The following are all my own opinions, based on being successful for decades at playing competitive sports and being picky at small things that other people don't even think about. In shopping for new shoes I've noticed that you can't find any weights for them, except Yonex Aerus 3's. I use Nike Air Vapor Ace tennis-specific shoes which are an excellent inexpensive alternative to badminton-specific shoes, but now need to be replaced. They stick to any floor surface like glue, offer good support, and are very light. https://www.amazon.com/NIKE-Mens-Vapor-Tennis-Shoe/dp/B00XKC767U They are only 291 grams per shoe compared to Yonex's claimed weight of 270 grams for Aerus 3's. Aerus 3's are on my short list for new shoes, but I want to know more about others. Don't you? I may seem a little obsessed about low weight, but think about this: Just to have some numbers to work with, let's say you average 40 steps in a typical single point rally. In a 21 point game, that is 840 steps total. Let's compare shoes that only weigh a difference of 21 grams per shoe, as in my Nike's vs the Aerus 3's. By the end of the game, I will have lifted 538 pounds in the Nike's, whereas if I had been wearing Aerus 3's, I would have lifted only 500 pounds, a difference of 38 pounds. That may not seem like a lot, but go pick up something that weighs 38 pounds and imagine NOT having to use any muscle strength or energy to pick that up in the space of a single game. Now multiply that over several games. I usually play at least 7 games a night which means that by the end of the night, I've lifted 266 pounds more than I would have in Aerus 3's. Do you think that won't contribute to tiring you out, making you slower, causing bad footwork? Of course it will, and that's with a minor weight difference of only 42 grams between shoes. Pick any numbers you want, but just think about how much extra weight you are lugging around and have to expend precious energy on by wearing heavy shoes. Light weight is the main reason I'm willing to pay for more expensive shoes (but not in the case of the Nike's). The enhanced support, cushioning, and safety is a bonus. Still, there is a legitimate place for heavy shoes. Train with them, then when you go into a game with your light shoes, your feet will feel light as a feather, and you will feel a lot faster. With this in mind, I ask any of you who have access to a scale to measure the weight of your shoes and post them here so we all have a reference point. I use a Perfect Portions kitchen scale, but any accurate scale that measures grams will work. https://www.target.com/p/perfect-portions-digital-food-scale-silver/-/A-13560576 I consider weight to be an important factor in what shoe I will buy, and would like to see a lot more numbers before I commit to a new pair. Let's help each other out!
I got some weights at my club last night. Everyone was actually excited to participate, and we weighed all of our rackets and other stuff at the same time. Very enlightening. Asics Gel Rocket A9 - size 6.5 US - 554g both - 277g per shoe Nike Air Vapor Ace - size 8 US - 582g both - 291g per shoe Victor AS-3W - size 10.5 US - 718g both - 359g per shoe Yonex Aerus 3 - size 7.5 US - 506g both - 253 per shoe Yonex Power Cushion 34 - size 8.5 US - 550g both - 275g per shoe I think I awakened a monster. Now everyone in the club wants to know their racket, shoe, grip tape, string, shuttle and god only know what else weights, and have asked me to bring the scale on a regular basis. Maybe we should place weight posts in all of our equipment categories in Badminton Central, because once we started and the word spread, it was infectious. Everyone at my club brings their own shuttles, and although we can feel the difference in weight between them, now we can quantify them by weight and performance. Racket weights went from 73g to 91g. The guy with the 718g Victor shoes, although already one of our fastest players, after finding out how heavy his shoes were in comparison to everyone else's, started looking for new shoes before with left the building. Plug his numbers into the example I gave above compared to Aerus 3's. You will be astonished at how much extra work he is having to do just to move his shoes around. I was surprised to find out the Aerus 3's were lighter than advertised by Yonex, but their published weight may be because their sample was a larger size. Cudos to them though for being honest, if not conservative, rarely found in the marketing world. Anybody else want to play?
It turns out the weight difference I gave between my Nikes and Aerus 3's is probably worse than I thought, allowing an extra 10g for a size 8 Aerus. Another member has a larger pair of Aerus 3's, so I'm going to weigh his as well to get a rough idea of how much the weight changes between sizes.
Instead of posting each data here & will be lost in the jungle after a while, how about put it in a database like a website if possible or if not, just use excel & upload it here & ask the mod to put it on sticky thread. It can be 2 sheet, shoes & racket. For racket we can have name, overall weight min, overall weight max, head weight min, head weight max, balance min, balance max, string, tension, grip, overgrip, additional part (lead tape, cushion tape, etc) for shoes we can have name, weight min & max, size, insole. Why min & max, well most of the time spec is kinda different in small significant number right. & also here we who want to contribute, can also post our equipment & you can update the data after every ... Like 20-30 new data.
I personally think you think about things which don't have any long term impact. Each pair has a different weight at at different size. I wear a US10, but somebody with US8 or US12 will have a lighter or heavier shoe. So a database is useless. I don't know how you play, but my socks and shoes get soaked with sweat during play. I estimate that each shoe get 20-30g heavier during play. How about you? Do you drink inside the games? I do and this can be up to 1.5 liter. I think if you really care about the weight you carry in a rally, shave your whole body, play just in slips and be pretty sure to have a racket of 60g. Don't wear glasses, orthopedics, braces and bandages, watch, jewelery and sweatbands. Cut the shoe laces as short as possible and so on. Now a bit serious: I think that any loss in fat, building up stamina and muscles and improving efficiency of footwork is more beneficial than counting peas with shoes. I think that most of us don't a body fat below 10%. So why not making a diet and loose up to 500g in just one week? Here a table of my shoes I have in the closet: A820: 350g S80: 319g SHB65: 343g P9200: 369g P9300: 396g Basically the S80 must be my prefered choice. Frankly I don't notice any difference now, when I play in the 9300, compared to the S80 3 years ago. According to my sports watch I do between 6000 to 8000 steps in a club night Do you win and loose always 21:0? Howd o you move? IMO each step is not the same. Jumping 50cm high to smash is different amount of "lifting" compared to just making a lunge. I personally glide more on court instead of making high knees.
I have posted many shoe images with weights on older shoes. They were all in my size of 7.5 us mens in Asics, Yonex, Mizuno. Some of the lighter ones were the Mizuno Wave Fang from about 7 years ago or Yonex F1, both around 250 - 260 grams. The lightest were a actually a pair of Adidas from the era when they launched into badminton about 8 years ago. I think less than 230 grams. I will try to find the post.
I found a previous discussion about shoes. I posted an image of Adidas Crazy Light @ 227g and Gel Blade 2 @ 260g. The Gel Blade is still very similar to the current model. Both in 7.5 US mens. https://www.badmintoncentral.com/fo...hoes-lightest-ever.155346/page-3#post-2418004
Dear different shoes have different weight, well I wear Nike Air Vapor Ace - size 8 US - 582g both - 291g per shoe, and it's good not heavy, and its totally depend on your choice what types of shoes you wanna wear.
I wouldn't try to move 38 pounds of dirt in one go, I would use a shovel and move 500g at a time. Fewer muscles are activated and less energy is used in one go. I'm not sure it is right to think about the cumulative weight. Only think about it in terms of an extra 21g in a foot movement and how much that can effect you then measure the cumulative quantity of effort or calories burned. Do you use more muscles to lift/move the extra 21g? Are more calories burned per movement or even over 7 games? In the context of badminton I don't think the effect is going to make a difference, with badminton style movements anyway. In the context of 100m sprints then it is likely to measure a difference - the feeling of inertia will be greater for a start because foot movement is so much faster for longer. Aerus 3 and other very light trainers; they don't always have good cushioning and support so can cause foot pain. Making a choice based on weight might work but if you have blisters, bruising or tendon issues then you risk being slower than if you kept wearing your current Nike.
Yeah, my weight example was pretty iffy, but you all got the basic idea, and maybe some of you are starting to give it some thought, and how it might be affecting your performance personally. If you play casually, just for fun, who cares? But when you try to be the best you can possibly be at something, it would be foolish to not consider every aspect of what you are trying to do, whether you take action on it or not. Because if you don't, I guarantee you someone else will. I know the suggestion to shave arms and legs, cut shoe string ends etc... was made in jest to show how silly this is, and I laughed too, because it made me feel somewhat ridiculous for thinking about it Thinking this way is just natural to me after so many decades, but through the eyes of your fresh outside perspective, maybe I hit my head on something one time too many! I did flip a mountain bike in a race end-over-end after smashing into a low-cut tree stump hidden in a bush.... hmmm..... but I still won. But that is exactly how nuts extremely serious people get in many sports, at least in my part of the world. BTW, if you do wear cotton t shirts, shorts and socks, they do collect sweat and can add weight by the end of the night. That was one of the main purposes (and light weight) behind wick-drying clothes that help sweat evaporate quickly so you don't have to carry that weight around with you. I also race road bicycles in the Senior Olympics, and we riders will do anything to lighten our bikes and bodies, including dieting, shaving all body hair (for aerodynamics and a tiny weight loss, but it all adds up), and reducing the weight of any little thing on our bikes. Things like not using the little plastic inner tube valve covers on our wheels. That is why our bikes are dripping in titanium and carbon fiber and now cost up to $10,000. Try this. Ride a bike up a steep hill with 5-10 pounds of weight added to it, then, take off the weight and ride it again to see how much easier it is. Over the period of an entire race, it can really wear you down. All that aside, I think it is good common sense that if your shoes are not comfortable, it doesn't matter how light they are. So what would you say are the most comfortable shoes you've worn? Lately not only do my ankles hurt, but the outsides of my feet ache as well after my games. I can't wait to get home and soak in a hot tub. I don't know if it's because the shoes were designed for tennis and not badminton, or is it just me putting out more effort and taking the shoes to their limit. But I sure would like my feet to not hurt after playing.
It sounds more like marginal gains than competitive gains. Getting good sleep, training well, arriving at the venue on time, eating the right meal can have greater effects and I assume you are taking care of those things already. What else are you looking at for improvements? Racket, grip, strings, shoes? Gains can be made but they need to be considered as your shoes are the only point of contact you have with the ground. Comfort is so personal it is hard to recommend anything even though I love my Aerus 2 I know they are not suitable for everyone. If your ankles and outside of feet are hurting then it could be too much arch support. I have had that. It could also be the shoes slowly collapsing from typical usage. Have you looked at a moneyball/sabermetric approach? So, if most rallies are won with a smash (65% or so) then make sure you can do 2 things - smash and defend a smash. And, make sure you have the equipment and ability to allow you to do both maybe even sacrificing other areas.
For Improvements? If you are serious, look at everything. Things we've already mentioned, and more, stuff you haven't thought of yet. Always ask yourself, "What can I do to make it better?" You said it in your first sentence, "marginal gains". But they are all "gains", and collectively can make a competitive difference. As you know, the biggest influence is your mental state when entering and during a competition. You need to be so confident about your equipment, training and well-being that you don't even think about any of that, just focus on your game. It also relaxes you, a state of mind that cannot be under emphasized if you want to perform your best. You KNOW you are going to do well because you have done everything possible to let it happen. Any lingering doubt in the back of your mind about preparation is like a weak link in a chain, like the difference between being down a few points and thinking "maybe I should have done this..." or "this is nothing, I'm going to win anyway because I'm ready for it..." Sabermetrics is used extensively now in conjunction with older methods in the USA. That's why you now see on some of our college football teams guys who can go out and do incredible things on the field, but off-field get arrested, jailed, and kicked off the team for doing stupid stuff like assaulting their girlfriends or doing drugs. On a personal college football note: Go Tigers! (LSU alum here) Aerus 3's were naturally my first choice, but a couple of friends have them and they both say that they feel rather flat, like they don't have much support or cushioning to save weight. They are both 1/3 my age so it probably doesn't bother them. Right now I'm thinking of Victor A830 or S81's.
Effect of Carbohydrate and Caffeine Ingestion on Badminton Performance Abstract PURPOSE: To investigate the effect of ingesting carbohydrate and caffeine solutions on measures that are central to success in badminton. METHODS: Twelve male badminton players performed a badminton serve-accuracy test, coincidence-anticipation timing (CAT), and a choice reaction-time sprint test 60 min before exercise. Participants then consumed 7 mL/kg body mass of either water (PLA), 6.4% carbohydrate solution (CHO), a solution containing a caffeine dose of 4 mg/kg, or 6.4% carbohydrate and 4 mg/kg caffeine (C+C). All solutions were flavored with orange-flavored concentrate. During the 33-min fatigue protocol, participants were provided with an additional 3 mL/kg body mass of solution, which was ingested before the end of the protocol. As soon as the 33-min fatigue protocol was completed, all measures were recorded again. RESULTS: Short-serve accuracy was improved after the ingestion of CHO and C+C compared with PLA (P = .001, η(p)(2) = .50). Long-serve accuracy was improved after the ingestion of C+C compared with PLA (P < .001, η(p)(2) = .53). Absolute error in CAT demonstrated smaller deteriorations after the ingestion of C+C compared with PLA (P < .05; slow, η(p)(2) = .41; fast, η(p)(2) = .31). Choice reaction time improved in all trials with the exception of PLA, which demonstrated a reduction (P < .001, η(p)(2) = .85), although C+C was faster than all trials (P < .001, η(p)(2) = .76). CONCLUSION: These findings suggest that the ingestion of a caffeinated carbohydrate solution before and during a badminton match can maintain serve accuracy, anticipation timing, and sprinting actions around the court. Source...or google the title at the top. https://journals.humankinetics.com/view/journals/ijspp/11/1/article-p108.xml
My shoe problem is over. I bought a pair of Yonex Power Cushion 65 ZM 2's. For size 8.5 US they weigh 607 grams for the pair, 303.5 grams per shoe, only 12.5 grams more per shoe than my Nike's. And boy, do they make a difference. They are much more comfortable, have better grip, and feel more stable when I'm making extreme maneuvers. My ankles and sides of my feet don't hurt anymore. They really excel at moving straight backwards because of the curved heel. The 90 degree angle of regular shoes can cause you to trip or not move smoothly if you dig in right on the edge. Overall, there is a significant difference between these shoes and my old Nike's. Play-mates comment that I'm moving faster than before, and smoother. I'm getting to even more of those shots other people would give up on, the kind that people watching see and go "uuuuuuhhh", or politely clap or bang their rackets. If you need new shoes, I highly suggest these for their light weight, comfort, stability and grip. My doubles partner just bought some Comfort Z's, and hates them because he was used to the low weight of his Aerus 3's. Mine aren't that much heavier, but have all of the other bonus's the 3's don't have, which I think is well worth the trade-off.
Ultimately the right choice for your quest for performance at this time. I tried some older yonex "comfort" shoes before and the extra weight was OK (just) but the additional cushioning caused a sort of pillowy feeling that absorbed too much energy when trying to push off, making me feel lethargic and weighed down. Aerus are so light and thin that they are super responsive in comparison so your partner really has gone from day to night in terms of both weight and responsiveness. That was a step too far (pardon the pun).
