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Discussion in 'Sudirman Cup 2009' started by Takamsda, May 17, 2009.
What string and tension was team China using with their new racquets !?
Any idea anyone?
I might have mis-heard, what I heard on CCTV during live coverage was 36-39lbs.
what type of string they are using?
Probably yonex with li Ning logo painted.
BTW Lin Dan still using his trusty old AT700? Looks like it from my blurred broadcast
The Chinese National Badminton Team has signed Li-Ning as official sponsor.
The team outfit was redesigned, and by Li Ning, and almost all the sponsorship signboard in the GZ stadium were taken by Li Ning.
Between games on CCTV channel there was also lots of sponsored adverts. Most being Li-Ning marketing its new racket and claiming the new design and extra power it delivers.
It just all seems to me that Li Ning paid huge money in inventing, producing and marketing their new line of rackets.
With that in mind, I strongly doubt if Lin Dan will be using Yonnex racket since Li Ning is officially known as the sponsor of the entire China team.
Lin Dan is not using his AT700...the Li Ning racket he's using happens to have almost the same colour pattern...i tried it a bit at the outside games of the stadium...it's really light and stiff...but some of them seem to follow some sort of colour pattern seen on yonex rackets...like Chen Jin's fire one...looks like ARC10...XXF's is pink...kinda like ARC9, but I think the Li Ning one looks better...
I noticed the Li Ning's shirts not made of drifit material? Rather they were like cotton? So when wet with pespiration, it gets stuck to your body. Maybe, it was designed that way to show off LD's well toned body?
I heard from a CCTV reporter during live coverage that the shirt is very light, and it actually helps evaporation despite the sticky look.
I have to admit tho, the "wet and sticky" look is really quite annoying to look at lol I cant help noticing how uncomfortable it would be.
Appearantly, its very comfortable to wear according to the commentary. The whole top is also just a mere 70g. Its not like I weight sportwears lol but I would imagine that being quite impressive to be worth mentionning at all lol.
According to the commentor of GDTV, the shirts are made with "special" material and weighs only 70g! And altough it is all wet, it won't drip at all! I can't find any offical confirmation on the web, but I did not see any dripping, do you?
no idea what strings but if this is accurate, it's good enough to know.
Invest in reverse-engineering?
I guess no one has the answer, I've searched all but come out nothing. My guess is, BG65/BG80. And Yonex would have no control on this.
(I searched the offcial site, and yes I can read Chinese)
For all marketing gimmick, they've missed out one thing. String!
You can have all the best racquet you have, yet Li-Ling cannot come out strings to compete. After reading all the forms in Chinese and all the Li-Ling paidoff promotes the brand like no tomorrow, demoting Yonex like over-pricing low c/p brand. Promoting Li-Ling racquet like it's the highest technology produced in China with MSRP almost the same as yonex without discount. I feel ashame for Li-Ling marketing department. Is this really the nature of chinese people? No hard feeling. If they cannot provide solid product with reasonable pricing, they're gonna have dead-stock or later 60% off on those inventory.
Racquet + String + Shoe are the most important equipments in Badminton.
Their racquet paint job is so original.
They have no strings.
Their shoe sole pattern is so original as well.
It's like so much mint intake for a guy and he doesn't even want to get a condom, he wouldn't get the chance to use it. It's so chilling that a real badminton person would not pay attention on Li-Ling products.
If Li-Ling wants the market share. Do Something!!
i went to the li ning shop after watching the semifinal, china vs malaysia, and they even had a racquet that was used by lin dan but it was re-strung, the salesperson said ld was using something like 31 lbs.. it looked really nice.. they even had a shirt that was worn by fu haifeng put on a mannequin. haha..
Li-Ning do have strings... but not sure which being used by whom...
sounds like someone doesn't like the brand ...I'd still rather be more forgiving on paint designs and shoe designs...Li-Ning can't reinvent the wheel you know...whatever works works...if yonex's shoe design (soles) work..why not try to improve on it...not everyone can be smart enough to think of ORIGINAL ORIGINAL new things...you can't paint a racket any new colour design that hasn't been done, because i'm sure almost all schemes HAVE been done...it only has relative features that look like yonex/other brands...they DO have strings, like most companies..although it may not be the best at the moment...i'm not saying i'm the greatest fan of their product, but if you're going to go off on Li-Ning about these little things, you might as well go off on all those clone brands of yonex..."why can't THEY be original as well?! they don't have strings!!"
Apparently it was on sale..i was there every day to watch every session..they told me that the price was over 1.5k CNY, so i didn't bother to buy it xD...wayyy to expensive ahaha...i DID however take advantage of their autographs promotion ...i missed Wang Lin and Yu Yang though.. :crying: !!!
i took a look at them at the Li-Ning stores...but nothing special worth mentioning, although i haven't tried them ...i don't think yonex is out of the string market just yet
lol I guess they do have strings indeed.
You know it's a amazing thing that when you post those kinda thing on BC/BF, those Li-Ling marketing people wouldn't spank on you. look @ the Li-ling official discussion board(bbs). Who ever criticize Li-Ling product, they will have tons "user" to come up and "support" Li-Ling products.
So copy someone's original design and maybe improve upon it is a good idea? not so much for patient lawyer(or is it?) You can copy ALL YOU WANT in CHINA. DO THAT IN USA and lol...
I dare Li-Ling to sell the shoe(straight sole copy of Yonex) in USA, see if Yonex USA would not sue them?
I don't particularly dislike the brand, just simply don't like how their marketing people's face. And the way they promote their products. If China National Team is using Li-Ling Strings. Then I'll give a thumb up for the bravery.
For example, Victor Racquets and Shuttlecock and Strings are really solid. They match Yonex quility and price position is a little lower. If today I have to choose between Li-Ling and Victor, I have a clear winner. but if I don't have to choose, I can play any brand of racquet / string / show as long as I like. and btw I don't use Yonex racquets, they're good and sometimes too good for me. nor I use Victor racquet, and or any clone racquet.
and you think Li-Ling is all that original? See their grommetless "technology"? Do you realize that they copy it from some major European company?
Here at BC/BF, I think it's a good thing to get your opinion out. However, I think you might have missed my point on my previous post. I pointed out that nothing is really original in any racket, if you see past the paint etc...they're all pretty much same shape and stuff...so unless a company comes out with a square racket or something, i don't think it's quite original...my real point is improvement...that's how evolution takes place...little by little, things get better because of improvements...if Li-Ning makes slight improvements to something yonex has started, i think that's original enough...have you ever watched the simpsons? the episode where Herb loans Homer's $1000 and invents a baby translator and Homer says why don't you just put a clock in something that's been invented? same idea...if you can modify something that's out, and it's been done...i think that qualifies as new...speaking of patents (i happen to be a law student), i don't see much use in yonex spending millions in courts to sue Li-Ning simply because it's losing a battle...if so, yonex would also have to file suits against several other clone companies...and if you think that doesn't matter, then technically all written documents are plagerism by a little book called "Webster's Dictionary"
i can't defend their marketing gimmicks or strategies...but as far as i can tell, if you're talking about it, it's working...
your last part kinda proves my point...nothing is really that original is it? do you think yonex is the only brand to use grommets? why don't companies just use holes, and be original?....whatever works, it's gotta be improved on...
well, I did not watch that Simpson's episode. And I am not completely agree with you regards patients. but since you're a law-student, you might see it with more tolerance. If you practice law then no one can really copy your work. If you're a engineer, and someone in China is copying your work, how would you feel?
Not like Yonex never sue someone for copying their racquet. There're many smaller companies copies Yonex to a extend I would say disgusting. I would predict Yonex would sue a company if the company uses copies of Yonex work and eat up Yonex's market-share. Did you know that Li-Ling probably planned this take-over for at least 2 year? And Korean National team also converted to Victor(besides 2 player!?). Yonex is losing BIG in sponsoring top international players. China National Team has been using Yonex for 26(28?) years. And it's time for the team to get rid of Yonex. For some chinese badminton enthusiasts they distaste Li-Ling in ALL aspects.
Back to the topic, copy is copy, if a company can come up something original and cannot be prirated then they'll survive.
Try to go to China, with your foreign passport, and get rob, lost it all, no cash no ID, see how long and how much trouble it will take you to recover to get back to your country? When I was taking a trip in China I felt I am so small and so helpless if something bad would happen to me.
I completely feel for any Yonex original work that has been pirated. Copying someone's work and base upon it is not call original. It's call no conscious.
And as for Lawyers, ever heard a star trek joke? " Captain, they've throw all lawyers into the sun in 2050!." lol =P You must watch Boston Legal often !?
i actually fail to grasp how your last post has any relevance, if at all, contributes to your point. patents are made out to secure the original work to the owner. This does not apply if even one little thing is changed. However, if the patent completely covers the entire aspect of work, ie how it works, how it's made, it would be an infringement. Like you said, a copy is a copy. But a copy is not a copy if something new is in it, which makes the product different right?
I have never recalled Yonex suing someone/company for their work. Please show me. For years tiny companies have been eating bits of their market share, especially in beginning level players. If your point in arguing is that now that yonex is losing a battle, they should start something, then okay, i agree with you to some extent. Yonex lost 2 big markets and is losing face. Does that mean they should start suing people and gain market back? How would fans react to that kind of action, rather than giving better quality equipment at better prices or better designs that gives players what they want? Similar example you might find relevance. If a hockey team is losing a game that they were formerly dominating, should they start playing dirty and get back that way? Where does it say that Li-Ning has planned this for this long, i missed that. And what relevance does it have? Are you now aruging that it's a consipiracy? Furthermore, I'm sure some chinese people distaste yonex as well, what's your point?
Your part about creating something original for a company to survive is true. However, if a company improves on an existing product and it's by far better than the competition, then they should also survive right? Kind of like how Maps and Globes work. They provide the same information, but a globe is more of a visual representation of how the world looks like. Does that mean whoever invented the globe should be sued by the person who made the world map? But i still see how this has any relevance to your original point.
I don't see what your story in China has to do with your point, but I've taken it is require of my law program to take sociology and psychology classes, and i feel that your certain resentment maybe due to your bad experiences in China. And furthermore, I do not have to "try", I'm IN CHINA and I watched the Sudirman Cup live for everyday lol...I've been back and forth a lot, and nothing scares me. People are people. If you live in fear, you deny yourself of living...
i agree that completely copying is wrong. I don't like supporting clonex brands that way. But this isn't an "edge sabre" or a "mighty muscle" we're talking about...I suggest you test out the rackets and see if you feel a difference before you make an honest opinion. Otherwise, you're not seeing past the paint job, and you're regarding your opinion on your experiences and feelings associated with a country that is runned differently than your own(perhaps).
PS: TV is there for one thing. Entertainment. It's not meant for a substitute for real life. Boston Legal is based on American Law and I don't find it any entertaining. I also don't know of the star trek quote in which you speak of, but I'm only a fan of the William Shatner series.
Takamsda, are you Korean.....? You just seem to be hate Li Ning and China so much LOL
Look, you cant ask Li-Ning to produce a triangle-racket made of glass weighting 50g
They might be copying Yonex TO SOME EXTEND, but everyone does that because Yonex is good, very very good.
Now, Li-Ning is new in the badminton racket department, but it is a huge company that can afford to put in huge money in investment and research. Badminton is one of the most popular sport throughout the country, I really dont see any harm if a company like Li-Ning stepped up and took the challenge to produce new quality rackets.
Yonex is very good as we all know, but without competition there will be no improvement.
Would you like to see a world with just Yonex equipments?
I really think it is a good thing that companies can compete with each other and improve the rackets even further.
A good racket = a good racket, with or without Yonex tag on it
If Li-Ning is capable of producing a good racket, then we will be seeing some healthy competition here.
Like a car must have engine, wheels and steering, there is only so much you can change in a badminton racket, how "similiar" shouldnt really be the focus, the focus is how they drive. So what really matters is how the Li-Ning rackets play.
If you still want to whine about copying.... you know what, European players are generally taller than Asian players, Asian players have agility over European players' strength and stamina. Historically European players have been learning footwork from the Asian players in order to improve on their agility and speed, which is their weakness. Now do you call that copying and look at them with disgust? Sure you cant ask every single player out there to invent a new set of footwork can you?
Chinese team players are very very serious when it comes to badminton because the entire country will be watching, and I see no reason that the coach will use Li-Ning rackets if they are of poor quality.
Plus, why are you feeling disgusted when a country's national sport team use quality equipment provided by their own country instead of a foreign country?