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  1. #35
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    i am not sure how BC/BF got drag into this...

    i was trying to say that consumer awareness is good.

  2. #36
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    Originally posted by Pecheur
    This is completely the call of the individual (in this case Kwun), you have to consider the case though of some faker getting really grumpy with this site since they can't sell stuff and launching a DoS or more serious attack on this site out of irritation.
    this is how bf got into this

  3. #37
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    I doubt a big company like Yonex would be hurt by fakes... Given the proliferation of fakes in Asia, Yonex would have gone bankrupt by now if the fakes are that strong. I think only the consumers bear the brunt of it. Caveat emptor for those who knew little about racquets and still bought the deals because they're too good to pass. I don't think there's much anybody can do about this. For every dishonest dealer found on the net, there's probably ten other dealers on the street selling fakes.

  4. #38
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    Originally posted by cappy75
    I doubt a big company like Yonex would be hurt by fakes... Given the proliferation of fakes in Asia, Yonex would have gone bankrupt by now if the fakes are that strong. I think only the consumers bear the brunt of it. Caveat emptor for those who knew little about racquets and still bought the deals because they're too good to pass. I don't think there's much anybody can do about this. For every dishonest dealer found on the net, there's probably ten other dealers on the street selling fakes.
    Hypothetical scenario: one day by some miracle, all fakes dissapears. Will Yonex become more profitable? I'm (99 + 3*1/3)% sure that the answer is yes. Hence, Yonex is being hurt by fakes. Perhaps not fatally hurt, but it is hurt by it.

    more ppl buying fakes = less ppl buying authentic

  5. #39
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    Originally posted by bigredlemon
    Hypothetical scenario: one day by some miracle, all fakes dissapears. Will Yonex become more profitable? I'm (99 + 3*1/3)% sure that the answer is yes. Hence, Yonex is being hurt by fakes. Perhaps not fatally hurt, but it is hurt by it.

    more ppl buying fakes = less ppl buying authentic
    The above reasoning is too simplistic. IMO, Yonex is hurt but not much in term of their overall sale percentage. The real losers are other legitimate racket makers like gosen, carlton, prince, wilson, prokennex, proace. It is simple logics, when a beginner using fake yonex rackets improves his/her skill, guess what brand will he/her graduate to(most of the time)?
    Last edited by cooler; 01-16-2004 at 09:00 PM.

  6. #40
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    That's quite an interesting point. To a certain degree, Yonex benefits indirectly from exposure given by the fakes. Afterall, imitation is a form of flattery... whether the racquet is authentic or not, at the end of the day, people will still see "Yonex" on the racquet.

    Originally posted by cooler
    The above reasoning is too simplistic. IMO, Yonex is hurt but not much in term of their overall sale percentage. The real losers are other legitimate racket makers like gosen, carlton, prince, wilson, prokennex, proace. It is simple logics, when a beginner using fake yonex rackets improves his/her skill, guess what brand will he/her graduate to(most of the time)?

  7. #41
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    I think the effect of brand dilution (Yonex's name is hurt by being associated with crappy racquets) outweights the benefit of increased exposure. Otherwise, Yonex would license out their name for extra profit.

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    licensing for extra profit? LOL. Nike, MS, autocad, SONY, etc have tried for years. I mean, why pay licensing fee when you don't have to? Just go check out any hawker markets, copied products galore
    Last edited by cooler; 01-17-2004 at 02:51 PM.

  9. #43
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    For those of you think Fake items will help the original companies, you have think about this example about the Fake CDs vs. Original CDs.

    What Happened:
    Music CD Copying and Fake Original Music CDs. The profit for the original music companies has decrease more than 70% than 5 years ago because nowadays, people do not buy Music CDs or they buy Copied Music CDs(which is fake originaly CDs), and this happened in Taiwan a lot lately.

    Result:
    So, what Happened in Taiwan was, since people don't buy the originals, several companies had to cut down the cost and got rid of several singers and lyricts. It was really bad, and I am not joking.

    And applied the same logic from above case to badminton:
    Buying Fakes definetely hurts the original companies deep, especially for those people don't know what they bought was fakes, and things break down, and people will think these companies don't have good items (but what they have in hand are fakes, not from these companies), and this will damage the reputation of the original companies deep.

  10. #44
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    This scenario is different though... in this case, most people knew what they're buying. For the majority of the fake racquet purchasers, either they have no clue or they knew and still want to try it out (ie. looking for that proverbial gem in the rough).

    We have to give alot more credit to the average consumer who unknowingly purchased a fake Yonex racquet. Eventually, they'll learn to differentiate the fake from the real deal... by getting information from friends and the Net; they'll know more about proper pricing and legit vendors once they are into the game and more aware of racquets. If they haven't figured the authencity of the racquet yet, they are probably satisfied with it or have given up the sport already. And it's unlikely anybody would give up the sport because of equipment... most of the time, it's something else.

    Yonex, in the end, still win... they get exposure boost and get more customers from people who switched to the legit ones.

    Ming

    Originally posted by bluejeff
    For those of you think Fake items will help the original companies, you have think about this example about the Fake CDs vs. Original CDs.

    What Happened:
    Music CD Copying and Fake Original Music CDs. The profit for the original music companies has decrease more than 70% than 5 years ago because nowadays, people do not buy Music CDs or they buy Copied Music CDs(which is fake originaly CDs), and this happened in Taiwan a lot lately.

    Result:
    So, what Happened in Taiwan was, since people don't buy the originals, several companies had to cut down the cost and got rid of several singers and lyricts. It was really bad, and I am not joking.

    And applied the same logic from above case to badminton:
    Buying Fakes definetely hurts the original companies deep, especially for those people don't know what they bought was fakes, and things break down, and people will think these companies don't have good items (but what they have in hand are fakes, not from these companies), and this will damage the reputation of the original companies deep.
    Last edited by cappy75; 01-18-2004 at 02:31 AM.

  11. #45
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    the yonex situation is worse preceisely because people might not know they are buying a fake. It is like the music case, except even people who would have bought authentic versions would buy fake ones.

    All the justifications you put out apply to both situations, and more so to the yonex situation.


    cooler, you are missing the point. I said if yonex benefited from fakes, they would be licensing their brand for more money. They don't because it doesn't. Even if they only charge $1 a racquet, that is extra profit. I'm sure the cost of making fakes (having to hide, paying hush money, premium wages to compensate risk of jailtime, etc) will far outweight the the extra $1 licensing fee to make it legally. Thus, fakes would dissapear because it's not profitable to make fakes. It'd be cheaper to make authentic racquets. Yonex doesn't do this because the cost of brand dilution is far more than some small amount like $1. When someone makes a fake, Yonex suffers loss from brand dilution. Thus, making a fake itself hurts yonex without even considering the other effects (lowers reputation of yonex for performance/reliability, lost sales, etc.)

  12. #46
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    time to split the thread...

  13. #47
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    Hello all, I'm new to this site, and I have a question about Yonex badminton racket to ask. I'm sorry if this has been explained somewhere My question is, if the rackets (MusclePower or ArmorTec) serial number have been etched with laser, can it be guaranteed that this is genuine/original racket from Yonex?
    Is there any fake/imitation racket that have laser engrave serial number?
    Thanks heaps guys

  14. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by ben1680
    Hello all, I'm new to this site, and I have a question about Yonex badminton racket to ask. I'm sorry if this has been explained somewhere My question is, if the rackets (MusclePower or ArmorTec) serial number have been etched with laser, can it be guaranteed that this is genuine/original racket from Yonex?
    Is there any fake/imitation racket that have laser engrave serial number?
    Thanks heaps guys
    Quick answers for your questions:

    1. Not anymore, fakes can have engraved serials as well.
    2. Not sure if it's done by laser, but fakes now do have engraved serials.

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