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VIDEO: What is wrong with my form?

Discussion in 'Techniques / Training' started by rlim701, Aug 29, 2014.

  1. rlim701

    rlim701 Regular Member

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    Hi,
    Please critique my form, especially the overhead clear/smash stroke sequence. It looks really weird and I'm not really sure what's wrong. I think my movements are too big, and my elbow is not high enough when preparing for the stroke. How and where can I improve? Really would appreciate constructive feedback. Lost all 3 events in the first round of a previous tournament and is feeling really bumped! I am 44, and just these 12 30 second work/rest interval drills is wearing me out! Perhaps my movement is very inefficient? Was really chucking to myself when I saw how slow I was in the video, yet I felt fairly fast and taxing when doing the drills!

    Thanks in advance.
    [video=youtube;C3o-rffC43k]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3o-rffC43k&feature=youtu.be[/video]
     
  2. lordrogue

    lordrogue Regular Member

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    This video is private
     
  3. rlim701

    rlim701 Regular Member

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    Hope it's okay now.
     
  4. Exert

    Exert Regular Member

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    You're occasionally missing split steps, also you know when you're doing the scissor kick for the smash or a shot? Make sure you land on your behind foot first and the front should lead after that. Use the behind foot to push off.
     
  5. lordrogue

    lordrogue Regular Member

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    Probably not what you want advice on but don't use scissor to rear forehand side, and even more preferably not scissor while jumping backwards.
    And don't practice on asphalt, my shins hurt by just watching that!

    As for the stroke, I'm no expert but the motion itself looks good, perhaps widen the elbow gap a little more and push out your breast. Your core stability also seems a little weak.
     
  6. rlim701

    rlim701 Regular Member

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    Thanks for the pointers. So when should I use the scissor kick? I thought I should always use it to generate extra power.
     
  7. J_Noodles

    J_Noodles Regular Member

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    I think around the head shot uses scissor kick often. In terms of the video though, when you move backwards in a straight line, scissor kick is good. However, you may want to stabilize your position first before you scissor kick, because right now you scissor kick while you move backwards. You want your body weight to go forwards
     
  8. OhSearsTower

    OhSearsTower Regular Member

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    i dont understand the advices with the scissor kick

    i see pros all the time doing it while moving backwards :confused:

    i dont know if your shuffle is needed...if i imagine a court i feel like you would jump way out of the court because of all the distance you cover with the extra shuffle


    your core stability is bad as was already mentioned

    also i miss the splitsteps
     
  9. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    If on the forehand side, when the shuttle flight is higher and falling to you on a more vertical trajectory.
     
  10. lordrogue

    lordrogue Regular Member

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    If you look at the rear forehand side, it's only done in some situations if you have a lot of time and you clear. I think it's pretty rare to see in MS. Normally you teach either the chasse step/jump (it's quicker) or the crossover step, if you are pressured. Straight backwards you do the scissor yes, and you can do it similar to what you do in the around of head position, BUT, the left foot (non racket) should always land first and then you push your body forward to land further in with the right foot in order to gain momentum. This might seem minor but it's a very important detail in footwork, otherwise you become stranded in the rear corner. It can also be difficult to execute in a match without good core strength.

    Hope that clear it out...
     
  11. MSeeley

    MSeeley Regular Member

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    Hello!

    Some feedback from me (I only had a very quick look, so can't say more):

    Your speed and footwork - its very "upright" meaning you are stood upright as you move/run. A fast badminton player uses a lower centre of gravity - bending the knees and almost "sitting" as if in a semi-squat position (your bottom will stick out!). Watch Lee chong wei, Son wan ho, chen long etc etc - they all have a very low body position, with knees bent - you should be striving for the same. When you do this, three things will happen:
    1. your balance will get better (watch your upper body, it sways alot during the movements, which will tire you out). Your core muscles will be engaged more and better posture will help you to be quick "off the mark".
    2. you will engage your leg muscles - at the moment you are not making use of the strength in your legs because you are not loading them properly (by bend them!). You will be able to move more powerfully once you make the change.
    3. your stance will be slightly wider - standing with knees bent is easier if the feet are further apart. Once the stance is wider, you will need fewer steps to travel in any given direction (as each step is longer), which will make you appear/feel quicker.

    Your lunge - notice when you lunge, that two bad things happen
    1. your upper body falls over forwards (watch the way your head and chest fall down as you lean forwards - very noticeable on backhand side). Make sure you stay upright (better stance) with your weight inbetween your two feet - this will speed up your recovery and use less energy to move - which is easier. You will start using your legs, whereas at the moment you are using your whole body (which is harder).
    2. you do not reach forwards with the racket - you tend to move first, and then swing with the racket once you arrive. You should be moving with your racket already outstretched, and then hit as you land.

    Your overhead - the form is not bad. There are some things to mention:
    1. Non racket hand - you keep you hand a little low before you hit - keep it high (even whilst jumping, until you actually swing - you tend to drop it too early). Also, you tend to "drop" your non racket hand, which makes you "fall over" forwards. Try instead to tuck your arm into your chest as you hit - this helps control rotation and keep you upright (balanced).
    2. Your footwork - others have mentioned jumping backwards during the scissor kick - this is a bad idea. If you are going to do a scissor kick as in the video, you should really be jumping UPWARDS, rather than backwards. You only show jumping up and backwards at the same time. To perform it best, you should be driving your leg upwards and striking the shuttle at the top of your stroke. When the jump initiates, you should be jumping up and landing roughly where you left off - you will notice your jump lands a lot further back than where you took off. This means that in order to get the body weight going forwards, you have to lean forwards a lot (which makes you look unbalanced). If you jump up instead, you will maintain better balance.
    Note: Other have talked about using a block jump in the rear forehand corner - if you are jumping backwards to forehand deep corner, use a block jump. Its easier.
    3. Your rotation in the air - you are rotating quite a lot. I would only expect to see that if someone were playing a smash - you do not appear to be smashing. Try to control the rotation - rotating too much can confuse your strokes, the necessary rotation for any shot is short and sharp, (note that the feet and hips may rotate more than the upper body - thats fine!).
    4. Your swing speed - your swing looks quite slow (the racket comes through very slowly). Try to relax your arm/wrist/fingers and swing in a "snappier" way, with greater speed.

    As I say - I haven't spent long looking, so hopefully this should get you started.

    Having said all that, all the changes I have suggested are minor (generally stance changes - which are immediate!). Your fundamentals look pretty good, they just need to be refined to start using better muscles and be more explosive to take you to a higher level of performance.

    Good luck!
     
  12. rlim701

    rlim701 Regular Member

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    Thanks everyone, especially MSeeley for the fine pointers. I definitely have enough things to work on that I never knew before. And yes, it's the minor changes that I'm hoping to tweak since I feel that I am working really hard with hardly any performance improvement. I'll probably post back in about a month to document any positive changes. Really appreciate you guys taking time to help me improve my game.
    Thanks.
     
  13. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    Add my two cents.

    It's not that bad but you seem to be asking for some refinement of technique.

    It's hard to judge the distances on asphalt without the court markings. So how can judge the number of steps you take is enough?

    Side step out to forehand side, first side step is too small and the last one is too big.

    The scissor kick is not wrong but you are leaping backwards on it far too much for a deep forehand corner shot. Once you land, it needs an extra step to get back to base area. Be judicious when using a scissor kick technique for a forehand shot on an attack/punch clear. It is easier to use scissor kick when the shuttle is falling more vertically after a higher trajectory (this is for forehand side).

    It looks like you need about 7 or 8 steps to get to the forecourt shot. Better if you can do it in 5 or less ;)

    You stand up straight after striking the shuttle making you centre of gravity higher. Put a slight crouch in and bend your knees. Have your weight slightly forward.

    The footwork rhythm is very constant. When you look at those really good players, their feet move differently. They will have something like two quick steps and the slow one to the corner.

    It's subtle but your right arm doesn't pull back enough and the racquet head points outwards before you start swinging the overhead. Whilst not bad, it makes you look a little 'untidy'.

    As pointed out previously, after your overhead, you have a huge arc in your follow through. Nowadays, the follow through after an overhead is more compact spiralling closer to the body. A more compact follow through allows earlier preparation of the arm for the next shot.

    I haven't mentioned the forecourt area technique. If you take the video on court, giving advice will be easier.
     
  14. rlim701

    rlim701 Regular Member

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    Thanks Cheung. Between you and MSeeley, I would have to slowly digest every point made for a period of time. I'll post a follow-up video on court after incorporating what I've learnt here. Maybe in a month's time. I'm motivated to improve.
    Thank you very much!
     
  15. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    You are welcome. Technique is one thing. Translating shots into tactics for matches and competitions is also another learning exercise. At 44 years old, isn't going to be hard coming up against 20 something year olds in competitions?
     
  16. lordrogue

    lordrogue Regular Member

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    I've struggled with this for many years. It's one thing having good technique and footwork during exercise but that doesn't mean you will be able to use it at a competition. At one point you have to make an active decision to either lose tournament matches but incorporate better technique or to win with faulty technique but never improve.
    If your brain learns something it doesn't automatically mean your body have learned it. On training, I can keep my brain involved in the movements to an extent, but on competitions my brain just goes blank and my body still uses movement I've learned 8 years ago incorrectly.
     
  17. MSeeley

    MSeeley Regular Member

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    This is a common problem - many people are good at practising until they get it right. What they do not do though, is then build up that practice into movements that are used in game situations...

    For example: if one was teaching yourself a fast cross slice from deep forehand corner.
    First step is to learn to play the shot from standing.
    Then learn with movement from and to base.
    Then people learn how to hit the shot whilst rallying.
    Then most people stop, thinking the work is complete.
    You actually then need to create game situations where you hit one shot, followed by a reply, followed by the cross shot e.g. tight spinning net shot on forehand side, followed by straight lift, followed by cross slice.
    THEN you need to do the tight spinning net shot on the backhand side, followed by the cross lift, followed by the cross slice.
    THEN you need to practice defending a smash on the backhand, then a straight lift, then a straight drop, then a cross lift, then the cross slice etc etc etc.

    By building the practice in this way, you start to learn to use the shot in game situations, rather than just during practice. The transition from learning a skill to using it in a game can be a slow one... but worth persevering with.

    Good luck to you!
     
  18. dontmakeme

    dontmakeme Regular Member

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    Just in case, I hope you are not doing drills or practice on concrete and that this is the only time for the video. The concrete surface is going to hurt your legs if you do it too much because of the impact. I would advise you practice on court or grass.
     
  19. rlim701

    rlim701 Regular Member

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    I actually am practicing on concrete just because it's convenient. I also have stopped activity on concrete partly because I have been extremely fatigued from doing what I thought was too much - running at least 3 miles 4 times a week, plus weight training, sit-ups (core), jump rope, shadow on concrete, and twice a week of 2-3 hour of court side badminton.

    In my previous 2 tournaments, I was physically exhausted during the match (singles and doubles), and I kept wondering what was wrong and if it was age-related. Perhaps I have been over-training, or perhaps all the concrete impact took a toll on the body. Still trying to figure this out other than blaming it on age. You guys have any ideas? Been taking supplements and food, so I don't think I'm deficient in nutrition.
     
  20. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    Wow. That's a lot of extra training. Very impressed.

    It probably isn't overtraining that is making you tired.

    IMHO, just from observing the video, you don't look like you have a clear concept of the footwork and rhythm. Of course, you can get from point A to point B pretty easily but crucially, the movement is inefficient. Hence a lot of wasted energy.

    Case point: I went to a club in UK and a very enthusiastic player and I were having a conversation (about badminton of course :)). He mentioned he can't get to the shuttle. I played with him and saw a few points:

    A) he concentrated very well
    B) he had fast legs
    C) he was bouncing all over the court
    D) mistiming the bounce
    E) overshooting the shuttle because moving too fast (anxiety)
    F) poor recovery
    G) can't slow down the feet within the rally.

    Let's take a simple routine that you see many people do training: rear court drop, run to the net, netshot, sidestep to back court, then drop again and repeat sequence. Most people do it without purpose.

    The routine can be trained better. Dropshot (with a body rotation), side step skip (after the shuttle has left the racquet head) and that is timed with the landing bounce occurring just after the shuttle crosses the net. So, this skip is actually not that fast.

    As the opponent hits the shuttle for the netshot, take two steps to the net fast (now, the speed has changed). Do the netshot as you land with front lunging feet on the floor. Slow down and recover your balance.

    One skip back to just behind service line to recover position. Time the bounce as the opponent hits the shuttle up for a lift. As the shuttle goes up, then quick sidesteps to rear court.

    In this example, it shows that within a footwork routine, there are certain short lengths of time that you can relax all you muscles and take things slow.

    So, you can recover your breath a bit even within a rally as well as maintaining speed around court.
     

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