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  1. #52
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    Actually, there were grumblings from some BFer's at Misbun during the poor showing of the M'sian team during the Thomas Cup.

    However, BAM did state their intention this year was the Olympics.

    I find Cheekygen's statement enlighting. M'sia may underperform in the next 5 years and the underlying structure of producing badminton players needs changing.

  2. #53
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    Very interesting and enlightening discussion on malaysian badminton.

    From an english view we have imported several top coaches, from Lee JB , PJB to Rexy and the chinese womens coach Yvette. These coaches have improved the players that already had the talent/ mentality :Archer, Robertson, Hallam, but have perhaps not done much for those "second rate" national players/ upcoming players. In short a great player will take advantage of a great coach but a great coach can't turn an 18 year old with only 90% of the required talent / attitude into a world beater.

    N Robertson is our true world class talent, I can remember when he was 16 and he was a unique player even then, his attitude (although sometimes questionable) , his shots, tactics were all very different to what you saw in other english juniors.

    I think Malaysia , much like England in badminton and other sports think they have a right to success based on the past. As Cheung says the game 20 years ago has no relevance to todays game. So like English players malaysians carry a burden of expectation based not on current talent but historical success. Rather than the AE singles win of Hafiz and md runner up this year being seen as major achievements they were seen as only stepping stones to bigger success which have proved beyond the players.

    Players from emerging countries such as Germany or Singapore are in a much better position, for them any success is heralded and they do not suffer in comparison with past champions.

    I think about six years ago at the All England malaysia didn't have a qtr finalist in any event, they were in danger of becoming a second class nation. Since then they have enjoyed a world no.1 singles player, an AE champion, World silver medalist, md no.1 pair and md AE ru pair. Ok so they have failed to land a olympic or world title but how many players do? When are only shooting for mens singles and doubles and there are some 15 pairs/players capable of beating anyone the chances of success are small. Look how indonesia have fallen, a country who had 4 pairs of md that were at the top and half the top 20 ms, until taufiks resurgence things looked bleak.

    There is possibly a question mark over the mental strength / long term motivation of their players, this may or may not be down to the coaches.

  3. #54
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    mmm.

    With all that has been mentioned here, I do not think any of my opinions will matter much to many bfers at this current time concerning malaysian badminton. Since my 'idealistic' views aren't practical, I would see no further point in adding to the discussion.

    However, I would like to add that many of the points mentioned in self-defense to my statements to me are mostly of unconventional and unproductive which will not help our malaysian badminton team. If what is mentioned by members on their opinions of retaining the services of misbun sidek is what they believe will be of benefit to the national team, then so be it. I am not the one who's running the show around here, I am not the one overseeing the development of our national team.

    Quote Originally Posted by dlp
    I think Malaysia , much like England in badminton and other sports think they have a right to success based on the past. As Cheung says the game 20 years ago has no relevance to todays game. So like English players malaysians carry a burden of expectation based not on current talent but historical success. Rather than the AE singles win of Hafiz and md runner up this year being seen as major achievements they were seen as only stepping stones to bigger success which have proved beyond the players
    Well said. Unfortunately this is the mentality in Malaysia who what I would describe play 'kampung' sports.

    For now, I would hold back my opinions on the current state of the sports in Malaysia as this would be the last post for a long time concerning the matter. If you want to stay where you are right now then go with the 'practical' ideas which have been done before and forget the 'theoretical' or 'idealistic' thoughs which have not been experimented with before.

    I also do not wish to add anymore philosophy or any of my opinions in this thread.

    From what has been said, I feel I do not owe anyone an explanation for what I have said and why I have said that. These are just the opinions of a 17 year old lad who was bored at that time he found the thread.

    mmm.

  4. #55
    Regular Member jug8man's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cheung
    Actually, there were grumblings from some BFer's at Misbun during the poor showing of the M'sian team during the Thomas Cup.

    However, BAM did state their intention this year was the Olympics.

    I find Cheekygen's statement enlighting. M'sia may underperform in the next 5 years and the underlying structure of producing badminton players needs changing.
    i dont really see malaysia underperforming i the future. what i do see however is malaysia performing, as well with many other countries performing well/better than before. this is already seen in the olympics. the playing field is now more even than ever before. almost every one is a 'world beater' now and there is less monopoly of the games by 'badminton power nations'. this loss of monopoly in my view is healthy for the sport and perhaps may help the game grow (commercially and globaly?).


    plus malaysia actually has a sport school to cultivate and develop sports (badminton included). it is the Bukit Jalil Sport School (BJSS) and has been running for years. so there is a solid development work/effort being done but where they go/what path they choose after school life plays an important role in the future of the sport in malaysia.

    just a thought.
    Last edited by jug8man; 08-27-2004 at 10:03 AM.

  5. #56
    Regular Member Loh's Avatar
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    Yes, I tend to agree that the playing field is much more level than before and no one nation can now claim that it has a monopoly in men's singles and doubles, not even China because their best have been beaten at the world's most prestigious tournament, the Olympics. There are Indonesia, Malaysia, Denmark and South Korea which can measure up. Other less badminton-dominant countries are also catching up fast.

    Certainly Malaysia is not really lacking in this department and it is not fair to place the blame solely on their coaches or other aspects of their training or preparation. Some have pointed out about the politics at BAM, about the inadequate junior programmes, exposure, funding, etc, yes this may partly be the case, but at the elite level, their national men players have often shared the international limelight.

    There will always be ups and downs and China has been a victim of this. Having taken the TC stranglehold from Indonesia, China succumbed in the Olympics. They failed in all the men's events. It may be the case that their singles players peaked too early. Other reasons have also been proffered. Conversely, Indonesia recovered from the TC debacle to triumph at the Olympics! What a reversal of fortunes!

    So China which seems to have prepared their players well and better than others has floundered. There seems to be everything at their players' disposal, yet they failed to live up to expectations.

    That is why I believe that it is the player himself who has to bear the brunt of his own failure.

    Malaysia will bounce back from their Olympics disappointment. Yes, changes willl be made, even in Indonesia's case and perhaps in other countries' badminton management and leadership as well, but there will always be success and failure thriving side by side. This is necessary to bring the game to a higher level.

    But amidst it all, the player must not be distracted but remain focus on his dreams and turn them to reality! In the main, he is answerable to himself.

  6. #57
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    I tend to agree with Loh's comments.

    There is only so much a coach can do. At the end of the day, it is the player who would be playing and facing the opponent. The player would have been prepared in training - physically, mentally & tactically by the coach.

    Having a personal coach is a good idea looking at what the other powerhouse are doing. Anyway, the player themselves must have the burning desire to excel and to become the champion expected. If the player is not good or champion material then he/she must leave. This can be identified either by the coach or the player himself if he/she is honest about it.

    The BAM has been in shambles with the same head all this years. So a revamp is overdue here. We have many head coaches; big names if I may add so I don't think its the coach fault although all fingers will point at him as the scapegoat.

    A proper roadmap to identify and nurture potential players during their school days must be there. Proper training and not to mention badminton clubs supported by the BAM to identify the late bloomers should be there also.

    Really, I don't see this at all. Year in year out we only depend on the few players we have. There is no clear strategy to groom new players for replacement and backup.

    Just my 2 cents comments.

    Quote Originally Posted by Loh
    Thanks for your interesting disclosure!

    Your parents must be Malaysians and made sure you are born in in their own country and Selangor state as they have been in Brunei for more than 20 years and you are only 17 now. You must have been brought into the world during one of those annual home pilgrimages made by them!

    I admire your patriotism and the manner you put forward some of your arguments although I cannot seriously buy all of them.

    I still maintain that in the final analysis, it is the player who has to answer for himself.

    Although the time period is different, let me bring you back to the days of the first Thomas Cup held in 1949 at Queen's Hall in Preston, England. Malaya (Singapore was part of the team with Wong Peng Soon and Ong Poh Lim representing) stunned the badminton world when they beat Denmark
    8-1.

    Hitherto, no Asian team was known to be so strong as the All England, which was then the de facto world championship that started as early as 1900, was dominated by the West, principally players from England, Ireland, Denmark, Sweden and even the USA, with their most famous singles player, Dave Freemann. But since the appearance of the Malayans in 1949, it was the turn for Asians to dominate, with Denmark (particularly Erland Kops, 5 times champ and Morten Frost, 4 times) being the only European country to spoil the aspirations of the Indonesians, Malaysians, Chinese and Indians.

    Of course one reason for the non-participation of the Asians in the All England during the early years was probably the lack of funds and the long distances they have to travel, often by sea. Yes, the first Malayan team had to brave the seas for many days (maybe a month!) to arrive in England in unfriendly cold weather in order to compete. Yet they demolished the Danish opposition 8-1. I don't think the Malayan players have better facilities or proper management than their Western counterparts at that time. Better coaches, probably unheard of!

    Malaya went on to repeat the TC story in 1955 when they handed Denmark another 8-1 beating in Singapore. And what was more astounding was this same player, Wong Peng Soon. At age 37, I repeat 37, Wong put up a superlative display by defeating, I presume, a much younger Joern Skaarup in three sets (then it was called 'set' and not 'game' as is now the case)
    15-5, 16-18 and 15-4. The next day, he followed up with another scintillating performance and showed tremendous fighting spirit coming from behind with a first set loss of 12-15 to whip the great Finn Kobbero 15-0 in the second. He wrapped up the third set and match, 15-7.

    What I'm trying to emphasize is that the PLAYER himself makes the difference. Badminton maestro, Wong Peng Soon, is a shining example of sporting greatness for he lived for badminton. The limitations and shortcomings he faced during his time never quite affected him as he pursued his only goal and ambition to be the best badminton player in the world!

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