions? This would be similar to FAQ but with questions asked and the thread links (with rankings) that answers those questions.
     
  7. bigredlemon

    bigredlemon Regular Member

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    you do that put putting quotes around the phrase you're searching for


    Neil Nicholls,
    you can type: string and bg and ti and 68 or 88
    the search will presume you have brackets around the last operator. but you can't mimic advanced functions ie.
    Code:
    search Ti10 and (bg and (68 or 88) and ti) or mp100 and (bg and (85 or 65)
     
  8. TheGr8One

    TheGr8One Regular Member

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    I've tried searching with quotes, doesn't work here.
     
  9. Yodums

    Yodums Regular Member

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    Personally, it's a great tool however most of the times people are too lazy to use it. I don't know if you guys visit other forums but if you've ever visited forums with alot of traffic, you'll see the same questions over and over. It's nothing that you can prevent like I've mentioned in the other thread.

    Sometimes when people give threads using the search function, they don't check the threads theirselves. It does not answer the queston asked in the topic at all.

    I've actually got used to answering repetitive questons on the other forum.

    Another suggestion is stickying on the forums that you have FAQs since people don't bother visiting the FAQ forum.

    Yodums
     
  10. bigredlemon

    bigredlemon Regular Member

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    works fine for me
     
  11. JChen99

    JChen99 Regular Member

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    There are too many threads that discuss the identical things. Merging them would make it more efficient for the search function to work. However, that's translates to more work for the Mods... which I doubt u guys are willing to do :p
     
  12. Neil Nicholls

    Neil Nicholls Regular Member

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    searching with quotes (double or single) doesn't work for me

    searching for

    string and bg and ti and 68 or 88

    returns threads that only have 88 in them
    e.g. the "pirce of MP-100" thread
     
  13. bigredlemon

    bigredlemon Regular Member

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    yea i think you are right. I guess you could use
    string and bg and ti and ?8
    but it's not as versitile
     
  14. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    Actually, we have considered that before. One problem is that threads are fairly often have slightly different questions. So merging may not be quite appropriate.

    As for advanced Boolean logic, one of the salient features I believe in is to keep things simple.
    Just like video games. I used to love Streetfighter. But they came out with so many different versions, my cashflow couldn't keep up. Now, it takes too long to learn.:(
     
  15. Neil Nicholls

    Neil Nicholls Regular Member

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    Update:

    I believe the brackets and quotes now work properly. Probably since an upgrade.

    So now we can do complex ANDing and ORing
    and search for phrases
     
  16. Kamen

    Kamen Regular Member

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    My answer is good but it will be easier to post a new question.

    Personally, i have been to other forums with high traffic flow and the mods over there do not care about repetitive posts. I think many newbies over here are put off when their first post is replied by, "Please do a search, this topic has been covered before". Since they are a newbie, how would they know?
    Badminton central is a forum. A forum is a place where badminton fans communicate with each other. Hence, people will register in order to communicate with other badminton fans throughout the world. It may be an experience which a newbie might want to relate but more often than not, it is a question.

    To state it differently, if badminton central is an archive, then i guess a newbie's expectation is to search in the hope that he or she will get an answer. But as we all know, this site is not an archive but a forum.

    Repetitive posts are unavoidable particularly on a high traffic forum.

    However, i think you mods could set a rule to ask members to post the question in the topic. Then again, i think most internet users will have known the ethic by asking his or hers question on the title anyway. In doing so, it will eliminate the inconvenience caused to other members. I recall that Kwun told me once when a member stumble to a repost and his reaction is "not again!". If the question is written in the title, this will not happen.
     
  17. quisitor

    quisitor Regular Member

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    It's been suggested that due to the inherently different backgrounds and preferences of forum members, the current standard for users may be a pareto-optimal solution. And in fact it could be argued that almost any quasi-reasonable standard for user conduct and etiquette may be a pareto-optimal solution.

    In searching-- no pun intended-- for the general equilibrium standard, normative considerations may include (limiting the number of continually revisited threads for older members who do not enjoy such repetitiveness) and (the continual fostering of an inviting and welcoming atmosphere for individuals of all skill levels and degrees of knowledge). It has been suggested that the latter might be characterized by an environment in which users may be free of the trepidation of "asking stupid questions". If part of the mission statement of this website is consistent with the ideal of increasing the popularity of the sport and assisting all individuals in gaining a greater appreciation and love for the game then the aforementioned second potentially normative consideration may bear a weight not inferior to the first.

    The question then becomes: Given our current endowment, what tools at our disposal may be employed to foster greater mutual consideration, respect and love for the game, the forum and its community of members. Two tools that may be available include the process of signing up as a new member and induced preferences.

    While excessively verbose EULAs (end-user license agreements) may not always be read with the utmost of thoroughness, there may exist space in the new user form for a few major pointers. Demarcation of desired points in boldface and/or increased font size may provide a stark contrast to the background, which may allow the reader to realize the large emphasis placed on them.

    E.g.:

    ----------

    1. Before starting a new thread do a thorough search to see if your topic has been covered before.

    2. Before starting a new thread do a thorough search to see if your topic has been covered before.

    3. Before starting a new thread do a thorough search to see if your topic has been covered before.

    4. The 4th commandment.
    (E.g. Be a nice dude)

    5. We're a friendly bunch. Enjoy your stay and we encourage you to become active in the discussions.

    ----------

    Given that the forum prohibits postings from non-members, the new member form may provide a vehicle for reaching the desired target audience.

    Induced preferences, as applied here, may involve the encouragement of individuals to adopt and prefer certain norms. If they can derive utility from the accomplishment of a self-initiated successful search, the behaviour may be positively self-reinforcing.

    One possible application might be to market the search function more aggressively. Its current placement in the middle of a relatively small-sized toolbar that aesthetically blends beautifully with the foreground but pragmatically may blend too beautifully, may be lost to the uninitiated new member. Members logging in could be automatically referred to a default webpage listing the top 10 FAQs (there may exist an equipment-related bias here) on a single page with a large search window in the middle or bottom of the page. Speculation suggests many new users to the Internet are happy to engage in major search engine searches when the result is a wealth of information and knowledge, the extent to which was not previously envisioned. Thus the size of the search window and the amount of effort required to reach the search window may be factors limiting the prevalence of their use among new members. Naturally, a simple modification of an individual's user settings may prevent the redirection of a member to this type of default homepage. However, it is conceivable that a slight correlation may exist between a new member's inertia in utilizing the search function and inertia in the adjustment of one's user settings.
    And if new users prefer the inertia of not logging in to browse through threads then the redirection to a default FAQ+Search homepage may coincide with the new users' desire to post (potentially a new thread).


    P.S. Original, Championship Edition and Hyper Edition were the only versions worth playing. The other editions were excessive money-marketing schemes that cheapened the game and took the beauty out of it. :cool:
     

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