Lee Zii Jia

Discussion in 'Malaysia Professional Players' started by undeadshot, Oct 7, 2018.

  1. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2002
    Messages:
    22,877
    Likes Received:
    4,144
    Occupation:
    wannabe badminton phototaker
    Location:
    Outside the box
    What is the function of BAM with these demands?

    What benefit does BAM get? I.e. what does he give to BAM?

    If these demands are true, then the dynamics change. BAM is now providing a service and the player would need to pay for the services.


    It’s like going for a new job. The higher up you go, you have to fit the job description. If you have demands for the new boss, the company has to decide whether A) they can accommodate, B) does the person bring in something that benefits the job and organisation. Unfortunately, LZJ might have made a miscalculation in badminton with the registration issue or he underestimated his own value.
     
    #301 Cheung, Jan 21, 2022
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2022
    rhoder likes this.
  2. samkool

    samkool Regular Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2004
    Messages:
    2,416
    Likes Received:
    1,577
    Occupation:
    too pre-occupied to work
    Location:
    the next world tour tournament
    the primary villain is bwf. federations are merely exerting the power bwf has given them. a players union would have zero power or influence under the current system.

    federations would not be able to own the players if the bwf tournament registration bylaw did not exist. it is an unnecessary bylaw. other sports do not have the same structure. this all goes away when the bwf bylaw goes away. do golf & tennis players have to join a gov't "team" in order to compete in tournaments? nope.

    the current bylaw causes the current problems. w/out the bylaw badminton players would pursue the sport like all other major INDIVIDUAL sports from the beginning: sign up for youth lessons as a kid, then a private academy or coaching team as you approach competitive age. play jr. tournaments, then regional tournaments, then entry level pro tournaments to accrue ranking points, and so on until you work your way up... like tennis & golf.

    bwf is forcing players to join a nat'l federation in order to compete in any tournament. in what world of 'individual' sports does that make any sense? fans are starting to see how this structure is blatantly flawed and unjust for the athletes.

    lzj v. bam is a simple contract issue. but, the system in place by bwf gives bam all the power.

    the least disruptive solution is for bwf to accept entries from anyone who is qualified for the draw, via ranking. pro's can compete as well as those belonging to a nat'l team. the players on those 'teams' can continue whatever deal/contract they currently have. in essence those federations become 'training academies' free to conduct business as they see fit: train youth prospects, sign any player from anywhere in the world to play for them under whatever financial terms they work out...

    this would not cost bwf a single penny.
     
  3. Nine Tailed Fox

    Nine Tailed Fox Regular Member

    Joined:
    May 10, 2015
    Messages:
    9,972
    Likes Received:
    2,345
    Location:
    New Delhi
    4)5G Data -100 GB
     
  4. justforfun

    justforfun Regular Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2012
    Messages:
    108
    Likes Received:
    106
    Location:
    Woodton
    He has asked for the public to stop comparing him to LCW so many times I lost count, although his achievements are clearly not on the same level yet, he is suffering from the same amount of pressure that LCW faced, if not more, which makes him think that he should enjoy the privileges that LCW had before he can compete at similar level.
     
  5. eaglehelang

    eaglehelang Regular Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2007
    Messages:
    12,334
    Likes Received:
    103
    Location:
    Malaysia
    When the 3 requests/demands was 1st reported by the Chinese language press yesterday, there were those who felt LZJ got big headed after winning only All England.

    But those of us who follow badminton know that LCW also made demand no 1 & 2 and was granted. LCW got his own physio team, a dedicated sports psychologist, later years Misbun came back BAM.
    LCW was allowed to be sponsored by Yonex when the national team was sponsored by Wilson(or was it Li Ning?).

    Of course by then LCW had already won 2 Olympic silvers. LZJ is currently only 23, a heavy burden to fill LCW's shoes.

    No 3 choosing own tournaments was due to injuries from participating in too many tournaments. This was something LCW did too, going here & there all year for tournaments.

    Personally, due to obligations to sponsors, I don't think BAM will agree to no 2( have own sponsors) and no 3(freedom to choose tournaments).
    BAM is more concerned abt maintaining sponsorship $$$. If they keep losing top players, sponsors will leave.

    Thing is long term wise, the message to youngsters is seen as - Want to
    be better appreciated, do a Loh Kean Yew & leave for other country in the teens.
    If wait till 20+, do badly till BAM kick out of national team. Then can go pro without worrying abt bans & penalties.

    Btw, years ago, Roslin Hashim did have to pay a penalty to BAM when he left. So did Sairul Ayob I think.
    Back then the leagues were not well established yet. It was all abt the national team.
     
    Cheung likes this.
  6. extremenanopowe

    extremenanopowe Regular Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2005
    Messages:
    13,547
    Likes Received:
    252
    Occupation:
    Chief Coach. The best and still active.
    Location:
    www.extreme-power.org or xtremexn.blogspot.com
  7. extremenanopowe

    extremenanopowe Regular Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2005
    Messages:
    13,547
    Likes Received:
    252
    Occupation:
    Chief Coach. The best and still active.
    Location:
    www.extreme-power.org or xtremexn.blogspot.com
    Even the stupid ex PM also understand the role of BAM ;). How stupidier is BAM?? Lol

     
    keithl likes this.
  8. ibelieveindevil

    ibelieveindevil Regular Member

    Joined:
    May 24, 2012
    Messages:
    737
    Likes Received:
    150
    Location:
    SG
    Number 3 was raised by gjw as well. Bwf doesn't provide explanation on why they sign up players for certain tournaments.

    The players sometimes need exposure, sometimes they need morale bost. They would prefer to join a smaller tournament and win it in the later case
     
    Simeon and Kowalski like this.
  9. extremenanopowe

    extremenanopowe Regular Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2005
    Messages:
    13,547
    Likes Received:
    252
    Occupation:
    Chief Coach. The best and still active.
    Location:
    www.extreme-power.org or xtremexn.blogspot.com
    Yes. Pls dont forget Goh Jin Wei. She was world junior champion and suffered AFTER joining BAM. Who will help her?? ;) You seen her facebook??

     
    Kowalski likes this.
  10. extremenanopowe

    extremenanopowe Regular Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2005
    Messages:
    13,547
    Likes Received:
    252
    Occupation:
    Chief Coach. The best and still active.
    Location:
    www.extreme-power.org or xtremexn.blogspot.com
    An association job is to build champions and let them be independent. Period. Not profit making. Not bossing around.

    Independent players have their own responsibility and risks to win else facing humiliations. ;)

    Thats called professionalism like tennis and golf.
     
    Kowalski and Simeon like this.
  11. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2002
    Messages:
    22,877
    Likes Received:
    4,144
    Occupation:
    wannabe badminton phototaker
    Location:
    Outside the box
    BWF has(had?) a rule about if your ranking is above a certain level, the player must appear in the super series tournament. Is that rule still in force ? Because with the changes in schedule and problems of travelling after covid, this rule works against the players. Also, if players are injured, they still feel the need to go for a tournament rather than keep to a lower level one to build up.

    I think the intention was to keep the best players in televised tournaments for the benefit of the sponsors. If that rule is still in force, I'm not sure is necessary now especially with injured or tired players. More variety of players is better for the world game
     
  12. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2002
    Messages:
    22,877
    Likes Received:
    4,144
    Occupation:
    wannabe badminton phototaker
    Location:
    Outside the box
    1. Build champions - yes

    2. Let them be independent - are you sure? That would need clarification by the funding body that controls BAM


    Also different countries have different rules for their associations so what happens in European or any other country would be different to Malaysia.
     
  13. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2002
    Messages:
    22,877
    Likes Received:
    4,144
    Occupation:
    wannabe badminton phototaker
    Location:
    Outside the box
    Good points. LCW already proved himself to be consistently successful.

    LZJ wasn't able to prove himself in the Olympics nor World Championships unfortunately. Therefore he still has a lot to prove for those demands but clearly he doesn't see it from the same perspective.
     
    rhoder likes this.
  14. Sundis

    Sundis Regular Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2012
    Messages:
    3,573
    Likes Received:
    968
    Occupation:
    Watching and playing badminton
    Location:
    at home
    BAM is ruining Malaysias best chance for olympic gold in 2024
     
  15. Sundis

    Sundis Regular Member

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2012
    Messages:
    3,573
    Likes Received:
    968
    Occupation:
    Watching and playing badminton
    Location:
    at home
    BAM now stands for Banning Association of Malaysia
     
    stanleyfm and samkool like this.
  16. Cheung

    Cheung Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2002
    Messages:
    22,877
    Likes Received:
    4,144
    Occupation:
    wannabe badminton phototaker
    Location:
    Outside the box
    That is debatable:)
     
  17. ngkt67

    ngkt67 Regular Member

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2007
    Messages:
    4,074
    Likes Received:
    235
    Location:
    Kuala Lumpue
    nah BAM don’t even care about Malaysia best chance for Olympic gold at all…
     
  18. eaglehelang

    eaglehelang Regular Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2007
    Messages:
    12,334
    Likes Received:
    103
    Location:
    Malaysia
    stanleyfm likes this.
  19. NanoBatien

    NanoBatien Regular Member

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2006
    Messages:
    165
    Likes Received:
    16
    Location:
    N/A
    Does BAM get money from the Malaysian government?

    If so it seems to me that the primary purpose of BAM then is to make Malaysia win/do well in international tournaments, it doesn't matter which Malaysian wins. In fact LZJ leaving is actually good because it frees up more resources for the other players. I doubt 90% of badminton watchers even know which Malaysian players are BAM and which are not, all you see is the Malaysia flag.

    If BAM isn't getting money from the Malaysian government then aren't they effectively some kind of private corporation? In which case there is surely some anti-monopoly/slavery rules about this? Its like an employer can somehow forbid their workers from leaving?

    Sponsor-wise I kind of sympathize with BAM, in the sense of all their top players leaving so nobody wants to actually sponsor the national team, but there can surely be some financial way of sorting this out. Also, surely the cachet of sponsoring the national team is pretty good already?

    Also, apparently there is some kind of free-agent thing that kicks in after 12 months? If you live in a different country for 12 months you can just register for them, don't need the consent of the original country. If so, a neighbouring small rich country with a reigning Malaysian-born world champion would probably like a word... :p
     
    #319 NanoBatien, Jan 22, 2022
    Last edited: Jan 22, 2022
  20. justforfun

    justforfun Regular Member

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2012
    Messages:
    108
    Likes Received:
    106
    Location:
    Woodton
    They do get funding from the yearly Malaysia budget and the National Sports Council while also relying on sponsors to keep the association running. From their viewpoint, letting LZJ leave without repercussions would have damaged their credibility to sponsors, which is understandable. The only problem is they chose to air their dirty laundry before coming to an agreement with the players. They basically had an internal meeting, made the decision and held the press conference and the involved players found out about their ban the same time as everybody else. Instead of doing the sensible thing of trying to hold continued discussions on how to resolve it another way, they announced a decision that they know is highly unlikely to be the final outcome and invited huge backlash from the pros, government and fans.
     
    Kowalski likes this.

Share This Page