Thanks for visiting us!

Badminton Central is a free community for fans of badminton! If you find anything useful here please consider registering to see more content and get involved with our great community users, it takes less than 15 seconds! Everybody is welcome here.

Click here for a FREE account!

Stringbed frequency to monitor string tension

Discussion in 'Badminton String' started by visor, Feb 27, 2013.

  1. visor

    visor Regular Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2009
    Messages:
    13,410
    Likes Received:
    230
    Location:
    Vancouver, BC
    (Updated and summarized Nov 2015. Original post quoted below the update.)


    Have you ever wondered if there is a way to determine whether your newly strung racket is at the right tension that you asked for? Perhaps you're trying out a different stringer, or you're stringing yourself and you're not sure whether the string job is consistent. Or perhaps you're wondering why after playing a few weeks your strings don't feel as crisp as it did initially, and you just want to monitor the inevitable tension drop so that you'll know to string a bit higher next time. Or whether the 30 lb that your friend says he plays with is really that when it feels less tight than the 25 lb that you play with. Or perhaps you just want to monitor more precisely and objectively your preferred tension than just by pushing the stringbed with your fingers or pinging the strings to the ear.

    Fortunately with the ubiquitous existence of smartphones, there is an easy way to achieve this by using a smartphone app to measure the fundamental or dominant frequency of the stringbed.

    For tennis, an app exists that measures the frequency, and given information on string diameter and racket face area, it will calculate the string tension. This however doesn't work as well for the lower tensions used in badminton.

    For badminton, there are several tuner apps for smartphones that can be used to measure stringbed frequency, eg. CarlTune for Android, and ClearTune for iOS. It's quite easy; just flick or strum lightly across the stringbed with your 3rd and 4th fingers like a guitar, and let it ring close to the mic on your smartphone preferably in a quiet room. As in this video.

    [video]https://youtu.be/ahW2gZbVg4I[/video]


    The dominant frequency reading should be in the range of 1000-1300 Hz for most strings strung in the usual range of 20-30 lbs, where each 1 lb change in tension results in about 30 Hz change in frequency. Obviously the frequency will be in the higher range with higher tension, thinner string (eg. ZM62, BG66UM), or smaller racket frame (eg. Jetspeed 10, ZForce ll) in accordance to
    [​IMG]
    (See reference #1.)


    I had initially started a thread to pool data points for various strings at different tensions here (http://www.badmintoncentral.com/for...Stringbed-frequency-to-monitor-string-tension). Kwun and other stringers had kindly contributed tables and tables of data points and soon we could see the difference between thick and thin strings. Interestingly, Kwun's measurement of a single piece of ZM62 string under various tensions correlated directly to my measurements of a ZM62 stringbed after a few weeks of play.

    [​IMG]


    Soon after, discussions naturally turned to whether measurements should be done immediately after stringing or after being played. Due to irreversible stretching at the molecular level within the string material itself in the first 24 hrs after it comes off the stringing machine, there's about a 30-60 Hz (corresponding to a 1-2 lb) loss, and that's before even any shuttle is hit. And then there's a more gradual drop of another 30-60 Hz (again reflecting another 1-2 lb) loss after a few sessions of play. (This however is not as serious as in the tennis world where a typical 60 lb job will lose 5-10 lbs in the first 24 hrs before any balls are hit and another 10-15 lbs after the first 100 hits!)

    Higher initial tensions will lose more, and certain strings (eg. BG65, VS850) that are well known for their tension loss will also lose more if not properly prestretched.

    Other factors that mitigate tension loss include mostly stringing techniques such as ECP (electronic constant pull) machines, slower and longer pulls, sturdy clamps and side supports, 2 knots 1 piece stringing (possibly) vs 4 knots 2 pieces, special finishing knots etc.


    Accepting these sources of tension loss then, the real tension that we play with is dependent on the time it has been since strung and the time it has been played with. So a requested 27 lb job will drop to an actual 25-26 lbs 1 day after stringing without play and then continue dropping to 23-24 lbs after 10-20 hrs of play. Maybe that's why pro players need to restring their rackets every week! In any case, the most important thing is that we all like to play with a certain consistent tension, hence this objective method of monitoring string tension.


    References:

    #1) How string frequency is related to tension, string length and density.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vibrating_string#Frequency_of_the_wave

    #2) Changes In String Tension Affect Racket Performance (http://www.ashawayusa.com/BadmintonTip2.php)

    #3) Post by Lieu201 on treating the stringbed as an elliptical membrane to directly calculate the frequency
    http://www.badmintoncentral.com/for...ring-tension?p=2179777&viewfull=1#post2179777





     
    #1 visor, Feb 27, 2013
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2016
  2. Licin

    Licin Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2008
    Messages:
    4,044
    Likes Received:
    11
    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    Asia
    @visor

    What a useful & informative thread.

    Perhaps, we could also include the name of the racket, since racket head shape & number of string holes in the racket do matter. Additionally, i think it is useful to list down number of usage hours and playing characteristic whether smasher at the back or controller at the front for MD. The X factor would be the quality of the game the racket being used, weather & shuttle quality & type also play some part too.

    We could also measure our stringer ability versus the other stringers in the other parts of the world, by comparing the frequency, the stringer claimed tension, the tension lost rate, and number of quality hours the racket being used.
     
    #2 Licin, Feb 27, 2013
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2013
  3. visor

    visor Regular Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2009
    Messages:
    13,410
    Likes Received:
    230
    Location:
    Vancouver, BC
    ^^ Re racket head shape and string density, you didn't read my OP carefully... ;)

    Also, number of grommets doesn't matter. ;)

    Yes, agree on the amount of time played and player characteristic, whether hard hitter or not... which affects the rate of tension loss.

    But yep, it's interesting to note that some people claiming to play with zm62 at 26 lbs get a frequency of only 1100 Hz after a few weeks of play. This correlates to only 23 lbs from my experience.
     
  4. Licin

    Licin Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2008
    Messages:
    4,044
    Likes Received:
    11
    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    Asia
    I thought you mentioned that we could not compare the frequency of different racket frame, for example VTZF vs Ordinary Isometric frame ?
    Therefore, i am thinking that mentioning racket name is necessary since VTZF & ordinary Iso head racket will not indicate same frequency given same stringer, tension, stringing machine, and type of string.
     
  5. kwun

    kwun Administrator

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2002
    Messages:
    38,209
    Likes Received:
    278
    Occupation:
    BC Janitor
    Location:
    Santa Clara, CA, USA
    I used to record the frequency of each of string job s. I had a thread with a graph drawn. Let me dig it out when I go home.
     
  6. visor

    visor Regular Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2009
    Messages:
    13,410
    Likes Received:
    230
    Location:
    Vancouver, BC
    Heh... guess I wasn't clear enough... but I did mention that the first requirement is that iso frames are preferred, and if not iso, then must be specified
     
  7. visor

    visor Regular Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2009
    Messages:
    13,410
    Likes Received:
    230
    Location:
    Vancouver, BC
    tension.png

    Interesting... I dug up one of your graphs from 2 years ago from this thread
    http://www.badmintoncentral.com/for...e-is-the-answer-(maybe)?p=1493361#post1493361
    where you measured one single length of zm62.

    The data correlates directly with my frequency data on the whole stringbed!
     
    #7 visor, Feb 28, 2013
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2013
  8. Mark A

    Mark A Regular Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2005
    Messages:
    6,096
    Likes Received:
    85
    Occupation:
    Stringer, Panda reseller, whatever else comes up
    Location:
    St Helens, UK
    I've been considering getting a PC microphone and doing this myself... no iPhone, so I'd have to find an appropriate PC application.
     
  9. demolidor

    demolidor Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2003
    Messages:
    10,545
    Likes Received:
    5
    Location:
    @Hollanti
    There was a program mentioned in one of the frequency threads. Had it installed once but not sure which measurement to read :D ...
     
  10. demolidor

    demolidor Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2003
    Messages:
    10,545
    Likes Received:
    5
    Location:
    @Hollanti
  11. visor

    visor Regular Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2009
    Messages:
    13,410
    Likes Received:
    230
    Location:
    Vancouver, BC

    Thanx [MENTION=1495]demolidor[/MENTION]. I had forgotten about that thread.


    Google also shows these java aplets that run in windows explorer.
    http://www.google.ca/search?q=frequency+tuner+online+&btnG=&hl=en&gl=CA&source=android-browser&sa=2
     
  12. zombie0517

    zombie0517 Regular Member

    Joined:
    May 25, 2009
    Messages:
    241
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Canberra
    Frequency also depends on frame size. Though it can be hard to tell, it definitely makes a difference.

    It would also be interesting to see frequency differences due to different string patterns, on the same type of racquet:p
     
    #12 zombie0517, Mar 1, 2013
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2013
  13. Mark A

    Mark A Regular Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2005
    Messages:
    6,096
    Likes Received:
    85
    Occupation:
    Stringer, Panda reseller, whatever else comes up
    Location:
    St Helens, UK
    #13 Mark A, Mar 1, 2013
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2013
  14. visor

    visor Regular Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2009
    Messages:
    13,410
    Likes Received:
    230
    Location:
    Vancouver, BC
    @zombie0517 :
    Yep, frame size affects frequency probably due to a change in string density. So vztf,
    z slash, cabs will ping about 30-50 Hz higher, wheras
    bs series (with slight pinching in at 2 and 10 o'clock) ping the same.

    2 knot vs 4 knot stringing doesn't affect the frequency, from what i've
    seen.
     
    #14 visor, Mar 1, 2013
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2013
  15. visor

    visor Regular Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2009
    Messages:
    13,410
    Likes Received:
    230
    Location:
    Vancouver, BC
    MX80 with @26lbs = 1143 Hz
    AT900 LCW with @26lbs = 1129 Hz
    AT700 with @26lbs = 1127 Hz

    Some data from that RacquetTune thread.
    String=BG65
     
  16. visor

    visor Regular Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2009
    Messages:
    13,410
    Likes Received:
    230
    Location:
    Vancouver, BC
    Same thread:

    Yonex VT80 w/ BG80 @ 27lbs = 1270 Hz
    Victor MX80 w/ VS850 @ 27lbs = 1246 Hz
     
  17. visor

    visor Regular Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2009
    Messages:
    13,410
    Likes Received:
    230
    Location:
    Vancouver, BC
    Same thread:

    Yonex VT80LTD w/ BG66UM @ 27lbs = 1315Hz
     
  18. kwun

    kwun Administrator

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2002
    Messages:
    38,209
    Likes Received:
    278
    Occupation:
    BC Janitor
    Location:
    Santa Clara, CA, USA
    here are my contribution:

    racket, string, tension, frequency

     
  19. visor

    visor Regular Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2009
    Messages:
    13,410
    Likes Received:
    230
    Location:
    Vancouver, BC
    @kwun

    WHOA!! :D :D :D

    Those are measured after tension stabilized, not immediately after stringing, I presume?
     
  20. kwun

    kwun Administrator

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2002
    Messages:
    38,209
    Likes Received:
    278
    Occupation:
    BC Janitor
    Location:
    Santa Clara, CA, USA
    sorry. as these are clients' rackets, they are measure right after stringing. :(
     

Share This Page