User Tag List

Page 2 of 9 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 LastLast
Results 18 to 34 of 143
  1. #18
    Administrator kwun's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Santa Clara, California, United States
    Posts
    35,910
    Mentioned
    52 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    on average, i think each match there might be 1 or 2 questionable calls. hardly do we see anything higher than that. it happens, but very rare.

    the only abuse of the system would be if a player was fatigue near the end of the game, and as a result made an erroneous judgement on reading the line, then he/she might go ahead and ask for a review anyway. it is at the end of the match anyway, so not really at much of a cost to them, and they get to take a breather.

    but this will be even more rare of a case.

  2. #19
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    NorCal, United States
    Posts
    856
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Ahh, now kwun brings up an excellent point.

    The big thing now is how long would all of this take? Now players can use this as an extra advantage. You're up 20-19, shuttle lands near the line, it lands in, you know it lands in, but you're tired and have both of your challenges. You decide to just waste 1 right now to take a little breather.

    As you know, some umpires are strict on delaying of the game, now using this, you can take an extra little breather that you would normally not get.

  3. #20
    Administrator kwun's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Santa Clara, California, United States
    Posts
    35,910
    Mentioned
    52 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    yeah. i think the design was partly smart. or at least, it was naturally this way.

    i think the key here is the opportunity. the player will have to lose a point before they can invoke a review. that makes it very different than a time out or towel break request, in which they can request without cost. to use a delibrately use a line review request as a breather, player incur a real cost of losing a point first.

  4. #21
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Sydney, Australia
    Posts
    88
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I'm wondering if the introduction of the review system will cause a big drop in the number of main umpire overrules on line calls like it did in tennis when Hawkeye was introduced.

  5. #22
    Regular Member AlanY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    England
    Posts
    4,438
    Mentioned
    7 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kwun View Post
    on average, i think each match there might be 1 or 2 questionable calls. hardly do we see anything higher than that. it happens, but very rare.

    the only abuse of the system would be if a player was fatigue near the end of the game, and as a result made an erroneous judgement on reading the line, then he/she might go ahead and ask for a review anyway. it is at the end of the match anyway, so not really at much of a cost to them, and they get to take a breather.

    but this will be even more rare of a case.
    Quote Originally Posted by CantSmashThis View Post
    Ahh, now kwun brings up an excellent point.

    The big thing now is how long would all of this take? Now players can use this as an extra advantage. You're up 20-19, shuttle lands near the line, it lands in, you know it lands in, but you're tired and have both of your challenges. You decide to just waste 1 right now to take a little breather.

    As you know, some umpires are strict on delaying of the game, now using this, you can take an extra little breather that you would normally not get.
    Even more interesting is if you have all your challenges left at the end of the match, in order to take a breather and use it to challenge call that in your favour. No rule against that, is it?

    What I would also like is for both the server and receiver to challenge the high service faults as well.

  6. #23
    Regular Member visor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Vancouver, BC
    Posts
    9,131
    Mentioned
    95 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AlanY View Post
    Even more interesting is if you have all your challenges left at the end of the match, in order to take a breather and use it to challenge call that in your favour. No rule against that, is it?

    What I would also like is for both the server and receiver to challenge the high service faults as well.
    Currently in tennis, each player is allowed max 3 incorrect line call challenges per set. If unused, they cannot be carried over to the next set.

    And why would the receiver challenge the high service faults?

  7. #24
    Regular Member AlanY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    England
    Posts
    4,438
    Mentioned
    7 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by visor View Post
    Currently in tennis, each player is allowed max 3 incorrect line call challenges per set. If unused, they cannot be carried over to the next set.

    And why would the receiver challenge the high service faults?
    To challenge the high services from your opponent that the service judge allowed. Especially the flip one that already got you wrong footed anyway, why not try your luck and see what the match umpire think if the service judge keep allowing it.

  8. #25
    Regular Member craigandy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Glasgow
    Posts
    1,718
    Mentioned
    18 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by AlanY View Post
    To challenge the high services from your opponent that the service judge allowed. Especially the flip one that already got you wrong footed anyway, why not try your luck and see what the match umpire think if the service judge keep allowing it.
    Given that the height rule laid down by BWF is that line at bottom rib, You would need take an xray shot at every serve for a confirmation. Sounds expensive and it's against the players human rights

  9. #26
    Regular Member AlanY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    England
    Posts
    4,438
    Mentioned
    7 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by craigandy View Post
    Given that the height rule laid down by BWF is that line at bottom rib, You would need take an xray shot at every serve for a confirmation. Sounds expensive and it's against the players human rights
    Not if they all signed up for that, as if.
    Btw, are they still looking for match umpires for that boring job to look over all those x-ray camera shots? I'm in.

  10. #27
    Regular Member visor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Vancouver, BC
    Posts
    9,131
    Mentioned
    95 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Nah, you guys, haven't you heard of those Xray vision glasses that when worn can see thru anything... I remember those when I was a kid ...

  11. #28
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Netherlands
    Posts
    290
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    No, no x-ray is needed. The service judge calls service faults today without having access to x-ray pictures, right? So this is what the chair umpire must do as well when he/she reviews the slo-mo challenge.

  12. #29
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Netherlands
    Posts
    290
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    It's funny how history tends to repeat itself. I'm sure many of us who also follows tennis remembers the classic overrule in the Us Open 2004 QF between Serena Williams and Jennifer Capriati. The epic moment can be seen here:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-27jN1mDuMU

    This was the call that really pushed the entry of Hawk-eye into tennis. Funny thing is a very similar overrule was just made in Saturday's semifinals of the China masters between Wang Shixian and Porntip Buranaprasertsuk. The chair umpire overruled a shuttle by WSX so obviously in, in the exact same place of the court as in the tennis match.

    So from this we can assume that the far side-line is very difficult to see clearly from the umpire position and that they should rather not try to overrule on that line.

    This happens also in my lower-league matches where the person keeping the score also wants to "play umpire" and call shots in or out on the far sideline or on the baseline. Me as a player has a much better view and I want to call it myself.

  13. #30
    Regular Member craigandy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Glasgow
    Posts
    1,718
    Mentioned
    18 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by vixter View Post
    No, no x-ray is needed. The service judge calls service faults today without having access to x-ray pictures, right? So this is what the chair umpire must do as well when he/she reviews the slo-mo challenge.
    It's not a visable line though so the call would be just as worthy without replay so no point. Still just a guess basically either way with or without replay, no point in delaying play for that.

  14. #31
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Nor Cal
    Posts
    704
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I can't wait for all this to be implemented. I just hope they find a way to do this in a timely manner (about 20 seconds for the entire challenge process)

    People have mentioned using the challenges to buy time when the shot was not even in. Tennis players do this all the time for a quick physical or mental break. Most often tennis players use it when they're mentally rattled and need to calm down and need a breather. You can bet we'll see this in badminton as well because it becomes a tactic through the systems manipulation you can't get around. It may not be popular with the crowd if players do this but thankfully the challenges are only two unsuccessful ones per match so the disruption will be very limited.

    I wonder what the cost of this all this is and if they will be on TV courts only. It makes sense for only certain courts to save costs because mind you, only a select group of tennis players get to take advantage if hawk eye because it is only used on the big courts with the high ranked/more famous players playing. And this is despite the oodles of money tennis makes more than badminton.

  15. #32
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Netherlands
    Posts
    290
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by craigandy View Post
    It's not a visable line though so the call would be just as worthy without replay so no point. Still just a guess basically either way with or without replay, no point in delaying play for that.
    I do agree, I see your point.

    But sometimes a service is definitely too high but the service judge just doesn't call it for some reason. Sometimes the player elevates the racket and shuttle just before delivering the serve and it could go unnoticed. In these instances the opponents could ask for a challenge, and the chair umpire would look at a replay of the serve and make the final call.

    Of course the play would have to be stopped when asking for this challenge, so if the umpire doesn't agree then it's a lost point. So the receiver would have to be really sure. It could never be used as a delay tactic.

  16. #33
    Regular Member craigandy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Glasgow
    Posts
    1,718
    Mentioned
    18 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by vixter View Post
    I do agree, I see your point.

    But sometimes a service is definitely too high but the service judge just doesn't call it for some reason. Sometimes the player elevates the racket and shuttle just before delivering the serve and it could go unnoticed. In these instances the opponents could ask for a challenge, and the chair umpire would look at a replay of the serve and make the final call.

    Of course the play would have to be stopped when asking for this challenge, so if the umpire doesn't agree then it's a lost point. So the receiver would have to be really sure. It could never be used as a delay tactic.
    Sounds nice, but borderline challenges would be made, so after going to the delay/disturbance of a vid replay and still they judged it wrongly(someone could more deeply analyse the video with more time to proof it) It would raise massive questions over the use/cost/value of it. It would be easy to set up and get right for fixed height though if they changed.

  17. #34
    Regular Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Netherlands
    Posts
    290
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by craigandy View Post
    Sounds nice, but borderline challenges would be made, so after going to the delay/disturbance of a vid replay and still they judged it wrongly(someone could more deeply analyse the video with more time to proof it) It would raise massive questions over the use/cost/value of it. It would be easy to set up and get right for fixed height though if they changed.
    I don't think there would be much extra costs, since this technique will be implemented for line review anyway, so it would just be one extra camera for the serve. And borderline challenges would not be wise since the umpire would most likely go with the service judge, and that would mean a point lost.

    But of course also the server must be allowed to challenge his own faulted serve. So here we do have the possibility of a delay tactic. You have lost the point anyway, so why not try to challenge? Worst case scenario you lose a challenge, but you buy some time.

    Bottom line is with only two faulty challenges per MATCH, one would have to think very carefully when to use them. There are probably better ways to delay the game if one really wants to. One can "fall" and put hand on the floor so court has to be mopped. Or one can pull a Sun Yu and simply take your knee bandage off and sit down and wait for doctor.

Page 2 of 9 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •