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  1. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by DinkAlot View Post
    Disclaimer: Panda is no expert in the field of graphite nor racket design and manufacturing.

    Panda just having fun.
    Now you are Fun Master now? Is that kind of Fun you buy in chinese restaurant?

  2. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by silentheart View Post
    Now you are Fun Master now? Is that kind of Fun you buy in chinese restaurant?
    I love chow-fun!

    Panda is an expert on dinking and breaking graphite rackets!

  3. #54
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    Hey Dink, u got an extra prototype for Viper to test?
    I'll be at GG rec center Sunday.

    I'm currently testing the Yonex Nanospeed 9900.

    Quote Originally Posted by DinkAlot View Post
    Disclaimer: Panda is no expert in the field of graphite nor racket design and manufacturing.

    Panda just having fun.

  4. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by kwun View Post
    i was told that Yonex uses at high as M30 for their top of the line rackets.

    the high end Jpsee i received as samples are M40 grade. they claim a M46 grade model is coming soon.

    i wonder how Yonex can be using M30 graphite but at the same time claim it is High Modulus.
    Toray's M series start from M30 to M65J. M46 is usually used in high end racquets. The best grades for racquets are their M55J, M60J and M65J, but these may not be economically viable due to much higher costs.

  5. #56
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    So curious to see the racket design.
    Any pandas picture on the racket

  6. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by taneepak View Post
    I believe these are standard modulus fiber (frame) and medium modulus fibers (shaft). These have great modulus strength (TS) but relatively poor tensile modulus (Youngs modulus or TM)).
    Toray's nomenclature with M and low numbers like 30 to 40 are medium tensile modulus but high tensile strength, with low probably belonging to the standard modulus category. The T means high strength, the larger the number (T1000), but low or medium modulus.
    According to the Toray site, M30 and T1000 are intermediate modulus graphites: http://www.torayusa.com/cfa/intermediatemodulus.html

    You have declared yourself the expert on graphite, can you explain what 40-ton graphite means? So far as I can tell (internet search) it is a term that is only used by badminton racquet companies.

    If I had to guess they are referring to the tensile modulus (even though the units for that are msi meaning millions of pounds per square inch which is about 500 times greater than a ton (2000ish pounds)).

    If so, then the graphites in question are 42.7 msi which would make them relatively high in the badminton world.

    Try to get MJ65J extremely high youngs modulus carbon fiber from Toray directly and then get a manufacturer who is prepared to do some research to use this high-tech fiber. It has extremely high youngs modulus but only so-so tensile strength. Most racquet manufacturers do not buy MJ65 because of very high costs.
    That is very funny! DinkALot posted about a racquet that can take a 40lb string tension and might possibly be strong enough to resist the racquet snapping force of DinkALot's smash. And you suggest that he use an extremely high modulus graphite with, "only so-so tensile strength!"

  7. #58
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    BTW, there are racquets that is rated by the manufacturer to take up to 40lbs.

    http://www.fleetsports.com.tw/02/can...=WOVEN%A8t%A6C

    The Woven Fleet 1000/999/888 in 2U specs are supposed to take the high tension.
    Last edited by teoky; 04-25-2009 at 02:28 AM.

  8. #59
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    My take on racquets is to go for the highest tensile modulus like M65J which has a rather modest tensile strength of 559 ksi. This racquet can be strung upto 36lbs but you will have to take care to avoid clashes, because its high stiffness is relatively brittle.
    Not all fiber manufacturers specs are the same. Toray is by far the most conservative.

  9. #60
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    I don't think any of Toray's M series fibers have a tensile modulus lower than 45 msi. The M30 could be about 45msi, M35J 49.8 msi, and M40 about 57 msi. These would be considered lower grades for really top racquets.
    Some years ago I had about 30 racquets with tapered shaft made by a friend who owns a racquet factory. He claimed he used M60J. Although it played well, I never really believe he actually used M60J.
    Some of the carbon fibers made by other fiber manufacturers claim even much higher specs than Toray's M series, but I have tried some and they are nowhere nearly half as good as Toray's.

  10. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by taneepak View Post
    My take on racquets is to go for the highest tensile modulus like M65J which has a rather modest tensile strength of 559 ksi. This racquet can be strung upto 36lbs but you will have to take care to avoid clashes, because its high stiffness is relatively brittle.
    Or in DinkALot's case, don't smash and don't ever mishit

    Quote Originally Posted by taneepak View Post
    I don't think any of Toray's M series fibers have a tensile modulus lower than 45 msi. The M30 could be about 45msi, M35J 49.8 msi, and M40 about 57 msi. These would be considered lower grades for really top racquets.
    According to the Toray site: http://www.torayusa.com/cfa/intermediatemodulus.html
    M30S is 42.7 msi
    M30G is 42.7 msi

    But who's counting?

    Can you give us an ideal of what kinds of graphite are used in specific top racquets?

  11. #62
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    I don't think Yonex uses carbon fiber grade higher than M40J, based on their ex-factory transfer prices. To use M65J would increase the same price by 7 times, which will not be economically viable.

  12. #63
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    What's the point of super high tension?

    I have a racket that I bought that was supposed to be 25lbs but is actually much higher, and it's like throwing a plank of wood at the shuttle.

    No feel, no massive smash gain over my mates NS9KS strung at 22lbs....what am I missing?

  13. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Easy Tiger View Post
    What's the point of super high tension?

    I have a racket that I bought that was supposed to be 25lbs but is actually much higher, and it's like throwing a plank of wood at the shuttle.

    No feel, no massive smash gain over my mates NS9KS strung at 22lbs....what am I missing?
    You're missing a higher 'racquet head speed'.

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    So it's just for smashes then?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Easy Tiger View Post
    So it's just for smashes then?
    I believe master Oldhand is indicating you need to swing harder to utilize the higher tension 26lbs+ tension on your friends racket. Over the last year ive gone from 22/23 lbs up to about 25 lbs currently. I jumped to 27 and it was stiff as a board. You definitely need a harder swing to use higher tension. This doesnt mean the PPP wont be the racket for you, just not at those tension.

    Dan, any updates on the PPP aka Thunder? How is this run of prototypes compared to the last overspec runs?

  16. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Easy Tiger View Post
    So it's just for smashes then?
    No, it is used in almost all types of strokes. For example, if you are caught with a shot hit deep into your backhand and you just barely manage to reach it without anytime for any leverage from backswing, you just execute a sharp, short snap of the wrist for either a staright net or a cross net drop. There is hardly any movement of the arm and it is deceptive, effortless and very fast. It is also ideal for that quick taps at the net. Low tensions cannot do this with the speed and crispness of high tension.
    Btw, you don't actually hit hard to hit well with high tension. It is the final acceleration of the wrist and hand that is the key. A classic example of this acceleration is a backhand clear where strength is not that important but lightning speed from the snap of the wrist is the key.

  17. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by taneepak View Post
    No, it is used in almost all types of strokes. For example, if you are caught with a shot hit deep into your backhand and you just barely manage to reach it without anytime for any leverage from backswing, you just execute a sharp, short snap of the wrist for either a staright net or a cross net drop. There is hardly any movement of the arm and it is deceptive, effortless and very fast. It is also ideal for that quick taps at the net. Low tensions cannot do this with the speed and crispness of high tension.
    Btw, you don't actually hit hard to hit well with high tension. It is the final acceleration of the wrist and hand that is the key. A classic example of this acceleration is a backhand clear where strength is not that important but lightning speed from the snap of the wrist is the key.
    Couldn't agree more with the highlighted portion.
    taneepak lays it out extremely well

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