Indonesia Badminton

Discussion in 'Indonesia Professional Players' started by kidosetiawan, May 15, 2007.

  1. yuquall

    yuquall Regular Member

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    Something like, "Everyone acted as if public audition was the only way to be a top player. I could become one without any (audition)" :rolleyes:

    Meh, for someone who was blessed with huge talent and opportunities like him, would never understand how hard it is for not-so-talented or not-so-lucky children to get noticed and scouted by big clubs. With that kind of talent, I am not surprised he could make it without any audition and with the least effort. I don't think he was one of most hardworking players from what I have heard. Even LD and LCW had to work so hard to get to their level.
     
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  2. sen

    sen Regular Member

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    Taufik is always the bad boy on and off court. Kevin will still be a long way from that standard because Kevin is actually quite shy.

    Taufik comment missed the point of the whole debate, of course when you are talented like him, he could even be born in Spain and still do well in badminton but that kind of talent is very rare. Meanwhile, Djarum club has given chance for some of the less talented to make decent living, I think the best example should be Shesar
     
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  3. It'sMeMeMe

    It'sMeMeMe Regular Member

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    i'll try to chime in...
    the issue is that during audition (which are held in many cities throughout the country) the children are wearing shirts with big 'DJARUM' logo in front (given by Djarum organiser)...now KPAI (this is the government body whose job is supposed to protect children) says that this is an act of exploiting children to promote cigarette....considering Djarum records the entire process for review purposes and that there are many photos or videos of said act floating in various media

    what KPAI wants is for Djarum to stop using the company logo on the children during the audition (especially considering the logo is synonimous with cigarette)....

    n Djarum pretty much says *uck off (this is after KPAI sends official letter to Djarum asking them to stop the audition if they still want the children to wear the logo during audition - the letter has since been rescinded after meeting of sport minister + KPAI + Djarum) n decides to stop the audition for 2020...now the company spends roughly USD 13 millions /year to fund its badminton club n scholarships n audition n sponsorships n stuff n with such amount they probably feel it's within their right to use their logo in every badminton activities they hold...

    now there are rumours flying around saying KPAI does this to get shut-up money from Djarum (considering KPAI chief political ties) or that they asked for money but didn't get that's why they are going public with this....and also rumour that Djarum really fund this badminton business to actually promote its cigarettes n stuff (which is unlikely i think considering Djarum boss really likes badminton i think- remember that story some old lady brings INA badminton team shopping after Asian Games...)

    either way personally i'm not taking any stance here... both sides have got points....n this matter needs to be resolved.....i definitely don't want Djarum to pull out from Indonesia badminton but i also think something needs to be done about those photos of kids wearing Djarum shirts....dunno what though...i've got no idea how to resolve this...
     
  4. yuquall

    yuquall Regular Member

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    Djarum CLUB tried to accommodate KPAI's demand to take down Djarum off the audition title and not distributing the t-shirts with Djarum CLUB logo or name to the participating kids.
    To think that "Djarum Badminton Club" not Djarum cigarettes company had been around and established with high resume for 50 years, how could everyone who really care about badminton would associate an elite badminton club to a cigarette product?

    KPAI and other government officials needs to get their fact and statistic right before claiming one 50 years old prestige school is "exploiting" children for their own promotional campaign. What are the Djarum Badminton Club products? Top athletes. So they are doing the right thing actually according to the law.

    There won't be anything to be resolved here. The damage had been done, can't be undone. But seriously, do you really think it is about cigarettes? I don't think so. If so, go campaigning against the tobacco company not the audition done by a badminton club/school which FUNDED (not sponsored) by a tobacco company.
     
  5. It'sMeMeMe

    It'sMeMeMe Regular Member

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    yes but the issue is that Djarum is synonymous with cigarette be it Djarum Badminton Club or Djarum Foundation ....it is STILL cigarette brand
    and yes the club tried to accomodate by the children not wearing Djarum shirts and as a result they decide to stop 2020 audition probably after they think what's the point if we can't use our brand....see?
    the problem is the brand...the problem is that right now cigarette is viewed as bad and can't be associated with children....be it a badminton club or anything....just like IndonesiaOpen no longer Djarum but Blibli....despite blibli is owned by Djarum also...see?

    this just goes far beyond children exploitation....
     
  6. j4ckie

    j4ckie Regular Member

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    I've found it hypocritical and amusing for years to see a sporting association gladly accepting tobacco money...
     
  7. yuquall

    yuquall Regular Member

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    The issue is why now after 50 years? Or after what, 13 years doing annual audition using Djarum club name or scholarships programs.

    And really? Djarum club is also another branding. How about if Djarum's cigarette name is changed to something else? Can they still use "Djarum" Club's name then? It's like you go to Harvard but you can't brag about it because, for example say, Harvard just become strongly associated to something bad. Hey I got a scholarship to the You-Know-What-One-Of-the-Best school?

    The solution is for Djarum Club to stop the audition, they are doing the right thing. Don't know why government or people expect "Djarum" to hold million dollars annual event without using its name or getting any acknowledgement whatsoever. Hypocrite and hilarious clowns. They should take over without expecting any funds from anyone if they really do care about the children future as they claim they do.

    They just want free money and glory:rolleyes: no such thing.

    Well not my problem if Indonesia badminton going downward as long as Kevin is still playing. He happened to be one of the "exploited" child by the audition. If they started banning players from Djarum club then it's hell on the loose.
     
  8. yuquall

    yuquall Regular Member

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    Sadly the founder of the company Djarum apparently just love badminton, even started its own badminton school Djarum club (PB Djarum) back in 1969. It was first just for his company staff to have fun. Who knew they had continued to produce legendary players up and grew so big.
     
  9. It'sMeMeMe

    It'sMeMeMe Regular Member

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    why now ? of course it's becoz nowadays tobacco is toxic....they're getting squeezed more n more... formula 1 marlboro few years ago is another good example of that

    as for keeping djarum badminton club name and ask the Djarum cigarette company to change name....now that simply won't happen for various reasons....if anything it would be the other way round....keep the Djarum cigarette and change to BliBli badminton club...

    as for stopping the audition as the right thing....now that's not the solution IMO....
     
  10. It'sMeMeMe

    It'sMeMeMe Regular Member

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    the sporting association... in this case Djarum badminton club/foundation...actually was founded by the owner of said tobacco company...n been funded solely by the company since its inception till now...including dormitories...schools...etc...
     
  11. It'sMeMeMe

    It'sMeMeMe Regular Member

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    this is such a delicate situation...the country needs this club and the owner's money....on the other hand the country forcing the club to rename or change its audition system or whatever is also not really proper...considering the club's illustrious history and the owner's position as the country's richest person...

    they better get this handled properly before something bad happens n the poor kids with talents get denied the opporturnities....
     
  12. yuquall

    yuquall Regular Member

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    Depends on how you see it really.
    I hate smoke but I hate inconsiderate smokers much more. Just like I hate irresponsible drinkers more than the alcohol. Or others.
    Tobacco is always toxic, funny how suddenly people just realised that.

    Though I think smartphone is even more dangerous than tobacco nowadays.
    How many accidents have people using smartphones on the street or on the road caused? Or for demoralising the children then suicide rate increasing? And so on and so on. Are the smartphones or the company who makes them bad? Or the users?

    I don't see any solution out of this dilemma. If you were the owner of the company what would you do? Are you going to be quiet and let people strip all your hard efforts and contribution for years after being treated just like that?

    The only solution is the government needs to find different legit sponsors and experienced and dedicated ones too. Can you imagine any company will come up after what they did to Djarum Club? If they could do it to a huge and reputable company that had given nothing else but honor and pride to the country numerous times, imagine how they would thrash smaller companies.

    The association might have to swallow their "pride", apologize and the government probably needs to beg Djarum to compromise. Good luck with that. :D:p
    It was their own fault in the first place anyway, the reason why the public got enraged.

    Well that's only my personal view on this. I am siding with Djarum on this one. :p
    Government needs to behave and watch what they are doing on public.
     
  13. j4ckie

    j4ckie Regular Member

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    So the company that is literally causing the deaths of hundreds of thousands is doing some small good things in order to advertise their deathly products. Based on how many things I've heard in their favor it seems to work quite well.
    Badminton is too ingrained in Indonesia to be dependant on this one company and their pockets. Don't let yourself be fooled into supporting them by their saber rattling.
     
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  14. minions

    minions Regular Member

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    AFAIK, PB Djarum (a badminton club, not a company) doesn't even promote cigarette. Hell, the players from that club are prohibited from smoking or else they will get kicked out.
     
  15. yuquall

    yuquall Regular Member

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    You talk as if you knew Indonesia inside out and its people very well.
     
  16. It'sMeMeMe

    It'sMeMeMe Regular Member

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    i have to say you got a point

    however as yuquall pointed out how the badminton club started it isn't really fair to say the company did this only just to 'reduce their sins' of the 'bad parent' company

    they really do have good systems in place n their supporting of the sport really seem quite sincere ...they no longer use Djarum Indonesia Open just an example....

    as for too dependent on this one company..no not at all...just that this badminton club really gives complete package to talented youngsters of poor family....something the other major badminton clubs in indonesia can't provide due to lack of funds....

    n i'm not saying the government should bow to Djarum either....just that compromise needs to be reached to appease both sides

    that being said one last thing Djarum needs to consider....if they're really sincere in supporting badminton they would adhere to government regulation especially this no tobacco brand on kids shirt thingy....such a giant conglomerate surely can afford to use BliBli or BCA or others come on....though as for the badminton club now that's quite a bit harder to resolve ahah
     
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  17. yuquall

    yuquall Regular Member

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    If they're really sincere.. seriously? Have they not been very sincere and supportive all this time? They seem to be the only one care enough about Indonesian athletes, fortunately the sport of their choice to fund is badminton. Heck, even the one of the owners won a bronze medal for Indonesia in AG last year lol (and I am sure it wasn't for the bonus)
    https://www.scmp.com/sport/other-sp...asians-who-win-bronze-asian-games-bridge-meet

    Indonesia Open has changed its name to Blibli so it showed that Djarum people do care about badminton and they didn't mind changing their sponsorship name. I didn't know why back then but I do now. As for the school/club name, it can't be helped. They just happened to be the same name.

    It's not about if they could afford it or not. All they ask was the association to give them some face and ask them nicely before thrashing them in public with such allegation and ordering them to shut down the whole event. And it seemed to me from the news and comments, that the association has yet done anything credible. The badminton club has done nothing wrong regardless where the fund has come from. That was outrageous.

    Personally, after reading and knowing about the school's history after this happened, I don't want them to change their club name.. it's such an icon for Indonesia badminton. For now, PB Djarum had agreed to keep this year's audition on and take off Djarum's name from the event. They said, that only IF there are 10 more companies who will join them to fund this event and agree to not use any of their company name anywhere in the event, then they will run the audition again. Reasonable, considering the situations.

    However, despite as this issue seen as only a "badminton" matter to some, I suspect there are some political things going around in the back with the timing all things happening recently. If it's true, then for a sport to be dragged into politic is just maddening.
     
  18. It'sMeMeMe

    It'sMeMeMe Regular Member

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    that owner that won bronze medal it wasn't in badminton...just sayin...though it's true they support badminton all the way...

    as for the school name they just confirmed that they won't change it for ever...they gave example that when they sent 20 athletes to Akita Japan for sparring (n other countries that ratified FCTC) they all wear shirts Djarum Badminton Club n there were no problems...it is legally a sport institution

    n yes they agree no Djarum on the front of the shirt for this year's audition... replaced with BliBli.... though they said for next year (yeah they agree to hold audition next year though said something bout different format) that they will put PB Djarum on the back of the shirt...(i dunno where yoU got the info on that 10 other companies stuff)

    oh ho ho not bad middle way eh..though it remains to be seen next year whether all this gonna come to fruition...things can still change eh but for now seems peace
     
  19. sen

    sen Regular Member

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    You blamed it on the company that is causing deaths ? If it is that horrible and all government around the world never ban it, shouldn't the government are all evils too ? So you support no advertisement but you never pressure your government to make total ban and even bring the people who are bosses of the companies to court for mass murder trial ?

    I am not saying Indonesian government are not evil. I am just saying that the Indonesian government usually only follow other government. When even Singapore does not ban it(while they ban chewing gum), it is hard to imagine that the Indonesian government would do anything more than what other government do.

    World sporting body is right when banning the sponsorship because that's all they can do, they are not the one who can make it illegal.
    But then all other government do is just barely minimal and they love to earn taxes on tobacco(but not really doing much to protect their citizen)
     
    #3839 sen, Sep 14, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2019
  20. sen

    sen Regular Member

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    I think this "middle way" is another bs. You either go total ban or you got to let go the fact that when you accept sponsor, you can't accept halfway
     

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