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  1. #35
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    agree...the future is looks so bright for Kido/Hendra

    maybe the toughest rivals for them in the future is :
    Lee Young Dae/Jung Jae Sung
    Koo Kien Kiet/Tan Boon Heong (if they r in their best)
    Hwang Jiman/Lee Jaejin (thats if they could reduce so many unforced errors which has become their "habbit" everytime these pair playing)
    and...their juniors like Rian/Yonathan or Bona/Ahsan
    Last edited by lin_xingfang; 10-27-2008 at 01:40 AM.

  2. #36
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    Dont forget mas have alot of potential pairs.....

  3. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dato Asbullah View Post
    Dont forget mas have alot of potential pairs.....
    Dont forget mas's coach is from Indonesia...

  4. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by nick.h View Post
    Dont forget mas's coach is from Indonesia...
    Yes. He is from INA. What's the problem?

  5. #39
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    Kido/Setiawan have done a good job maintaining their performance this past year (except All-England, that was unusually bad). I am most happy with Hendra's ability to recover from a bad patch in the semis game against Cai Yun/Xu Chen. And most important of all, they took charge of the points when the going got critical in the final.

  6. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by abedeng View Post
    Kido/Setiawan have done a good job maintaining their performance this past year (except All-England, that was unusually bad). I am most happy with Hendra's ability to recover from a bad patch in the semis game against Cai Yun/Xu Chen. And most important of all, they took charge of the points when the going got critical in the final.
    Of the six defeats this year, 2 were to Jung Jae Sung/Lee Yong Dae (both in rubber-sets, with the INA pair crumbling badly in the decider ). 2 were to INA pairs: Tony Gunawan/Candra Wijaya in the Indonesia SS QF (Hendra was still unfit then) and Rian Sukmawan/Yonathan Suryatama Dasuki in the Japan SS QF (post Olympic syndrome?).

    Yes, the defeat to Tadashi Ohtsuka/Keita Masuda in the first round of All-England was uncharacteristic and totally unexpected They also suffered another early defeat to Lars Paaske/Jonas Rasmussen in the R16 of Korea SS (again, another collapse in the second set).

  7. #41
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    badMania pointed very well.

    JJS will join the badminton team inside the military next year but expected to keep partnership with LYD when they play in international games representing for KOR. So MK/HS should keep caring about that.
    IMO, the motive MK/HS could win the Gold in Beijing was that they lost to JJS/LYD two times in a row this year as you mentioned. They must have practiced very hard to win the only team they had fear.

    Especially, this year JJS/LYD had mastered the playing styles of INA, MAS, and CHN so that they could win over them with confidence. However their only fear was against the european style as MK/HS also had the same difficulties with LP/JR. And Beijing was their first participation of the Olympics and they were too concerned about their first opponent and chinese unfair judges. IMO, if they could manage the pressure in the first round, they surely had confidence to win MK/HS in final (on the contrary, MK/HS would have fear).

    BTW, JJS/LYD will participate in the Shanghai super series in November, but unfortunately INA won't.
    Last edited by narnia; 10-28-2008 at 02:46 AM.

  8. #42
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    They have beaten Lars Paaske/Jonas Rasmussen twice this year (including the Beijing Olympics SF match), who themselves have beaten Jung Jae Sung/Lee Yong Dae TWICE this year also. The fact that Jung/Lee lost as early as the first round in Beijing is an indication that they are probably not as strong as what most people have predicted prior to the Beijing Games. So, I don't think Kido/Hendra FEAR Jung/Lee. Remember, Kido/Hendra also triumphed over Jung/Lee in the Final of World Championships 2007

    The opponents Kido/Hendra beat in the Beijing Games included 2 ex World Champions and 1 ex All-England and Asian Games Individual Gold Medallist. I think they DESERVE the Gold Medal after surviving a difficult draw prior to the Final.

  9. #43
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    Not convincing. MK/HS has also been defeated by LP/JR last year, then you will conclude LP/JR are the best? In the sports like badminton, there exist this kind of relations: beating and beated. And the speed from the rallypoint system has brought much changes in the strategies and movements. MK/HS should have fear especially against JJS/LYD becuase they lost "completely" in the last two important games. Please check the videos how much they were embarrassed not finding their positions in the court. You can read it from their faces. On the contrary, JJS/LYD was full of confidence in their movements. Especially Kido's moves are easily read. That surely made MK/HS get motivated to train even harder.
    And as for LYD, he's just 20 and had been improved a lot partnering with JJS for the last two years. He's not a big smasher nor a rocket-speed player. Instead, he's a fast learner, best frontman, best in reading his opponents' movements. Now, he's just mastered all the movements of his major opponents and can exactly anticipate their next moves and lead them make faults. Just watch his videos. The Beijing was only due to the Olympic pressure as everybody knows(he's too young and it's their first participation).
    Last edited by narnia; 10-28-2008 at 03:21 AM.

  10. #44
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    And... don't forget LYD won over two INA teams in XD SF and F: Limpele and Widianto. How? With XD ranking of just 10th? Because he knows very well about INA's playing style. But it was a tragedy it happened just after he was awaken from the first game pressure with JJS.

  11. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by narnia View Post
    And... don't forget LYD won over two INA teams in XD SF and F: Limpele and Widianto. How? With XD ranking of just 10th? Because he knows very well about INA's playing style. But it was a tragedy it happened just after he was awaken from the first game pressure with JJS.
    seems that u are a big fan of lee yong dae

  12. #46
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    Calm down, narnia. LYD has the potential to be a great player and possibly eclipse his countryman, Park Joo Bong. Having won All-England MD and Olympic XD at such a young age, he is one of the best players in the circuit right now. But so are the INA pair.

    About who is better than the rest, well that's subjective and based on what we see. As they are all young, improvements will continue. But it is normal to see how some pairs have more difficulty against one particular playing style compared to other pairs.

  13. #47
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    [quote=narnia;1012579]Not convincing. MK/HS has also been defeated by LP/JR last year, then you will conclude LP/JR are the best? quote]

    Err...u are wrong again. The INA pair maintains a perfect 2-0 record against Lars Paaske/Jonas Rasmussen last year, beating them in the Sudirman Cup and the Chinese-Taipei Open Final, a match they totally dominated.

    The KOR Open R16 defeat was the first time that they lost to Paaske/Rasmussen in recent 2-3 years Anyway, they managed to avenge the loss in the Beijing Olympics SF. Beating 2 CHN pairs (including a former World Champion) in front of the home crowd, 1 MAS pair (whom Kido/Hendra never beat prior to the Beijing Olympics), and a resurgent DEN pair (who themselves is a former World Champion and the one who beat the so called "unbeatable" KOR pair) are achievements that are definitely worthy of an Olympics Gold Medal.

    Kido/Hendra "lost completely"??? Watch the first set of the Swiss Super Series Final and the second set of the Thomas Cup SF. In both sets, the INA pair was more than capable of matching the KOR pair. The INA pair was even leading comfortably in the second set of the Swiss SS Final and the first set of the Thomas Cup SF was a close encounter (the INA pair losing 19-21).

    It's only in the rubber-sets of both matches that the INA pair collapsed uncharacteristically That's where they still lack the situational awareness.

    Oh...do I need to remind you that the "unbeatable and mighty" Jung Jae Sung/Lee Yong Dae was embarassed right at home, in the Korea Super Series this year (not last year) by INA's now disbanded pair of Luluk/Alvent

    And we are talking about Kido/Hendra here...not Lee Yong Dae. So, I am afraid his achievements in XD is out of the topic here Regardless of his achievement in the Beijing Olympics, it still remains that Nova Widianto/Liliyana Natsir have won 2 World Championships so far, a feat that even the mighthy LYD still has yet to match And even if he is to become a great XD champion, we still have to wait till 2010 before knowing if he can match Nova's achievements as two-times World Champions

    As for MD achievement, LYD probably will need to win the World Championships soon enough and another Gold Medal in London 2012, before you can talk of matching Kido/Hendra's achievements As for number of titles won, Kido/Hendra have won 13 titles (including the WC 2007, Invitational World Cup 2006, and Beijing Olympics Gold). Meanwhile, Jung/Lee have won a total of 6.

    I rest my case.
    Last edited by badMania; 10-28-2008 at 04:29 AM.

  14. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by abedeng View Post
    Calm down, narnia. LYD has the potential to be a great player and possibly eclipse his countryman, Park Joo Bong. Having won All-England MD and Olympic XD at such a young age, he is one of the best players in the circuit right now. But so are the INA pair.

    About who is better than the rest, well that's subjective and based on what we see. As they are all young, improvements will continue. But it is normal to see how some pairs have more difficulty against one particular playing style compared to other pairs.
    Exactly...wise words from abedeng (as always). No one is doubting Lee Yong Dae's brilliance. But to completely discredit the INA pair's achievement in the Beijing Olympics as unconvincing is just a tad too much
    Last edited by badMania; 10-28-2008 at 04:36 AM.

  15. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by narnia View Post
    Especially, this year JJS/LYD had mastered the playing styles of INA, MAS, and CHN so that they could win over them with confidence. However their only fear was against the european style as MK/HS also had the same difficulties with LP/JR. And Beijing was their first participation of the Olympics and they were too concerned about their first opponent and chinese unfair judges. IMO, if they could manage the pressure in the first round, they surely had confidence to win MK/HS in final (on the contrary, MK/HS would have fear).
    So did Kido/Hendra in their first Olympics, facing the Chinese 2nd pair in front of the home crowd, with the huge burden on their shoulder of winning the Olympics Gold, they nearly crumbled too. Luckily, their experience brought them through and they were able to defeat Guo Zhendong/Xie Zhongbo in rubber-set.

    There's no way Kido/Hendra were to face Jung/Lee in the Final because they would have met earlier in the SF And, if the results stayed the same....Kido/Hendra had beaten Koo/Tan prior to facing Jung/Lee, they would have gotten such a morale booster in beating their MAS nemesis and would go into the match against the KOR pair full of confidence that they can overcome all odds, not full of fear

  16. #50
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    One of the rare occasion badMania get worked up

    Head to Head, they're even at 3-3, so I think this paragraph summed it up nicely:
    As for MD achievement, LYD probably will need to win the World Championships soon enough and another Gold Medal in London 2012, before you can talk of matching Kido/Hendra's achievements As for number of titles won, Kido/Hendra have won 13 titles (including the WC 2007, Invitational World Cup 2006, and Beijing Olympics Gold). Meanwhile, Jung/Lee have won a total of 6.

  17. #51
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    If by "best form" you mean current best form, then I don't think Koo/Tan is a problem. Also, for "team-mates", Gill Clark indeed mentioned that MK/HS didn't seem concentrated when they lost to their teammates.

    LP/JR is getting old and cannot keep their speed throughout the whole match, otherwise I don't think they would lose to FHF/SY.

    You see, the situation is that, except for Jung/Lee, all other pairs have to be "in their best" to challenge a normal MK/HS. What happens when MK/HS is in "their best"? Who can stop them? I would say only Jung/Lee.

    The past DO final clearly shows that SY/FHF just cannot keep up with MK/HS and were sent into every corner of the court.

    The only concern for MK/HS is their consistency (throughout the season and throughout a match). But they seem to be improving on this during the past year.

    Quote Originally Posted by badMania View Post
    IMHO, Jung/Lee, Koo/Tan (in their best form), and probably a team-mate (like Rian/Yoke) will be the pairs that can stop Kido/Hendra at the moment. Pairs that will give a close match will also include Paaske/Rasmussen and probably Fairuz/Zakry (at their best also).

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