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  1. #834
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    Quote Originally Posted by twobeer View Post
    When Chineese players being so superior, it is only natural that they want to mix aand groom yunger players, try differnt players out etc. etc. I think this would have been the case if INA or MAS would have been as dominat as well.. I dont really think it is "that" strange...
    This has been discussed countless times, it would not have happened in other countries, esp democratic countries. In terms of walkover/withdrawals/intentionally losing. Would have complaints from players, coaches,etc, inquiries, investigations

  2. #835
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    since i am new here,i dont understand what u guys talk about lin dan
    aren't a player should participate a tournament with his/her best effort to win?
    why lin dan is doing the opposite way?

    lol

  3. #836
    Regular Member pBmMalaysia's Avatar
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    China player win fair and square, there's no doubt ... but with assistance It's like my car with traction control, abs, xyz ... It sure runs better . Btw, I never realize by training harder and more skillful than the Chinese player one can beat them??? Would that be the answer the whole load of coaches from all over the world has been looking for? Seriously there must be some explanations here

  4. #837
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    Quote Originally Posted by pBmMalaysia View Post
    China player win fair and square, there's no doubt ... but with assistance It's like my car with traction control, abs, xyz ... It sure runs better . Btw, I never realize by training harder and more skillful than the Chinese player one can beat them??? Would that be the answer the whole load of coaches from all over the world has been looking for? Seriously there must be some explanations here
    No, No it is soo easy to beat the chineese playes, just let friends like LCW WO to Gade or Taufik, and they will be sooon rested for the finals.. hmm.. maybe winning isn't just as simple as a "coaching" planning of the draw???

    Think about the opposite.. Do you really think Gade would have won JO, if LCW throw the game based on shoulder injury, and LD pushed himself despite a hurting toe to win against CL?? I think not! And would you have cried foul if LCW withdrew from the semis due to pain in the shoulder??

    Seriously, The Chineese team has both better boomsticks and more "turtle soup" :-D

  5. #838
    Regular Member pBmMalaysia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by twobeer View Post
    No, No it is soo easy to beat the chineese playes, just let friends like LCW WO to Gade or Taufik, and they will be sooon rested for the finals.. hmm.. maybe winning isn't just as simple as a "coaching" planning of the draw???Think about the opposite.. Do you really think Gade would have won JO, if LCW throw the game based on shoulder injury, and LD pushed himself despite a hurting toe to win against CL?? I think not! And would you have cried foul if LCW withdrew from the semis due to pain in the shoulder??Seriously, The Chineese team has both better boomsticks and more "turtle soup" :-D
    What you are saying is the impossible (lcw purposely give wo to pg). A good prediction but it will never ever happen

  6. #839
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    Quote Originally Posted by eaglehelang View Post
    This has been discussed countless times, it would not have happened in other countries, esp democratic countries. In terms of walkover/withdrawals/intentionally losing. Would have complaints from players, coaches,etc, inquiries, investigations
    Then why Democratic Maylasia and India can not win more champion than China?

  7. #840
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    Quote Originally Posted by pBmMalaysia View Post
    What you are saying is the impossible (lcw purposely give wo to pg). A good prediction but it will never ever happen
    Where have you been lately? Impossible OK, I agree with you, but really LCW/TSB should seriously consider 'throwing' a match to PG, not WO. CJ is currently 6th in WR behind PG and TH. LD and CL are in OLY12. If LCW meets PG in SF or F, whether PG win F or not, PG gets more points to stay to maintain that gap in WR points.
    If I am TSB, I would rather see 2 CHN MS than 3 in OLY12. How CL plays in OLY12 remains to be seen and CL was venerable in WC, his 1st major. But we know CJ played well in WC, AE and OLY, and played tough against LCW, and come OLY12, you can bet CJ will be prepared, fit and focus, and very dangerous.

  8. #841
    Regular Member pBmMalaysia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneToughBirdie View Post
    Where have you been lately? Impossible OK, I agree with you, but really LCW/TSB should seriously consider 'throwing' a match to PG, not WO. CJ is currently 6th in WR behind PG and TH. LD and CL are in OLY12. If LCW meets PG in SF or F, whether PG win F or not, PG gets more points to stay to maintain that gap in WR points. If I am TSB, I would rather see 2 CHN MS than 3 in OLY12. How CL plays in OLY12 remains to be seen and CL was venerable in WC, his 1st major. But we know CJ played well in WC, AE and OLY, and played tough against LCW, and come OLY12, you can bet CJ will be prepared, fit and focus, and very dangerous.
    Otb, I know you make that prediction earlier and in fact that could be the only way to prevent lyb from manipulating china players ranking further

    imagine a fresh Chen long can do damage to lcw, what about a fresh lcw can do ?

    I think beside sending any of china player, be it 1, 2 or 3 packing also lyb crying

    Anyway, it's so easy said than done
    Last edited by pBmMalaysia; 10-04-2011 at 08:46 PM.

  9. #842
    Regular Member extremenanopowe's Avatar
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    PG and lcw shd work closely. good one otb. Pls inform their coaches. or fb them.

  10. #843
    Regular Member extremenanopowe's Avatar
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    Initially my thought is also to have PG give WO to LCW in JO. I guess PG's ego is bigger that that.

    LCW would have been fresher to take on CL then.

  11. #844
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    Quote Originally Posted by extremenanopowe View Post
    Initially my thought is also to have PG give WO to LCW in JO. I guess PG's ego is bigger that that.

    LCW would have been fresher to take on CL then.
    The Match was fixed :-O .. He lost on purpose.. Their sponsor told them to give LCW an easy win and then he threw the game to LCW to keep him well rested to the finals :-)

  12. #845
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    Quote Originally Posted by laonong View Post
    Then why Democratic Maylasia and India can not win more champion than China?
    sounds like nerds who fighting for the exam results

  13. #846
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    Quote Originally Posted by pBmMalaysia View Post
    Otb, I know you make that prediction earlier and in fact that could be the only way to prevent lyb from manipulating china players ranking further
    imagine a fresh Chen long can do damage to lcw, what about a fresh lcw can do ?
    I think beside sending any of china player, be it 1, 2 or 3 packing also lyb crying
    Anyway, it's so easy said than done
    Quote Originally Posted by extremenanopowe View Post
    PG and lcw shd work closely. good one otb. Pls inform their coaches. or fb them.
    Quote Originally Posted by extremenanopowe View Post
    Initially my thought is also to have PG give WO to LCW in JO. I guess PG's ego is bigger that that.
    LCW would have been fresher to take on CL then.
    Quote Originally Posted by twobeer View Post
    The Match was fixed :-O .. He lost on purpose.. Their sponsor told them to give LCW an easy win and then he threw the game to LCW to keep him well rested to the finals :-)
    I am only musing on match fixing, talk is easy and cheap, to actually do it is another story. The reason is LYB is in supreme control of CBA, he is the mother of all bosses and he can use the players as a chess game, do as he please and the players buy into this scheme, whether willingly or reluctantly they have no choice. Match fixing in CHN works.
    There is no way PG or DEN as a whole will join in this match fixing game. LCW is solidly rank in the top 4 for OLY12, he just have to maintain either 1 or 2 to be drawn opposite of LD, in other words LCW does not need the points for now. PG is rank 4 and CJ is at 6 now catching up fast. PG needs the points to deny CJ in the top 4. And you can be sure if there is any chance for CJ to pick up WR points, LYB will do it in a heartbeat.
    If you think by having PG throw his match to LCW at SF, so LCW can be fresh and beat CL, then you are missing the point and focussing on JO11 and all these SS titles. I am looking at the big O, which is what LYB, LD and CHN really wants, and that is the only reason LD is staying on despite having won everything and not retire yet. LD endorsement fees alone is more than all these SS wins.
    If LCW said he is focussing on OLY and not these SS, then he has to learn to be creative and play his cards wisely. Sacrifice an SS title if he meets PG at SF, lose some US dollars, swallow some pride, but silently laughing away, why not? LCW would sure rather face 2 CHN MS in OLY than 3 straight. If LCW wins the big O, we are talking rewards into the millions, SS titles are in the thousands, kachang puteh lah.
    If LCW throws his match to PG, even if CL beat PG at F, PG gets more losing finalist points than losing semi-finalist points and maintain that points gap against CJ. It is all about PG getting as many WR points as possible to deny CHN of having 3 MS in top 4.
    IMO, between CL and CJ, TSB would rather have CL in OLY than CJ. CL is still a 'rookie' at the big stage and he screwed up at WO11, whereas CJ was always dangerous and played his heart out in WC, AE, OLY.
    On another note, as for match fixing in MAS now, even if MAS has the top players to match fix, that is very difficult to do because there is no way KLRC or NUSA would agree to have their player throw a game to LCW. In the past, haven't Roslin and Yo-Yo beaten LCW or gave him a hard run. Nobody in MAS has the kind of supreme control LYB has.
    That is my take
    Last edited by OneToughBirdie; 10-05-2011 at 04:16 PM.

  14. #847
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    Quote Originally Posted by twobeer View Post
    No, No it is soo easy to beat the chineese playes, just let friends like LCW WO to Gade or Taufik, and they will be sooon rested for the finals.. hmm.. maybe winning isn't just as simple as a "coaching" planning of the draw???

    Think about the opposite.. Do you really think Gade would have won JO, if LCW throw the game based on shoulder injury, and LD pushed himself despite a hurting toe to win against CL?? I think not! And would you have cried foul if LCW withdrew from the semis due to pain in the shoulder??

    Seriously, The Chineese team has both better boomsticks and more "turtle soup" :-D
    It is very tough to beat CHN MS and WS players and CHN has done her part in producing world class players. To be and to maintain the top 3 in CHN is a feat in itself, it is ultra competitive environment. Take for instance, a still young BCL 'force' retire, ZL, LL, XXZ (reigning WC cannot defend their WC titles as they are not good enough to make the team and retire), Gong WJ, DPY, WZM, and you name them all plus those gals who 'migrate' out like Xu Huai Wen, PHY, WC, YJ, etc. who go on to play past their 30's in other countries. JYJ alone would give the rest of the world hiccups, yet cannot make CHN team, that tells us how tough it is.

    But if PG or TH gets a WO to final to face CL who also got a WO, that is an even playing field, no one gets any advantage or rest.

    As to your comment that, would PG beat CL if LCW gave him a WO in JO11, that is 50-50 IMO. If LD indeed has a real toe injury, forget about beating CL, LD would be real stupid to play anyone anyway.

    Likewise, if LCW has a real shoulder pain and WO, I am okay with that. But if LCW throw a WO faking an injury, and I take vacation, fly into Japan, hotel and pay tickets, not only would I cry 'foul' but I would be mighty pissed and scream $#&^@.

    It is easy for us arm chair spectators or web browsers with nothing to lose, except losing sleep, sitting in front of a computer screen, stark naked scratching our balls watching live streaming, anticipating to see a game that turn to dust, and say it is all okay for WO to happen.

  15. #848
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneToughBirdie View Post
    It is very tough to beat CHN MS and WS players and CHN has done her part in producing world class players. To be and to maintain the top 3 in CHN is a feat in itself, it is ultra competitive environment. Take for instance, a still young BCL 'force' retire, ZL, LL, XXZ (reigning WC cannot defend their WC titles as they are not good enough to make the team and retire), Gong WJ, DPY, WZM, and you name them all plus those gals who 'migrate' out like Xu Huai Wen, PHY, WC, YJ, etc. who go on to play past their 30's in other countries. JYJ alone would give the rest of the world hiccups, yet cannot make CHN team, that tells us how tough it is.

    But if PG or TH gets a WO to final to face CL who also got a WO, that is an even playing field, no one gets any advantage or rest.

    As to your comment that, would PG beat CL if LCW gave him a WO in JO11, that is 50-50 IMO. If LD indeed has a real toe injury, forget about beating CL, LD would be real stupid to play anyone anyway.

    Likewise, if LCW has a real shoulder pain and WO, I am okay with that. But if LCW throw a WO faking an injury, and I take vacation, fly into Japan, hotel and pay tickets, not only would I cry 'foul' but I would be mighty pissed and scream $#&^@.

    It is easy for us arm chair spectators or web browsers with nothing to lose, except losing sleep, sitting in front of a computer screen, stark naked scratching our balls watching live streaming, anticipating to see a game that turn to dust, and say it is all okay for WO to happen.
    As I have said I would be more happy to watch LCW vs. CL in Japan than LD vs. LCW in the finals. And I would not have paid for travel/ticket ticket just to go watch one game between LD vs. CL anyway. I would guess that LDs motivation to "give" LCW a sparring opportunity was pretty low to begin with, and that LYB probably prefferedd CL to get a good sparring opportunity with LCW.

    It is hard to get "pissed" either way for suspicions and speculation about injuries.

    Some people have said that Taufik has placed bets against himself trough proxies and then earned alot of money by loosing to lower ranked players ths WC and US (Zwiebler) etc. But I honestly hate it with all this unfounded speculations!!!

    If match fixing, doping, team-order etc. can be proved. Then lets have severe punishment to deter things like that.. But unfounded accusations, based on "patterns" or "history" does not lead to anything more than more speculation, discussion, really imop!

    And No I think PG would have been an easier scalp for CL than against LCW in this years JO finals :-)

  16. #849
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    Quote Originally Posted by twobeer View Post
    As I have said I would be more happy to watch LCW vs. CL in Japan than LD vs. LCW in the finals. And I would not have paid for travel/ticket ticket just to go watch one game between LD vs. CL anyway. I would guess that LDs motivation to "give" LCW a sparring opportunity was pretty low to begin with, and that LYB probably prefferedd CL to get a good sparring opportunity with LCW.

    It is hard to get "pissed" either way for suspicions and speculation about injuries.

    Some people have said that Taufik has placed bets against himself trough proxies and then earned alot of money by loosing to lower ranked players ths WC and US (Zwiebler) etc. But I honestly hate it with all this unfounded speculations!!!

    If match fixing, doping, team-order etc. can be proved. Then lets have severe punishment to deter things like that.. But unfounded accusations, based on "patterns" or "history" does not lead to anything more than more speculation, discussion, really imop!

    And No I think PG would have been an easier scalp for CL than against LCW in this years JO finals :-)
    You are in Sweden and I am in Canada. There is no major baddy events in either countries, so unless you and me get of our butt and fly out, you ain't gonna see live events, other than live stream and download.
    BTW, I would not fly to see one game only, that is a big risk cos the players I hope to see may not happen and got KO early. I want to see the whole event from day 1 to end, and with my friends to go along. I feel for those fans who take time to pay to see.
    LYB want CL or CJ to play LCW than LD for sure, especially CJ who needs to get into the top 4. The less LD plays LCW the better to lessen exposure, whereas CL has a poor record against LCW so he needs match practice and gain confidence since being WR3, there is high probability that CL will be in LCW half in OLY12.
    I noted you joined in 2003, before me, what have you been reading all these while? There are quotes from CHN newspaper of LYB openly and proudly admitted he fixed match results, YZH losing to GZC in OLY SF as GZC has better chances of beating Mia, ZM confirmed team order as she has to throw her SF match to ZN in OLY04 as LYB deemed ZN has better chance against MA, and CHN players would play the 1st set all out, the winner would win the match with the loser of the 1st set throwing the 2nd set and so on.
    I always said years ago, there are 2 ways to look at this match fixing. As a fan that pay for the tickets, it really sucks. For you and me sitting at home, with our arse on the chair, butt naked scratching itchy balls watching for free live streaming, it cost us nothing, so who care about match fixing, WO or players putting on a show.
    Now, if I am LYB, my job is to win, bonuses await, there is no BWF rules against match fixing, no way you can prove faking injury, match fixing and WO, and I have all the players like playing cards to manipulate the outcome of a match, you can bet your arse I would do it.
    So much for sportsmanship, and given the same opportunity, INA, MAS, KOR would do the same, except for DEN IMO. So where is the 'severe punishments' as you said, none and business as usual.
    Now this 'injury' and WO and intentionally throwing a game is difficult to prove, that I agree. And gambling and betting is there.

  17. #850
    Regular Member nokh88's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OneToughBirdie View Post
    It is very tough to beat CHN MS and WS players and CHN has done her part in producing world class players. To be and to maintain the top 3 in CHN is a feat in itself, it is ultra competitive environment. Take for instance, a still young BCL 'force' retire, ZL, LL, XXZ (reigning WC cannot defend their WC titles as they are not good enough to make the team and retire), Gong WJ, DPY, WZM, and you name them all plus those gals who 'migrate' out like Xu Huai Wen, PHY, WC, YJ, etc. who go on to play past their 30's in other countries. JYJ alone would give the rest of the world hiccups, yet cannot make CHN team, that tells us how tough it is.

    But if PG or TH gets a WO to final to face CL who also got a WO, that is an even playing field, no one gets any advantage or rest.

    As to your comment that, would PG beat CL if LCW gave him a WO in JO11, that is 50-50 IMO. If LD indeed has a real toe injury, forget about beating CL, LD would be real stupid to play anyone anyway.

    Likewise, if LCW has a real shoulder pain and WO, I am okay with that. But if LCW throw a WO faking an injury, and I take vacation, fly into Japan, hotel and pay tickets, not only would I cry 'foul' but I would be mighty pissed and scream $#&^@.

    It is easy for us arm chair spectators or web browsers with nothing to lose, except losing sleep, sitting in front of a computer screen, stark naked scratching our balls watching live streaming, anticipating to see a game that turn to dust, and say it is all okay for WO to happen.
    Uncle OTB, again, I like the last sentence of your post. You never failed to impress.

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