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Thread: Customworqs

  1. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Avenger View Post
    well, if everyone are doing it doesn't mean it will justify you to doing it too
    and no, you don't come clean. it is after Kwun pointed that BaddersUS is actually a clone that's why you open everything

    how about something like this?



    ha, a clone said he bought a racket from customworqs

    I saw many people support other brands (esp if they are agents, like PP agent, Victor, etc) but this forum is more or less neutral compared to other badminton sites (such as Indonesian badminton forum which is flooded with sellers that trying to knock out each other)
    it becomes apparent who support who after reading so many posts (and we know the review would be good. PP does a good job in this but they do add some depth by not only telling you their racket's pros but also cons)

    what I don't like is, you challenged us as a buyer, not as a seller.
    I did not bother posting about colour scheme, etc since I thought you are a clueless forumer
    but as a seller, buyer has the right to talk. I will give you free hints. I saw many people and only casual people who think about the colour scheme esp women or kids (which IMO, not your target market as it should be hardcore players)
    yes, I live in the UK for 5 years, and most of the time, the one who said: the "colour scheme is ugly" is woman
    for women, we recommend something a bit flash and in pink colour such as arcsaber 3FL / 9FL (and we say, go for it and earn brownie points)
    not many in this forum says: oh I hate the colour so I don't buy it
    that's why I said it is only 24-36 specs since colour is useless for us (and it is only 27 specs according to you)

    I don't like how you justified your brand by saying you are not selling those marketing technology.
    it doesn't justify why you don't put sword frame or box frame, 80-88-96 string holes, why it is only 670 not 675mm
    so many questions and as a seller you don't justify why it should be that way (actually, I don't want to talk a lot about it since everyone already questioning it since the beginning)
    why not 675mm? why 22x21 string pattern? why isometric?

    except you are saying this is not marketing tech stories:
    Detonate string
    Vlite cap
    sensigel

    I don't know, I just feel so many thing wrong in this thread
    this is a new brand, and you need to prove us that this is something that worth our money. but not using an under handed tactics like above
    tell us about your brand. answer our question. challenge our ideology about a racket if you want to change it, and lastly, try to justify WHY we should pay �121.15 for your racket.

    P.S: to Kuwn or other mods, sorry for being so frontal here. if you think this is too much, feel free to delete it
    I'll try and answer these in an order:

    1. I'm not baddersUS so please stop quoting these posts as mine. however I know they are keen on customisation

    2. I've not challenged you as a buyer as I'm not BaddersUS. I have, as all other brands do, challenged you and others as a forum member / person interested in what you have to say

    3. I agree with you that members of this forum will look past the colour of the racket and into the playability. However these forum members are only 1 segment of many different types of badminton player who will buy expensive badminton rackets.

    4. The rackets are a mold which combines box frame at the T joint for stability and aero frame or "sword frame" as you term it, in the head for good aerodynamics. In my opinion this is the best combination for badminton rackets.

    5. 22 x 21 string pattern because it is easier to string, aside from this, in my opinion, there is little difference in playability between the most popular string patterns on the market today

    6. I'd like to offer 665mm, 675mm as well as classic and optimetric head shapes. The reality I have agreement from the factory in principle to do this if I get to a certain sales number.

    7. You list Detonate, Sensigel and V-lite as my technologies stories. I have to disagree with you that these are not stories as all I've done is provide images and construction information. I haven't claimed the string delivers for example, 25% more control. What I do know is that, they are excellent playing string and grips.

    7. Re payment, you are paying �121.15 for rackets because:
    a) it has 2 years development time underpinning them
    b) my 30 years experience as an international player, coach and former Head of Carlton to ensure they are great playing rackets
    c) the molds created in the development of the rackets
    d) the numerous samples tested in the development of the rackets
    e) the fact it is manufactured as a one off
    f) the air freight from China to the customworqs office to QC it
    g) the air freight from my office to the customer
    h) any customs duty charges are included in the price

    Can I ask you the same question. What racket do you play with, how much did you pay for it and why do you think it cost that much?

    Hope this helps

  2. #53
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    I love the idea behind the site, but what I find difficult to figure out is how is a person to know what your racquet is actually going to feel like? Racquet balance is so subjective to where the weight is actually located in certain spots of the racquet that just knowing the balance point doesn't really give you a perfect idea of what it's going to feel/swing like. This is especially worrisome because these are one-off racquets where no one has the ability to test them before purchasing. This also applies to the flexibility of the racquet as well. I also find it interesting that you are basically telling us that the current top end companies are using technologies that don't actually stack up to their claims and are therefore misleading and or useless technologies... but then you proceeded to make a website where you can customize your racquet... but only to the technologies you personally deem worthy. It suddenly becomes a purchase that really requires a trust in your judgement... more so than my own personal likes/dislikes/preferences. I noticed you said you have to wait for a certain amount of sales to come in before you allow more customizations.. but from what I can tell you absolutely need it to be more specific.. and to figure out a way to convey how the racquet is going to feel. Head light - medium - head heavy just isn't cutting it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie Hang View Post
    I'll try and answer these in an order:


    7. Re payment, you are paying �121.15 for rackets because:
    a) it has 2 years development time underpinning them
    b) my 30 years experience as an international player, coach and former Head of Carlton to ensure they are great playing rackets
    c) the molds created in the development of the rackets
    d) the numerous samples tested in the development of the rackets
    e) the fact it is manufactured as a one off
    f) the air freight from China to the customworqs office to QC it
    g) the air freight from my office to the customer
    h) any customs duty charges are included in the price
    I am interested in buying one of these rackets but I'm wondering if there would be any discount if I buy more than one racket as I usually buy more than 1 racket at a time

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    Quote Originally Posted by bifo the monkey View Post
    I am interested in buying one of these rackets but I'm wondering if there would be any discount if I buy more than one racket as I usually buy more than 1 racket at a time
    On the review basket page, there is a banner that says you get a 20% discount for each subsequent racket purchased each time.

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    Default Demo

    I was fortunate enough to have a hit with a variety of sample rackets this afternoon. To give you some background, I am a coach and generally find medium balance/weight/flex setups the best for me because they have good all round playability. So, I mainly stuck to that setup this afternoon. Comparing it to my current Forza rackets with similar setups, in a nutshell it felt far more solid to hit with and more forgiving too. I'm not saying these rackets are going to make you Lin Dan but a racket should compliment the users strengths and improve (to some degree) weaknesses and that's exactly what it did.

    I also had a play with headlight and head heavy setups. They are what they claim to be (not much more I can add, just depends what you want/need from a racket. They definitely don't just manipulate the weight in the handle, you can feel the difference in the mold itself. The samples I used today were strung at 26lbs but I think Mat said that they can go up to 28lbs but don't quote me on that.


    To the suspicious forumers: I am not a plant, I have had a Forza coaching sponsorship for the last 4 seasons and before that I owned a range of top line Yonex rackets. I've been waiting for something different for the past few years and I am very pleased with the results. For the time being I will still use Forza for clothing etc but I will most definitely be using Customworqs rackets.


    Thanks again to Matthew for a very productive afternoon, cheers!

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    Quote Originally Posted by bbh66 View Post
    I was fortunate enough to have a hit with a variety of sample rackets this afternoon. To give you some background, I am a coach and generally find medium balance/weight/flex setups the best for me because they have good all round playability. So, I mainly stuck to that setup this afternoon. Comparing it to my current Forza rackets with similar setups, in a nutshell it felt far more solid to hit with and more forgiving too. I'm not saying these rackets are going to make you Lin Dan but a racket should compliment the users strengths and improve (to some degree) weaknesses and that's exactly what it did.

    I also had a play with headlight and head heavy setups. They are what they claim to be (not much more I can add, just depends what you want/need from a racket. They definitely don't just manipulate the weight in the handle, you can feel the difference in the mold itself. The samples I used today were strung at 26lbs but I think Mat said that they can go up to 28lbs but don't quote me on that.


    To the suspicious forumers: I am not a plant, I have had a Forza coaching sponsorship for the last 4 seasons and before that I owned a range of top line Yonex rackets. I've been waiting for something different for the past few years and I am very pleased with the results. For the time being I will still use Forza for clothing etc but I will most definitely be using Customworqs rackets.


    Thanks again to Matthew for a very productive afternoon, cheers!
    * pix or it didn't happen *

    But on a serious note, just wondering if those demo's had their final paintjob yet and what Forza are you using and compare the three balances to FZ rackets?

    On a sidenote: I also think not including girlie paintjobs is a glaring hole ...

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    Quote Originally Posted by demolidor View Post
    * pix or it didn't happen *

    But on a serious note, just wondering if those demo's had their final paintjob yet and what Forza are you using and compare the three balances to FZ rackets?

    On a sidenote: I also think not including girlie paintjobs is a glaring hole ...
    * referring to a forumer that you quoted
    to think that a 4 years account can come back to life just to post in this thread.. must be a miracle?

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    @ Demolidor

    All the rackets I used today had their final paintjobs. I have quite a few FZ rackets but the one I used today was the new N-Forze ipower 10000 which is medium stiff and medium balance. Hope this helps.

    P.S. Avenger - it must be tricky going through life being so paranoid :P

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie Hang View Post
    I'll ...

    6. I'd like to offer 665mm, 675mm as well as classic and optimetric head shapes. The reality I have agreement from the factory in principle to do this if I get to a certain sales number.

    ...

    Hope this helps
    So my understanding of statement #6 is that there will be NO oval (Classic) head available as I don't expect there to be a lot of requests for them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tranqq View Post
    I love the idea behind the site, but what I find difficult to figure out is how is a person to know what your racquet is actually going to feel like? Racquet balance is so subjective to where the weight is actually located in certain spots of the racquet that just knowing the balance point doesn't really give you a perfect idea of what it's going to feel/swing like. This is especially worrisome because these are one-off racquets where no one has the ability to test them before purchasing. This also applies to the flexibility of the racquet as well. I also find it interesting that you are basically telling us that the current top end companies are using technologies that don't actually stack up to their claims and are therefore misleading and or useless technologies... but then you proceeded to make a website where you can customize your racquet... but only to the technologies you personally deem worthy. It suddenly becomes a purchase that really requires a trust in your judgement... more so than my own personal likes/dislikes/preferences. I noticed you said you have to wait for a certain amount of sales to come in before you allow more customizations.. but from what I can tell you absolutely need it to be more specific.. and to figure out a way to convey how the racquet is going to feel. Head light - medium - head heavy just isn't cutting it.
    A good question tranqq, I will try to answer it as best I can. As a product manager in any badminton brand, at the start of the development of a specific racket, putting "technology" aside, you will be thinking about the type of player you are aiming to develop the racket for and trying (in the majority, there are exceptions) to ensure you can sell as many rackets as possible to that type of player. Therefore the racket has to be easy to play with. From this you will decide on a range of specifications and lay-up combinations that you think will work. What specification / lay-up combinations you think will work will be dependent upon your knowledge of previous specification / lay-ups you've used which have / have not worked as well as your overall understanding of what makes a good badminton racket. These samples will then be ordered and playtested. This is the most crucial element in the whole process as understanding how the racket plays and translating this information into the racket development process is fundamental to creating excellent playing rackets. Now here's the interesting bit. Who do you think normally play tests these rackets?

    1. The Brand Product Manager? If so is he/she up to a sufficient playing standard where he/she can understand what's going on with the racket?
    2. The type of player whom the racket is aimed at? If so European Players? Far Eastern players?
    3. Elite badminton players?

    In my opinion, these stages are hugely overlooked. I believe options 1 to be crucial as it's so important for the person who is developing rackets to be able to feel what's going on rather than giving it to someone else and expect them to explain to them how the rackets is playing. Option 2 is also crucial as you quite rightly point out, playability of a racket is so subjective. Therefore you need to engage the consumer whom you are aiming the racket at. In my opinion many brands rely too heavily on giving their rackets to their top players (option 3) to play test and rely on their feedback. A top player has a very different perspective on racket playability vs a good club / league player for multiple reasons.

    In summation, every racket you purchase is based on the robustness of the development process and to a degree, the judgement of the product manager to develop that racket is the best way possible. Established racket brands have shown they can do this and sometimes do it extremely well. Take the success of the Yonex MP99 - an excellent playing frame. I don't have this brand history and therefore, as you quite rightly point out, you are purchasing based on my judgement. My offer to the badminton market is I believe, through my playing history, my exposure to racket development in the far east and understanding the true foundations of racket playability, I can design and have manufactured by a premium rackets factory, excellent playing badminton rackets at given specifications. 2 years for racket development is a long time, I hope the results speak for themselves.

    Re not being able to play test them pre purchase, I take your point here. I guess where I'm coming from is that if you look at the wider badminton market that purchases rackets, 80% do not play test them before purchasing. I also come back to the robust development process I have been through to create Customworqs. What Customworqs also offers is the ability to continue with a frame rather than having to move to a new frame in 18 months because your frame is no longer available.

    I hope this answers your questions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by maxout View Post
    So my understanding of statement #6 is that there will be NO oval (Classic) head available as I don't expect there to be a lot of requests for them.
    I'm a big fan of the classic head shape still and have agreement that once I've a hit a specific number of sales, I can introduce this as well as what some people term the smaller isometric head shape. I went for the Isometric head shape to launch Customworqs because this covers the majority of players today.

    Thanks

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    How do the grip sizes work, Mat? Reverse scale like Yonex? Also, the sensigel grips.... Can you explain a bit more about what they offer? I'm close to taking the plunge but trying to gather as much info as possible before I do so.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie Hang View Post
    Hi All,Rather than everyone speculating on this thread, here are some facts. I am Matthew Dance-Shuker and I am the owner of Customworqs. My credentials are:- Played badminton since 5 years old (30 years)- Highest world ranking, 43, at men's singles- 5 years at Carlton Sports responsible for the brand globally (product development, sponsorship and marketing) on a shoe string budget and with no control over the Far East market (Carlton is licensed over there)- Responsible for the Vapour Trail range of rackets which was Carlton's best selling range for 10 years- Qualified coach with experience coaching juniors through to internationalsThis brand has been 2 years in the making. The reasons for launching this brand as follows:1. Aside from frame geometry, "technology" has negligible impact2. Some well known international players do not use off-the-shelf products, they have specific frames / carbon lay-ups customised for them which are painted to look like the current range of racketsBecause of the above, I felt the rackets industry was doing a dis-service to all badminton players by hoodwinking them into purchasing rackets based on questionable information.Having spent 4 years understanding what makes a good badminton racket (this is all to do with racket geometry,specs and carbon lay up), I left Carlton and approached a premium rackets factory to discuss setting up a single racket production line. 2 years later and having developed 27 different carbon lay ups which play fantastically well, Customworqs was born. So yes, each racket is made individually. Yes, the spec range is limited at the moment, we had to start somewhere. We have agreement that this can be increased to 3 frame geometries, 7 weights, 7 balances, 7 shaft flexs, 100 design options in the future dependent upon success.Like you, I am a mad keen shuttler and always will be. Customworqs is trying to do something different which breaks away from the norm, to drag the rackets industry into customisation and in doing so, it can catch up with other sports categories. It might fail, and if it does, then at least I can say the brand was transparent in it's offering to badminton players.Mat
    Anyone going to question his username and his name within his post or do I have to point it out?

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    Maybe it's his favorite person???

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    Quote Originally Posted by CanucksDynasty View Post
    Maybe it's his favorite person???
    Already tried googling that name.

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    I think a number of forumers here just "give up" after reading some of the posts here esp on the "marketing" tactics used.

    I know I definitely would not buy one - too risky and dodgy ... concept/idea may be good but approach is all wrong.

    Just my 2 cents.
    Last edited by maxout; 11-20-2012 at 07:57 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by f1rst View Post
    How do the grip sizes work, Mat? Reverse scale like Yonex? Also, the sensigel grips.... Can you explain a bit more about what they offer? I'm close to taking the plunge but trying to gather as much info as possible before I do so.
    Hi f1rst, yes its reverse scale to Yonex, therefore our Grip Size 2 is 3 1/4 / 82.5mm which is very close if not the same as a Yonex G4. Our Grip Size 4 is 3 3/8 / 85.5mm which is similar to the Yonex G2. I've asked our web programmer to put some additional information into the website to help with this in the future - I appreciate the feedback.

    Re sensigel grips, this comes with a gel layer underneath the PU layer which makes the grip feel as though it molds around your fingers. Being non technical, it feels a little squigeey to hold.

    Hope this helps.

    Cheers

    Mat

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