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Thread: BAM news

  1. #154
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    Have you heard of Alex Ferguson, the chief coach of MU? Now, do you think any bosses would dare tell him what to do? Or for that matter, any of his players? When David Beckham got too much publicity from his wife's fame, Ferguson simply dumped him off to Real Madrid because he said that David has lost focus to the entertainment world which distracted his soccer.
    This is the standard and yardstick we want to judge our badminton coaches. Now tell me, do we have anyone coming even close to this level? Obviously not, as most have for good reasons lost the players' respect. When you cry and bitch like a crying baby and displays such immaturity, how do you expect your charges to respect you? Most want to "carry balls" with their bosses to secure their regular pay cheque.

  2. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by limsy View Post
    so?
    he is a businessman,like lyb
    but do he manage bam well?
    no
    because he dont know badminton and lyb know
    thats the different
    management expertise is everywhere in malaysia,how special is him?

    he dont even know who is the coach for state ba
    the connection is not there
    if the bam president is good enough
    he will tell state ba what should been teach by the state coach to those youngster,hence,we wont have any shortage or lack of talentin any department
    state ba,bjss and bam now work as if they are a separate organization and this is funny
    lol
    I don't share your concern as I have had some experience in this area.
    I am no mechanical or chemical or engineer but I was at one time put in charge of them as well as to head a company. I also have had no knowledge of computing sciences and telecommunications but was asked to take charge and to clean up the mess in a later assignment. This happened many years ago in a multi-national company.
    But I was not in the least awed by them and managed to clean up the mess and brought the comapany back to health. From working against me at the beginning at the end at least I earned their respect at the end and even became feared by some too.
    The key is problem solving ability and taking corrective actions. Technical expertise can be sourced

  3. #156
    Regular Member Bbn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by limsy View Post
    so?
    he is a businessman,like lyb
    but do he manage bam well?
    no
    because he dont know badminton and lyb know
    thats the different
    management expertise is everywhere in malaysia,how special is him?

    he dont even know who is the coach for state ba
    the connection is not there
    if the bam president is good enough
    he will tell state ba what should been teach by the state coach to those youngster,hence,we wont have any shortage or lack of talentin any department
    state ba,bjss and bam now work as if they are a separate organization and this is funny
    lol
    It sure helps nowadays if the chief is someone thru the mill and has a little technical knowledge.The chinese have a traditional sayong "Zhi Sang Dan Ping"the ancient story of a scholar who tried to head an army and failed.
    It also depends on the activity , to ask an accountant to head an army may not work, also to ask an army officer to head a Creative Agency may not work, it depends on the "Culture" of the organisation, mechanistic,organic, creative etc.
    Read the works of Mintzberg to understand all these modern concepts.its all about the cart and the horse and putting your money where your mouth is.
    Anyway it would be difficult to find in Msia a player with management and corporate skills , they are all not well educated and seldom continue to develop in education and qualifications.
    Besides being able to see the big picture learning also means to see the situation and case we are talking about, on a case by case basis, not the old"one size fits all concept".,that would be like asking to take aspirin to cure everything.
    That must be the sickness of many institutions, the ability to learn, re-invent , innovate, analyse a situation, a lot of the people just rely on past experience to solve current tasks. I wonder how effective a person can be when he was making cars 10 years ago that are standard products that have no innovation, and product development, probably all reflected in the products, standard player, standard coach all brought up from experience with no continuous development, re-education etc etc.
    Its probably alright if his bosses don't want any change ,just standardising the procedures, making enforcing rules, benchmarks, etc keep old alliances etc, probably not acceptable to people who want to see change and development.
    People in Malaysia nowadays simply want more transperancy and benchmarks , a lot of organisations are still in the command or army mode perhaps by necessity, Maybe we can learn from more advanced countries, not badminton but about re-inventing organisations for more effectiveness. We would all still be living in caves, if we do not keep up with change.
    Last edited by Bbn; 05-31-2010 at 02:16 AM.

  4. #157
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    Wow interesting concept about the chief not needing to have any technical skills to run an organisation.

    Must be a very low tech industry.

    Imagine registering oneself in a Private Hospital where the decision makers are accountants more concerned in making money and not knowing anything about health-care, or enrolling in a University where the Administrators know nothing about education and research and are just interested in the bottom line.
    The CEO of Taylor's was asked about his involvement in Education to which he replied " I am in the education business and not in the business of education".Horse before cart or cart before horse?
    Its probably ok in traditional sectors, like fast food, but where technology is involved some measure of technical knowledge is essential,in order that the product or service can be further developed to meet competition. That's where a lot of continuous learning and development and re-training re-education is required . In transforming a country it is necessary to study all aspects of an organisation to improve it, if that is the mission.
    We cant be like the Kempitai and threaten to shoot doctors and professors if they are not obedient, or badminton stars for eg.

  5. #158
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    Public / fans do not reject BAM management for they are not badminton people. If so, this would happen 10 years ago. Malaysia fared badly in major tournaments these few years. Yes, we call 'barely go to finals' as bad achievements. This priorly the main reason for this.

    We want another Lee Chong Wei. Forget that. We want a Lin Dan in Malaysia. Is it too big for a hope? Maybe yes. There is no other way to do this. The first thing to do is to acknowledge what we do wrong and start hitting the right button. Please look into the actual problem and don't always get the coaches and players the boot for the failure. Yes, to admit the wrongdoings or shortcoming in our system is good start, fairly enough.

  6. #159
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    lol
    how much honor SAF bring to mu?
    and u want to compare our president with him?
    i think u are insulting SAR
    lyb is in the same league with SAF
    our president?
    fine joke
    lol

  7. #160
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    Look, badminton is a zero sum game. If you are number one it is at the expense of others. If you fail to be no. 1 and start looking for others to blame, then the problem may be in your own head.
    What more do you want? Malaysia have the no. 1 rank MS and MD. It has won the AE singles MS twice in the last decade. It has won an Olympics MS silver medal. It has for most of the time entered theTC semi-finals, itself no mean achievement. However, it has not won the TC for the last 18 years. Neither has Korea or Denmark ever won the TC even once.

    So, be realistic chaps. I say this same thing to the Malaysian press too. Stop over-rating yourself. It is this over-rating of itself that is Malaysia's greatest weakness, because it is not based on any hard, logical, and sound basis. If the fans and the press behave like emotional mobs then this is a serious problem.
    Case in point is the demonstration by a group of NGOs. What a silly and misguided application of so called good intent. It doesn't take a genius to see through this as silly or being instigated by some other party. If any of you are contibutors to these NGOs financially you may want to question where all your contributions go.

  8. #161
    Regular Member ctjcad's Avatar
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    ...............

  9. #162
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    are we talking about the failure of tuc 2010?
    lol
    even the river near my place are not shallow as that
    we are talking about bam problem since 2008(atleast for me when i start to know what happen inside)
    i have been keep mentioning since long time ago
    since people start to pay attention to this issue
    i just try to tell more
    any problem?
    am i the one who say why lcw always lost to lindan?
    am i the one who say koo/tan lost to opponnt because of fat,skinny,making fun,fancy and bla bla bla?
    lol

    this is funny when people comment as if they know the point
    its ok
    i rest my case
    wont comment further

    if not
    someone will say we overate ourself
    keep demanding
    and bla bla bla
    will not visit this thread and bam in mess thread anymore
    tata

  10. #163
    Regular Member pBmMalaysia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by limsy View Post
    he dont even know who is the coach for state ba
    the connection is not there
    if the bam president is good enough
    he will tell state ba what should been teach by the state coach to those youngster,hence,we wont have any shortage or lack of talentin any department
    state ba,bjss and bam now work as if they are a separate organization and this is funny
    lol
    the future of malaysian players start from the bottom with the state ba, true if those players are really the products of the state ba. but if one takes a closer look they may not all come from there, in a lot of state these players comes from private coaches and if there are not these coaches (from state ba and private) who love badminton so much, who go out, scout and hunt for talented kids to start off, there won't be any good ones for bjss to pick. and one can imagine the outcome of the next generation of players...

    what bam should consider, giving incentives to development coaches inside state ba or private coaches but through the state ba to produce potential players not just winning results but take into consideration of using sports science. there has been a lot said on this than done. what kind of physique and development skills do we look at for a start or only just their winnings?

    not to mention the salaries/allowance gap between the state ba and national coaches and how do they monitor each state ba coaches performance? a cable?

    does bam knows all of this especially the president? i don't think so

  11. #164
    Regular Member Bbn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by limsy View Post
    are we talking about the failure of tuc 2010?
    lol
    even the river near my place are not shallow as that
    we are talking about bam problem since 2008(atleast for me when i start to know what happen inside)
    i have been keep mentioning since long time ago
    since people start to pay attention to this issue
    i just try to tell more
    any problem?
    am i the one who say why lcw always lost to lindan?
    am i the one who say koo/tan lost to opponnt because of fat,skinny,making fun,fancy and bla bla bla?
    lol

    this is funny when people comment as if they know the point
    its ok
    i rest my case
    wont comment further

    if not
    someone will say we overate ourself
    keep demanding
    and bla bla bla
    will not visit this thread and bam in mess thread anymore
    tata
    Indeed, most of us here are not condeming the players etc etc, we are discussing how to develop talent
    and further developing the game to keep up and not fall behind. Of course we are not doing too badly,
    but that may not be true in future.A doctor examining a sick patient just has to take a holistic view of a problem so
    as not to create new problems.Limsy like all the younger generation want to see a better society, they are not like their
    grandparents always benchmarking with the past it is their world so to speak.
    And we can help by providing more positive and optimistic leads.Anyway, we keep on going round and round, I suggest Limsy start activating the ignore button.

  12. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by pBmMalaysia View Post
    the future of malaysian players start from the bottom with the state ba, true if those players are really the products of the state ba. but if one takes a closer look they may not all come from there, in a lot of state these players comes from private coaches and if there are not these coaches (from state ba and private) who love badminton so much, who go out, scout and hunt for talented kids to start off, there won't be any good ones for bjss to pick. and one can imagine the outcome of the next generation of players...

    what bam should consider, giving incentives to development coaches inside state ba or private coaches but through the state ba to produce potential players not just winning results but take into consideration of using sports science. there has been a lot said on this than done. what kind of physique and development skills do we look at for a start or only just their winnings?

    not to mention the salaries/allowance gap between the state ba and national coaches and how do they monitor each state ba coaches performance? a cable?

    does bam knows all of this especially the president? i don't think so
    private coach should be co-operate with state ba and not directly connected to bam as that would create some conflict between state ba and private coach when dealing with bam
    so
    my structure for malaysia badminton would be

    --------------------------------bam
    --________________________l_______________________
    --l----------------------------------------------------------------- l
    bjss <---------------------provide talent----------------------state ba
    --l ______________________________________________l
    --_______________________l________________________
    --l----------------------------------------------------------------- l
    club(for both under 19 and above 19)--------------- private coach(under-19)
    --l______________________________________________ l
    --------------------------------l
    -----------------------------school

    i skipped mssd,mssn,mssm and those tournament
    i show this for just a brief ideal for what i mean/thinking of

    now
    bam only connected with bjss(not well connnected also)
    to have a better future
    bam need to work together with state ba,club and private coach
    the grass root is the school(which player get send to mssd and etc)
    bam should have a guideline on what they want,what they lack,what is the ideal
    a fully understanding squad from the grass root to bam
    they will have a long term planing for let say atleast 20 years without any worried

    bjss is doing their job by producing many good player since the pilot project start from 2007(credit to bjss coach for training and state ba/private coach for spotting)
    we had 4 wjc title,4 ajc title since then(not to mention tons of silver and bronze)
    how many wc did bam had?non
    why?
    we have talent,but policy killed them
    they should change,not blame.
    dont start to looking for water after ur house is burning
    store ur water and beware of fire is a wiser choice

    of course every section is a long story to explain
    this is only the brief ideal

    Quote Originally Posted by Bbn View Post
    Indeed, most of us here are not condeming the players etc etc, we are discussing how to develop talent
    and further developing the game to keep up and not fall behind. Of course we are not doing too badly,
    but that may not be true in future.A doctor examining a sick patient just has to take a holistic view of a problem so
    as not to create new problems.Limsy like all the younger generation want to see a better society, they are not like their
    grandparents always benchmarking with the past it is their world so to speak.
    And we can help by providing more positive and optimistic leads.Anyway, we keep on going round and round, I suggest Limsy start activating the ignore button.
    well
    its ok
    i should just stop answering those that didnt get my point
    Last edited by limsy; 05-31-2010 at 07:39 AM.

  13. #166
    Regular Member pBmMalaysia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by limsy View Post
    private coach should be co-operate with state ba and not directly connected to bam as that would create some conflict between state ba and private coach when dealing with bam
    what about the case of private coaches who can't get along with state ba, am sure there are a few and possibly these could mean also a few future potential player been left out? no doubt it has to be through the state ba to the private coach but there must be some kind of monitoring or link!
    one example and i won't mention the state and this has been happening some time already:
    state ba 1st policy all players winning respective aged group in their state junior will be selected to undergo training at their center and receive full privilege. failing to attend will only be allowed to play doubles! actually this happen in the 100plus junior gp final last week!

    another example also no state name given, if the private center players can beat up all the state ba players, will the state ba still, willingly send them to national level tournament including their private coach? and if it involve centralized training what would happen. sending the players to be trained by the state ba coach whose players all lost to them? sound rather funny, isn't it and this has been happening in a number of state!

    i can still go on but you tell me whether these private coaches should get some kind of link to bam as what the sukan teras was for?
    Last edited by pBmMalaysia; 05-31-2010 at 08:30 AM.

  14. #167
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    Quote Originally Posted by pBmMalaysia View Post
    what about the case of private coaches who can't get along with state ba, am sure there are a few and possibly these could mean also a few future potential player been left out? no doubt it has to be through the state ba to the private coach but there must be some kind of monitoring or link!
    one example and i won't mention the state and this has been happening some time already:
    state ba 1st policy all players winning respective aged group in their state junior will be selected to undergo training at their center and receive full privilege. failing to attend will only be allowed to play doubles! actually this happen in the 100plus junior gp final last week!(1st)

    another example also no state name given, if the private center players can beat up all the state ba players, will the state ba still, willingly send them to national level tournament including their private coach? and if it involve centralized training what would happen. sending the players to be trained by the state ba coach whose players all lost to them? sound rather funny, isn't it and this has been happening in a number of state!(2nd)

    i can still go on but you tell me whether these private coaches should get some kind of link to bam as what the sukan teras was for?(3rd)
    overall
    yes
    i know the situation
    that's why
    bam need to have a clear policy to every state ba and to private coach
    i sure bam have no clear policy for this issue
    even they does,surely they didnt enforce it


    to me,
    each and every state should send their best player to play in national tournament,regardless coach by state ba or private coach
    we want the best player,not only the player coach by state ba
    this is just as same as in bam where some player wont get kick out due to their special identity
    the 1st clear point of view is,regardless race or identity,if the player is the best in state by beating each and everyone else,they should get send to national tournament.
    if i am the president of one of the state ba,of course i can do whatever i want to gain the most advantage i can,be it money,power or fame
    no one is guiding me,i only need to report to my own state council for fund.
    bam should start to set guild line to prevent this kind of issue happen again.
    that's my point of view in previous post.

    in fact,this happen for years
    i know some player who is pretty good but quite badminton because state ba coach their own player only and not the best player

  15. #168
    Regular Member ctjcad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by limsy View Post
    ...
    its ok
    i rest my case
    wont comment further

    ...
    will not visit this thread and bam in mess thread anymore
    tata
    ..i must say, that's like the quickest "tata" i've seen..
    ..limsy, you're sounding more and more like Krisna with all the detailed analysis and input on what MAS and BAM must/should do..

  16. #169
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    Quote Originally Posted by ctjcad View Post
    ..i must say, that's like the quickest "tata" i've seen..
    ..limsy, you're sounding more and more like Krisna with all the detailed analysis and input on what MAS and BAM must/should do..
    lol
    but i am not in the position to do so

  17. #170
    Regular Member extremenanopowe's Avatar
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    due to politics, the private coach will never be in favour. Else state ba will have no face.

    So, one suggestion is to 'join the gang' instead of going against it.

    Meaning, the private coach should part with his best player and allow them to train under state ba. If not migrate to another state or get bam help. Am sure some can see if the player is good. There are lots of tournaments in Malaysia for people to judge.

    Once the state player is good enough to go into national, then he can decide later to go back to the private coach to try out (if the chemistry still works again).

    This is just like going pro.

    I've read a lot in this thread. Wistle blowers should be encouraged. This will keep everyone on their toes. Politic will always be there. The best man wins. You have to know what you are doing, else arrows will be coming to your back. No one owes anyone a living....

    Its internet world now days. Those idiots who think the can get away with abuse are gone... Just report to this if you feel there are 'corruptions'

    http://www.sprm.gov.my/

    If someone abuse their power, then there are lots of lawyers waiting to take up the role to pounce on them.

    I did tried and they do work (not all the time working tho). If you got evidence and they don't work, and sure the top head will roll.

    There are lots of technology to help nab those er... you know what....

    So, for those players who felt that they have been mistreated, you can post your grievances here.

    Let people know or the media know. Let them do the investigations. The media loves to be a hero... (psst.. you may use free internet or anonymous name to hide your identity, dun use your home one la... tau ka..? later kena trace susah. )

    So, there are lots of potential players with facebook. Do inform them on this.

    It is time to give some freedom to the players to speak out. (This applies to difficult and abusing bosses if you are being mistreated in your company).

    The truth is out there..... deng deng... like x files...
    Last edited by extremenanopowe; 05-31-2010 at 10:21 AM.

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