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  1. #103
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    It may not be about the number of cross strings at the bottom but do you see the tapered frames of an iso and an ARC Z, the former on the top and the latter at the bottom? The total frame or stringbed area of the ARC Z may even be larger but it plays faster than an iso Cab 20. Reducing air resistance at strategic places to suit the late acceleration of badminton shots, that is provided you know the technique of using late acceleration, will pay rich dividends.

  2. #104
    Regular Member pBmMalaysia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by taneepak View Post
    It may not be about the number of cross strings at the bottom but do you see the tapered frames of an iso and an ARC Z, the former on the top and the latter at the bottom? The total frame or stringbed area of the ARC Z may even be larger but it plays faster than an iso Cab 20. Reducing air resistance at strategic places to suit the late acceleration of badminton shots, that is provided you know the technique of using late acceleration, will pay rich dividends.
    some buy that while some don't, guess you have to figure it out how to prove your point. i know you tried your best

    it will solve the problem if lin dan's stringer, in a hurry, forgot to put the last cross string in his racket...

  3. #105
    Regular Member Blitzzards's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pBmMalaysia View Post
    It will solve the problem if lin dan's stringer, in a hurry, forgot to put the last cross string in his racket...
    If you want to put it that way then:

    Quote Originally Posted by Smichz View Post
    Notice the one additional cross string right near the top of the frame. It doesn't tell us anything does it? Whether Lin Dan specifically requested for it or the official stringer on spot did it for a specific reason is up to speculation. Even if either case someone knows that adding one additional cross string onto the string bed has some benefits. We have yet to prove that the omitting of one cross string has much if any benefit yet major competition play.

    FYI Lin Dan won the AE2006 by beating Lee Hyun Il with this particular racquet.

  4. #106
    Regular Member pBmMalaysia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blitzzards View Post
    If you want to put it that way then:

    Notice the one additional cross string right near the top of the frame. It doesn't tell us anything does it? Whether Lin Dan specifically requested for it or the official stringer on spot did it for a specific reason is up to speculation. Even if either case someone knows that adding one additional cross string onto the string bed has some benefits. We have yet to prove that the omitting of one cross string has much if any benefit yet major competition play.

    FYI Lin Dan won the AE2006 by beating Lee Hyun Il with this particular racquet.
    then you solve part of the problem! and the other part of the problem is getting the rest here to buy that!

  5. #107
    Regular Member Blitzzards's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pBmMalaysia View Post
    then you solve part of the problem! and the other part of the problem is getting the rest here to buy that!
    Quote Originally Posted by Blitzzards View Post
    It doesn't tell us anything does it?
    I don't like repeating myself

  6. #108
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    It tells us from the picture that LD wants to hit the shuttle at the top of the frame sometimes and not just the sweetest spot of them all for all the reasons not intended for public discussions, probably!

    So adding one more at the top or at the bottom and even skipping whereever, if, at the end of the day, it happens to be LD, LCW or TH doing that kind of string pattern, then it wouldn't matter, does it? But since we are mere enthusiasts or not at their caliber of play, we tend to be more keen on discussing the pros and cons these pros never gave a hoot? So what gives for all the logs here?

  7. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by pBmMalaysia View Post
    even more interesting...from a tennis comparison..
    Yup, a tennis comparison (but claims to be a badminton stringer first and foremost), from a guy who supposedly got tons and tons of stringjobs under his belt who likes to flaunt his stringing prowess but is a snob when ask as per client's request a certain pattern or tension variation because the guy wants to impose his skills and seems to know better and doesn't give a damn because he thinks he is superior to the guy needing a stringjob and charges extra if the client insisted.

  8. #110
    Regular Member pBmMalaysia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrayDark View Post
    Yup, a tennis comparison (but claims to be a badminton stringer first and foremost), from a guy who supposedly got tons and tons of stringjobs under his belt who likes to flaunt his stringing prowess but is a snob when ask as per client's request a certain pattern or tension variation because the guy wants to impose his skills and seems to know better and doesn't give a damn because he thinks he is superior to the guy needing a stringjob and charges extra if the client insisted.
    thats what we call businessmen..

  9. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by GrayDark View Post
    Yup, a tennis comparison (but claims to be a badminton stringer first and foremost), from a guy who supposedly got tons and tons of stringjobs under his belt who likes to flaunt his stringing prowess but is a snob when ask as per client's request a certain pattern or tension variation because the guy wants to impose his skills and seems to know better and doesn't give a damn because he thinks he is superior to the guy needing a stringjob and charges extra if the client insisted.
    Hi
    please tell us what you are drinking. I will suggest most people to stay away. Because you are just making no sense at all...

    And don't worry, this is only reply to your post. Have a nice life.

  10. #112
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    I think graydark is just another one of his new alias because he got banned before.

  11. #113
    Regular Member pBmMalaysia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cooler View Post
    I think graydark is just another one of his new alias because he got banned before.
    i was waiting to see what's he's got with his tennis stuff until you came along with that..

  12. #114
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    Most yonex racket is 22 main and 22 cross, The starts at top 7 ends and bottom 9.
    Most non yonex racket( victor, head, blackknight) is 22 main and 23 cross. They finish at Bottm 8.
    Some new Yonex (ARC10, ARC9, ARC7) is 22 main 21 cross, They starts a top 8 end and bottom 9.

    The is common for Chinese team to add extra cross at top. So their yonex usually starts at top 6, and end at bottom 9. It become 22 main 23 cross.

    It is only could be done at two point machine, and impossible on most 6 point mahine. Because the top cross would be too close to frame, The middle beam on 6 point machine just too thick for that to happen. It is in the way of that extra cross. Even on two point machine , extra cross is difficult to do. Some racket has a small single pass grommet at top 6 make it also impossible.

    One thing most experience stringer agree, best playable racket is string form top to bottom, so the top part for the racket is tigher than the bottom part. It makes sense, since when you do a smash the top part has higher speed than bottom part of racket. The faster the racket speed , the higher the string tension. That is why most pro prefer high tension, and usually wouldn't work for most player, average player just can't wipe the racket as fast as pro. Add extra cross would provide more support and higher the tension and you could raise you hitting point on the racket.


    But we also know , string from bottom up is safer( which is recommanded by Yonex).

    So at extra cross on bottom is not something new, It is just a standard for non yonex racket.











    Quote Originally Posted by Blitzzards View Post
    I have been analysing our Alan Kakinami's technique of adding one extra cross string at bottom 8, which he says gives an overall stiffer feel for the whole string bed.

    What I really like about this pattern is that IMHO I'm hoping to be able to apply that to an overall less tensioned racquet string bed to sort of simulate an overall higher tension feel so that I can actually protect the racquet frame from unnecesary high tension stress while still be able to play with high tensions.

    I'm thinking of this as I have been using tensions of 30lbs plus sometime ago but then dropped down to 27-28lbs to protect my racquets but recently felt that I'm not able to get enough feel and repulsion from the string bed to my satisfactory as I could when I used 30lbs plus. I recently also cut the strings on my AT900P and found that one grommet at the bottom has sunk in very slightly, and that racquet had only been strung to 28lbs tension once, ever since I bought it brand new (I wouldn't want to think what 30lbs would do to it lol). One of my friends advised me that for his case, he would actually rather risk racquet damage then to limit himself to playing less tension that he is used to (which is about 30-32lbs plus), but I think that is a bit extreme.

    So the important thing that I want to inquire here is, if I add an extra cross at bottom 8, will the grommet there (which may not exactly be designed for shared strings, from my humble experience) be able to withstand both the lateral and horizontal (meaning both way) tension stress of the stringing?







    I also propose to tie the main tie offs at bottom 7 rather than tie them at bottom 9 or bottom 8. What do you more experienced stringers think?
    Last edited by Tim1456; 02-22-2010 at 02:50 PM.

  13. #115
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    Good summarization there, Tim1456!

  14. #116
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    there are many ways to have tighter top feel without doing TD.

    If taneepak likes less air resistance, he should be recommending 1 less cross at the top since 1 less top cross is more meaningful than 1 less bottom cross. As noted, chinese team 'add' one more top cross. This debunks taneepak's claim that removing 1 or 2 bottom cross will give u practical advantage in speed gain.
    Last edited by cooler; 02-22-2010 at 03:33 PM.

  15. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by cooler View Post
    there are many ways to have tighter top feel without doing TD.

    If taneepak likes less air resistance, he should be recommending 1 less cross at the top since 1 less top cross is more meaningful than 1 less bottom cross. As noted, chinese team 'add' one more top cross. This debunks taneepak's claim that removing 1 or 2 bottom cross will give u practical advantage in speed gain.
    Cooler, please do not make false claims on my behalf. I have never said that one missing cross string at the top will reduce air resistance in any meaningful sense. It works only on or at around the T-joint or throat area-in other words the bottom part, not at the top. In addition I replace all U-shaped paired grommets at the T-joint with small single grommets to reduce air resistance too.
    One more cross string at the top will not significantly affect air resistance as the velocity at the tip is so much greater. That extra top string is there to ensure any mishit at the top will not snap the string. Players tend to hit the top part of the racquet than the bottom part, hence any mishit at the bottom is more unlikely.

  16. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by taneepak View Post
    Cooler, please do not make false claims on my behalf. I have never said that one missing cross string at the top will reduce air resistance in any meaningful sense. It works only on or at around the T-joint or throat area-in other words the bottom part, not at the top. In addition I replace all U-shaped paired grommets at the T-joint with small single grommets to reduce air resistance too.
    One more cross string at the top will not significantly affect air resistance as the velocity at the tip is so much greater. That extra top string is there to ensure any mishit at the top will not snap the string. Players tend to hit the top part of the racquet than the bottom part, hence any mishit at the bottom is more unlikely.
    So given the string has same gauge. The additional top string on the top should have approximate same air resistance index as the string near the throat. If that is the case, the top string will produce more resistance to the racquet head speed because 1) It is near the top. So the leverage will produce more resisatnce force. 2) The speed is faster as you mention. So the resistance force will be greater because the force=speed*resistance index (just a simple formula for some one has no idea in physic) Master Cooler is not claiming anything you did not say in your post.

  17. #119
    Regular Member Blitzzards's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by silentheart View Post
    So given the string has same gauge. The additional top string on the top should have approximate same air resistance index as the string near the throat. If that is the case, the top string will produce more resistance to the racquet head speed because 1) It is near the top. So the leverage will produce more resisatnce force. 2) The speed is faster as you mention. So the resistance force will be greater because the force=speed*resistance index (just a simple formula for some one has no idea in physic) Master Cooler is not claiming anything you did not say in your post.
    Agree totally on this simple physics fact; the faster an object is moving, the more resistance force it will have restricting its movement forward, no matter how small the restriction area is. Although actually the faster the speed of movement the more serious the resistance force will be even if the surface area remains the same.

    So to summarise (for all), the extra cross string will have much more effect on swing speed due to resistance if it is placed at the top rather than at the bottom as claimed, if the extra cross string actually does increase resistance surface area in the first place anyway.

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