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  1. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by renbo View Post
    Regarding the results, one cannot deny the success of the CHN team in the recent 10 years. In that respect, it is indeed a golden era.
    But that is not the only criteria. Some badminton fans, including a lot in China, do find the team's style annoying under LYB. They all play the same style, it is all about nation's glory, there is no sense of freedom or joy. There is less and less respect for the world of badminton or sport.
    For me CHN team inspire awe but do also has its flaws ; it do not enhance the badminton world. Perhaps I am asking too much?

    Under LYB leadership, CBA got many gold medals.

    But CBA lost glory, honours and pride. Ever heard of the Wang XiaoLi story?

    http://sports.qq.com/a/20120529/000708.htm

  2. #138
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    As expected in this English-speaking forum, there is apparently quite a lot of misperceptions and misconceptions about CBA. I attribute it mainly to a dearth of Chinese articles published or translated into English in the news media.

    At the same time, the situation is aggravated by a number of anti-CHN elements taking every opportunity to misrepresent, misinterpret,miscommunicate, misinform,exaggerate and even distort the truths, often without bothering to check with or at least cite authentic sources of their information or attributing them so that others can judge for themselves. Bear in mind that opinions are not facts.

    Take the Wang Xiaoli story fully recounted in the link kindly posted by pcl99 above - for those who can read Mandarin, I urge you to do so and form your own opinion. It was about the news of WXL's grandmother passing away and only told to her after the Uber Cup finals was over for fear that it might affect her performance. Presumably according to the article, the decision to withhold the news from WXL was made by her mother together with and after consulting the government official concerned at the provincial level. Needless to say, the incident was hotly debated in the Chinese social media with severe criticisms or sympathetic understanding shown on either side. It demonstrated how free and open,lively and healthy the Chinese online media at least is today on matters of public interests as far as sports are concerned. As for WXL herself, well, she bore no ill feelings towards anyone and has put the incident behind her and is happily back with CBA playing badminton. Actually this topic was fully discussed before in another thread, I don't wish to revive it here. Personally, I'd much prefer WXL be told of it and for her to decide what course of action to take; naturally, her mother too has her rights and consideration to take into account.

    Another example was recently in the CHN Nat'l Team C'ship, Lin Dan out of frustration with himself for mishitting a shot during his match with Chen Yuekun vented it out by throwing his racquet to the floor and was immediately issued a yellow card by the umpire, that's all. But a certain ill-intentioned poster here without revealing the details nor citing his source of information (misinformation?) dubiously wrote:"yes,he answered it with a flying racquet and yellow card yesterday". Well, you know the bad implication and the kind of mistaken queries it provoked until the matter was clarified by simply referring to the report itself. You'd have thought that's the end of the matter but no, the recalcitrant poster not only ignored the clarification but went on to repeat the similar insinuating remark in another thread, good grief!

    As I've said, there are nearly twenty million followers on Lin Dan's microblog. If just 1% of them can write acceptable English and join this forum, I'm sure we'll get a fairer, balanced, more representative and clearer picture of Chinese badminton. Don't worry that they'll be all CHN fans and supporters. My impression is they can be outspoken, giving credit where due, criticism where justified; just see how well-received and highly regarded many of the foreign players are in CHN till today, such as Taufik Hidayat, Peter Gade, Lee CW, just to name a few of the better-known ones who together with Lin Dan are regarded in China as the 'Four Heavenly Kings'. Even the commentator, Gillian Clark, herself said she is recognised on the streets and in the taxi whenever she's in China.

    To be honest,it very much benefits China when not only they hold themselves to the highest standards and demand the very best from themselves but the foreigners too expects as much from them, and that not just purely in terms of badminton. To CBA's credit, since its inception, she has been fortunate to be blessed with many great talents and characters. Of course, all this did not come about by mere chance but through their concerted efforts, perseverance,dedication and hard work. Without doubt, nobody or organization is perfect; as long as CBA is willing to admit her shortcomings and learn from mistakes whilst constantly consolidating her strong points, she will continue to grow from strength to strength well into the future.

  3. #139
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    Well, what we don't need is more of "love China thus love CHN team, criticize CHN team means you hate China". It is precisely this equation that the present management of CHN team over-emphasize and is not good for the sport. Beside, I think the style of play in the national training center is becoming more and more standardized. All the shuttlers play alike! Though they all play well

  4. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by Justin L View Post
    Some days ago, on a CCTV program, Li Yongbo was interviewed during which he hailed Lin Dan as a national hero in the company of the likes of Liu Xiang, the 110m hurdler, and Sun Yang,the swimmer, among others. http://sports.qq.com/a/20130128/000418.htm

    He also took the opportunity to correct a misconception where he previously was reported to have said that winning gold medals is the only yardstick for sporting success.He explained to the interviewer:" Why do you only talk about gold medals, what about national glory and honour? Let me rephrase it,I urge my players to strive towards the raising of the national flag and playing of the national anthem in the arena, as such would anybody still doubt me? So in future I 'll change my statement to - gold medal matters not, I only want to do my nation proud."
    Good reading. Thanks for citing the source and the translation, as always.

    Liu Xiang is indeed a national hero. I like Liu Xiang for the same reasons I like LCW. They are respectful of their opponents, be they stronger, weaker or equal; they try their best even when their bodies are full of injuries and strains; they have boldly go where no one from the countries have gone before.

    They are real national heroes.
    Last edited by pcll99; 04-02-2013 at 02:45 PM.

  5. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by renbo View Post
    Well, what we don't need is more of "love China thus love CHN team, criticize CHN team means you hate China". It is precisely this equation that the present management of CHN team over-emphasize and is not good for the sport. Beside, I think the style of play in the national training center is becoming more and more standardized. All the shuttlers play alike! Though they all play well
    I beg your pardon, where did you get that impression from? Certainly not from me as I'm against blind loyalty. I believe the same goes to CBA who takes constructive criticism and practises self-criticism, if I'm not wrong. Anyway, I'm not their spokesman, my humble opinions are formed from my own reading and analyses, eg from Tang Xianhu's words such as (if I may paraphrase from memory) when he said it's not the coach that is super and should be given all the credit but the players themselves willing to work hard and have the right attitude that is key to success, of course, not discounting natural talent which to him is by itself not enough.

    Talking about criticisms, it is none other than Li Yongbo himself in the whole of CBA who often or more than occasionally comes under quite a bit of flak. The players are also not spared, particularly WSX whom we know was receiving a lot of brickbats from before the London Olympics to as recent as the KOR Open 2013.

    Well, if you think that CBA's emphasis on the team spirit and putting Nation before self is no good, then I'd say, please take into account China's national situation (this is a big topic which I'm reluctant to delve into here) and the current state of professional badminton the world over ( I was told certain associations are having to skip a few tournaments for lack of funds).I'd go so far as to say this, that no organization can demand blind obedience and total submission without paying a heavy price for it - it's counter-productive and no way can it strives towards excellence whether it be in sports, the creative arts,music or running a business, the exception is in the military (or the cults but we know the outcome).

    Regarding standardized training, to my limited knowledge, I'd say it is necessary and the right thing to do for a large part of it for the sake of efficiency and effectiveness. But this cannot be applied to styles of play and shouldn't even be attempted as each player is unique in terms of his/her physical and mental make-up including individual life experiences and age.

    In fact,among the CHN MS, Chen Jin and Du Pengyu (though he is trying to transition to a more attacking game) are considered the rallying type, what I call 'grinders' if you know what I mean, whereas Lin Dan and Chen Long and now Wang Zhengming, are the aggressive (even explosive) attacking players. And among CHN WS, who could be more different than Wang Shixian,practically a one of a kind player. Come to think of it, if all the CHN MS can be standardized to play really like a Lin Dan or Chen Long or Lee CW, why not, that'd be great, isn't it?!

    Just a friendly exchange of views, nothing personal. Thanks.

  6. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by renbo View Post
    Beside, I think the style of play in the national training center is becoming more and more standardized. All the shuttlers play alike! Though they all play well
    i don't think i agree with that either. or perhaps in a limited fashion.

    MS: as mentioned by JustinL, CJ, Du Pengyu are the rally type, Du is slightly more interesting than CJ's "robot" style. LD/CL are offensive players but LD is more dynamic/flamboyant and CL is less so.

    WS: while you can say the taller girls like WYH and LXR have similar style, one cannot say that they are the same as WX or WSX. WX speed, and twisty attacking play is a joy to watch and totally different than WYH/LXR and also completely different than WSX's rallying style.

    MD: not many to do comparison, but certainly the new pairing of Liu/Qiu don't look any more simliar than Cai/Fu.

    since they are always so much adhered with each other, in travelling, in cheering, in how they all present themselves, and with the relatively lacking in personal communication with their fans, it is an easy and dangerous trap to view and treat the Chinese as a collective. if you look closely, they are in fact individuals with individual styles both on and off the court.

  7. #143
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    Justin, I do not write my comments because of your opinion, but because what I think is one of the reason so many fans dislike CHN team while it is winning so many. Beside, as you said, one really has to take into account the situation of China, and this situation is precisely one that have a governement that says "love your country" but means "obey to me".
    Anyway enough politics ; regarding the style of play of the players, I still think each one particular style is being molded into a common pattern, though of course this cannot be totally acheived.
    In MS, of course there is LD, he is the greatest player, but besides, and even considering his recent evolution, all the others are pointing in the same direction. Chen Long is not the attacking and explosive type : he retreives everything. His smash is lethal but that is something he developped after the rest. Personnaly, I think his play is boring to watch, despite the fact that I like the guy. Du and CJ we all agree I think. Wang Zhengming used to have a true personnal style, so'ething a bit like TH when he was 18, but now is being grinded into a sort of CJ. The second rate players like Chen YK or others are even more the same.
    for the WS, only WS is for me different. And also LXR in some,respects. Others all have the 拉开playing style.
    I'm being to long so I'll stop here. I think what I criticize is also what many persons actually likes in CHN team, so I know it is only a personnal view.

  8. #144
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    In the last post by WS i mean WX

  9. #145
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    Badminton fans here are weir. No one dislike Federer, Spanish soccer team, USA basketball team just because they win too much.... These so-called badminton fans simply don't love badminton, don't love those excel in badminton (if not their countryman)... That's the reason that I feel sad about badminton sport, and don't think badminton will be as competitive in the world of sports as tennis, soccer, basketball... becoz badminton does not have a good quality fan base without borders.

  10. #146
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    The reactions of a sport's fan, whatever the sport, is always complex. It is in many cases a love-hate relationship, and it is almost impossible for the fans to be satisfied. Badminton is no exception at all! In football it is two thousand time worst in Europe, and in South America it is even more so!
    As for winning, it really depends. The Spanish football team is loved in many places outside Spain because of its style of play, which is attacking, elegant and technical.

  11. #147
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    The same can be said of Federer!

  12. #148
    Regular Member undeadshot's Avatar
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    While WS seems to be on a decline with only perhaps Sun Yu being a ray of hope (Li Xuerui is still very young though), MS seems to be doing pretty well!

  13. #149
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    Default Badminton is the most popular, at least in urban area

    Not sure about country side, in cities I have been to, badminton is definitely the most popular sports participated. Few young people play table tennis nowadays. Basketball does attract a lot of men, but badminton has more followers from both genders.

    Quote Originally Posted by laonong View Post
    From my observation. badminton should be ranked below table tennis, basketball. Just compare how many table tennis tables and basketball court to badminton courts. In China's rural area, badmitnon courts are close to zero.

  14. #150
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    Coming up: the World Championships, held in China this year.

    It should give us a pretty fair indication of where things are headed.

  15. #151
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    still winning golds. peak golden era is under lyb. only time china fails to win gold medals was first time at olympics.

  16. #152
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    Well, it's just over 2 years since I had started this thread to plot the course of CBA's arguably most productive and proud era in international badminton, and it appears that the original estimate is correct.

    I had said that that era would wind down within 2-3 years, and that appears to be the case, without a doubt. There are glaring issues with continuity in many disciplines. And there appear to be issues with discipline, too.

    Oh yes, the China team is still notionally stronger that ay other team and still contains more depth in many disciplines than any other opponents' but the consistency and infallibility at the top is just not there anymore.

    Change must come...

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