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  1. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by PyourK View Post
    like you said, you would be wanting to do a straight lift. but thats where his racket is, so you could be lifting right into his kill. Am i making sense? if not, the lift would be too steep and too shallow.
    Bascially his racket is a small target in a big hitting area, the chances of him hitting it, even if he tries are slim, and in that case you want to take him out of the game by doing either a high lift over his racket, or if he is in that extreme position then even a poor cross court shot would do, since he isn't going to get there.

  2. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by PyourK View Post
    re:
    Question 3:
    Give an example when 'blocking the shot' is considered illegal.
    Answer: 'Blocking the shot' is always legal. It is interfering with your opponent's stroke that is illegal.
    Example: You are stuck very close to the net and you played a net return just over the net to your opponent's court. Your opponent moved in to return your shot. Being stuck very close to the net, and knowing that a return is coming, you raise your racket-head above the net in anticipation. This happens often in play, but now it is an illegal block.

    Am I right in saying that the illegal part about this question is that his racket crossed the vertical plane that is the net? so as long as his entire racket is on his side of the court, this is fine?
    No. The illegal part is that the racket obstructs the opponent's shot. That is, you've made it hard for the opponent to play a shot without clashing rackets. It's rule 13.4.4, as quoted in a previous post.

  3. #20
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    and i was told by my friends that it was legal..

  4. #21
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    Arrow You can block the SHOT, but you cannot block/obstruct the STROKE

    Quote Originally Posted by SmashThat View Post

    and i was told by my friends that it was legal..

    .
    Probably, your friend has never played Squash before. He cannot stand (on purpose) infront of his opponent to obstruct his opponent's swing of his/her racket.

    We shall repeat:

    You can block the SHOT, but you cannot block/obstruct the STROKE.

    SHOT = Flight of the shuttle/ball.
    STROKE = Swing of the racket.
    .
    Last edited by chris-ccc; 04-07-2010 at 10:52 AM.

  5. #22
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    I asked this question once to a referee, and he said that you always have to make a hitting action. That would mean that simply blocking the net is a fault, as you make no hitting action.

    Furthermore, a guy at my club does this all the time. If I play a tight net shot, he can still manage to hit it back, almost from the floor, and move his racket so quickly to the net, that I am afraid to make a kill. Here he would be blocking my stroke, right?

    BUT, what if he plays a tight net shot and I am too late to hit it near the net tape, meaning I have to hit the shuttle from the bottom side of the net or from the floor. If I play a lift and he has his racket above the net (still on his side), he doesn't block my stroke, but he still blocks my shot. Is this legal? I would think not.

    If you look at top players in doubles when they have to play a lift from a tight net shot, the guy at the net never blocks the net, but he jumps and makes a smashing action in hope he hits the shuttle.

  6. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dekkert View Post
    I asked this question once to a referee, and he said that you always have to make a hitting action. That would mean that simply blocking the net is a fault, as you make no hitting action.
    Even referees can be wrong. Being confidently wrong is something we humans are remarkably good at.

    Few players read the Laws. Of those who do, few understand them thoroughly. And except for the really big tournaments, why should the tournament officials have had any significant training? For the most part, they're just well-meaning volunteers. There's little or no financial incentive, and demand for officials exceeds supply (i.e. plenty of tournaments don't get any officials).

    Under those conditions, you inevitably get amateurs. Amateurs who are doing a great service to players by giving them experience of an officiated match, but amateurs nonetheless.


    Furthermore, a guy at my club does this all the time. If I play a tight net shot, he can still manage to hit it back, almost from the floor, and move his racket so quickly to the net, that I am afraid to make a kill. Here he would be blocking my stroke, right?
    To be exact, it has nothing to do with your "being afraid" to make the kill. It's not about how you feel.

    What matters is the counterfactual: if you had played the kill, would your racket have hit his racket? This, of course, is something that cannot be known for sure; the umpire must make a judgement. The benefit of the doubt, however, should go to you.

    (Normally, with no umpire, the players must come to an agreement. Play a let if you can't agree.)

    You can force the issue: play the shot anyway, and hit his racket! There can then be no question of what would have happened. However, you may prefer to refrain from this, as it could damage your racket.


    BUT, what if he plays a tight net shot and I am too late to hit it near the net tape, meaning I have to hit the shuttle from the bottom side of the net or from the floor. If I play a lift and he has his racket above the net (still on his side), he doesn't block my stroke, but he still blocks my shot. Is this legal? I would think not.
    It's absolutely legal, but rather unlikely -- especially if you're playing a high lift, which will usually rise well above net height before it crosses the plane of the net.


    If you look at top players in doubles when they have to play a lift from a tight net shot, the guy at the net never blocks the net, but he jumps and makes a smashing action in hope he hits the shuttle.
    That's because blocking the net is useless unless the lift is very shallow: the shuttle will not be in that area of space. If he wants to intercept a higher lift, his only chance is to reach up.

    Moreover, if he reaches up high to play his block, then the opponent would likely have time to kill it. He needs to add some pace to the shot, so that it passes below the net before the opponent can respond -- hence the smash-style action, rather than merely attempting to block.

    Even then, it's really a "no harm in trying" shot: most of the time, it won't work. The higher the lift, the less chance he has to intercept it.

  7. #24
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    here's my mean reply.

    if you can kill and u see the racket there... KILL IT.. chances are that the completion on ur stroke will cross the net to the other side... take this change to hit his racket and his face which is probably just as close and say... "THAT's RIGHT".

    if you have to get the shot so low... hit it straight up with the intention of not getting it over. when opponent hits it... ILLEGAL cuz the shuttle was definitely not going to pass the net

    that said...none of this is typically done, because the real truth is that you just need to get more experience (and skills... because u should really get to the shot before it gets low enough that you have such a limited amount of shot selection that u have to lift) and know what shots you would do and also have some faith in ur partner who should be lending you help. when you can do that... u know that all this at the net trying to block ur returning shot is all child's play.

  8. #25
    Regular Member chris-ccc's Avatar
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    Arrow Breaking our rackets is not the way to prove that the law is right or wrong

    Quote Originally Posted by drowsysmurf View Post

    here's my mean reply.

    if you can kill and u see the racket there... KILL IT.. chances are that the completion on ur stroke will cross the net to the other side... take this change to hit his racket and his face which is probably just as close and say... "THAT's RIGHT".

    .
    Not good, not good.

    We only need to follow the Laws of Badminton.

    Breaking our rackets is not the way to prove that the law is right or wrong.
    .

  9. #26
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    u didn't quote the rest of my text:
    "that said...none of this is typically done, because the real truth is that you just need to get more experience (and skills... because u should really get to the shot before it gets low enough that you have such a limited amount of shot selection that u have to lift) and know what shots you would do and also have some faith in ur partner who should be lending you help. when you can do that... u know that all this at the net trying to block ur returning shot is all child's play."

  10. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by PyourK View Post
    sorry, I asked my question wrong.

    the racket is not above the net, but rather just behind it, in an almost parallel fashion.

    Needless to say, I am reluctant to clash rackets, as you never know what would happen, what if your racket breaks? what if his racket breaks?

    "if"s aside, I am under the impression that in order for one's shot to count, you must have made forward movement with the racket. just holding it still on your side does not really cut it. Moreover, it serves to be some sort of distraction, as it prevents one from doing a swipe shot if I treasure my racket. It also seems rather amateurish, as I dont see this happen in higher level games.

    correct me if i'm wrong. thanks.
    .
    Now we have witnessed such an incidence at a top lever game (2011 Super Series Finals - the Saina Nehwal-vs-Wang Yihan Finals Match).

    To follow the story, here is the link;
    http://www.badmintoncentral.com/foru...02#post1814402

    .
    Attached Images Attached Images    

  11. #28
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    i think the rule is quite simple...

    If Saina held her racket up over the net before WYH hit the shuttle, then it's obstruction...

    but there is one exception.... if Saina's intention was to prevent the shuttle hitting her face, then it's not obstruction....

  12. #29
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    Lightbulb The fault is the obstruction of an opponent's follow-through

    Quote Originally Posted by pcll99 View Post
    i think the rule is quite simple...

    If Saina held her racket up over the net before WYH hit the shuttle, then it's obstruction...

    but there is one exception.... if Saina's intention was to prevent the shuttle hitting her face, then it's not obstruction....
    .
    It is still a fault.

    The fault was called because Saina has interfered with Wang Yihan's follow-through. It didn't matter whether Saina's intention was to prevent the shuttlecock from hitting her face or not.

    But if Saina's racket-head was more than a meter away from the net, where Wang Yihan's rachet-head follow-through was not obstructed, then a fault would not be called against Saina.

    The fault is the obstruction of an opponent's follow-through; whether it is intended or not intended, it doesn't matter.
    .

  13. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by chris-ccc View Post
    .
    Now we have witnessed such an incidence at a top lever game (2011 Super Series Finals - the Saina Nehwal-vs-Wang Yihan Finals Match).

    To follow the story, here is the link;
    http://www.badmintoncentral.com/forums/showthread.php/105993-2011-Super-Series-Finals-Day-5-(Finals-Day)-Sun-18-Dec?p=1814402#post1814402

    .
    for the first time, I think WYH is quite sexy....

  14. #31
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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SfPNe...&lf=plpp_video

    1:48 - this is definitely a fault isn't it?

    Ignore the poor play lol

  15. #32
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    Arrow We cannot prevent/block the follow-through of the racket-head over the net

    Quote Originally Posted by Sengcheek View Post
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SfPNe...&lf=plpp_video

    1:48 - this is definitely a fault isn't it?

    Ignore the poor play lol
    .
    Yes, it is a fault.

    When 2 players are at the fore-court, challenging each other at netplay, a fault shall be called against any player who raises his/her racket-head above the net-tape to prevent/block the follow-through of the racket-head over the net.

    Many BCers are still missing this point - It is allowed for a striker to follow the shuttle over the net with his/her racket-head in the course of a stroke.

    Any attempt to disallow the striker's racket-head to follow through over the net will be called a fault.

    In fact, when I am at the net and see that my opponent raising his/her racket-head to prevent the follow-through of my racket-head, I would not play my stroke, and claim a point straight away.

    I wouldn't want to break my racket.
    .
    Last edited by chris-ccc; 03-29-2012 at 12:45 PM.

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    is there an official (ie BWF's) explanation as to what is or is not an obstruction?

    How does an official referee learn what it or is not an obstruction?

    How does anyone qualify as a referee? is there a test?

  17. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by pcll99 View Post
    How does anyone qualify as a referee? is there a test?
    Yes, there is a test. If you are interested in becoming a referee (different from an umpire), contact your national badminton association for details and clinics. You will need to pass a written test and an on-court evaluation (which usually includes you being a referee for a local tournament of some sort and they evaluate how you do)

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