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Returning serve to agressive players

Discussion in 'Techniques / Training' started by Ecko123, Mar 29, 2006.

  1. Ecko123

    Ecko123 Regular Member

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    Ok, here's the problem.

    I play doubles fine, except for this one team. After the serve, (I don't know if they guess or they're just extremely fast) they jump up at the net to hit down our returns. It's not like the returns are massive pop-ups (we're better than THAT :p). They do it to our pushes too. Sometimes I deliberatly push it at them, because I can often hit their shaft or handle. We got raped the other day, they did it probably 8 times in one game.

    Any way I can counter this? I've tried waiting a bit to see if they make the first move but they don't usually until I move my racquet.
     
  2. chessymonkey

    chessymonkey Regular Member

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    Net rusher can become a pain in dee ass sometimes
    if they really do rush that often, then u should mix in more flick serves
    to make them stay put instead of wellcome them to the net.
    But still flicks would just be a small percentages and u will
    have to make short serves head on no matter.
    If you can keep your serves low at good quality,
    As net rusher tend to rush toward the net as soon as they decided its
    a short serve, i would serve right into their face, giving them less time to react cos they'r running straight into the bird.
    As long as your serve is tight and stay low to the tape, most they can do is #1 brush the bird a bit and drop back at the net, which is nothing special and u should be ready to get it.
    #2 flat drive push back to your 2 back corner. With a little anticipation your partner should have no problem picking them up.
    So net rusher are annoying no matter but they'r not Deadly as long as you keep yr serve tight. Plus sometimes i would throw in a few "uncertain" serve
    thats just abit short. So they have to Think before they react, in return they become slower to react making the return easier to pick up.
    So u bump into some net rusher that doesn't think and rush the net no matter, u can really try serving shorter and shorter, cos as u serve shorter
    the bird drop below the tape quicker and most they can do is a simple flat drive. The look on their face is funny as they KNEW its a short but their body reacted to the bird anyway. So they get confuse eventually they will learn to play less aggessively
     
  3. Gollum

    Gollum Regular Member

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    I think you should ask them to stop doing that; it must be very distracting :D

    Er...anyway: develop and use a good flick serve. Keep using it if it wins you points, and eventually they will start standing further back.

    If their flick serve returns are just as effective as their low serve returns, then you have a real challenge. You will need to improve the quality of your serve.

    It's also worth developing a deceptive wide low serve to the tramlines, although this is quite difficult on the backhand.
     
  4. DinkAlot

    DinkAlot dcbadminton
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    Another effective way is to...hard to explain, do a pull back serve. That is regardless whether it's a normal or flick serve, practice pulling the racket back all the way to your chest like you are going to do a flick serve. Learn how to do a normal and flick serve with this method and the aggressive returner will not attack your serve because they cannot tell what type of serve you are going to do. It takes a bit of practice but it's very effective.

    I mix the pull back with my normal serve and now, not even the top players attack my serve. :D
     
  5. Gollum

    Gollum Regular Member

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    Whatever method you use for your service, it should be impossible to read until very shortly before impact. The service relies on deception to be effective.

    Make the preparation and hitting actions as similar as possble until the last moment.
     
  6. tze yang

    tze yang Regular Member

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    one other way, might not be the best...ur partner shld be ready to cover the court that is open to the receiver when u serve and the server shld raise his racket high and be ready to return their fast pushes...

    Hope u understand what i mean...i know its a lil hard to understand
     
  7. DinkAlot

    DinkAlot dcbadminton
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    Well, sometimes it's impossible for your partner to cover. Sometimes the opponents push is just too fast and just too good. It's up to the server to minimize that. :)
     
  8. chessymonkey

    chessymonkey Regular Member

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    yah thats what i feel as well
    the server really need to work it out in order to limit
    the quality of the serve return, or your partner will
    get really helpless at the back.
    The more u know your own partner the easier it gets.
    Cos the guy at the back knows what you can and can not do.
    and he can better predict the return.
     
  9. valourarc

    valourarc Regular Member

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    I may be reading this wrong but it isn't the serve that is the problem but the return of the service return that is causing the problem.

    I played against a guy who after he served was right on top of the net. The way we played against him was to (1) push to the sides and corners; (2) make a extra fake. If he's too aggressive, the fake will throw him off more than a not-so-aggressive player.

    But yeah, it is hard to play against a team who has someone like that since it's hard to get cheap lifts from a "drop-to-the-net" service return.
     
  10. chessymonkey

    chessymonkey Regular Member

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    if he really is "after the served was right on top of the net."
    Most likely he is one of those hard core net rushing fans that
    made up his mind before u even start swinging.
    in those cases a few good flicks will make him think twice before he start
    rushing again.
    as long as he is "thinking twice", then all his return won't seems as threathening.
     
  11. stumblingfeet

    stumblingfeet Regular Member

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    Yes, the way I read the first post was that the server is moving in aggressively after the short serve which is giving the person returning serve some problems. This is one of the basic tactics in doubles, to put pressure on the return of serve and take control of the net area.

    You have a few options in this situation. The simple one would be to lift the bird, which is probably what the server wanted in the first place. Of course, this is really just the backup option, only used when you're in trouble.

    The main counter to this would be to have a number of different returns to hit off the serve, and the ability to get those shots off as quickly as possible. Often, many people I play against will move in relatively slowly and try to use deception to beat me at the net. What happens is that as they do this, the bird drops lower, their shot selection becomes more limited and I get more time to get ready for their shot. Other times, the person will repeat the same shot over and over, which makes these returns easier to anticipate.

    The usual return of serve targets I use are : straight net shot, push directly at server, drive directly at server's partner, and net, push or drive to the nearest corner. If you can execute these returns at high speed, then the server will have a much harder time returning your return of serve.

    Once you get decent at those, then you can start introducing the fancy deception shots very sparingly (maybe 1-2 in a game). If you can get them, then it will be a blow to your opponent's morale, and possibly put more pressure on them to not get embarassed by getting deceived again. However, attempting a fancy shot too frequently often result in a lot of points gained for the opposition.
     
  12. Ecko123

    Ecko123 Regular Member

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    Yeah sorry, I should have been clearer.

    The problem is them attacking my service return. So, they serve, I return, they attack.

    I suppose I could approach the bird faster. This is what my partner does mostly and he generally beats them. Pushes to the corner don't work (they anticipate those the most) so I figure a quick push the their body would work.
     
  13. chessymonkey

    chessymonkey Regular Member

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    ahhh so u have problem with those good reflax one that smack down/intercept your serve return easily
    well one thing u can do is speed up yr push, make it fast and make it flat.
    as long as u get pass the front guy, the guy in the back can't really
    Attack your drive cos its right above/below net height.
    If u can't get pass the front guy cos he has superhuman reflax,
    u have to start aiming yr serve return to go through area that's awkward for him to intercept, like passing just left and right to his face.
    Plus usually the front guy perpare to intercept with his racket held up
    on his forehand side. Mix in a few net drop returns and turn it into a net game, or push to his backhand side which takes him longer to reach the bird,
    intercepts is a slipt second game, if he has bring the racket from forehand to backhand, gives u better chance to get by the brick wall.
     
  14. Ecko123

    Ecko123 Regular Member

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    haha did what you guys said.

    They didn't do it once.

    We still lost, though. Played a horrible game lol. We've beaten them before, so I guess thats what counts ;)
     
  15. __Lam

    __Lam Regular Member

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    serve in irregular times? IE, sometimes stare at him a long time, then serve, and sometimes as soon as his ready serve it, and put more variaty of where the serve is going to go. i also sometimes net rush if the opponent always serves at the same time to the same place. just mix up your serves a bit and he'll stop rushing.
     
  16. chessymonkey

    chessymonkey Regular Member

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    no no his problme isn't when he's serving
    his problem is when he is receiving serve
    he return the serve and his return get pin down riteaway
     
  17. __Lam

    __Lam Regular Member

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    oops :p , sorry, its late...
     
  18. fishmilk

    fishmilk Regular Member

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    I had a similiar problem... Me and my partner haven't lost a match in our school league except one game, where these two guys never even returned with a netshot, they were all drives and pushes and it was near impossible to win a point against them. I'm very worried about them in the upcoming tournament.

    Flick serves just DON'T work... I have a pretty good disguise and a flick serve that is as deep as it goes, but they will always smash and end the point or stay on the attack until it's over. I have a HUGE problem playing them... please help.
     
  19. cappy75

    cappy75 Regular Member

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    Well, I guess your disguise is not good enough since they are fast enough to wait it out before hitting. When taking on strong opponents, nothing is more important than your confidence in your shots... particularly your service. Considering that this is one shot where you have 100% control over, it's also one of the most difficult to master since in order to serve well, you must be confident in it. You can't rally until you get it across the net unmolested:p. Master the low service shot. Not many players can attack a well-done low service shot with drives and... god forbid... netkills:D.

     
  20. Distanc3

    Distanc3 Regular Member

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    take ur time serving... in order for them to rush at the net they need to b on their toes... if u take ur time it'll throw their timing off pplz tend to slowly tip to one side then u can do w.e once they start tipping... and if they dotn do that juss flick it nice and deep =T
     

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