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VIDEO: what's wrong with this smash?

Discussion in 'Techniques / Training' started by kwun, Mar 14, 2012.

  1. pcll99

    pcll99 Regular Member

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    hip rotation is important, yes.

    what about shoulder rotation? should we do that?
     
  2. sautom88

    sautom88 Regular Member

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    Hip rotation is more important, like in "hula-hula" belly dance from Hawai :D

    Just jokin pcll, nothing personal.
     
  3. visor

    visor Regular Member

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    Finally got a chance to view the video (i was on iphone all day). thejym has nicely broken down the shoulder and forearm technique.

    I would also suggest that the feeder not feed the shots so far to the baseline (as seen in the video), so that this "fella" can concentrate on smashing first and not have to worry about footwork yet in getting to behind the bird. When the smash technique improves, then the feeds can go to baseline, but we all know that a smash from baseline is not gonna be a kill shot. :)

    I only have a few more things to add...

    1. Explosiveness and acceleration
    The swing has to explode and accelerate into the bird with maximum velocity at strike( and a bit after). It is not a constant velocity affair. This fella must feel the racket head moving faster and faster into the shot ending with a swish that is as high pitched as possible.


    2. Aggressive mindset
    In order to get more power, as some others have mentioned, this person needs to think and feel more aggressive. Imagine your opponent has just dissed your mom! That should get the adrenaline flowing in the blood. :p Say it with me: adrenaline is good... it gives more power. :D


    3. Eccentric contractions and proximal to distal transfer of power
    I learned this concept from kenzo, who hasn't posted in the last half a year, but I must credit him here. Essentially you need to prestretch ie. preload your muscles for max speed and power of contraction. Just like why we do the split step. And also just like the split step, in order for it to be effective, this has to be done at the right moment: not too soon and not too late, otherwise the stored energy is wasted. In the winding up side-on preparation, the muscles in the torso, shoulder, upper arm, forearm, (and those involved in controlling the wrist and fingers), all undergo preload and energy release in sequence. Actually, it starts in the quads first, then the pelvis/hip > torso > shoulder > upper arm > forearm > wrist > fingers. And you should be able to feel the power transfer from one joint to another in sequence from proximally to distally all the way to the racket head. In essence, your pelvis all the way to your fingers and racket should feel like a "whip". :)


    4. Weight transfer
    For that last little bit of power, this person needs to "lean into" the shot with his body weight at strike. He can't be falling backwards away from the bird if he wants power. It just means that he has to have faster footwork to get behind the shuttle earlier.



    For a video, please refer to this youtube video "Fu Haifeng teaches how to smash". The super slow mo part is in the middle of the video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eH6qFJoySf8 (The only part missing is no one has dissed his mom yet! :p :) )
     
  4. NanoBatien

    NanoBatien Regular Member

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    Technique looks smooth to me, whip and impact sound is nice! He must be quite high level if that is a "weak" smash! I would like to see the shuttle speed if possible?

    Hes not that young (sorry!) and so realistically cant expect really massive mega smash. Technique is all good and well but eventually you are pretty much optimized and then its just explosive power. Big fast guys actually do smash harder. The earlier posters have made some very interesting points though! The smash at 0.46 looks like he is already running out of steam :p, if he smash any harder only one smash and he will have no energy left!
     
  5. Yuzo64

    Yuzo64 Regular Member

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    This's something I noticed too on the video, thank you for reminding me : looks like he's accelerating his racket head too late, so all the power he uses is useless because released after making contact.

    Have you tried to make him stop the racket right after he hits by tightening the grip and "pulling the racket backwards"?
    Basically, don't let him bring his arm down, or remove the follow through part of his motion.

    I know this is not the ideal form of hitting, but it might help him find some clues on how to use his power efficiently...
    I think LJB mentionned something close to this for backhand, and underhanded shots.
     
  6. blableblibloblu

    blableblibloblu Regular Member

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    also everyone knows the red zymax67 isnt as good as the other colours
    he should definitely get the ivory white one and everything will be fine
     
  7. thunder.tw

    thunder.tw Regular Member

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    Didn't read all of the responses but, it seemed to me that a lot of the time he was smashing while still moving backwards. It doesn't look like he's transferring any energy from his legs into to shuttle.

    Edit: Yeah, look at the slow motion, he's on his back foot on contact with the shuttle. He needs to step into the shot.
     
    #47 thunder.tw, Mar 15, 2012
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2012
  8. raymond

    raymond Regular Member

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    If we're thinking/talking about the same thing here, but I'd focus on discussing the pronation part first.

    I've been wondering delaying one's pronation would add more power. If you start to rotate forearm too early, then your rotation would have to be done over longer period of time to cover the same distance (away from your body). This means slower speed (distance/time), and thus less kinetic energy transfer.

    So holding the rotation till the last minute (maybe with the Karate chop thing) would actually mean you've less time to finish your rotation, but you'd need to do it faster, thus more energy transfer.

    Presumably, the same thought process can apply to other parts of the body/arm movement/rotation.

    So I would suggest he checks when he starts his pronation process (early, or later).
     
  9. raymond

    raymond Regular Member

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    Please check my other post on pronation timing, in case you're referring to just the extend/magnitude of pronation. Note this is just my personal view.

    As on slicing, he could check if his racket face movement is in the same direction as the shuttle's flight path. If the racket face is not moving in the same direction (or at any angle from that flight path), a slice is there. Depending on whether he does that intentionally, or not, if he intends full power, then this needs to be looked at. A video from the front, focusing on the racket action, could help reveal that.
     
  10. sautom88

    sautom88 Regular Member

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    Kwun, by now you should be as confused as I am (after reading so many comments) as to how to 'improve' an already decent smashing skill. As some of the posters noted, aggresive mental attitude and personality also helps in developing an 'explosive' smash.

    Just look at Markis Kido, FHF and JJS faces when they are smashing, they look like they want to 'KILL' the guys on the other side of the net. I don't know you personally but I have a feeling you are not their type.:D
     
  11. kwun

    kwun Administrator

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    yes. aggression is good.

    but also be aware that this guy is pretty old and not so fit as FHF/JJS... haha. ;)
     
  12. urameatball

    urameatball Regular Member

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    sautom88 is right. guy in the vid looks like he's swatting butterflies in the park. Get behind the bird and throw your body into it as hard as you can.

    I hesitate to post a vid of myself here but whatever... this video illustrates exactly what I mean (you guys get to witness the moment I tore something in my wrist :(, haven't been able to smash hard since ).

    [video=youtube;Ga6edrYHeP8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ga6edrYHeP8[/video]
     
  13. visor

    visor Regular Member

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  14. Staiger1

    Staiger1 Regular Member

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    this is one of the situation that coaching would really help, even if you hire 1-2 hours with him just for him to stand next to you showin gthe correct techique. What thejym wrote is the closest description ,
     
  15. Staiger1

    Staiger1 Regular Member

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    loose grip , and squeeze on impact __________ Relax your wrist _______keep it simple____________it should be one smooth action ______footwork and body rotation is not there ____________dont force it _______________on impact concentration that power generated from arm, wrist upper body there are videos on youtube that you can use to aid your techique
     
  16. visor

    visor Regular Member

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    A few more things to add to my post on the previous page...

    Spefically, he needs to further time compress and accelerate his swing and really explode into the strike while falling forward into the bird to maximize weight and power transfer. He also needs to rotate his body more into the shot... remember it's "hip, hit, hooray", ie. from the side on preparation position, hip leads first, then torso, then shoulder, then the upper arm as what thejym said.

    The action is very similar to throwing a pebble, albeit downwards for the smashing action. If you want to break down the smash action, just remember how you throw.

     
  17. kwun

    kwun Administrator

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    thanks all. there are a lot of good feedback and i am still trying to digest all the information!
     
  18. visor

    visor Regular Member

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    ah, now we know who that person is ! :p :D
     
  19. volcom

    volcom Regular Member

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    Good luck to this bloke!
     
  20. Staiger1

    Staiger1 Regular Member

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    how much power does this guy needs , for a club player , his smashes would be pretty lethal (
     

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