# Physics - Impossible not to hit it over the net

Discussion in 'Techniques / Training' started by Phil, Dec 27, 2002.

1. ### Phil Regular Member

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Well, I have finished one day of a badminton camp for a team selection, and I learned quite a few things today. It just so happens that one of the coaches is a physics teacher, and this is what he had to say.

At the baseline/backcourt, as long as you are taller than the net, and hit the shuttle above your head, due to the equations and physics involved, it is impossible NOT to hit the shuttle over the net, unless you "choose," to hit it down into the net.

Interesting, no? He says that many people when they hit a drop shot from the backcourt, they think of hitting a drop, and hit it down into the net, and instead you should be thinking clear and then if you want to drop then hit it softer but with the same stroke and it will always go over.

Anyone else heard of anything like this? I think he is a great coach, as well one of his players has a national junior title and is currently ranked first in the province. He has been coaching for 30-some-odd years.

If anyone wants, I could ask him tomorrow for the equations/explanations used to formulate his theory.

Phil

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2. ### iwannaeatkimmy Regular Member

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i can hit the shuttle in the net. wanna bet?

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3. ### Joseph Regular Member

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I dont think you understood what Phil was trying to explain. Im guessing its rather complicated if you dont understand the physics behind it all. Sure you can hit it into the net, but that's only if you "intend" to. If you just hit it normally above your head and wishing to hit it over the net, then it should go over the net according to physics.

What physics equations did he use? Im really interested on this whole subject. This year, im taking physics ap and would like to know. Was it potention energy? kinetic energy? conservation of energy? does it also involve torque? speaking of torque, i think i finally understand why some raquets are a bit longer than others...to increase power right? of course i think there are other reasons behind the length...

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4. ### Joanne Regular Member

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Hey, that's cool! So if you don't think that the shuttle will go into the net, it won't?

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5. ### iwannaeatkimmy Regular Member

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this wont work for you =/ he said if you are taller than the net =P

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6. ### Californian Regular Member

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True--as long as you don't hit it too softly.

The only things that differentiate the overhead shots--smash, drop, clear--and the underhand equivalents--drive, drop, clear--are the force with which the shuttle is struck and the angle of the racket face at the point of contact. If you hit a shuttle into the net, you've used the wrong combination of force and racket angle.

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7. ### iwannaeatkimmy Regular Member

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well but then i can prove with physics that its not possible to clear less than 2 meters out if you dont hit softer than it takes to clear 2 meters out. so whats the point? i dont get it.

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8. ### chrisgin Regular Member

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I don't quite get it either. Let me see if I understand what's been said.

It's impossible to hit the shuttle into the net if:

a) You're taller than the net
b) You hit the shuttle upwards
c) You don't intend to hit it into the net
d) You don't hit it too softly

Point d is the bit that I don't get. Surely you could then say it's impossible to hit a smash into the net so long as you don't misjudge the angle. The fact that judgement still comes into it means that it's very possible to hit the net (or not even make it to the net).

Or am I missing the point?

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9. ### Cheung Moderator

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Maybe the coach is trying to say

"if you want to do a drop, don't think of the aiming for the tape of the net. Just pretend you are hitting a clear and try and take some pace off the shuttle"

The usefulness depends on the interpretation. Some people would slow their stroke down so much, the opponent can spot the drop coming. The stroke should look similar in speed to a clear.

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10. ### Joanne Regular Member

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I am taller then the net!!!!! But it didn't work. I tried it at class. lol.

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11. ### iwannaeatkimmy Regular Member

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joanne youre funny

btw i dont want my drops to pass the net high and then drop pretty straight down. id rather have em pass the net low and then drop down. if some of em hit the net thats the price i have to pay for the times it does work i guess.

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12. ### zero Regular Member

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What do you mean by taller than the net? Your head above the net? Or the racquet head above the net?

Is it true that the taller you are, the easier it is to hit the drop shots too?...
Cause the ranked first in the province is around how tall? 6 foot 5?....

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13. ### Phil Regular Member

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zero: Taller than the net meaning your actual height is above 5 feet. I don't know if being taller helps with drops, because a parabola for say, a shuttle will eventually drop vertically. BTW, are you playing at the High Performance circuit in Ottawa? I'll most likely be at that one.

iwannaeatkimmy: Aside from your jibe about the clearing less than 2 metres out which I couldn't comprehend, the point is that physics proves that with a proper stroke, you should NEVER hit a drop into the net. Of course, you don't want your drops to go high and drop close to the net, even the most novice player will be able to put it away. And, if some of your shots hit the net and you're willing to settle for that, you shouldn't. You need to strive for no mistakes in practice.

Cheung: Exactly.

chrisgin: Point "b)you hit the shuttle upwards" is not part of this. All this is assuming you use a proper stroke for a clear but do not hit it as hard. As for point c, it means when people want to hit a drop, they think "drop," and they aim to hit the shuttle downwards, which is not correct. This is the "choosing," to hit it into the net.

I asked him about it at lunch today, and he said that badminton has the net set at 5 feet because most people are taller than this. When you reach with your racquet to hit the shuttle, the contact point is around 10 feet or higher for people taller than 5 feet. Because of the parabolic trajectory produced by whatever physics are involved in the racquet hitting the shuttle (I didn't bother asking too deeply into the values involved), the shuttle will always pass over the 5 foot net.

When I was warming up with some drops from the baseline, I thought clear and it would always go over unless I tried to hit it too softly and it would float into the net. Later, when he saw me practicing drops from the back, he told me to not aim down at the net, but to think clear and aim for a spot about where the front service line is on my side of the court.

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Last edited: Dec 28, 2002
14. ### iwannaeatkimmy Regular Member

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whats there not to undertand? i can prove with physics that your car wont overtake mine if i drive faster than you. thats about like saying you cant hit the net if you dont hit the shuttle too soft >.<
of course you dont hit the net if you dont hit the shuttle too soft. ppl try hitting the ball not too soft so it wont hit the net nor too hard so it wont go too long whenever they play a drop.

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15. ### iwannaeatkimmy Regular Member

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oh and im pretty sure noone here when playing a drop from the base line aims downwards anyway. i think ppl are aware of the fact that you cant do a drop from the base line with the same stroke you do one when standing at the net.

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16. ### zero Regular Member

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I want to, but I cannot since it's such a far drive!!....
But I will be at the Ajax one.

Have you been to the other HP circuit tournies yet? The Woodstock, KW Granite, or Boulevard?

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17. ### Joanne Regular Member

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Oh. No wonder.

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18. ### iwannaeatkimmy Regular Member

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wanna tell me how tall you are? when i was your age i was like 4 feet at best i think.

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19. ### Phil Regular Member

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zero: I might not be going to the Ottawa one because it is a far drive, but my region is subsidizing a team to go, and I may be on it. I'll be at the Ajax one for sure since its closer. I have not gone to any of the previous HP tourneys, mainly because of transportation and timing problems.

iwannaeatkimmy: Have you ever hit a drop from the baseline into the net? I have. We didn't have proper stroke technique. We thought of hitting a "drop," and guess what happened? All this is proving that you should NEVER hit a drop into the net from the baseline. Of course you shouldn't use a net kill stroke to hit a drop from the back. But many players think of hitting a "drop," and they angle their racquet head downwards, which is the "aiming" to hit the net part. Try this next time you do drops from the baseline, imagine yourself clearing until the last possible moment, and then hit it softer. At least for me, my drops are much more consistent when I do this.

Phil

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20. ### Joanne Regular Member

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Hmm....I'm 4 feet 9. At least few months ago.

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