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Thread: Canon EOS 7D

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    Quote Originally Posted by eaglehelang View Post
    USD$1,700?!! That's more than MYR5,000, can buy 3 laptops with that $$. <Sigh> Now I remember why I never took up photography as a serious hobby, though studying the angles & all was/still is very interesting.
    Yes, photog is expensive hobby especially the DSLR line..
    USD 1700 seem expensive? wait until start to upgrade lenses (L lenses)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gladius View Post
    As with all hobbies, there are various ways to enjoy a hobby. If there is limited budget, then 'play' it the limited budget way. If there is no budget limit, then the sky is the limit.

    You can always stake out those 'buy and sell' sections in your local photography forums. A (still) very capable camera like the EOS 40D probably can be bought for less US$600 now. A kit lens like the 18-55IS is quite good for most forms of use. And it still takes pictures of quality way exceeding and PnS is capable. By a long way in fact.

    But it must be noted that most of the time with camera equipment, most of us are actually just "lusting" after them rather than 'planning' to buy them...

    Sounds as if we can buy it right away doesn't it ??

    Money doesn't grow on trees unfortunately... ...
    Yes very true... and I still use 30D

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    Quote Originally Posted by ae86trueno View Post
    Yes, photog is expensive hobby especially the DSLR line..
    USD 1700 seem expensive? wait until start to upgrade lenses (L lenses)
    eagleheng must be new to photography.

    the camera body is much cheaper when compare to the lenses. pro bodies are normally to be paired with pro lenses. you may have rugged camera body that is water sealed, dust sealed and able to withstand knocks. there is no point to get a 7D and couple with kit lens. the lens will not survive while you take photos during drizzling weather.

    like me as enthusiast, i did carry EOS1VHS before, it just too troublesome. getting a smaller body and few good lenses now, i can enjoy traveling and taking photos. rather than lugging the 10kgs bag moving around. if you are pro, that means you make living by taking photos, it will be fine. as mostly you will travel alone and shoot photos. more crazy enthusiast will have gang of members to take photos. where as 7D, 50D will a good one to pick. several members with the same intention will take time to snap photos.
    if you go with your boyfriend, he will be there yawning .......

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    Quote Originally Posted by ae86trueno View Post
    Yes very true... and I still use 30D
    30D is good though.
    maybe next year bonus, you may either get 7D or 50D or wait another year, another new DSLR body. changing to FF format, you need to replace half of your current lenses. ouch......
    it is just a tool to take photos, the artistic idea is more important.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eaglehelang View Post
    USD$1,700?!! That's more than MYR5,000, can buy 3 laptops with that $$. <Sigh> Now I remember why I never took up photography as a serious hobby, though studying the angles & all was/still is very interesting.
    It all depends on when you want to buy it. Wait 3 years it may drop to MYR 500. There is a flea market in Hong Kong where you can find some really cheap cameras. There are also many specialist camera shops in Hong Kong that sell older models of dslr for a song. Hong Kong people are always the first to be off the gun for things new at any price.
    Does the 7D have dedicated top quality L lenses without having to use its bigger brother's?

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    Quote Originally Posted by drifit View Post
    30D is good though.
    maybe next year bonus, you may either get 7D or 50D or wait another year, another new DSLR body. changing to FF format, you need to replace half of your current lenses. ouch......
    it is just a tool to take photos, the artistic idea is more important.
    Hopefully.. but I think its next to impossible as I have other priorities.. I actually want a FF so pretty much 5D line.. But its not like critical so I can wait . The only EF-S I have is the kit lens 18-55 mk2 (before the IS version). I try not to buy EF-S lenses (10-22 tempted me though...) because I like landscape, nature etc.. so I held back on EF-S in case I really convert to FF. Most of time I use 24-70 and if I need reach I got 70-200 and TC1.4.

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    Quote Originally Posted by taneepak View Post
    It all depends on when you want to buy it. Wait 3 years it may drop to MYR 500. There is a flea market in Hong Kong where you can find some really cheap cameras. There are also many specialist camera shops in Hong Kong that sell older models of dslr for a song. Hong Kong people are always the first to be off the gun for things new at any price.
    Does the 7D have dedicated top quality L lenses without having to use its bigger brother's?
    7D can take all EF and EF-S lens, its APS-C sensor so the same as xxxxD, xxxD, xxD which is 1.6 crop.

    Only 5D and 1D series cannot take EF-S.

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    Moderator drifit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by taneepak View Post
    It all depends on when you want to buy it. Wait 3 years it may drop to MYR 500. There is a flea market in Hong Kong where you can find some really cheap cameras. There are also many specialist camera shops in Hong Kong that sell older models of dslr for a song. Hong Kong people are always the first to be off the gun for things new at any price.
    Does the 7D have dedicated top quality L lenses without having to use its bigger brother's?
    by early next year, the EOS 1D Mark III will be 3 years old, can you help me get one at RM500 as you come to Malaysia next year. of course i want the working 1D Mark III, not those broken sensor or totally not working. at least 70% condition will be fine. thanks.

    7D doesnt need dedicated lenses. EF-s lenses are more for kit lens, good for enthusiast or beginner.
    great L lenses for 7D;
    1. EF16-35mm F2.8L II USM
    2. EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM
    3. EF 14mm f/2.8L II USM
    4. EF 24mm f/1.4L USM
    5. EF 35mm f/1.4L USM
    6. EF 85mm f/1.2L II USM
    7. EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM II
    8. EF 70-200mm f/4L IS USM
    9. EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS USM
    10. EF 200mm f/2.8L II USM
    11. EF 300mm f/2.8L IS USM
    12. EF 400mm f/2.8L II USM
    13. EF 500mm f4.0L IS USM
    14. EF 600mm f/4L IS USM
    pick few and you will be fine.

    FX or DX format is good for telephoto. getting at 200mm f/2.8 is equivalent buying a 300mm f/2.8 but the price difference will be RM10,000.
    saving that amount is easily can get wide angle lenses to counter.

    one needs to get into or hands-on experience rather than complaining that no good, this no good.
    professional can make living by having D30 + 300mm f/2.8 for wildlife photography. even D30 + 50mm f/2.8 II(costing RM300), also able to take stars photography at night.
    buying Leica S2 + Summarit-S 35mm f/2.5, doesnt mean anyone can take some good photographs.

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    Moderator drifit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ae86trueno View Post
    Hopefully.. but I think its next to impossible as I have other priorities.. I actually want a FF so pretty much 5D line.. But its not like critical so I can wait . The only EF-S I have is the kit lens 18-55 mk2 (before the IS version). I try not to buy EF-S lenses (10-22 tempted me though...) because I like landscape, nature etc.. so I held back on EF-S in case I really convert to FF. Most of time I use 24-70 and if I need reach I got 70-200 and TC1.4.
    arrhhh! the landscaper and nature lover!!
    1. Tamron 17-50mm f/2.8 VR or non-VR
    2. Tamron 70-2000 f/2.8 (nature doesnt need super fast focusing but still need pin sharp images.)
    3. cir-polarizer filter is a MUST for landscaper!!!
    optional EF 14mm f/2.8(USD3,000?)

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    Quote Originally Posted by drifit View Post
    by early next year, the EOS 1D Mark III will be 3 years old, can you help me get one at RM500 as you come to Malaysia next year. of course i want the working 1D Mark III, not those broken sensor or totally not working. at least 70% condition will be fine. thanks.

    7D doesnt need dedicated lenses. EF-s lenses are more for kit lens, good for enthusiast or beginner.
    great L lenses for 7D;
    1. EF16-35mm F2.8L II USM
    2. EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM
    3. EF 14mm f/2.8L II USM
    4. EF 24mm f/1.4L USM
    5. EF 35mm f/1.4L USM
    6. EF 85mm f/1.2L II USM
    7. EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM II
    8. EF 70-200mm f/4L IS USM
    9. EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6L IS USM
    10. EF 200mm f/2.8L II USM
    11. EF 300mm f/2.8L IS USM
    12. EF 400mm f/2.8L II USM
    13. EF 500mm f4.0L IS USM
    14. EF 600mm f/4L IS USM
    pick few and you will be fine.

    FX or DX format is good for telephoto. getting at 200mm f/2.8 is equivalent buying a 300mm f/2.8 but the price difference will be RM10,000.
    saving that amount is easily can get wide angle lenses to counter.

    one needs to get into or hands-on experience rather than complaining that no good, this no good.
    professional can make living by having D30 + 300mm f/2.8 for wildlife photography. even D30 + 50mm f/2.8 II(costing RM300), also able to take stars photography at night.
    buying Leica S2 + Summarit-S 35mm f/2.5, doesnt mean anyone can take some good photographs.
    I am talking about the 7D, a body with pretensions to a high quality camera and using a magnesium alloy body, but with no dedicated L lenses. All the lenses mentioned above are not sized for the 7D-more a marketing ploy to lure you to use their F/F legacy L lenses. If only they came out with dedicated L lenses for this body, which will also have a welcome bonus of having lenses that are faster and less massive. A dedicated 7D EF-S L 200mm f/2.0 lens will be lighter and smaller than the EF L lens 200mm f/2.8. Why, oh why, do you have to use big brother's L lenses when a dedicated L lens can extend your reach photographically.
    Instead, one brilliant idea of a high quality body is being let down without another matching brilliant idea of dedicated high quality lenses (for the format) that are not only smaller but would also be faster.
    Legacy F/F L lenses let in unwanted light into a smaller EOS 7D body. Even the best of care to minimize glare from such unwanted light can do such much. Isn't it better to cure the source of this problem by coming out with dedicated L lenses for this format? Why throw in rubbish and then try to clean it up when a more simple and more effective solution is prevent any such rubbish from being thrown in?
    Time will tell if a 3-year old 7D body can be had for one tenth its original value. I think it will be easy. But then would you want to buy one, when by then there will be so many goodies coming on stream?

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    Quote Originally Posted by taneepak View Post
    I am talking about the 7D, a body with pretensions to a high quality camera and using a magnesium alloy body, but with no dedicated L lenses. All the lenses mentioned above are not sized for the 7D-more a marketing ploy to lure you to use their F/F legacy L lenses. If only they came out with dedicated L lenses for this body, which will also have a welcome bonus of having lenses that are faster and less massive. A dedicated 7D EF-S L 200mm f/2.0 lens will be lighter and smaller than the EF L lens 200mm f/2.8. Why, oh why, do you have to use big brother's L lenses when a dedicated L lens can extend your reach photographically.
    Instead, one brilliant idea of a high quality body is being let down without another matching brilliant idea of dedicated high quality lenses (for the format) that are not only smaller but would also be faster.
    Legacy F/F L lenses let in unwanted light into a smaller EOS 7D body. Even the best of care to minimize glare from such unwanted light can do such much. Isn't it better to cure the source of this problem by coming out with dedicated L lenses for this format? Why throw in rubbish and then try to clean it up when a more simple and more effective solution is prevent any such rubbish from being thrown in?
    Time will tell if a 3-year old 7D body can be had for one tenth its original value. I think it will be easy. But then would you want to buy one, when by then there will be so many goodies coming on stream?
    affordable is the answer.
    why no need dedicated? is to reduce cost.

    dedicated lense of 7-12mm(if i recall correctly the range, new release) costing at GBP1,000 which is RM6000. the quality for not even Canon's lowest quality of L lense.
    yes, there are some people will only drive Rolls-Royce and say BMW is a crap car. what happened to Rolls-Royce then?
    can above average enthusiast spend USD2000 and get leica S2 + dedicated lense? which mean that i can only dream EOS 1D Mark III at RM500.

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    Quote Originally Posted by drifit View Post
    affordable is the answer.
    why no need dedicated? is to reduce cost.

    dedicated lense of 7-12mm(if i recall correctly the range, new release) costing at GBP1,000 which is RM6000. the quality for not even Canon's lowest quality of L lense.
    yes, there are some people will only drive Rolls-Royce and say BMW is a crap car. what happened to Rolls-Royce then?
    can above average enthusiast spend USD2000 and get leica S2 + dedicated lense? which mean that i can only dream EOS 1D Mark III at RM500.
    I think you misunderstand me. What I am saying is that the EOS 7D has no dedicated high quality L class lenses as of today. The EF-S 7-12mm is not listed and even if it is listed is still not a dedicated L lens but a lens of less stellar performance than L lenses. It is like having a Mercedes S320 with an old Austin engine of the 1960s, leaving you with the more expensive ill-fitting S600 engine as an option. It is not horses for courses. Canon should do what they say and that is to come out with L lenses for the 7D format instead of having a half-baked quality product. It is like replacing a jockey with one that is twice as fat and twice as fat.

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    Quote Originally Posted by taneepak View Post
    ...
    A dedicated 7D EF-S L 200mm f/2.0 lens will be lighter and smaller than the EF L lens 200mm f/2.8. Why, oh why, do you have to use big brother's L lenses when a dedicated L lens can extend your reach photographically.
    ...
    Legacy F/F L lenses let in unwanted light into a smaller EOS 7D body. Even the best of care to minimize glare from such unwanted light can do such much.
    ...
    2 arguements I do not get..

    A 200mm/2.8 in FF vs a 200mm/2.0 in APS-C, the latter is almost always heavier. No solid example in the 200mm world but 300mm is quite common FL. The Olympus 300/2.8 weighs in a 3.2kg (4/3 format). Nikon and Canon's FF 300/2.8 weighs in 2.85kg and 2.55kg. 1 stop less, Nikon and Canon's FF 300/4 are 1.44kg and 1.2kg respectively. Very unlikely for Olympus did not "optimise" their 300/2.8 to the 4/3 format. Is there any evidence to suggest otherwise?

    "Unwanted" light always enters your light box. Most lenses cast an image circle that is at least as big as the sensor size. This happened in the film Leicas, to the 1DS to the phone camera. Further, the size of the image circle varies depending on focusing distance. This hasn't been a problem for ages since the light box is black matt. Why do you think an extra large image circle poses a problem now?

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    Quote Originally Posted by taneepak View Post
    It is like having a Mercedes S320 with an old Austin engine of the 1960s, leaving you with the more expensive ill-fitting S600 engine as an option. It is not horses for courses.
    Bad example. The S200, S320 and S600's do differ in the engine and I'm sure you do know that most cars reuses engines even from other brands. So which horse for which course?

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    Quote Originally Posted by drifit View Post
    arrhhh! the landscaper and nature lover!!

    2. Tamron 70-2000 f/2.8 (nature doesnt need super fast focusing but still need pin sharp images.)
    I'd like to test this lens

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    Quote Originally Posted by weeyeh View Post
    2 arguements I do not get..

    A 200mm/2.8 in FF vs a 200mm/2.0 in APS-C, the latter is almost always heavier. No solid example in the 200mm world but 300mm is quite common FL. The Olympus 300/2.8 weighs in a 3.2kg (4/3 format). Nikon and Canon's FF 300/2.8 weighs in 2.85kg and 2.55kg. 1 stop less, Nikon and Canon's FF 300/4 are 1.44kg and 1.2kg respectively. Very unlikely for Olympus did not "optimise" their 300/2.8 to the 4/3 format. Is there any evidence to suggest otherwise?

    "Unwanted" light always enters your light box. Most lenses cast an image circle that is at least as big as the sensor size. This happened in the film Leicas, to the 1DS to the phone camera. Further, the size of the image circle varies depending on focusing distance. This hasn't been a problem for ages since the light box is black matt. Why do you think an extra large image circle poses a problem now?
    Let us say you consider three different Canon camera sizes, the F/F, the APS-C, and the P&S. Designing a lens of the same focal length, the same lens speed, with the same quality in optics and mechanical construction, it is obvious which lens will be larger and heavier. With this it should be possible to increase the APS-C' lens speed by one stop and still keep it smaller and lighter than the same lens on the F/F. Lens size is also dependent on the sensor size. However, if a lens on a F/F is lighter than another lens of the same focal length and speed on an APS-C, then we are not comparing apples with apples. Cheap lens use more plastics and cheap optics that are light, contributing to its light weight. Do you know why Canon's L lenses and almost all Leica lenses are very heavy? The same applies to Olympus' very high quality fast lenses made for their 4/3 cameras.
    Of course unwanted light reflects bad lens design. No lens designer will design a lens specifically for more than one format. I have experimented with this-using Hasselblad Zeiss lenses on the Leica-and they were easily out-gunned by their little 35mm Leican M lenses. On the Leica M body this was easy to test. You hust mount a frosted pc of plate glass on the film plane, focus at colour test charts on the wall, and then use a 50 x magnifier to examine the frosted glass. No need to take pictures or to depend on the recording medium. It is strictly putting optics to the test, without any other inputs from sensors, films, shutter, camera shake, etc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by drifit View Post
    arrhhh! the landscaper and nature lover!!
    1. Tamron 17-50mm f/2.8 VR or non-VR
    2. Tamron 70-2000 f/2.8 (nature doesnt need super fast focusing but still need pin sharp images.)
    3. cir-polarizer filter is a MUST for landscaper!!!
    optional EF 14mm f/2.8(USD3,000?)
    yeah.. the 24 with 1.6 quite a few times is not wide enough for landscape well it still can be fix by stitching but giving me hassle..
    70-2000 2.8 wow.. it must be bigger than rocket launcher or even cannon. or do you mean 70-200? i use 70-200 2.8 IS though.
    yep I do have CPL as well and .3 & .6 cokin gradient.
    EF 14.. at the moment if I buy one of those.. I will get killed instantly by my other half

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