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  1. #358
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    Quote Originally Posted by narnia View Post
    Despite Fu's improved power and in-court movement, the CHN team still lacks in the fundamental apsects of MD; speedy drives, rotations, techniques, strategical movements in comparison with JJS/LYD.
    On the aspects you named, FHF does lack consistency in speedy drives but not CY. Rotation is happening a lot since the pair prefers to have FHF behind and they are usually successful in carrying that out. You need to be more specific about techniques and strategic movements.

  2. #359
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    Quote Originally Posted by weeyeh View Post
    On the aspects you named, FHF does lack consistency in speedy drives but not CY. Rotation is happening a lot since the pair prefers to have FHF behind and they are usually successful in carrying that out. You need to be more specific about techniques and strategic movements.
    CY/FHF's formation is basic, traditional but monotonous; if you would say it is also a kind of rotational movement it would be true. However, in contemporary badminton, especially in MD, many variations have been brought in with the introduction of 21 rally systems. Especially instant and speedy drives and strategic variations in rotations and dynamic movements are making them taking the edge; look KKK, Setiawan, and Lee Yong Dae. Cai Yun is still good but a guy of old age and usually he can only make points in the front when Fu can back up in the rear court. (Unusually, in this event, Fu quite improved in his front-net attacks as preparing in advance with racket up consistently.) That formation is so vulnerable once one of them can't do his role; usually they can't because it's difficult to keep it consistently. And they should be multi-player in all-around court.
    (If you want to mention the win of AE 2009, in that event, the WR #1 who was the champion of AE 2008 and #2 who was OG Gold medalist were not there to compete them. It was lucky for them.)

    In sum, even though Fu improved a lot, they still lack in more advanced skills that current badminton requires. They could win this event just because Fu was in good form. We can check it in their next matches if he can be consistent.

    Note I always enjoy discussing on the matches among the top 4 in the world. The only team who have shown their consistent performance in current badminton of MD is JJS/LYD; they have mostly advanced to the Finals. The partnership had some break time for the past couple of months and still they showed their promising future.
    Last edited by narnia; 05-20-2009 at 05:40 AM.

  3. #360
    Regular Member AlanY's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by narnia View Post
    Despite Fu's improved power and in-court movement, the CHN team still lacks in the fundamental apsects of MD; speedy drives, rotations, techniques, strategical movements in comparison with JJS/LYD.
    well, well, well. are we talking about the same pair that won WC, AE, olympics silver and with no less than 15 major titles todate? aren't you belittled the rest of the MD around?

  4. #361
    Regular Member george@chongwei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by narnia View Post
    Please read carefully what I wrote; you seem to just browse it. I wrote all you are wondering about. You need to read the details.

    Yeah, in spite of win or loss, LYD always risking his physical strength as he plays in two categories usually up to the finals. Especially in the final event, he could take only about tens of minutes in hustle. Why can't it be one of the reasons for his loss? I already saw many people here mentioning about that before the game and after.
    May i suggest you to read carefully what i'm trying to say 1st.
    Calm yourselves down and read carefully

  5. #362
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    Quote Originally Posted by narnia View Post
    CY/FHF's formation is basic, traditional but monotonous; if you would say it is also a kind of rotational movement it would be true. However, in contemporary badminton, especially in MD, many variations have been brought in with the introduction of 21 rally systems. Especially instant and speedy drives and strategic variations in rotations and dynamic movements are making them taking the edge; look KKK, Setiawan, and Lee Yong Dae. Cai Yun is still good but a guy of old age and usually he can only make points in the front when Fu can back up in the rear court. (Unusually, in this event, Fu quite improved in his front-net attacks as preparing in advance with racket up consistently.) That formation is so vulnerable once one of them can't do his role; usually they can't because it's difficult to keep it consistently. And they should be multi-player in all-around court.
    (If you want to mention the win of AE 2009, in that event, the WR #1 who was the champion of AE 2008 and #2 who was OG Gold medalist were not there to compete them. It was lucky for them.)

    In sum, even though Fu improved a lot, they still lack in more advanced skills that current badminton requires. They could win this event just because Fu was in good form. We can check it in their next matches if he can be consistent.

    Note I always enjoy discussing on the matches among the top 4 in the world. The only team who have shown their consistent performance in current badminton of MD is JJS/LYD; they have mostly advanced to the Finals. The partnership had some break time for the past couple of months and still they showed their promising future.
    Well, FHF/CY's formation is really non-traditional MD. Most MD pairs have a fairly balanced front/back capability so you see a lot more rotational work. In the case of FHF/CY, the front/back bias is very obvious. The net capability of CY easily equals JJS (perhaps LYD is stronger) but the base capability of FHF is off the scale (with a possible equal in Kido). FHF used to absolutely suck at the net (quite possibly the worst net player in the top 10 MD but he's improved a lot) and CY's smash is not nearly as powerful as the rest in the field.

    Whereas traditional MD pair relies on no obvious weaknesses and a strong bias towards a certain style of play (e.g. JJS/LYD strongly prefers the fast knocking games), FHF/CY's style changes depending on who's where. Neither FHF or CY has the versatility of LYD but as a pair, they have a more versatile range of play. The dynamics that works for them is very different from the more conventional pairs.

    A few other notes:
    • OG Gold medalist (MD) pair is World #1 Kido/Hendra; JJS/LYD were beaten by Lars/Jonas in 1/16.
    • FHF/CY is still top ranked (currently 7) despite their "lack of skills/technique". No pair can claim certain dominance over them.
    • Yes, FHF's performance is vital in this pair but so it CY's performance. To a certain extent, at their level of play, no pair can afford to have anyone off-form.
    Once again, lets get back to discussing JJS/LYD. I believe they will top the chart again once JJS is out of military.

  6. #363
    Regular Member huangkwokhau's Avatar
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    As Long As LYD/JJS has not won OG or WC, they wont be remembered..it does not matter..how many SS titles or AE they have won.....

  7. #364
    Regular Member huangkwokhau's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AlanY View Post
    well, well, well. are we talking about the same pair that won WC, AE, olympics silver and with no less than 15 major titles todate? aren't you belittled the rest of the MD around?
    Even Kido/Hendra won WC and OG plus more SS titles are nothing to Narnia.....remember that LYD/JJS are dominator.......if Kido/Hendra are not good for him..then let alone CY/FHF for him...

  8. #365
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    Quote Originally Posted by weeyeh View Post
    Well, FHF/CY's formation is really non-traditional MD. Most MD pairs have a fairly balanced front/back capability so you see a lot more rotational work. In the case of FHF/CY, the front/back bias is very obvious. The net capability of CY easily equals JJS (perhaps LYD is stronger) but the base capability of FHF is off the scale (with a possible equal in Kido). FHF used to absolutely suck at the net (quite possibly the worst net player in the top 10 MD but he's improved a lot) and CY's smash is not nearly as powerful as the rest in the field.

    Whereas traditional MD pair relies on no obvious weaknesses and a strong bias towards a certain style of play (e.g. JJS/LYD strongly prefers the fast knocking games), FHF/CY's style changes depending on who's where. Neither FHF or CY has the versatility of LYD but as a pair, they have a more versatile range of play. The dynamics that works for them is very different from the more conventional pairs.

    A few other notes:
    • OG Gold medalist (MD) pair is World #1 Kido/Hendra; JJS/LYD were beaten by Lars/Jonas in 1/16.
    • FHF/CY is still top ranked (currently 7) despite their "lack of skills/technique". No pair can claim certain dominance over them.
    • Yes, FHF's performance is vital in this pair but so it CY's performance. To a certain extent, at their level of play, no pair can afford to have anyone off-form.
    Once again, lets get back to discussing JJS/LYD. I believe they will top the chart again once JJS is out of military.
    Thanks for your real discussion in the midst of many people's just blah blah blah. I enjoy analyzing the games in details but don't like the guys who just stick to saying who wins... who gets the titles... without careful investigation into the details, quality, and content of the head-to-head matches.

  9. #366
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    Quote Originally Posted by narnia View Post
    Thanks for your real discussion in the midst of many people's just blah blah blah. I enjoy analyzing the games in details but don't like the guys who just stick to saying who wins... who gets the titles... without careful investigation into the details, quality, and content of the head-to-head matches.
    I didn't see other guy always pay attention to the titles(although mention about but as a good reference, why not?)

    As a matter of fact,they did give some reasonable analysis, if you pay more attention.

    U wish is good but is not true.
    I also wish other people could really stand up to compete with china team, but not only with word.
    so take it easy, buddy!

    ps:I'm not a newbie

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    Quote Originally Posted by Timmm View Post
    I didn't see other guy always pay attention to the titles(although mention about but as a good reference, why not?)

    As a matter of fact,they did give some reasonable analysis, if you pay more attention.

    U wish is good but is not true.
    I also wish other people could really stand up to compete with china team, but not only with word.
    so take it easy, buddy!

    ps:I'm not a newbie
    So what's your analysis or view? Without detailed opinions, I can't tell the difference from a newbie. Take relax...

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    Quote Originally Posted by narnia View Post
    So what's your analysis or view? Without detailed opinions, I can't tell the difference from a newbie. Take relax...
    what's you detail question?

  12. #369
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    wow..intense conversation..you know what? screw the analyzing..you guys should FIGHT IT OUT!!!!!

  13. #370
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    c'mon mates chill......there's no need to have the war of words here...

  14. #371
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    Quote Originally Posted by narnia View Post
    Despite Fu's improved power and in-court movement, the CHN team still lacks in the fundamental apsects of MD; speedy drives, rotations, techniques, strategical movements in comparison with JJS/LYD. What they are specialized in is only the traditional way of standing; front-back, that's vulnerable if you can't make effective smashes like Fu did at the final match (he can't do it like that in all tourneys; it usually depends on the mood on the very day.) and their opponents can prepare for it in advance.
    (Note I like Cai/Fu very much. I'm only analyzing their abilities in my viewpoint.)
    In theory, all around is great. In reality, as long as you have a reliable of generating "W", you are all good.

    I remember reading an article, as compare to BCL, both CH and LD are tend to be "1 dimensional" in skill category. However, CH and LD's personal achivement are both better compare to BCL, and it likely will be that way, consider BCL's condition right now. So, how you explain this?

    There's another article regarding Reggie Miller, who might be the best 3-point specialist in NBA history. Scientists still can not explain Reggie's wrist release motion, as it's obviously against the law of physics. If most of us such form, it will cause injury, and let alone making thousands of 3 pointers in NBA.

    So, theory does not equal to victory in reality.

  15. #372
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    Quote Originally Posted by narnia View Post

    One more "little" side-talk; JJS's smashes were not so powerful as before. He seemed not used to his new Victor racket from his military duty. On the contrary, CHN have played with the Lining rackets for a longer time. That could be a reason for the difference they showed.

    Relax always. This is only a game as we enjoy watching and thinking of great players.

    LOL, know what, besides Lining rackets, the Chinese got to get used to the Lining shorts, clinging T-shirts, shoes & socks...

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    wow, narnia and weeyeh, thanks so much for a terrific analysis and rich discussion.
    Very professional and showing wonderful mutual respect.
    Similar and different views at the same time.
    No right or wrong opinions.
    Different preceptions conveyed in a sincere manner, that's why it's so enjoyable.
    Kudos!

  17. #374
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    Quote Originally Posted by narnia View Post
    The only team who have shown their consistent performance in current badminton of MD is JJS/LYD; they have mostly advanced to the Finals.
    Oh well...the most consistent pair in the World right now has lost yet again in the first round. So sad....

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