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  1. #1
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    Question Malaysian female player?

    I am wondering why I never saw a good malaysian female player in past 10 years. Malaysian male players are so good that they can go into 2002 Thomas cup championship, then what's wrong with the female? Is it because Malayisia is an Islam country and then discourage women to play professional sport? I know a lot of chinese girls came from Malaysia, and they do play very well. So I really have no clue about it.

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    Regular Member wilfredlgf's Avatar
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    Default Re: Malaysian female player?

    Being an Islamic country doesn't stop Malaysian women from being good in sports. I don't know what they tell you in the US but Malaysia is way progressive than most of the Islamic countries in the world. In fact, we're a model country for a progressive multireligious multiethnic society. The only people who discourage women from taking up sports are the small minority of religious zealots who live in their narrow minded world ever since the beginning of time.

    Back to the question...

    The problem here perhaps stems from the fact that the number of women badminton players are so much less in Malaysia. The pool of talented players to choose from are so much smaller in comparison to, say, Indonesia or China; (China has more than 1 billion citizens and Indonesia has more than 100 million?) For every 1 talented lady that Malaysia has, Indonesia produces... 5, and China perhaps 50? (Still, this doesn't explain the US, for example).

    Perhaps the fact that Malaysian women don't have any local heroes (heroines?) to look to when it comes to women's badminton may somehow dampen the interest.

    More so, the social norm here is very much like many other countries in Asia, that sports is a short term commitment that is not as important as a ... career in the industries for example. Thus, more are interested in more secure jobs such as teachers, engineers, businesswomen etc etc.

    Still, I'm sure one of these days, Malaysia is likely to produce one or two world beaters. All it takes is a good awareness in the game and a good programme to round it off; most important of all. The grassroots must prosper before the elite classes can be born.

    My bottom dollar would be on the lack of interest to pursue badminton (or in general, sports) as a professional career.

    Feel free to comment.

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    Sorry if my guess about islam country hurt anyone.

    My question is, if population is a problem, why it didn't happen to Malaysian male players? They are so good to go into Thomas cup championship, then how come the about the same amount of women in Malaysia can't be as good as men? I know the level of a country go up and down all the time, but for a very long period then there must be some problems. Even Denmark with only 6 million people, they still can have stars like Peter Gade and Camilla Martin, and a lot of other good double players.

    Then talk about socail norm, is the social expectations for men and women in Malaysia are different? I mean, I know for asian countries, somehow they don't encourage women to become professional players, but we still see china, korea, indonesia, and even Japan have some very good female players. So, is the social norm very different in Malaysia?

    Maybe this two factors come together to make it, I don't know, any other possibility?

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    Regular Member wilfredlgf's Avatar
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    Nah, you hurt no one. I'm not even a Moslem.

    Had a chat with a badminton kaki just during lunch and we both arrived at a few conclusions.

    The population of women in Malaysia who plays badminton perhaps, are much lower, perhaps so much lower that the number of real talents are not significant enough. Population to badminton player ratio are perhaps much much smaller compared to countries like Denmark.

    As for social norms, I guess this must be one of the biggest culprits. Women are taught from young to pursue good education and qualification, get a secure job, marry a good man, have a family. That's the stereotype although things had changed much. Thus, more spend their time on academic matters than on things like sports. Badminton, to them, is just a past time. Many won't bother to even learn how to hit properly.

    This too, may have contributed to the inferiority complex, thus, the Prime Minister had repeatedly asked the people to strive for excellence and shed that second class mentality. Still, like you, I don't understand as well.

    I seen once on the Discovery Channel about a diving academy in China, where the trainees grew up doing a regiment of training from they were much younger, spending almost all their time at the swimming pool as their coaches perfect their technique etc. The training could go on for their entire day, from early morning until late evening. Education is placed somewhere in between. I don't know if it's still that way in China, but that shows one thing though - it will be hard to mix education and sports together. Still, sports, to the Chinese, is important for social mobility , ie, to break from the cycle of poverty and hardship (don't blast me for this, I heard this on the show).

    The other thing we discussed about was about the quality of coaching which was quite interesting. The same coaches everywhere in Malaysia often have female pupils trained under their wings all the same. And if the men could come out and become world beaters, what happened to the women? Now that is a good question.

    From 50 talented youngsters, maybe 10 would make it to the national level academies. From that ten maybe only 1 or 2. Now, we may not even have 10 to start with, how to reach that elusive 1 or 2 top class?

    Good discussion this one, but too bad I have never seriously thought about.

    As for that matter, I believe the quality is there, but the mentality is not. Still, perhaps things will pick up for now that professional clubs are beginning to play a serious role in the development of badminton, maybe new talents are to emerge soon. We have Joanne here, maybe?

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    I am surprised to know that there are only 20 million people in Malaysia, it's almost equal to Taiwan's population number!

    I came from Taiwan, I think from your reply, the social norm in Malaysia is very close to what in Taiwan. In Taiwan, all parents always think that study toward higher education is the most important thing for children, all other things are just for fun. So even a lot of people play badminton in Taiwan, no one would encourage their child to play badminton as a career. For them, it is not "serious" In their point of view, only going to college and getting a white-collar job is respectful. Therefore, a lot of talented young player would be forced by their parents to give up playing badminton at all, just for going to college.

    I think the problem come from the essence of professional badminton.Since the reward from tournament is too low, a badminton player usually just can't earn their living just by playing in tournaments. Therefore, professional players usually earn from two sources: either government or corporation support. In coluntries like china or korea, since the governments think that winning championships is important, they just put a lot of money on it. In countries like Denmark or Indonesia, since badminton is so popular, a lot of company would like to support players as kind of advertisement. But in Taiwan, neither is the case, therefore no one wants to play badminton as a career since he can always earn more from other jobs. I don't know if it is also true in Malaysia, but I think if the prize for badminton is still so low, it would keep happening in developing countries.

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    Regular Member wilfredlgf's Avatar
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    You're on this forum continuously, are you? It almost felt like chatting!

    I guess it's the same as in Taiwan, most Malaysian parents/guardians does not encourage women to go and play badminton as a career. And as for the income part, I couldn't agree more. There had been quite some argument over the difference in sports prize monies for men and women events which I think is justified (the argument I mean). Still, I doubt this had anything to do with the matter.

    Perhaps the lack of competition matters a lot in this. When there aren't many competent players at the same level, one tends to deteriorate when the skills are not tested against new ideas and opposition. It grows stagnant, as one sportsman said in a local paper once.

    To make matters simple, most Malaysian women (and men) just don't see professional sports as something they'd do for a career. Professional is seen as not a stable and secure career to embark upon unless you're good. And to most Malaysians, we just aren't good enough. This self-defeating attitude is also another reason for that. To make matters worst, sometimes even the local fans are supporting the players from China or Korea when playing against our home grown talents. This, I can say, is a sad fact.

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    hm...i dunno how should i start here...
    in malaysia there's alot of female badminton player...
    there's more than 5 in the national team...( i think so )
    y i think they can't reach to the level like china n other countries ...is not enough exposure in international tourney....mostly they'll send male players than female players...
    but i think it'll change this time around...as misbun is in charge now....
    maybe they'll start to send them to 1 or 2 stars tourney or even satellit events....if they perform well ...then maybe they'll compete in higher ranking tourney...

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    Regular Member wilfredlgf's Avatar
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    Agreed.
    Actually, they should send the girls to all the tourneys that they could afford. A sporadic involvement in the international circuit is simply insufficient. They need continuous exposure to top and world class players to improve. It matters not that they win or lose now, as more often than not they ended up beaten. Over time, that improvement will translate to victories.

    I once had a problem playing players who are much better than I am, but had since shed that inferiority complex. Results? Great improvement and new playing ideas. Losing mattered not anymore, as long as I go down fighting.

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    yup, go down fighting, and learning as well for self improvement.

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    dunno when i can improve...as i'm used to lost in every game i played coz i'm still a beginner...hav to start from the basic....
    there's no chance for me to improve...coz when i train..is once a month...not every week...
    i wish i can train at lease once every week...but i'm bz wit my studies...

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    Default Malay women player

    I believe there is a young Joanne on this forum, who will put Malaysian Women badminton on the map!

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    I think if Malaysia give the women players more attention and exposure, they will eventually improve. Also, with the men so strong, BAM should get the girls to spar with some of the national and backup players. However, I have to agree with wilfredlgf's observation. Malaysian women and people in general have to change their mindset, or the situation will continue to be lopsided.

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    Regular Member wilfredlgf's Avatar
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    Originally posted by wl2172
    Also, with the men so strong, BAM should get the girls to spar with some of the national and backup players.
    I believe that is exactly what they are doing now at BAM, getting the men and women to spar together. The men get to play against opponents with different ideas and style, while the women get to benefit from the high powered and speedy competition.


    Originally posted by Wizbit
    I believe there is a young Joanne on this forum, who will put Malaysian Women badminton on the map!
    People like Joanne here are those whom I believe to be kind to truly excel in the game if given enough support and exposure. She shows high enthusiasm in badminton which is not so common among Malaysian women (not a girl, not yet a woman...) and this, could perhaps be the difference between those who can succeed and those who are not going to make it. All that is needed now is continuous quality guidance, ample support from the family (change of mindset) and the people around her as well as quality competition.

    I was thrilled to actually know that someone like Joanne does exist, whom I find to be a rare gem among Malaysian women. Her inquisitively about the techniques, rules etc as well as issues on the game could only help her improve. It used to only be the boys who are fanatical in badminton. If we have more girls like her in Malaysia, I don't see why we can produce top class contenders.

    Hm... let's not pressure her, shall we? Plenty of support, but no pressure.

    Originally posted by spectra
    dunno when i can improve...as i'm used to lost in every game i played coz i'm still a beginner...hav to start from the basic....
    there's no chance for me to improve...coz when i train..is once a month...not every week...
    i wish i can train at lease once every week...but i'm bz wit my studies...
    Good for you that you had the chance to start from the basics. I never had the chance to do it the proper way the last time when I was back in school (perhaps I should have been more insistent when I told my dad about the idea...), and now I have to undo all the bad habits which can be quite tough.

    Hey, when you're down there, the only way is up. There is no such thing as no chance to improve. You can train once a month, but play regularly weekly. That can still help. I play only once every week and I can say without boasting that I am twice the player (the skills, not the size! ) I was compared to last time.
    Last edited by wilfredlgf; 06-11-2003 at 07:01 PM.

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    In a way, that's probably a disservice to say that M'sia women are not inquisitive becuase they are not surfing the web and posting questions up on a badmintonforum.

    But I definately agree on this point

    As for social norms, I guess this must be one of the biggest culprits. Women are taught from young to pursue good education and qualification, get a secure job, marry a good man, have a family. That's the stereotype although things had changed much. Thus, more spend their time on academic matters than on things like sports. Badminton, to them, is just a past time. Many won't bother to even learn how to hit properly.

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    Default Re: Re: Malaysian female player?

    Originally posted by wilfredlgf
    The pool of talented players to choose from are so much smaller in comparison to, say, Indonesia or China; (China has more than 1 billion citizens and Indonesia has more than 100 million?) For every 1 talented lady that Malaysia has, Indonesia produces... 5, and China perhaps 50? (Still, this doesn't explain the US, for example).
    how come we can't come up with a decent soccer team?
    soccer/football is even more popular in china, I believe (not sure)

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    Default Re: Re: Re: Malaysian female player?

    Originally posted by TOmike
    how come we can't come up with a decent soccer team?
    soccer/football is even more popular in china, I believe (not sure)
    Who are you referring to as 'we'? Malaysia, China or Canada?

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    yes i was refering to china, and i gave the vague point in the direction of china, hehe sorry

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