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Taking the fun out of badminton

Discussion in 'General Forum' started by Mag, Feb 5, 2002.

  1. Mag

    Mag Moderator

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    <a href="http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2002/2/5/sports/pdyung&sec=sports">This</a> sounds completely insane to me... (but then again, I'm such a haysack)

    These guys aren't badminton players anymore -- they're soldiers. There is actually a limit (albeit individual) as to how much training the human body can stand before it becomes destructive...
     
  2. Bbn

    Bbn Regular Member

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    A lot of PUBLIC money has been dumped in and if they

    don't show results the money can be put to better use.

    I think it is a worldwide trend, if you are on public funds, the

    public want to see results.

    If you are privately sponsored you can do what you like

    eg.commit career suicide.

    I think this partly explains the decline of the sport in the West

    and it's rise in socialist countries like China.

    The sport may become a two horse race between China and

    Msia in future with Ina and Singapore( moneybags) close

    behind.
     
  3. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    How much can the body take and how much can the person take on the mental aspect either.

    Much publicised attempts of Army captains taking over part of the training have conspicuously disppeared into the dust.

    What is the objective? To physically push those boys into exhaustion when they are not physically ready just to find out if they can really suffer punishment.

    Why not just force them on marathon runs everyday until they collapse from exhaustion?

    Need to show some tangible reward from training to encourage further motivation.
     
  4. Bbn

    Bbn Regular Member

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    The recent T Cup in training had a few of their players

    becoming ill during training.

    It has always been like that !

    International badminton esp Thomas Cup is a very physical

    game.I think it is 30% skill and 70% fitness as opposed to say

    Table tennis or bowling or snooker the other way round.

    That's way Malaysia has players like Foo Kok Keong and

    Rashid Sidek!
     
  5. Mag

    Mag Moderator

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    As Cheung says, motivation is the key. Motivation can be achieved and upheld in many ways -- but not by force.
     
  6. Pecheur

    Pecheur Regular Member

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    Not these days

    In 3x15 it may have been 30% skill and 70% fitness, now, it's mainly power and skill with much less fitness, not sure how much 5x9 will change from 5x7, but it should be better.
     
  7. Mikie

    Mikie Regular Member

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    Do not agree. Motivation CAN be achieved (and upheld) by force. Do you know the word "blackmail"?
     
  8. Resistance

    Resistance Guest

    IMHO, this is totally acceptable for several reasons.

    1. Theses shuttlers are world class, then world class pressure and disciplin is not only standard but a rule. Like the clip says, if they cannot handle it, then pack their bag and leave. Today, there are too many people who want to the title but do not have a clue what it takes to get there. This type of training will surely filter these lackers out..

    2. Unlike most people who take badminton as a recreational sport, these teenagers don't. These are their careers.

    3. You must understand the Asian mentality. And it goes for most Asian countries. Because of the large population, everything is a competition. Competition as most of us know it means to win while having fun. In Asia, winning is not everything... It is the ONLY thing. Good or bad, this is the environment that they live in. And you will see this fierce and killer competitiveness instinct outside of sports. In business, in education, in everything.

    And many have said that there is a limit to what the human body can do. That's right. Fortunately, there is no limit to what the human mind can do. In most cases, when put under pressure and stress it is often the human mind the fails first. Only people who have extremely good self-disciplin and presistence will outlast the mental stress of any training. Already said, the teenager must learn how to make sacrafices..... Can't have the best of both worlds... I believe this is what they are really training for....
     
  9. Mag

    Mag Moderator

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    Then the BAM should kidnap these guys families and release them when they win a Grand Prix tournament.
     
  10. Mag

    Mag Moderator

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    I believe you CAN have the best of both worlds. And please don't assume that I don't understand the "Asian mentality". You know nothing about me or my background. I am quite familiar with the cultural patterns that makes this BAM project seem like a good idea to those involved. And I think it's so wrong.

    I am well aware that we're talking about elite sports here as opposed to recreational, but I think this is NOT the way to go. By training under these military-like circumstances, how are these kids going to develop their individuality and creativity? You can't make a real champ without nurturing those key elements.

    Only time can tell, but my belief is that this project will not produce any future international champions.
     
  11. johnboy

    johnboy Guest

    You mean Badminton is meant to be FUN

    All these years I've spent charging around the court chasing that bloody dead goose, with sweat pouring into my eyes and nearly suffering a heart attack was meant to be FUN !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  12. Valentino

    Valentino Guest

    I agree that its taking a little too far, its like they think they have no disipline.
    but for the fact this will increase their fysical performance, well if it doesnt kill you, it only makes u stronger right? something like survival of the fittest as i c it
     
  13. Mag

    Mag Moderator

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    That was Darwin and Nietsche in the same posting!

    ;)
     
  14. Mag

    Mag Moderator

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    Fun, joy, lust, whatever

    At times even I have found myself in doubt! ;)

    But yes, fun, joy, lust, use whatever synomym you like! Even at elite level sport must have this quality. I think it is the most important motivational factor. It is what really gives it meaning.

    Regardless what you do in life, if you're not enjoying it then you have failed bitterly.

    It is easy to make the connection to the Chinese training methods. They have similar training regimens, and indeed they have produced good players... with extremely short careers. It's "burn fast, die young", all the way. I think this burn-out is partly due to over-training, but mainly I think it's a question of lacking motivation.

    Oh, damn the torpedoes! Let BAM send out their army of badminton robots to conquer the world! And good luck to them... :)
     
  15. Bbn

    Bbn Regular Member

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    I think there's a very popular show in UK now called

    'The weakest link', something like the American one about

    survival of the fittest.
     
  16. spacio42

    spacio42 Guest

    I think the pt BAM is trying to instill in the players are discipline. I am sure the coaches are professional enough so as not to push the players too hard as to wear them out but condition them to be better.
    Sending these young boy to the academy would be a wake up call to all players to wake up or get out!
    This has got nothing to do with what Asian metallity......all who participate wants to win....but little ppl know the price one need to pay.
    Be it anywhere all players at competition level need to be very fit, metally strong and skilled.
    I think what M'sia is doing is a good trial. Let's see if they can kill !
    WATCH OUT WORLD THE M'SIA badminton POLICE are here !!!!!!
     
  17. Winex West Can

    Winex West Can Regular Member

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    Right or wrong. This is obviously an approach that Malaysia has decided to take in order for them to produce world class players. One could argue that this is one sure way of doing so (see China, Indonesia, etc). Singapore's approach is different ("let's offer them citizenship to play for us") and obviously in Western countries (US/Canada/Denmark/England, etc), the approach is different but then the emphasis on badminton in these countries is different from the asian countries.

    Mag is right in that if there is no fun (joy) in what you do, you will burn out or quit completely. My wife teaches piano and have seen so many talented kids quit or burn out because of pressure from their parents on doing well, etc.

    I think that the programme will produce some world-class players but at what cost? (one of 20 elite players? one of 50?).
     
  18. Brett

    Brett Regular Member

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    Valentino, don't use that "what doesn't kill you ..." phrase around me. I had an ex-girlfriend use that line on me after she broke up with me, trying to argue that her little surprise (our break up) was a "really good thing" for me. What a load of horse manure. I hate that phrase! :( :)
     
  19. Brett

    Brett Regular Member

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    I agree that this sounds extreme. More trophies have been won and records have been broken by athletes in all sorts of sports who were self-motivated, than by athletes who were inspired by harsh training regimens and fear of their coach's discipline. Given that pre-professional and professional badminton players want to earn a living by playing badminton and that that career is only feasible if the player is successful in tournament play, why would career necessity and personal pride not serve as sufficient motivation to train hard?

    Correct me if I am wrong, but badminton is not the same as chess, where there are prescribed countermoves for every move by the opponent. Wouldn't a harsh training system like that take some of the creativity out of a player's game, thereby resulting in a lack of the inventiveness and brilliance that marks a true champion's play?
     
  20. Brett

    Brett Regular Member

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    In retrospect, my analogy to chess in my previous message is a bit simplistic, but I think you get the point.
     

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