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  1. #443
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctjcad View Post
    BWF ranking?? A player/pair wins or collects pts and they all add up to reflect their ranking. What more do i need to know? And your point??..

    *scratching my head & wondering why am i all of a sudden immersed in this thread*??..
    It's not enough. Please read the system carefully not to misunderstand it.

  2. #444
    Regular Member ctjcad's Avatar
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    Default ^^Please summarize it..^^

    ..for us here, not only for me but for others as well, trying to figure out what is your point in bringing up the BWF Ranking system??..

  3. #445
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctjcad View Post
    ..for us here, not only for me but for others as well, trying to figure out what is your point in bringing up the BWF Ranking system??..
    Haiseh, said already mah, the more you ask, the more confusing, haha.

    Btw, you all forgot to count SS FInals participation, must factor that % in also, my calculations did not include International Challenges, but GP upwards to be consistent with all top pairs.

    Another thing, the 'dominant' or not thingy, can be very complicated. Cos we can also see how many runner-up, semi, the pairs entered.

    And then, whether to count Asian Games, OG, Commonwealth, SEA Games. Not all countries can play in Commonwealth & SEA Games, then the question will be to count or not. Then there's some European Team championship or sthing like that, which the European pairs take part.

    And timeline, 2008 was good year for LYD/JJS, 2007 was bad, 2009 ok.
    End of 2009, can be 3 yr period, 2 yr period or just 2009, just the different variables can make one pening kepala.
    Last edited by eaglehelang; 06-14-2009 at 06:17 AM.

  4. #446
    Regular Member ctjcad's Avatar
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    Default ^^What, where and why..^^

    - Hmm, what do you mean by "already said mah"? Did narnia point it out already? I was asking because i'm confused and bemused by narnia's intention of me reading more into the BWF ranking system.
    - I'm only looking at those BWF-sanctioned tourneys.
    - Just the 2008 stats. Unless you really want narnia to do extra work by counting the 2006, 2007 & 2009 stats.

  5. #447
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    Default Head to Head Stats among the Tops

    Head to Head Stats among the Top MDs

    This table was prepared based on all data collected from the stats available in Tournamentsofware from 2008 MAS Open to 2009 SIN Open, which reflects the records for the recent 1 and a half years. Among the Top 10 in current BWF ranking, 8 teams were included who have taken the titles in Super Series.

    If there are any errors or any other data missing for the period, please let me know to update.

    Name:  H2H Stats of Top MDs.jpg
Views: 311
Size:  70.9 KB
    (To read the table, WHO in horizontal beat WHOM in vertical in the tourney specified.)

    Some findings from the stats:

    - JJS/LYD shows absolute winning % of 77% or around 80%!
    - They were esp. stronger over MK/HS, KKK/TBH, and MB/CM
    - FHF/CY had only 10 matches against the tops for the recent period, that's not enough to determine their strength against the tops.

    Post your reflections as reading the table...

    Enjoy~!
    Last edited by narnia; 06-16-2009 at 02:50 AM.

  6. #448
    Regular Member ctjcad's Avatar
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    Thumbs up ^^Pretty darn good effort..^^

    ..what can i say, you've exceeded my expectation, narnia!!2 thumbs up for your effort!

    Actually, i was just looking for the 2008 head-to-head stats between JJS & LYD vs. the other top 10 MD pairs.
    If you don't mind, could you do another similar tabulation, but just for the yr 2008? I think you can get the 2008 final MD ranking from BWF's website.

    Now, to point out JJS & LYD's 2008 record, i guess they went 11-3 vs. the assumed top 10 MD pairs in BWF-sanctioned events. That's a winning percentage of 79%-80%!!, a pretty respectable number. While winning all 3 of their meetings vs. Markis & Hendra. And only going winless against BC's resident pair, JR & LP.

    Markis Kido & Hendra Setiawan went 7-7, a winning percentage of 50%.

    Koo Kien Keat & Tan Boon Heong went 7-8, a winning percentage of 47%.

    Cai Yun & Fu Hai Feng went 2-3, a winning percentage of 40%.

    And BC's resident players, JR & LP went 6-3, a winning percentage of 67%.

    Clearly, looking at those numbers (in addition to their titles), LYD & TBH do have an argument that they were arguably the most dominating MD pair in 2008.
    Last edited by ctjcad; 06-16-2009 at 03:35 AM.

  7. #449
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctjcad View Post
    - Hmm, what do you mean by "already said mah"? Did narnia point it out already? I was asking because i'm confused and bemused by narnia's intention of me reading more into the BWF ranking system.
    - I'm only looking at those BWF-sanctioned tourneys.
    - Just the 2008 stats. Unless you really want narnia to do extra work by counting the 2006, 2007 & 2009 stats.
    Cos you post 1 time why are you immersed in this thread. And what you ask, we already gone thru long, long time ago. The % stats as in titles & all that, I already did for 2007 & 2008, a 2 year total, & 2008 total.

  8. #450
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    I am impressed with the hard work that our resident KOR fan has put in and indeed shows that Jung Jae Sung/Lee Yong Dae is the DOMINANT PAIR of 2008 No doubt, Jung/Lee only lost 3 times to the top 10 pairs in 2008; the other losses were to Luluk/Alvent, Hwang/Lee, and Guo/Xie; bringing the total losses to 6.

    I do accept that in terms of percentage of winning against top 10 pairs, Kido/Hendra were inferior due to the fact that they had a 0-3 record against Jung/Lee and 2-2 record against Koo/Tan. And three of those happened when/after Kido's knee injury flared up during the Hong Kong SS 2009. The other losses were to Paaske/Rasmussen, Ohtsuka/Masuda, and Tony/Candra; bringing the total losses to 8. However, our resident KOR fan missed the fact that Kido/Hendra had beaten Fairuz/Zakry 3 times in 2008

    Even Lars Paaske/Jonas Rasmussen had a better record against the top 10 pairs during 2008 as they only lost a total of 4 times: 2 to Kido/Hendra, 1 to Koo/Tan and one more to Choong/Lee.
    Last edited by badMania; 06-16-2009 at 06:43 AM.

  9. #451
    Regular Member ctjcad's Avatar
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    Default Hmm..

    Quote Originally Posted by eaglehelang View Post
    Cos you post 1 time why are you immersed in this thread. And what you ask, we already gone thru long, long time ago. The % stats as in titles & all that, I already did for 2007 & 2008, a 2 year total, & 2008 total.
    ..hmm, i don't know either why all of the sudden i'm so immersed in this thread.....maybe cos of all of the debates that have been going on in here over the use of the word "domination/dominated/dominant" that i found quite insignificant; on the other hand, if narnia had put up a similar graphic earlier to back up his claims/arguments, then maybe this thread wouldn't be as long..
    Anyway, i was asking abt what narnia meant by "i need to read the BWF ranking system more carefully". Not questioning "% stats as in titles etc".
    Do you know what he meant??...i certainly don't. But if you do, do you mind explaining??..
    Quote Originally Posted by badMania View Post
    I am impressed with the hard work that our resident KOR fan has put in and indeed shows that Jung Jae Sung/Lee Yong Dae is the DOMINANT PAIR of 2008 No doubt, Jung/Lee only lost 3 times to the top 10 pairs in 2008; the other losses were to Luluk/Alvent, Hwang/Lee, and Guo/Xie; bringing the total losses to 6.

    I do accept that in terms of percentage of winning against top 10 pairs, Kido/Hendra were inferior due to the fact that they had a 0-3 record against Jung/Lee and 2-2 record against Koo/Tan. And three of those happened when/after Kido's knee injury flared up during the Hong Kong SS 2009. The other losses were to Paaske/Rasmussen, Ohtsuka/Masuda, and Tony/Candra; bringing the total losses to 8. However, our resident KOR fan missed the fact that Kido/Hendra had beaten Fairuz/Zakry 3 times in 2008

    Even Lars Paaske/Jonas Rasmussen had a better record against the top 10 pairs during 2008 as they only lost a total of 4 times: 2 to Kido/Hendra, 1 to Koo/Tan and one more to Choong/Lee.
    About those 2008 records:
    - narnia, in this instance, purposely showed head-to-head stats for the top 10 pairs only. IMO, the top 10 MD pairs counted more because of what they had accomplished in comparison to those outside of the top 10.
    - Looking at the graphic, I only counted 3 losses vs. the top 10 MD pairs for LP & JR.
    Last edited by ctjcad; 06-17-2009 at 02:16 AM.

  10. #452
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctjcad View Post
    About those 2008 records:
    - narnia, in this instance, purposely showed head-to-head stats for the top 10 pairs only. IMO, the top 10 MD pairs counted more because of what they had accomplished in comparison to those outside of the top 10.
    - Looking at the graphic, I only counted 3 losses vs. the top 10 MD pairs for LP & JR.
    Several pairs such as Choong Tan Fook/Lee Wan Wah, Tony Gunawan/Candra Wijaya, and Tadashi Ohtsuka/Keita Masuda were ranked in the top 10 by end of December 2008. So, If you are to count the number of losses to the top 10 pairs for Paaske/Rasmussen, it will be 4 (including 1 to Choong/Lee). Oh, and Nathan Robertson/Anthony Clark is not even a top 10 pair by the end of 2008 or even right now

    Plus Chris, u assume that the data presented in the table is 100% correct. I had raised a counter-example where narnia failed to include Kido/Hendra's three victories over Fairuz/Zakry in the whole of 2008!

  11. #453
    Regular Member ctjcad's Avatar
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    Default ^^Yes and maybe..^^

    - Yes, i am only looking for the top 10 MD pairs at the conclusion of 2008. I had requested narnia to do the stats for 2008 only. But i guess he got a bit excited and went a bit overboard and included this yr's also. As we can see, it gets a bit complicated.
    - I didn't check the standing of the top 10 MD pair for the end of 2008, so i took the stats as correct. Was Fuzzy pair a top 10 pair at the end of 2008?? And were those 3 victories occurred in BWF-sanctioned tourney(s)??..If so, then narnia probably needs to revise his stats graphic..
    Last edited by ctjcad; 06-17-2009 at 04:18 AM.

  12. #454
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctjcad View Post
    - I didn't check the standing of the top 10 MD pair for the end of 2008, so i took the stats as correct. Was Fuzzy pair a top 10 pair at the end of 2008?? And were those 3 victories occurred in BWF-sanctioned tourney(s)??..If so, then narnia probably needs to revise his stats graphic..
    Oh...definitely Fairuz/Zakry was a top 10 pair...u can look up the ranking by end of December 2008.

    The 3 victories were in: Swiss, Denmark, and French SS 2008.

  13. #455
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    Default

    Thanks guys for good discussions.

    I'm gonna discuss on the stats in another new thread and here will be dedicated to JJS/LYD's on-going performance.

    Enjoy~
    Last edited by narnia; 06-18-2009 at 01:08 AM.

  14. #456
    Regular Member george@chongwei's Avatar
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    Can anyone tell me who is JJS's former md partner? i think he' being recruited to the national squad quite late though.

  15. #457
    Regular Member ctjcad's Avatar
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    Default ^^Lee..^^

    ..Lee Jaeeee-Jiiiiiiiiiiiin...
    One of their youthful looking pics:
    http://www.badmintoncentral.com/foru...3&postcount=30
    Last edited by ctjcad; 06-20-2009 at 11:17 AM.

  16. #458
    Regular Member george@chongwei's Avatar
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    then what about HJM?
    lol, thanks for sharing their youthful pics.

  17. #459
    Regular Member ctjcad's Avatar
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    Default ^^Yoo..^^

    ..Yoo Yeoooon-Suuuuuung...I believe he was one of HJM's early partners..
    His pic:
    http://www.badmintoncentral.com/foru...2&postcount=22

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