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  1. #69
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    Let's See.

    LUAN JIN (CHN)
    - All England Champion 1983
    - World Championship Winner 1983

    YANG YANG (CHN)
    - All England Champion 1989
    - World Championship 1987, 1989
    - Thomas Cup Winner 1986, 1988, 1990

    MORTEN FROST
    - All England Champion 1982, 1984, 1986, 1987
    - All England Runner-up 1985, 1988, 1989
    - World Championship 2nd Runner-up 1984, 1985, 1986, 1987

    ZHAO JIAN HUA
    - All England Champion 1985, 1990
    - World Championship Winner 1991
    - Thomas Cup Winner 1988, 1990

    MISBUN SIDEK
    - All England 2nd Runner-up 1986
    - World Championship Runner-up 1982, 1988
    - Thomas Cup 2nd Runner-up 1988

    Let us judge from the statistic above whether MISBUN SIDEK is a GREAT or not.

  2. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneToughBirdie View Post
    Or else may as well include my kampong champion, Pak Busu bin Ali Baba who regularly win my kampong harvest cup.

    Btw, what is the cup made of....hahahaha!!!
    Basically, what you get is a bag of keropok lekor and 1/2 year supply of lompat tikam

  3. #71
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    Thumbs up It is best not to throw confusions in our threads

    Quote Originally Posted by chris@ccc View Post
    .
    Haha ... If I were to be one of our forum moderators, you would have been banned.

    It's not because that you are a avid LIn Dan fan, but it is because you despise so many other non-CHN players who are trying to make our beloved Badminton as an international sport.

    That is the issue.
    .
    Again, please be reminded that this is a Misbun Sidek's thread.

    Any non-Misbun's related subject intruding into this thread is just as bad as any non-Badminton fan intruding into Badminton Central.

  4. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by mugdays View Post
    So, you think there can only be three or four "great" players in a given era? Sure, he wasn't THAT great compared to some of his contemporaries, but the man was still world number 2 at one point! Do you know who happens to be world number 2 right now? Lin Dan. I know almost everyone will agree that he's a great player.

    "Greatness" is subjective, though. I happen to think Misbun was great, and players like Yang Yang are REALLY great, or "super great." If your definition of "great" only allows a few players in a generation, then I would agree with your assessment. No hard feelings, lah
    Hi dude,

    Its good that you decided to contribute but when did I say there are only 3/4 'great' players in a given era?? If you look at the names I put up those were shuttlers playing in Misbun's era.

    I am saying that we need to have some standards when we put a certain shuttler into that 'great player' category or else we are going to have everyone and their pet dogs there.

    Yes, LD is now the world no.2 but do we actually look at current rankings or titles won?

  5. #73
    Regular Member chris-ccc's Avatar
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    Arrow There's Misbun Sidek, Lee's coach, a great player himself

    Quote Originally Posted by Dato Asbullah View Post

    MISBUN SIDEK
    - All England 2nd Runner-up 1986
    - World Championship Runner-up 1982, 1988
    - Thomas Cup 2nd Runner-up 1988

    Let us judge from the statistic above whether MISBUN SIDEK is a GREAT or not.

    .
    That's why in some posts in this thread, we had a discussion on whether Misbun was a 'Great' or a 'Greatest' player at his time. It is a very subjective topic.

    The info provided by you is great, namely;
    MISBUN SIDEK
    - All England 2nd
    Runner-up 1986
    - World Championship
    Runner-up 1982, 1988
    - Thomas Cup 2nd
    Runner-up 1988
    indicating that Misbun was amongst the top players in the world at his time, but not the No.1.

    IMHO, anyone able to make it to the Top 10 in the World is a 'great' player. And, within any time frame, anyone making it to World No.1 would of course be the 'greatest' at his/her time.

    Regarding following a thread, we need to see the intention of our thread starter.

    Usually, the opening post tells us what we are to discuss. Our thread starter, sonnymak, actually finished his opening post saying that Misbun was not the greatest.
    Quote Originally Posted by sonnymak View Post

    So he was not the greatest, but was he a great player?

    And with admiration for another great player, Gillian Clark, sonnymak even quoted her comment, namely: "There's Misbun Sidek, Lee's coach, a great player himself".

    IMHO, it is better to try to understand why sonnymak and Gillian Clark made their comments that Misbun Sidek was a great player. For us BCers to bash one another just because we do not agree with their comments, we can only laugh at ourselves. And both sonnymak and Gillian Clark will be laughing at us too.

    So let's go back to Post#1.
    .
    Last edited by chris-ccc; 12-29-2008 at 10:00 PM.

  6. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dato Asbullah View Post
    Let's See.

    LUAN JIN (CHN)
    - All England Champion 1983
    - World Championship Winner 1983

    YANG YANG (CHN)
    - All England Champion 1989
    - World Championship 1987, 1989
    - Thomas Cup Winner 1986, 1988, 1990

    MORTEN FROST
    - All England Champion 1982, 1984, 1986, 1987
    - All England Runner-up 1985, 1988, 1989
    - World Championship 2nd Runner-up 1984, 1985, 1986, 1987

    ZHAO JIAN HUA
    - All England Champion 1985, 1990
    - World Championship Winner 1991
    - Thomas Cup Winner 1988, 1990

    MISBUN SIDEK
    - All England 2nd Runner-up 1986
    - World Championship Runner-up 1982, 1988
    - Thomas Cup 2nd Runner-up 1988

    Let us judge from the statistic above whether MISBUN SIDEK is a GREAT or not.
    Erm. If we consider these stats...

    Brazil national football team

    - FIFA WC Champion 1958, 1962, 1970, 1994, 2002
    - Copa America Winner 1919, 1922, 1949, 1989, 1997, 1999, 2004, 2007

    Italy national football team

    - FIFA WC Champion 1934, 1938, 1982, 2006
    - Euro Championship Winner 1968

    Germany national football team

    - FIFA WC Champion 1954, 1974, 1990
    - Euro Championship Winner 1972, 1980, 1996

    Argentina national football team

    - FIFA WC Champion 1978 & 1986
    - Copa America Winner 14 times. Too much to write la.

    England national football team

    - FIFA WC Champion 1966 (40 years ago, in kandang pula).
    After that, best result was fourth place in 1990. The rests, cannot go further than QF.
    - 0 Euro Champion. Latest Euro didn't even qualify.

    The Netherlands national football team

    - 0 FIFA WC Champion. Best record was 4th place in 1998.
    - Euro Championship Winner 1988.

    Spain national football team


    - 0 FIFA WC Champion.
    - Euro Championship Winner 2008

    Greece national football team

    - 0 FIFA WC Champion
    - Euro championship Winner 2004


    If we use titles achieved as comparison, can we say that the only teams considered 'great' are Brazil, Italy, Germany, and Argentina.

    And despite having a long roster of good players e.g. Sir Bobby Charlton, Sir Geoff Hurst, Peter Shilton, David Beckham, Alan Shearer, Johan Cruyff, Ronald Koeman, Ruud Gullit, Marco van Basten, de Boer brothers, Dennis Bergkamp, Emilio Butragueno, Pep Guardiola, Fernando Hierro, Raul, Xabi, Villa, etc, etc...
    Since nations they represented barely delivered good result in big events (WC, Copa, Euro), then England, Netherlands, and Spain don't deserve to be called 'great teams'?

    In the end, is it
    number of titles
    or
    performance, skill, style
    that matters most in deciding greatness of a player?

  7. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jagdpanther View Post
    Erm. If we consider these stats...

    Brazil national football team

    - FIFA WC Champion 1958, 1962, 1970, 1994, 2002
    - Copa America Winner 1919, 1922, 1949, 1989, 1997, 1999, 2004, 2007

    Italy national football team

    - FIFA WC Champion 1934, 1938, 1982, 2006
    - Euro Championship Winner 1968

    Germany national football team

    - FIFA WC Champion 1954, 1974, 1990
    - Euro Championship Winner 1972, 1980, 1996

    Argentina national football team

    - FIFA WC Champion 1978 & 1986
    - Copa America Winner 14 times. Too much to write la.

    England national football team

    - FIFA WC Champion 1966 (40 years ago, in kandang pula).
    After that, best result was fourth place in 1990. The rests, cannot go further than QF.
    - 0 Euro Champion. Latest Euro didn't even qualify.

    The Netherlands national football team

    - 0 FIFA WC Champion. Best record was 4th place in 1998.
    - Euro Championship Winner 1988.

    Spain national football team

    - 0 FIFA WC Champion.
    - Euro Championship Winner 2008

    Greece national football team

    - 0 FIFA WC Champion
    - Euro championship Winner 2004

    If we use titles achieved as comparison, can we say that the only teams considered 'great' are Brazil, Italy, Germany, and Argentina.

    And despite having a long roster of good players e.g. Sir Bobby Charlton, Sir Geoff Hurst, Peter Shilton, David Beckham, Alan Shearer, Johan Cruyff, Ronald Koeman, Ruud Gullit, Marco van Basten, de Boer brothers, Dennis Bergkamp, Emilio Butragueno, Pep Guardiola, Fernando Hierro, Raul, Xabi, Villa, etc, etc...
    Since nations they represented barely delivered good result in big events (WC, Copa, Euro), then England, Netherlands, and Spain don't deserve to be called 'great teams'?

    In the end, is it
    number of titles
    or
    performance, skill, style
    that matters most in deciding greatness of a player?
    Please compare apple to apple. Not Grape to Watermelon.....

  8. #76
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    That's strange...
    If my memory serves me right, a BC member once associated Japanese pair, Shuichi Sakamoto/Shintaro Ikeda's win over KKK/TBH with Stoke City who was able to restrict MU to 0-1 win.

  9. #77
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    why don't that dude compare it with Jeff Hardy vs The Undertaker insted lol
    Last edited by Zabee; 01-04-2009 at 09:38 AM.

  10. #78
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    I never saw he played.. But i heard that sidek brothers are good players..

  11. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jagdpanther View Post
    That's strange...
    If my memory serves me right, a BC member once associated Japanese pair, Shuichi Sakamoto/Shintaro Ikeda's win over KKK/TBH with Stoke City who was able to restrict MU to 0-1 win.
    Maybe you should re-read that posting. Slowly this time around so that you understand.

  12. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jagdpanther View Post
    Erm. If we consider these stats...

    Brazil national football team

    - FIFA WC Champion 1958, 1962, 1970, 1994, 2002
    - Copa America Winner 1919, 1922, 1949, 1989, 1997, 1999, 2004, 2007

    Italy national football team

    - FIFA WC Champion 1934, 1938, 1982, 2006
    - Euro Championship Winner 1968

    Germany national football team

    - FIFA WC Champion 1954, 1974, 1990
    - Euro Championship Winner 1972, 1980, 1996

    Argentina national football team

    - FIFA WC Champion 1978 & 1986
    - Copa America Winner 14 times. Too much to write la.

    England national football team

    - FIFA WC Champion 1966 (40 years ago, in kandang pula).
    After that, best result was fourth place in 1990. The rests, cannot go further than QF.
    - 0 Euro Champion. Latest Euro didn't even qualify.

    The Netherlands national football team

    - 0 FIFA WC Champion. Best record was 4th place in 1998.
    - Euro Championship Winner 1988.

    Spain national football team

    - 0 FIFA WC Champion.
    - Euro Championship Winner 2008

    Greece national football team

    - 0 FIFA WC Champion
    - Euro championship Winner 2004

    If we use titles achieved as comparison, can we say that the only teams considered 'great' are Brazil, Italy, Germany, and Argentina.

    And despite having a long roster of good players e.g. Sir Bobby Charlton, Sir Geoff Hurst, Peter Shilton, David Beckham, Alan Shearer, Johan Cruyff, Ronald Koeman, Ruud Gullit, Marco van Basten, de Boer brothers, Dennis Bergkamp, Emilio Butragueno, Pep Guardiola, Fernando Hierro, Raul, Xabi, Villa, etc, etc...
    Since nations they represented barely delivered good result in big events (WC, Copa, Euro), then England, Netherlands, and Spain don't deserve to be called 'great teams'?

    In the end, is it
    number of titles
    or
    performance, skill, style
    that matters most in deciding greatness of a player?
    In football, you need to understand the difference between great teams & great players. To make it easy for you, Maradona is one of the greatest footballer of all time but is Napoli a great team? (Maradona did played for this team, fyi).

    Is Malaysia a great team, after all we once had the legendary Mokhtar Dahari and Soh Chin Aun?

    And like everything else its the titles that determine the great teams or else we may as well say the Harlem Globetrotters are the best basketball team around because they are very skillful and are great entertainers.

  13. #81
    Regular Member danielwong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pemuda View Post
    Maybe you should re-read that posting. Slowly this time around so that you understand.

    flip-flop all the way????

  14. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by danielwong View Post
    flip-flop all the way????
    Flip flop. Congratulations my dear boy! You learn something new today.

  15. #83
    Regular Member danielwong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pemuda View Post
    Flip flop. Congratulations my dear boy! You learn something new today.

    realli? thank you master Youngster!!!!
    i finally made it.....

  16. #84
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    I am glad that so many people have began to debate about Misbun Sidek but sadly not many B'cers are giving us insight as to the style of play of the man himself and except for one or two who provided us with witness account of his playing days.

    Whether he was a great player ?, I guess one has to ask Han Jian, Yang Yang, Icuk, Prakash P, Morten and Liem Swee King about Misbun.

  17. #85
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    Quote Originally Posted by sonnymak View Post
    I am glad that so many people have began to debate about Misbun Sidek but sadly not many B'cers are giving us insight as to the style of play of the man himself and except for one or two who provided us with witness account of his playing days.

    Whether he was a great player ?, I guess one has to ask Han Jian, Yang Yang, Icuk, Prakash P, Morten and Liem Swee King about Misbun.
    No need to ask them. Just have a look of his career achievements. Thats enough.

    U cant be a great player if u do not have sparkling results.

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