Thanks for visiting us!

Badminton Central is a free community for fans of badminton! If you find anything useful here please consider registering to see more content and get involved with our great community users, it takes less than 15 seconds! Everybody is welcome here.

Click here for a FREE account!

33lbs on 3U Z-Force II?

Discussion in 'Badminton Stringing Techniques & Tools' started by VeritasC&E, Dec 5, 2018.

  1. VeritasC&E

    VeritasC&E Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2018
    Messages:
    64
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Stockholm
    Hello,


    I've been quite careful at increasing tensions on my racket (especially since I had a shoulder injury a year ago and a wrist injury six months ago). So I started around 20lbs and I've been through a few restrings on different strings (Unknown Forza String, BG65, BG66UX, LN1, GTone 5, and NBG99). I now play exclusively with NBG99 as it's the only one that does not break or frustratingly lose it's properties after a few weeks. My last string job was 3 months ago initially at 30+lbs (I had asked much less from my stringer, who is also a great player and helped me improve my technique, but he decided to do it his way, and though I at first was a bit upset and thought it would be too high, in retrospect I really have to thank him for it).


    Here are a few notes:

    > I play 2 to 3x per week, usually 4-6 hours each time.

    > I don't have any more pain whether to my shoulder or wrist now, having played over 3 months with a racket whose tension went from 30 to <27lbs. The shoulder pain I still had with a 4U racket has been non-existent ever since I use a 3U ZFII (I have two of them now), contrary to what had been advised to me by an (ill-informed?) member of this forum.

    > For some reason NBG99 always feels like it has less tension than it truly has. As far as I can feel, NBG99 at 28lbs feels like it has the same tension as LN1 at 24lbs

    > I'm not sure why but playing with the racket whose tension has been the highest really helped me improve my technique, and this seems not to be a permanent thing (in other words, it kind of forces me to play the right way / not being lazy). My other racket is still at a lower tension, 25.5lbs and I become "sloppy" just after a few shots playing with it so I barely ever play with it anymore.

    > My stringer is in another country than the one I'm in currently, so though I might restring more often to enjoy a narrower tension range between restrings (or do things like trying out Aerosonic) if I were living in the same place, I really love using the NBG99 which not only resists super well to breakage but also retains it's characteristics extremely well with time compared to other popular strings, and I'm happy to currently have rackets which have held 3-4 months since their last restrings with it (and I'd like to keep it that way, as I may have to last for up to 6 months at a time without a restring with at least one of my two ZFIIs playable at any point of time)


    For my last string job my stringer said he had measured the racket south of 30lbs right after stringing. When I personally measured it with Stringster 24h later and after 4h of play, I got a result of 28.1lbs. From that it had fallen all the way down to 26.90lbs a month ago, and to now 26.68lbs.


    I would have expected the strings to be broken by now, especially with this higher initial tension, since I had broken all my strings so far, most often within the first 3 weeks of play, but they haven't (though I'm getting a bit frustrated with not having the same feeling as right after it was strung). So I'd like to have my racket re-strung, and I'd love for it to settle down a tiny bit north of the initial tension I had with it (which must have been between 28.1 and 30lbs, so let's say I'd like it to settle down at 29lbs by this time, instead of the 26.68lbs it fell down to after 3 months). The only problem is that, per my linear calculations (which may be wrong), if this one was 30lbs right after stringing and settled to 26.68lbs after 3 months, and I'd like to have it settle to 29lbs instead, then it needs to be at 32.6lbs right after stringing, and I don't know if the racket can handle that, and if there are other considerations at hand (as if: would that tension make the string lose its characteristics faster as it did now - retaining them quite well - and would I be frustrated after a month and long for a new re-string, or would that be fine?).


    If I were to string it at 32.6lbs I would do that on my most recent ZFII, which per the serial number was manufactured in 2018, as is the 3rd revision of the initial/standard black ZFII model, which leads me to expect it might be more resistant than older / previous revisions of the same racket.
     
  2. VeritasC&E

    VeritasC&E Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2018
    Messages:
    64
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Stockholm
    One more note:

    (1) LN1 was killing my grommets
    (2) Forza, BG66UX, Gtone 5 quickly ended up deteriorating in the upper outside part of the racket before even breaking

    NBG99 does not of that, at all, even initially strung at 30lbs, and even after 3 months. It's just a very lovely string.
     
  3. VeritasC&E

    VeritasC&E Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2018
    Messages:
    64
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Stockholm
    1 Tiny Note of Contrast regarding the NBG99: I just notice that strings had been "digging into each other" on the stringbed (but, better on each other than into my grommets, and after 3 months I guess that could be considered normal).

    cf photo
     

    Attached Files:

  4. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2002
    Messages:
    20,131
    Likes Received:
    2,031
    Occupation:
    wannabe badminton phototaker
    Location:
    Outside the box
    Get another ZFII and tolerate the tension loss
     
  5. visor

    visor Regular Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2009
    Messages:
    15,594
    Likes Received:
    1,316
    Location:
    Vancouver, BC
    You actually read all that text?!

    Sent from my SM-G965W using Tapatalk
     
  6. shreyas666

    shreyas666 Regular Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2016
    Messages:
    1,288
    Likes Received:
    252
    Occupation:
    chief mis-information officer
    Location:
    not in outer space
    This is normal for nbg99.
    Initial tension drop is well inline with the observed trend. You can string your zf2 Upto 34 easily, but it will stress the frame. Enthusiasts and professionals have pulled up this kind of tension and it is in the deformation range of materials forming zf2. This is normal, although you'll be going through a lot of grommet changes and racket changes. For zf2, grommets are again on the higher side .
    With thicker strings rate of tension drop will be slightly more than the thinner strings . All this is well observed and commented upon. All strings will lose their tensions, knots will come undone .what you can do is get your strings pre-stretched to its plastic deformation range. This will affect the performance of strings.
     
    VeritasC&E likes this.
  7. VeritasC&E

    VeritasC&E Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2018
    Messages:
    64
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Stockholm
    Awesome reply! Thank you : )
     
  8. VeritasC&E

    VeritasC&E Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2018
    Messages:
    64
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Stockholm
    One more question:

    Should I still ask for +10% on the crosses or is that too much? (say it would be asking for 32 Main / 35 Crosses)
     
  9. shreyas666

    shreyas666 Regular Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2016
    Messages:
    1,288
    Likes Received:
    252
    Occupation:
    chief mis-information officer
    Location:
    not in outer space
    That's a user specific thing and people have their own preferences. Trial and error is the way.
     
  10. VeritasC&E

    VeritasC&E Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2018
    Messages:
    64
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Stockholm
    I understand. I was wondering, From a physical point of view, is it ok to push it an additional 10% at this level? i.e when you said 34, is that an absolute value or does that leave open the potential +10% on the crosses? / 34 = Strictly 34 or 34M-37.4C?
     
  11. shreyas666

    shreyas666 Regular Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2016
    Messages:
    1,288
    Likes Received:
    252
    Occupation:
    chief mis-information officer
    Location:
    not in outer space
    Have seen @swsh pull 32/34lbs on his zf2. String would be, iirc, 66um.
    Beyond 30lbs imo, you're traversing uncharted territory. Of course, my paramount concern is about racket durability. I have never ventured over 28lbs on 4u zf2
     
    VeritasC&E likes this.
  12. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2002
    Messages:
    20,131
    Likes Received:
    2,031
    Occupation:
    wannabe badminton phototaker
    Location:
    Outside the box
    He only has two racquets. At that tension, he'd better have another.
     
    ucantseeme likes this.
  13. VeritasC&E

    VeritasC&E Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2018
    Messages:
    64
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Stockholm
    Ok so maybe I'll be careful. I guess if I just had ~1lbs more at any point of time it would be great already. I'd start at 31lbs x 34lbs and 3 months later I'd be at 27.57lbs instead of 26.68lbs. And maybe combine that with getting a third racket.

    I used to warm up with my lower tension racket when the other one was still high, so I could have one strung at 29lbs x 31.9lbs to settle to 26lbs for warmup purposes, and the other two at initial 31lbs x 34lbs to play with.
     
  14. shreyas666

    shreyas666 Regular Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2016
    Messages:
    1,288
    Likes Received:
    252
    Occupation:
    chief mis-information officer
    Location:
    not in outer space
    get a vt10dg. you can pull as much as you would like to. its a mid ranger, but it pulls tension and is a hammer. or you can go for a duo 8xp. dead even balance and can take tensions upwards 35lbs+
     
  15. swsh

    swsh Regular Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    1,960
    Likes Received:
    580
    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    Earth
    Just to confirm, I did go 36 cross on ZF2 a couple of times IIRC. My TK9900 has gone to 37 without issues.

    Some japanese guys with balls of admantium have taken the zf2 to 42 IIRC. It'll take the tension if you take care of the grommets. Then it'll break after awhile obviously but it won't be right away.
     
    VeritasC&E likes this.
  16. VeritasC&E

    VeritasC&E Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2018
    Messages:
    64
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Stockholm
    I don't intend to ever bring it any higher than max 34 on the main, 37.4lbs on the crosses. What is meant by "after awhile"? Is that 1 year, 3 years?
     
  17. ucantseeme

    ucantseeme Regular Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2010
    Messages:
    3,963
    Likes Received:
    1,055
    Location:
    Somewhere over the rainbow
    A ZFII 3U at 37 on cross would be gone after a year or earlier. I wouldn't awaited more than a year above 32 on any racket. IMO you shouldn't give your stringer the tension ratio. Let the guy decide how he string the racket which less deformation on his machine. Grommet maintence and cutting the strings frequently prolong the racket life but each material will be weaken over time. I would not to wait peaceful until the strings pops and would my rackets give on/off times.
     
    VeritasC&E and Mr Arc2 like this.
  18. VeritasC&E

    VeritasC&E Regular Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2018
    Messages:
    64
    Likes Received:
    8
    Location:
    Stockholm
    My goal is not to "experiment" or try to see what's the max tension I can get. It's just playing with my ZFIIs + NBG99 with an average tension around 28.5-29lbs for a period of 3-4 months minimum of play between restrings for each racket. From the string side this is perfectly doable as unlike thinner strings the NBG99 doesn't break easily and retains most of it's elasticity / "repulsion" over that period. Another good side as mentionned earlier is that it's thickness makes it quite gentle on the grommets, even at higher tensions.

    I would not like my racket to last less than a year as I consider my racket to be a 2-3 years investment at minimum. What do you think should be the maximum initial tension to be able to keep each racket, on average, that long?

    The popping advice is good. I can imagine than more than the tension itself, the greater risk for the racket is UNEVEN tension across the frame, as it is subjected to when a string pops. Though I haven't used too high tensions in the past, I always waited for my strings to break before next restring, so I'll change that.

    I do monitor my strings quite frequently however, and I can tell when they are close to rupture, so from now I'll just cut them directly when so.
     
  19. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2002
    Messages:
    20,131
    Likes Received:
    2,031
    Occupation:
    wannabe badminton phototaker
    Location:
    Outside the box
    IMO, there is no real advantage of stringing at a higher tension. The strings will lose tension anyway and one factor is the sheer number of strikes on the string bed with the shuttlecock over four months or more.

    Therefore, my advice is to have three racquets strung to exactly the same tension with exactly the same string. Use each one equally throughout the period of time so that wear and tear and thus tension loss is near as equal for each racquet.

    Then, when you see your stringer, string them all again.
     
  20. ucantseeme

    ucantseeme Regular Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2010
    Messages:
    3,963
    Likes Received:
    1,055
    Location:
    Somewhere over the rainbow
    IMO it's a damn bad idea to clock a job so high to get after 3-4 month a 29 job. I played in my prime 34 lbs, now I'm okay with 28-30lbs. What I learned within this several years was following:

    Regardless how high you string the strings become unplayable after 4 weeks. I run sometimes jobs for a week or less, because they lost their favour. If you go over 30 most strings become less repulsive. Thicker earlier, thinner later. I tried around 20 different strings in the past. IMO NBG99 is one of these string which becomes dull quite fast.

    My advice is to buy a stringing machine and do your rackets every 3-4 weeks on your own (if bringing to stringer, the labour and so on is too expensive for you).

    I never experienced any string which played decent over 2 month or didn't break within a few weeks above 30 on my own rackets. I'm sorry to say, but IMO you should play a BG80 at 29 and get every 4 weeks a new job. 37 over 3-4 month without breakage will eat every racket quickly and is a potential risk of broken string if you play tournaments or league games. IMO it is smarter to got through 20-30 jobs per year and buy 2 rackets (for 2-3 years) instead of using 6 jobs at insane tension per year and buy every few month new rackets. Costwise and performance-wise a no-brainer. Your Idea of less stringing jobs at insane tension per year is like shaving your head twice a year to not go to the barber too often.
     
    #20 ucantseeme, Dec 8, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2018
    speCulatius likes this.

Share This Page