British cyclist fell on purpose to restart race - but they can KEEP gold medal

Discussion in 'Olympics LONDON 2012' started by jdileo, Aug 3, 2012.

  1. white91

    white91 Regular Member

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    Basically I am biased as I am British, but the British cycling team did it because they wanted to win, the badminton players wanted to lose, huge difference.

    Incidentally our medal hopes were blown when we made a mistake in the womens pair and were disqualified, the Chinese pair did exactly the same at a different stage in the event and went home with a silver medal!
     
  2. XtC-604

    XtC-604 Regular Member

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    The badminton players did it to win, just not the pointless round robin match but for a better chance @ gold.
     
  3. ionoo

    ionoo Regular Member

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    yup

    also this not using best effort occurs in many other sports

    One that I see fairly frequently is the end of a NBA season (basketball for those who do not know)
    Teams that are not in the running for the playoffs, are awarded more lottery balls for higher chance of picking early in the draft (to get players like Lebron James, Derrick Rose, etc).

    Awarded more lottery balls for a worse record (more LOSSES), you can see teams play essentially to lose. For other teams in playoff contention coaches often rest their star players? (How is this not deemed not playing with best effort) the only explanation they have is rest for playoffs..., and perhaps their playoff position is final.


    If that is true the regular season game becomes meaningless much like the badminton group match, yet NBA teams do not get penalized (for essentially throwing these final games by not playing their best players).
     
  4. F1_shuttle

    F1_shuttle Regular Member

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    Forget about olympic spirit or BWF rules. In any sport with group games leading to knockout games, there will always be teams/players who will deliberately lose to gain a better position. The problem was that the chinese players were so blatantly obvious in trying to lose the match that action had to be taken - in front of a world audience, the authorities had no choice. All they had to do was play normally but lose the important points and make it look close. There still may have been suspicions, but it would have been impossible to prove. I'm sure the coaches instructed this so they should have done a better job at instructing them on how to lose properly.

    In short, they were pathetic actresses and paid the ultimate price. I really feel sorry for the pair
     
  5. ionoo

    ionoo Regular Member

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    Almost every badminton player wants to win (gold, silver, or bronze), in that particular group match however it made more sense to lose.

    1. Avoid tough opponent early on until later rounds where a medal is in contention, every athlete has been sent to Olympics to represent and win medals (not to just represent and give 100% every time they compete) --------Cause if that's the case so many athletes are guilty of not giving 100% in almost meaningless heats/qualifying rounds (pretty much what the group stage was....)
    2 Conserve energy for matches that involve elimination (as both pairs were going to knockout rounds regardless of who won or loss)
     
  6. ionoo

    ionoo Regular Member

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    yup pretty much, the spectators were just butt hurt cause they paid to see high quality badminton, not realizing by pressuring IOC to take action eventually leading to DQing the pairs the later rounds of badminton would suffer (quality and ENTERTAINMENT).

    Russia or South Africa iirc were competing for bronze I think and its not really their fault but China and Korean badminton is higher at this time.
     
  7. F1_shuttle

    F1_shuttle Regular Member

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    Even more ridiculous was the following match where they copied the same antics. Surely after seeing the crowd reaction and warnings from the match and tournament referees that they should have made it less obvious.

    Seeing 2 thrown match end in 20mins apiece would have been great fun for the spectators!
     
  8. thunder.tw

    thunder.tw Regular Member

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    I'm actually inclined to give the second set of pairs a bit of a pass. The BWF should have acted swiftly and made it known that such a performance was unacceptable. So you can make a very small argument that they were operating under the assumption that the first quartet successfully called the BWF's bluff.

    So while I do believe they deserved to be DQ'd, I have some sympathy for them.
     
  9. ctjcad

    ctjcad Regular Member

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    ..in CHN's case, they wanted both GOld & Silver medals (not play against each other until at least Final Rd.)..
     
  10. XtC-604

    XtC-604 Regular Member

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    Where's the problem in that? You don't want Gold, silver and bronze?
    Silver is a by product of gold, and bronze is a by product of silver.
     
  11. LazyBuddy

    LazyBuddy Regular Member

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    Excuse me, do you really understand the whole story? It's not just 1 team wants to lose, it's both team want to lose. That's why 4 pairs are DQed (2 sides of 2 games). Tell me how you can be a better actor, if you opponent is trying even harder to lose. That's further proved the system is flawed, as everyone got invovled (already qualified, and have a legit shot at the semi or beyond) trying to do the same.

    Please do not argue with some no name team/player, as they are "trying best". Those are the ones do not fit for either or both of the coditions (already qualified AND have a legit shot at the semi or beyond).
     
  12. F1_shuttle

    F1_shuttle Regular Member

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    The chinese pair started losing on purpose first. The Koreans only joined in when they saw what was happening - they went into this match as per normal trying to win it.
     
  13. ctjcad

    ctjcad Regular Member

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    i don't see any problem..just pointing out what the CHN pair was planning to get in WD..
     
  14. demolidor

    demolidor Regular Member

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    What is wrong with that?? A team order to fix the screw up of your fellow countrymen, yep nothing wrong with that ... In case you forgot this is not a teamsport, they are not your "teammates". Best solution: one per country and/or get rid of silver and bronze ...
     
  15. demolidor

    demolidor Regular Member

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    But to put a little nuance into the mix and not view it from the totally naive side of things: we can see in many individual sports that allows for actual teamwork, often it's not who wins as long as you win [as a country]. Getting rid of silver and bronze in this case would not have mattered ... Usually someone sacrifices his/her own, usually non-realistic, medal opportunity to help their countrymen/teammates [by giving their all first, ex. Froom]. In this case it is not even a sacrifice ...
    It is the losing on purpose part rather than not trying your absolute best and taking it easy that ruffles everyone's feathers and as a sportsmen should go against your every instinct.
    As LB mentioned: it takes two to tango :D. If you take it easy and still are on the winning hand you have to descent to a disgraceful level and start scoring own goals or assist your opponents on the alley-oops [21-14 21-11] which makes a mockery of the sport and audience. You can blame the system for having a built-in escape or blame the #2 seed for losing in the first place for messing up your plans.
    Rationally I don't dispute the tactics from the coach's point of view but Cai/Fu for instance would never go along with it. And realistically gold was assured for the #1 but you never know when those nasty injuries might surface again so some insurance can never hurt right? ;)

    All I can say is: gambled and lost ... surely the Koreans weren't going to take it lying down.
     

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