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  1. #613
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    Quote Originally Posted by taneepak View Post
    Shouldn't it be your turn first in view of your unsupported claim that Frost, Yap and Park did not then have the power at BAM as Park and LYB now have in Japan and China?
    FYI, Park is today's head coach for Japan and these Japanese are still mainly part time players. Do you think this part time thing is Park's idea or it was that way all the time? Or maybe he tried but failed to convert them to full timers.
    everyone with brain and can function normally know about it
    what everyone with brain and can function normally dont know is that morten,park and yap have the power like what park and li yong bo do.

    it was like people who believe earth is square ask people who believe earth is not square to proof why earth isn't square

  2. #614
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    Do think that if tan kim her is head coach of china team can china be as they now?

  3. #615
    Regular Member pBmMalaysia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by riffsuad View Post
    Do think that if tan kim her is head coach of china team can china be as they now?
    We can't say he can do a good job

    nor can we say he will mess things up

    because he was never given a chance

  4. #616
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    Quote Originally Posted by cobalt View Post
    LYB? He adhered to the ideology of the party. Nothing more, nothing less. He was the facilitator. Of course, his unique mix of attributes made him well suited for the job. But make no mistake, its not LYB, it is the system he represents.

    Agree with pBm about ZJH; he was something else!

    Also, it is good to remember that MF, Park JB, et al achieved what they did with much less resources and talent at thier disposal than CBA; so I wouldn't ever dismiss their capability. What actually diffrentiates them from LYB is just 2 things: resources, and ideology. Give LYB to BAM the way it has been for so long, I suspect he will do much worse than his predecessors.

    But IMNVHO, none of them can help MAS badminton the way things are now.
    I see,that means what LYB has achieved cannot be replicated elsewhere. Good for China,bad for the rest of the world. Sorry, Gopichand,nobody can learn from China or LYB specifically. But,surely,we can still learn something from the best in the world. To me,adhering to the party ideology is beside the point,even BAM has its ideology, and LYB is more than just a facilitator,otherwise there would at least be a handful of others who can easily do his job. I believe LYB brings something special,unique as his contribution to improve and enhance the system,that's why after 19 years he's still at it and going strong.

    Of course,he's not perfect,he's only human. What we want is to learn,adopt and adapt what we think is good and suitable, discarding what we think is bad or unsuitable. Importing wholesale or imitating what he's done provided we know what it really is from the inside not just seen from the outside,simply won't work, a recipe for failure, plus BAM is unlikely to give him a free hand ...in which case you're right to suspect he will do much worse than his predecessors. Li Mao tried thinking he could copy over what little or much he's learnt in China and we all know the result. But Li Mao is Li Mao, LYB is LYB.

    Anyway, LYB won't go anywhere, he's done so much for China and achieved so much in his life,he's probably planning his retirement now,setting up that Badminton Academy in Dongguan is one of it. Just my 2-cents.

    Ahh, Zhao Jianhua, every time someone mentions his name...he is absolutely one of a kind !

  5. #617
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    To add , if ideology is an issue,then few other countries would accept any Chinese coach/player of any age. Besides, they went because they were interested in advancing their badminton career not spreading ideology.

    Take Denmark,for example,she has an ex-China coach for 22 years, Zhang Liangyin,producing the likes of Poul-Erik Hoyer Larsen, Peter Rasmussen, Camilla Martin, Tine Baun and Peter Gade who all paid tribute to him. Don't forget,he went there at a time when ideology mattered even more than today. I believe,you and I know,in today's China,who really talks about ideology, much less badminton players and coaches. http://www.badmintoncentral.com/forums/showthread.php/97858-Zhang-Lianying-A-Chinese-coach-behind-Danish-Badminton

    I
    ndonesia overplayed the ideology card, forbade Tang Xianhu from coming back, much to her detriment.
    Last edited by Justin L; 06-05-2012 at 06:12 AM.

  6. #618
    Regular Member pBmMalaysia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Justin L View Post
    I see,that means what LYB has achieved cannot be replicated elsewhere. Good for China,bad for the rest of the world. Sorry, Gopichand,nobody can learn from China or LYB specifically. But,surely,we can still learn something from the best in the world. To me,adhering to the party ideology is beside the point,even BAM has its ideology, and LYB is more than just a facilitator,otherwise there would at least be a handful of others who can easily do his job. I believe LYB brings something special,unique as his contribution to improve and enhance the system,that's why after 19 years he's still at it and going strong. Of course,he's not perfect,he's only human. What we want is to learn,adopt and adapt what we think is good and suitable, discarding what we think is bad or unsuitable. Importing wholesale or imitating what he's done provided we know what it really is from the inside not just seen from the outside,simply won't work, a recipe for failure, plus BAM is unlikely to give him a free hand ...in which case you're right to suspect he will do much worse than his predecessors. Li Mao tried thinking he could copy over what little or much he's learnt in China and we all know the result. But Li Mao is Li Mao, LYB is LYB. Anyway, LYB won't go anywhere, he's done so much for China and achieved so much in his life,he's probably planning his retirement now,setting up that Badminton Academy in Dongguan is one of it. Just my 2-cents.Ahh, Zhao Jianhua, every time someone mentions his name...he is absolutely one of a kind !
    If li yongbo was brought up in the underworld, he would have been the godfather by now

  7. #619
    Regular Member extremenanopowe's Avatar
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    I never respect tyrants or dictators. And the system that encourages it. Spoilers.

  8. #620
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    Me too, for a freedom-loving and independent-minded person like me, I can never tolerate tyrants and dictators,even benevolent ones. However, I do admire strong,capable and,most importantly,wise leaders, something akin to the Philosopher King but not exactly in the Platonic sense as in 'The Republic'.

    Sadly,tyrants are everywhere,in all societies and organizations , in different layers of society,including the family, and they come in various guises and forms. Even in America, the freest country in the world, big corporations are regarded by many as private tyrannies. Never judge a book by its cover, a so-called democratic government can also turn dictatorial, a so-called democratically-elected leader privately a tyrant or dictator. Even religious leaders can be dictators.

    Just as you don't judge a man by what he says of himself but look at his actions and true intentions,similarly you don't judge a socio-political and economic system by its name or what it claims to represent. Human nature is the same everywhere and all kinds of people are found in every system. In the best of us,there is some evil,in the worst of us,some good. We are still very far off from the millenium, a hoped-for period of joy,serenity,prosperity, and justice - perhaps never to be attained in this mortal world. Ultimately,we are each responsible for our own thoughts,words, and deeds. Peace, Loving-kindness and Wisdom.

  9. #621
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    Quote Originally Posted by Justin L View Post
    I see,that means what LYB has achieved cannot be replicated elsewhere.
    That is correct.
    Good for China,bad for the rest of the world.
    That is correct.
    Sorry, Gopichand,nobody can learn from China or LYB specifically. But,surely,we can still learn something from the best in the world.
    That is not correct. You must remember to take Gopi's statements in context and perspective. He was referring to the single-mindedness and dedication in pursuit of the achievement. The "Achievement" was never a single gold or even a clutch of golds; it was domination both physical and mental. The golds would be a symbol of that projection of power. Gopi understood that the conditions to create that reality were unavailable almost anywhere else but China.
    To me,adhering to the party ideology is beside the point,even BAM has its ideology, and LYB is more than just a facilitator,otherwise there would at least be a handful of others who can easily do his job.
    "Party ideology" as I referred to is, is not to be interpreted in the narrow sense. In communist/socialist countries, it permeates every facet of life. Maybe this link will help you to better understand my take.
    http://www.badmintoncentral.com/foru...06#post1518906
    I believe LYB brings something special,unique as his contribution to improve and enhance the system,that's why after 19 years he's still at it and going strong.
    Yes, as I said, he's well suited for the job! ----snip----

  10. #622
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    We know which leaders are bad. That is a sad case due to money and power.

    The sad case is these tyrants are messing up badminton. I couldn't be bothered by things outside badminton. We must get rid of these parasites.

    If everyone keeps on cursing him or calling him names, he will quit. The media will also help to expedite it faster.

    Camon, let's have a good Olympic spirit. Fair for all.

  11. #623
    Moderator cobalt's Avatar
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    Extreme, you talking about LYB or Nadzmi? Or both?

  12. #624
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    for those can read Malay, see this, http://www.bharian.com.my/bharian/articles/Undursajajikagagal_/Article

    h
    ow tan sri elyas omar cynically says to Nadzmi..

  13. #625
    Regular Member nokh88's Avatar
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    But he said to go after 5 to 6 years, which is way too long. In fact, it has expired.

  14. #626
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    http://thestar.com.my/sports/story.asp?file=/2012/6/6/sports/11424680&sec=sports

    For those who wants to read in English...

    He mentioned - "“Perhaps a change is needed within the BAM management because we haven’t really progressed much in the past 10 years"

    I say the change is way long OVERDUE!!!

  15. #627
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    Quote Originally Posted by cobalt View Post
    BAM can’t get it right over coaches

    Posted on 22 May 2012 - 03:13am
    Azman Ujang
    Azman Ujang is a former editor-in-chief of Bernama

    http://www.thesundaily.my/news/384868

    Excerpts:

    ...While we did have high-calibre coaches, it does suggest that BAM comes out poorly in managing them.

    Look at the latest case involving Yong-sung. BAM said the coach resigned because he had demanded a substantial pay rise which was rejected. But Yong-sung denied this. Rather, he grew restless and disappointed because his role was not clearly defined.

    ...This is an indictment of the unprofessional way some of the our sports officials are running their associations. No wonder our top pair of Kien Keat-Boon Heong have slipped into oblivion from their once lofty position as world’s No. 1.

    “Just what’s happening?” I asked BAM long-time president Datuk Seri Mohd Nadzmi Salleh in a text message.

    Nadzmi, who is in China with our Thomas Cup squad for the finals replied: “He’s no loss to us, asking very high salary which we think he doesn’t deserve.”

    ...Sports Minister Datuk Seri Ahmad Shabery Cheek also wants BAM to view problems among its coaches more seriously.

    “This issue involving coaches needs to be handled well so that players are not victimised especially with the focus on the Thomas Cup and the Olympic Games,” he said.

    He said his ministry would reassess all forms of coaching and financial support to BAM because such assistance comes from taxpayer’s money.

    ...One man credited for his strong leadership of BAM that enabled us to pull off the 1992 victory over arch-rivals Indonesia, Tan Sri Elyas Omar, is still as passionate as ever when talking about badminton. Elyas told me that over the years, he had offered his services and experience to BAM but was spurned every time.

    “We have amateurs running our sports organisations who have no clue how to develop sports properly within a specific time-frame,” he said.

    ...Nadzmi, meanwhile, is upset at critics who are quick to point fingers at BAM. His text message from China indicated that it’s perhaps time for him to hand over the baton to someone else.
    I like Azman Ujang. Straight forward to the point without beating about the bush. Another one that I like is Nadeswaran.

  16. #628
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    hahaha...the exit door for Nadzmi is slowly opened..just a matters of time.

  17. #629
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    Who want to leave BAM when there good money to be made? Sponsorship from ASTRO, Maxis, Maybank, Bernas.

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