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  1. #18
    Regular Member Mark A's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwun View Post
    that was exactly my thoughts too. but there must be something that we missed in how the main/cross interact with the shape of the racket head.

    or maybe the rounded racket head with main=cross is somehow feel-equivalent to a longer racket head with cross=main+10%.
    My goal is always to get the same "aspect ratio" strung as empty. Maybe a frame under slight N/S compression transmits more feel...

  2. #19
    Administrator kwun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark A View Post
    My goal is always to get the same "aspect ratio" strung as empty. Maybe a frame under slight N/S compression transmits more feel...
    well, when i had the ASE and gotten the good feel with main=cross, i was very first person to have disputed the theory that maintaining the racket head shape is simply just a aesthetic issue.

    i haven't measured the racket shape change after i moved to the new tensioning scheme though. more experiment needs to be done.

  3. #20
    Administrator kwun's Avatar
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    i also forgot to mentioned that with the new tension scheme, i do leave the bottom 4 and top 4 cross at the same tension as main. only the middle 13/14 cross are +10%.

  4. #21
    Regular Member Mark A's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwun View Post
    well, when i had the ASE and gotten the good feel with main=cross, i was very first person to have disputed the theory that maintaining the racket head shape is simply just a aesthetic issue.

    i haven't measured the racket shape change after i moved to the new tensioning scheme though. more experiment needs to be done.
    If I recall properly, Kim Dong Moon used to play with an "upside-down" tension - 28/26, or something. Might be worth a try.

  5. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by DarthHowie View Post
    I'm curious what yan.v has to say since he has the progression II + wise + chudeks?
    Trinhity also has a 6004, but he strings all rackets using Haribito Pro.
    I do mains with fixed clamps and crosses with flying clamps and +10% tension.

    However, I haven't tested much with mains = crosses. But people I string for love the feeling of the string job, be it low or high tension.

    I might test this next time I get to string 2 of the same rackets.

    The reason that mains + 10% might feel different than it did at the time might be the temperature/time of the year, actual perception or maybe psychological reasons. Just speculating though..

  6. #23
    Regular Member Blitzzards's Avatar
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    kwun,

    One thing I noticed about the difference between your ASE (or WASE) and your new Gamma is the spacing between the top and bottom side supports pair. The ones on your ASE are much further apart than on the Gamma and each machine does not "support" or touch the same parts on the racquet frame.

    I will give it a little more thought on how it might affect the finished string feel and post it later on.

  7. #24
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    Kwun,

    Just wanted to ask has this always been the case? I mean IM NOT TOOO SURE, BUT havnt you owned the GAMMA for some time now? (nearly a year?). When you first strung on the Gamma did it have that dull feeling? or did the DULL feeling only occurred recently?

  8. #25
    Administrator kwun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lightandtangy View Post
    Kwun,

    Just wanted to ask has this always been the case? I mean IM NOT TOOO SURE, BUT havnt you owned the GAMMA for some time now? (nearly a year?). When you first strung on the Gamma did it have that dull feeling? or did the DULL feeling only occurred recently?
    yup. it was the case since the beginning. the feeling is different. i went through some iterations experimenting with different things and finally found the combo that works, and that's cross=main+10%.

  9. #26
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    QUICK RESPONSE KWUN!

    Hope we can get to a SOLUTION!

  10. #27
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    Kwun - Sorry to hijack this thread but as you string Cross = Mains + 10%, if someone asks you personally for 24lbs, in your own stringing method how would you go about achieving this on your machine?

    I'm just trying to gather some exp and apply it to my own. Thanks

  11. #28
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    Sorry was meant to say would you string with one of the following tensions if asked for 24lbs

    24x26
    23x25
    22x24

  12. #29
    Administrator kwun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blitzzards View Post
    kwun,

    One thing I noticed about the difference between your ASE (or WASE) and your new Gamma is the spacing between the top and bottom side supports pair. The ones on your ASE are much further apart than on the Gamma and each machine does not "support" or touch the same parts on the racquet frame.

    I will give it a little more thought on how it might affect the finished string feel and post it later on.
    yeah. i thought about that too. firstly though, the difference isn't that much. maybe an grommet hole space or two. that's about it.

    the potential i can see is how the side support position prevents the side of the frame from bulging out when the mains are tensioned. and thus can potentially affect the shape of the final product.

    the effect maybe very very small though. i am not too convinced.

  13. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwun View Post
    yeah. i thought about that too. firstly though, the difference isn't that much. maybe an grommet hole space or two. that's about it.

    the potential i can see is how the side support position prevents the side of the frame from bulging out when the mains are tensioned. and thus can potentially affect the shape of the final product.

    the effect maybe very very small though. i am not too convinced.
    probably the shape is different due to the diff support, did you measure the width? could be millimetres different..

  14. #31
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    Just my 2 cents,

    (1) fixed clamps do hold tension a lot better than flying clamps;
    (2) stiffness and holding ability of side supports also make a huge difference;
    (3) Gamma 6004's support columns actually tilt inwards at very high tension of > 30 lbs (just look at Kwun's Youtube video about the tilting of the fixed clamp under tension)

  15. #32
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    Try to test at AK, I heard he and Terence just got an ES5 Protech so they have dualing machines, as well as a Yonex ST-3000 at home =)
    They can run 3 Yonex electronic machines. Probably the only shop in the states with 3 Yonex electronic machines. KRAZZY!!
    Quote Originally Posted by kwun View Post
    well, when i had the ASE and gotten the good feel with main=cross, i was very first person to have disputed the theory that maintaining the racket head shape is simply just a aesthetic issue.

    i haven't measured the racket shape change after i moved to the new tensioning scheme though. more experiment needs to be done.

  16. #33
    Administrator kwun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pete LSD View Post
    Just my 2 cents,

    (1) fixed clamps do hold tension a lot better than flying clamps;
    (2) stiffness and holding ability of side supports also make a huge difference;
    (3) Gamma 6004's support columns actually tilt inwards at very high tension of > 30 lbs (just look at Kwun's Youtube video about the tilting of the fixed clamp under tension)
    to address (1) and (3) first.

    (1) flying clamps were used in both cases. the experiment done was down to the point where i didn't used any fixed clamp at all although in my latest flow i used limited fixed clamp for speed sake and found that it make no difference.

    (3) i wasn't stringing 30lbs

    as for (2), one would think the much more beefier supports from the 6004 would be stronger, but that's counterintuitive as why would then i need more tension on the cross when use the 6004?

  17. #34
    Administrator kwun's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kakinami View Post
    Try to test at AK, I heard he and Terence just got an ES5 Protech so they have dualing machines, as well as a Yonex ST-3000 at home =)
    They can run 3 Yonex electronic machines. Probably the only shop in the states with 3 Yonex electronic machines. KRAZZY!!
    will drop by some day to check out the new toy and to pick up my allen keys from you!

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