Gideon Marcus Fernaldi / Kevin Sanjaya Sukamuljo

Discussion in 'Indonesia Professional Players' started by Espírito Santo, Apr 29, 2015.

  1. yuquall

    yuquall Regular Member

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    Like not blaming Liu Cheng for Liu/Zhang's loss in critical times? It's hard not to do so though haha

    Last year both Kevin and Marcus shared the same blame (though personally I blamed more on Marcus, if I could be honest ahem). This time, if it weren't for G3 I probably would have blamed Kevin too for not trying hard enough. I don't know what more weakness they need to work on honestly. Kevin shared the workload from the back court when Marcus was, in my chagrin, back to his habit of attacking with less variation like he did before IO or JO.

    And it obviously has nothing to do with Kevin's antics or behavior on court for that matter:cool::D
     
  2. tepokbulu

    tepokbulu Regular Member

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    agree that marcus serve neck high and choi tactic is not dirty?
    wow
     
  3. yuquall

    yuquall Regular Member

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    I know right. Marcus didn't serve neck high, but chest high.
     
  4. Yoji

    Yoji Regular Member

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    The draw hasnt been kind to them as well. Last year they drew CHN player in R1. in AG, they drew JPN player in R1 and this time they drew KOR player in R1.
     
  5. Thunder Hand

    Thunder Hand Regular Member

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    True. imagine if they're in ahsan/hendra position, guaranteed medal for them.
     
  6. ma.ria

    ma.ria Regular Member

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    Is 'dirty' another word for 'fair'?
    If it is, then I will say yes.
    You can disagree, but I measure it solely based on the call from the judge/umpire. What else I can rely on? Unless it's regulated, then my opinion on whether it's fair or not is baseless
     
  7. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

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    It doesn't stop them winning tour titles though.

    Maybe they just keep choking in the world championship...
     
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  8. ericksakti

    ericksakti Regular Member

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    Well I agree they always fail in WC, but thankfully they succeed really well in all other tournaments :D:D:D
     
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  9. rhoder

    rhoder Regular Member

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    No one’s judging a player’s career only based on the ability (or lack thereof) to win a single tournament. At the end of someone’s career, their achievements will be judged in totality for sure, but these majors represent a significant part of their careers. An inability to win something as major as WC would be a point of regret, even if we do not admit it as fans.

    Anyway, we’re getting ahead of ourselves. It’s perfectly possible they manage to sneak OG out next year, then all this talk is for naught. But time is running out for them as a pair, whether we like it or not
     
  10. ericksakti

    ericksakti Regular Member

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    I agree with this, for Marcus he is on his last leg of the careers, whereas for Kevin still a big world full of possibility of chance for him.
     
  11. tepokbulu

    tepokbulu Regular Member

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    dirty = unfair = cheating
    so by delaying the serve, choi is not cheating? because service judge or umpire says nothing about it?
     
  12. yuquall

    yuquall Regular Member

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    :(:(:(:(:(

    Am I right with the points (4800) they are getting from this WC?
    On a brighter side, minions has completed their "Round Exit" collection today for this year :R1, R2, QF, SF and Finalist. :D Let's hope they will not have anymore exits and win all the tournaments this year. Sweep them all up minions!! :):):)

    Updated 22/08/2019 :


    *(1) Malaysia Masters Super 500 -> Champion
    *(2) Indonesia Masters Super 500 -> Champion
    *(3) All England Open Super 1000; 06-10 March ->R1 exit
    *(4) Malaysia Open Super 750; 02-07 April -> QF exit
    *(5) Singapore Open Super 500; 09-14 April -> SF exit
    * Badminton Asia Championships (Individual); 23-28 April -> Silver Medalist

    Olympics qualification starting :

    * Sudirman Cup (Mixed Team); 19-26 May -> Bronze Medalist ; Pts: 11,003 ; Total: 11,003
    *(6) Indonesia Open Super 1000; 16-21 July -> Champion; Pts: 12,000; Total: 23,003
    *(7) Japan Open Super 750; 23-28 July -> Champion; Pts: 11,000; Total: 34,003
    *(8) Thailand Open Super 500; 30 July - 04 August -> QF exit; Pts: 5,040; Total: 39,043
    *- World Championships (Individual); 19-25 August -> R2 exit; Pts: 1,200; Total: 40,243
    (9) China Open Super 1000; 17-22 Sept
    (10) Korea Open Super 500; 24-29 Sept
    (11) Denmark Open Super 750; 15-20 Oct
    (12) French Open Super 750; 22-27 Oct
    (13) Fuzhou China Open Super 750; 05-10 Nov
    (?) Hong Kong Open Super 500; 12-17 Nov
    - W.T.F; 11-15 Dec

    *: competed.

    Pts : Points earned in the tournament
    Total : Total qualification points earned so far

    Edit: I was wrong. It's 1200 points I think for R2 exit.
     
    #4312 yuquall, Aug 21, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2019
  13. Yoji

    Yoji Regular Member

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    They are still all time SS leader and holders of host of records. Pray that they win OG then all these defeats will be forgotten
     
  14. yamsyams

    yamsyams Regular Member

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    Oh yea I completely agree that the service judges were/are incompetent, or rather lacked the spine to enforce the rules. I'm saying that just because the service judge didn't call a fault, that doesn't mean that the serve was legal, because legality should follow the laws of badminton as defined

    Edit: Also, calling the serve "illegal" in this case is not putting blame on Gideon. It's simply stating the fact that it should have been called as a fault, which goes back to my point above on the umpiring.

    Now, I don't think they are "cheating". Like all gamesmanship (delay tactics, etc.), this falls in an ethical gray zone. In an ideal world, no player would do it; but it is on the umpire/service judge to call out and stop such behavior (which they are in general doing a terrible job imo)
     
    #4314 yamsyams, Aug 21, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2019
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  15. tepokbulu

    tepokbulu Regular Member

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    the one who call marcus serve neck high is complete moron
    service judge does not fault marcus serve because he serve below black bar in front of him/her
     
  16. yuquall

    yuquall Regular Member

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    But it was "legal" in umpire's point of view because the service judge didn't say it was "illegal". No grey area here, so if it's not illegal it is legal. Point has to be given to one side.

    Well, thanks to that now they have changed the service rule. Now we can't blame the service judge anymore for any incompetence because there is no way we can know.
     
  17. rhoder

    rhoder Regular Member

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    ‘Fair’ implies a normative judgement while ‘legal’ is a positive one, bound by rules and regulations. I don’t know, but let’s say there was a scenario whereby someone who had committed a crime was wrongly acquitted. Would one call his act legal because the judge ruled it so? Or would it be illegal because the act itself violated the laws that are cast in stone? Quite interesting to think about it

    Could I ask you the above question too? Just out of interest haha
     
    #4317 rhoder, Aug 21, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2019
  18. ma.ria

    ma.ria Regular Member

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    Alright, we dont share the same stance.
    The point I was going to make was how you can say choi's delayed serve is cheating/dirty? Do you know how many seconds he delayed; 3, 5, 10 secs? Even if you count, which one is categorized as 'acceptable delay' or 'too much delay'? What's the standard?
    As far as I know, BWF doesn't regulate it. So it's legal, unless they call that out. You can say it's unfair, but I say it is because like I mentioned before, my standard of fairness is solely based on that call.
     
  19. rhoder

    rhoder Regular Member

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    Nah they need not win OG. I thought all that matters is that they are richer than Li Liu?
     
  20. yuquall

    yuquall Regular Member

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    Li/Liu lost their first match in WC 2017 as #1 seed and they won it the next year :p
     

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