Thanks for visiting us!

Badminton Central is a free community for fans of badminton! If you find anything useful here please consider registering to see more content and get involved with our great community users, it takes less than 15 seconds! Everybody is welcome here.

Click here for a FREE account!

Who is at fault?

Discussion in 'General Forum' started by Dendrobius, May 11, 2006.

  1. Dendrobius

    Dendrobius Regular Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2005
    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Australia
    I was involved in a racquet clash today, and both me and the other party insist that it's the other person's fault, so I'm going to try and get some second opinions and see where it goes. In the interests of fairness I'm NOT going to say which party I am.

    A and B are playing doubles, A is on the backhand (left) side, B is on the forehand (right) side. A receives the first shot, and goes to the forward right of the court. The return is to midcourt, down the middle. B goes for the shot which is B's forehand, A moves back and goes for the same shot with his backhand. A gets there first, hits, and simultaneously B clashes his racquet with A. B's racquet is broken.

    B says it's A's fault, as it was B's forehand, and B was already standing there waiting for it. A says it's B's fault, as B was the one who hit A's racquet which was there first.

    What would you say? A's fault? B's fault? Or 50/50? Should A pay for B's racquet, or should A tell B to go to hell?

    Cheers!
     
  2. lightsmash

    lightsmash Regular Member

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2004
    Messages:
    669
    Likes Received:
    1
    Occupation:
    Target board
    Location:
    SG and MY
    looks like A fault.
    but your story isnt too clear, after A receives the shot he went over to the front of B's court?
     
  3. Dendrobius

    Dendrobius Regular Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2005
    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Australia
    More detailed sequence of events:

    A and B start side by side

    A receives a short serve, goes to forward right corner of court, lifts to back of opponent's court.

    His shot is then returned weakly to midcourt, high, down the middle.

    B hasn't moved since service, then winds up for a smash.

    A then moves back towards his starting point from where he received the shot (A did not move between receiving the service and his shot being returned) and tries for a backhand.

    A gets the backhand in first, B's racquet comes thundering down straight into A's still outstretched backhand.

    The clash occured in the centre of the court.
     
  4. lightsmash

    lightsmash Regular Member

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2004
    Messages:
    669
    Likes Received:
    1
    Occupation:
    Target board
    Location:
    SG and MY
    This is highly debatable, I'm not too good in playing. But I think A should cover the front incase the return is a netdrop, and as A is nearer to net he has better chances of bringing it down faster than B.
    I still think the shuttle should have been hit by B.
    But again, when playing in doubles, both the players should roughly know where your partner is at all times. So in this case, B shud have seen that A has gone to receive the shuttle and thus stop the smash, avoiding the clash.
     
  5. coops241180

    coops241180 Regular Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2002
    Messages:
    1,286
    Likes Received:
    0
    Occupation:
    E-commerce content co-ordinator
    Location:
    Lymm, United Kingdom
    it's till pretty unclear to me what happened..

    so A is recieiving a short serve on the Left Hand side. i assume B is stood somewhere behind him - central.

    what is A's return of serve? - if it is a lift A&B should've gone defensive, so that one is on one side and one is on the other. i would suggest that A move to be cross court from the place where he has put the shuttle in order to create the necessary time-distance to return a smash.

    however now - at this point you opponent has played some weird (specially if A has lifted the service return) mid court weak lift. some points to note - i doubt this was expectde - and if A&B are moving into defensive positions there could be some confusion.

    Assuming A & B are right handed - and have moved towards a defensive position with A on the left and B on the right that would dictate that A's forehand is in the middle and as such he is in the best position to smash.

    however - i notice somebody mentions A taking the 'clashed' shot on his backhand.

    something is very mixed up here - the description of the rally needs to be made clearer
     
  6. franxon

    franxon Regular Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2005
    Messages:
    182
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Singapore
    well, it's hard to say whose fault it was. if you two have been partnering each other for some time, you could refer to how you pre-discussed and pre-agreed in scenarios like this.

    if you two never partnered before, i'd say it's 50-50:

    in terms of giving the opponents the most killing shot, B might be at a better possition? if it was meant to be a smash or fast drive.

    in terms of protecting your partner's racket (also your own), A could have been less aggressive; B, behind A, had a better view therefore more responsibility.

    if the front guy were Tony Gunawan, most likely he'd go for the shot though. ;)

    anyway, perfect excuse for B to get his next dream racket. he should be happy and thankful to A. :D
     
    #6 franxon, May 11, 2006
    Last edited: May 11, 2006
  7. robc06

    robc06 Regular Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2006
    Messages:
    220
    Likes Received:
    0
    Occupation:
    Editor
    Location:
    Hobart, Tasmania
    I dont really think it makes any difference, floor strike, raquet clash, its inevitable that its going to happen. Sometimes A could go for the shot, other times B could play the shot, depends on posistioning and who's covering.
     
  8. txyu

    txyu Regular Member

    Joined:
    Apr 30, 2002
    Messages:
    100
    Likes Received:
    0
    Occupation:
    Manager Fitness Facility
    Location:
    Back in Sudbury, ON
    I'd say it doesn't matter as well

    it's part of the game and should be expected...

    If I clash racquets and my racquet breaks then "oh well" guess I have to buy a new one

    **it happens

    In a competitive game, there's no telling what may happen. I can have a steady partner for 30 years and still clash racquets

    People break sticks all the time in hockey...do you see them asking the other person to pay for it? nope...unfortunately, it's part of the game :(
     
  9. MarkinJapan

    MarkinJapan Regular Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2004
    Messages:
    197
    Likes Received:
    1
    Occupation:
    kouchou sensei!
    Location:
    Victoria
    I don't think i would tell anyone to go to hell if they asked to pay for my racket. I would just laugh and say "nope"
    Exactly as txyu said, oh well. Stuff breaks. Suck it up. Don't be a whiner. Pay for your own gear.
     
  10. other

    other Regular Member

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2004
    Messages:
    1,566
    Likes Received:
    8
    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    Cambridge, UK
    like this?
    however i dont understand why player A ran to the front right after receiving serve, unless they were anticipating the striaght drop. Anyway, if it were me and my racquet broke after me swinging it into my partner's, i wouldn't be asking for any money :eek:
     

    Attached Files:

  11. Gollum

    Gollum Regular Member

    Joined:
    May 23, 2003
    Messages:
    4,361
    Likes Received:
    39
    Location:
    Surrey, UK
    Objectively, B should have played the smash and A should not have tried for the backhand. A forehand smash moving forward is much more effective than a backhand stroke moving backwards.

    This assumes, however, that B would have been able to play the smash without too much delay; otherwise it will drop too low to smash and an attempted net interception by B would have been better.

    Nonetheless, this does not constitute grounds for B to ask for money when his racket broke. Confusion arises in doubles, and racket clashes are a risk that all players take.

    Unless one player was deliberately trying to damage the other's racket, or was behaving recklessly or unsafely, then there are no grounds for asking for money.

    Bad luck for B :( It happens.
     
    #11 Gollum, May 11, 2006
    Last edited: May 11, 2006
  12. silentheart

    silentheart Regular Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2004
    Messages:
    4,214
    Likes Received:
    18
    Location:
    USA
    I am going to ask my company to start a badminton racquet liability insurance. IMHO, you play double, racquets clash happen all the time. It is also a tactic for double game to hit between oppenents and hope they miss because of racquet concern or their racquet clash. If that is the case, who's fult is it? Just like Gollum and other say, unless it is "deliberately trying to damage the other's racket, or was behaving recklessly or unsafely" just suck it up and take it like a man. It is easier to buy a new racquet than build a friendship.
     
  13. shanepaul86

    shanepaul86 Regular Member

    Joined:
    May 27, 2005
    Messages:
    92
    Likes Received:
    0
    Occupation:
    student
    Location:
    KL, Malaysia
    i think the one in the back should beware of their partner who is in front. Normally , i don ask for anyone to pay for my broken racquet and i will always use the cheapest racquet during double game.
     
  14. wood_22_chuck

    wood_22_chuck Regular Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2003
    Messages:
    2,214
    Likes Received:
    3
    Occupation:
    Electronics Technologist
    Location:
    Vancouver, BC
    Bad luck for B, I agree. It's B's shot to take, but when A backs up, B has full visibility of what's going on.

    If B is sensitive to racket breakage, then he shouldn't have swung.

    Rackets break. Get another.

    -dave
     
  15. magdrury

    magdrury Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2005
    Messages:
    31
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Canada
    Well, It is not too clear what the return looks like. According to your post, it seems that A could hit the return with no problem so I think A is not wrong to return this shot. It may not be the best option for your pair that person A returned the shot instead of person B.

    However, I think person B who standed behind A should be able to see that A was attempting to hit and should understand A is running into B's path. Given the fact that B should be able to see what A was doing while A had no idea what B was doing. I think B is at fault in this situation.
     
  16. ibm88

    ibm88 Regular Member

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2005
    Messages:
    114
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    toronto
    In any doubles play the middle court is always the forehand shot. It is always easier for a player to hit a forehand than a backhand or around the head. The exceptions would be player A the right side can intercept the bird without without moving back.
    Normally doubles play if a player makes a net shot the player should stay in the front to cover the net and let the person in the back smash when the opponents make a weak return the player in front would take that shot.
     
  17. Dendrobius

    Dendrobius Regular Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2005
    Messages:
    15
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Australia
    Ah, no, A and B's position were reversed!

    With the diagram from other, reverse A and B's positions. It'll make a lot more sense. As in, a midline shot would have been A's backhand from the very start.

    - A receives from RIGHT HAND SIDE, looking at opponent. Is drop served, goes to forward right
    - B starts on LEFT HAND SIDE
    - Return is weak (botched clear), down midline, midcourt
    - B readies smash, hasn't moved from start.
    - A goes backwards from net and clashes with B.

    Teaches me to go and post whilst looking at the situation from the wrong end of the court! :p
     
  18. other

    other Regular Member

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2004
    Messages:
    1,566
    Likes Received:
    8
    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    Cambridge, UK
    oh..nvm B on left and A on right makes more sense.
    A should leave it for B (or hit it without going backwards) and B should have seen A and left it. (one of them is however required to hit it :D)

    its an accident-learn from it i guess, no grounds really for demanding money.


    oh and its STOOD rather than standed
     
  19. DinkAlot

    DinkAlot dcbadminton
    Brand Representative

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2005
    Messages:
    12,415
    Likes Received:
    57
    Occupation:
    DCBadminton Racket Developer
    Location:
    dcbadminton.net
    Egg-zachary. Rackets break.

    I say forget who's "right" and who's "wrong", it's gray area when playing doubles as we weren't there and no amount of explanation is going to really clarify things. If you feel you were "right", you were right. He's going to feel the same way.

    The best way is for each person to pay for their own racket...and make sure you don't partner with that person again. :p
     
  20. s0lar

    s0lar Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2006
    Messages:
    296
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Nijlen (Belgium)
    The way I see it that A played a lob and then didn't moved side by side and chose to stay at the net then saw that he could still hit the poorly returned shuttle. A should have stayed by the net when he chose to stay in front and B is right when he tries to smash the shuttle.
    I don't understand what A was thinking when he stayed at the net after a lob? When playing doubles (not Mixed Doubles), you play side by side when defending and a lob is a defensive play.
     

Share This Page