The impact of bad linecalls on MSF players in KO 08 and CO 07

[ctjcad]

What do you mean by "neutral ground" Is such a place unless there are no players from the hosting country participating. If that is the case, why the country wants to host a tournament in the first place

..azabaz_ipoh was proposing a "solution" to this "bias-linejudging issues" in SS tourneys, that has been plaguing the sport..Why no neutral ground/countries want to host SS tourneys in the first place? Well, could be many reasons; one of which, possibly, was mentioned in your post (no players from the host country). Another could be logistics (one recent example, was the 2005 World Championships in Anaheim, USA. To many it was considered a "pretty neutral place" to compete. But after what happened during the week (no, there wasn't any chair or racket throwing incidents), i don't think U.S.A. will hold such significant BWF event in the near future, if at all; you can read all about it in the 2005 WC sub-forum)

[azabaz_ipoh]

i guess neutral ground would be places where they are not so gung ho about winning that they will forgo sportmanship. all england have been pretty fair. swiss open too. and france open.

[cooler]

the moon is partially own my some amercians, europeans and russians already

http://www.lunarregistry.com/land/index.shtml

[vching]

the moon is partially own my some amercians, europeans and russians already

http://www.lunarregistry.com/land/index.shtml

why on earth would u want to buy part of the moon?

[huangkwokhau]

the moon is partially own my some amercians, europeans and russians already

http://www.lunarregistry.com/land/index.shtml

Sigh!!....may be Mars then......

[Birdwood]

If BWF wants to meet up with LM and LD, it will not be to clear petty household issues. It will be to determine misconduct etc.

..but whatever they're going to decide/determine, hope both parties will mend any disagreements/misunderstandings.

How can BWF determine misconduct if they could not determine if the line call was indeed a bad one, which might cost LD from winning KO 08 MS title? Say if BWF found the call was bad, would they take back the MSF result? Or they will just simply bypass the thorny call issue and go directly to the behaviors of LD and LM

It seems unfair to LD if BWF does not look into the root cause of the dispute and the misconduct of linesmen or even the handling of the disputed calls by the umpire, which were at the heart of any disagreements/misunderstandings

[ctjcad]

How can BWF determine misconduct if they could not determine if the line call was indeed a bad one, which might cost LD from winning KO 08 MS title? Say if BWF found the call was bad, would they take back the MSF result? Or they will just simply bypass the thorny call issue and go directly to the behaviors of LD and LM

It seems unfair to LD if BWF does not look into the root cause of the dispute and the misconduct of linesmen or even the handling of the disputed calls by the umpire, which were at the heart of any disagreements/misunderstandings

..i was referring to the disagreements/misunderstandings of what happened prior to LD throwing his racket; not so much to the bad/good line call. According to a few posts/reports/articles, some eyewitnesses mentioned LM said something which sparked LD to be upset hence throwing the racket. While LM seemed to charge towards LD.
What was said, IMO, that has to be cleared up.
Of course, "neutral" eyewitness(es) will possibly be required, as both parties could "revise" their own stories.

[V3i HoN6]

The Umpire made four great calls (correcting the line judges) and one bad call (and I suspect he was not sure whether it was out or in --- so really cannot blame him).

Again, I stress that those are not great calls.
Those calls are correct as it suppose to be and it didn't favor the player that gain a point from it.
Nothing great about making a call as it suppose to be.
I'm sound like nit-picking here but my intention was just don't want anybody using it to justify the rest of the bad calls like last time in China Open.

Like, "those bad calls were very less, compare to the good one".

You're sure about this? Never heard of own umpire presiding over own open final in such an important event, which involved one of its own player. What happened to the conflict of interest, let alone the appearance

So you are not sure about this?
Didn't stop you from making comments about the result is not very much affected though.
But sure you are entitled to your own opinions.
I just dont agree about it.

[Birdwood]

i guess neutral ground would be places where they are not so gung ho about winning that they will forgo sportmanship. all england have been pretty fair. swiss open too. and france open.

I am afraid all those places ppl may not be interested in baddy. That's why they are "neutral" in a sense. Elsewhere, titles are hotly contested on and off courts by baddy nations and everything will be counted on to gain the upper hand.

[V3i HoN6]

..i was referring to the disagreements/misunderstandings of what happened prior to LD throwing his racket; not so much to the bad/good line call. According to a few posts/reports/articles, some eyewitnesses mentioned LM said something which sparked LD to be upset hence throwing the racket. While LM seemed to charge towards LD.
What was said, IMO, that has to be cleared up.
Of course, "neutral" eyewitness(es) will possibly be required, as both parties could "revise" their own stories.

As opposed to what Li Mao may said, cursing him or his family or any dirty words one can imagine, still didn't justify the physical actions.

That's right, how much I admire Zidane and no matters what the Italian have said, I still couldn't agree to what he did.

[X Ball]

Again, I stress that those are not great calls.
Those calls are correct as it suppose to be and it didn't favor the player that gain a point from it.

Nothing great about making a call as it suppose to be.
I'm sound like nit-picking here but my intention was just don't want anybody using it to justify the rest of the bad calls like last time in China Open.

Like, "those bad calls were very less, compare to the good one".

In the context of things, they are great calls because they put things right as opposed to the calls made in China. I did not say they were incorrect calls.

He called them as he saw them whereas the Umpire in China Open just went with the line judges' calls - so they are great (but if you don't like the adjective, call it 'good').

[V3i HoN6]

In the context of things, they are great calls because they put things right as opposed to the calls made in China. I did not say they were incorrect calls.

He called them as he saw them whereas the Umpire in China Open just went with the line judges' calls - so they are great (but if you don't like the adjective, call it 'good').

I would suggest simply "correct call", good overrule perhaps.
But hope everyone get the idea.

[ctjcad]

As opposed to what Li Mao may said, cursing him or his family or any dirty words one can imagine, still didn't justify the physical actions.

That's right, how much I admire Zidane and no matters what the Italian have said, I still couldn't agree to what he did.

..or actions or may have been said, if BWF deems it necessary to be resolved, then it has to be cleared up...Like many have said, it's unfortunate it happened, but at least they're working a way towards a resolution.

[indra]

My advice to WBF:

In any semi final or final round of the SS the umpire, service judge and all linespersons MUST be from

1. non-host countries
2. non-playing player countries

[yen_saw]

It is useless, the only way to resolve this is to implement instant replay, each player has 3 call to overrule just like in Tennis or American football. When all challenges exhasuted, the player has to obey the umpire's call that is it.

[indra]

It is useless, the only way to resolve this is to implement instant replay, each player has 3 call to overrule just like in Tennis or American football. When all challenges exhasuted, the player has to obey the umpire's call that is it.

yes. agree...

It is really expensive to have the instant replay cameras...? how much? just wondering?

[Birdwood]

So you are not sure about this?
Didn't stop you from making comments about the result is not very much affected though.
But sure you are entitled to your own opinions.
I just dont agree about it.

Since huangkwokhau said he saw it, I have to believe it. I only have RTM1 version and don't understand Malay. But after reviewing it, the umpire did appear to be familiar and mentioned somewhere else in another SS video (or videos) as being Chinese.

The results was affected by linesmen, not as much as by the umpire. I would wish Chn had used a foreign umpire. In that case, he/she might over-rule some bad calls. But again my comments were since the scores were further apart in CO 07, the outcome of the match might not have been different based on those bad calls. How much psychologically those calls affected LCW's performance I could not quantify them. I only based my opinion on the score and the number of bad calls.

The purpose of this thread is for BCers to air their opinions. If you don't agree with my assessment, please state your case and I think most of us are open-minded about the whole affair whether in CO 07 or KO 08.