Let's conclude it, Lin Dan is the best MS baddy player in human history.

First ZJH vs Frost is a much faster game; Second as I said LD and LCW should be too fast for 1985's ZJH to deal with.

But to say players like today's TH, PG or even Persson can beat ZJH, I just have to disagree.

To make things simple let's state the following facts.

1. Today's PG is at least half level down from his 1998-99 level.
2. In 1997, a 32 year old ZJH easily beat Sun Jun in a 7-pt game (so that the difference in stamina would not matter much).
3. Sun Jun and PG are around the same level.

Now, the conclusion of ZJH in his prime vs PG today should be obvious, isn't it? ;)

Wong8Egg said:
And for everyone's convenience.

ZJH @ 1985 (ZJH's prime time according to viver)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6KDmdZvXLk4&feature=related

Today's badminton
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wWJdwrbtkY

Even my Mom knows who is better:D
Click to expand...
 
yourbestfriend, wong8egg, i'm on the same wavelength as u fellas
ZJH was my favorite MS player of all time (i havent see tang fu played before so i can't judge him), but LD has improved so much continuously and after the OG win, i can't deny the fact LD has reached the height of badminton supremcy that even ZHJ can't match.

Yes, zhj is a legend in his own time but people keep comparing him to LD now which isnt a fair comparison. LD is way better. First, ZJH has a nagging lung problem, so no way he can match LD even if a peak form ZJH enter a time machine and meet LD now. LD is just way more fitter. Second, LD is taught under LYB and tang fu, LD got the benefit of learning all the past greats through these legendary coaches. No way ZJH knows more than LD now. Third, LD has better training and nutrient than a ZJH. All in all, there is no way ZJH or tang fu is better than LD now as some like viver claims even tho i repeat, this isn't a fair comparison. ZJH and tang fu (and many other greats) are greats in their time, they are worthy of remembering because without them, there is no LD or LD wouldn't be as great as he is now.
 
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Krisna said:
Lin Dan might be the best player 2006-2009... Taufik was argueably better than him before that [2004-2005]... but he is surely not the most famous! The most famous is: ...PRAKASH PADUKONE! Because he is the father of Deepika Padukone! :D :D Just google her if you don't trust me... She has 1 billion fans!
Click to expand...

she has her own thread http://www.badmintoncentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=53550&highlight=Deepika+Padukone

too bad, a truly badminton great shouldn't need a hot daughter to make him famous. Fame by association isn't in my standard book. Same as sidekick Nicole Richie, she wouldn't be famous without Paris Hilton. Same as sideshow bob, he wouldn't be famous without crusty the clown.
 
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cooler said:
too bad, a truly badminton great shouldn't need a hot daughter to make him famous. Fame by association isn't in my standard book. Same as sidekick Nicole Richie, she wouldn't be famous without Paris Hilton. Same as sideshow bob, he wouldn't be famous without crusty the clown.
Click to expand...

Too bad Lin Dan needed Taufik to be famous... :rolleyes: indeed, LD had benefited many times from Taufik's lack of form... Too bad...

LD is not the greatest player of all time [Taufik is! :cool:]...
 
Krisna said:
Too bad Lin Dan needed Taufik to be famous... :rolleyes: indeed, LD had benefited many times from Taufik's lack of form... Too bad...

LD is not the greatest player of all time [Taufik is! :cool:]...
Click to expand...
Krisna..wrong thread.:p
Get ready.But i'll be there for taufik.:D
 
Hmm..

Wong8Egg said:
...
Player like ZJH has set the standard in their era for the next generation to build upon, and players today are setting a higher standard, and this standard will contiune to rise in the future...
Click to expand...
..so, is this your final conclusion to the thread title??..:confused:
yourbestfriend said:
...but i think when LD retires and the dust settles, he will be looked at as the most successful and dominant player of any era.
...
With all this being said, it's still a little early to make any assumptions about how he will place in history. BUT the fact that we're even discussing this means he'll probably be pretty high;)
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..so, of the two, which one will it be??..:confused:
 
I feel that Lin dan is the best player china ever produce, who can up the air smash like Lin dan , not even Yang Yang ,Sun Jun amd Zhao jian hua. The only player that is able to do a similar style to Lin Dan is former indonesia player Hariyanto Arbi!
 
Why is the 2nd point true? TXF is just one "past great".

cooler said:
Yes, zhj is a legend in his own time but people keep comparing him to LD now which isnt a fair comparison. LD is way better. First, ZJH has a nagging lung problem, so no way he can match LD even if a peak form ZJH enter a time machine and meet LD now. LD is just way more fitter. Second, LD is taught under LYB and tang fu, LD got the benefit of learning all the past greats through these legendary coaches. No way ZJH knows more than LD now. Third, LD has better training and nutrient than a ZJH. All in all, there is no way ZJH or tang fu is better than LD now as some like viver claims even tho i repeat, this isn't a fair comparison. ZJH and tang fu (and many other greats) are greats in their time, they are worthy of remembering because without them, there is no LD or LD wouldn't be as great as he is now.
Click to expand...
 
ye333 said:
First ZJH vs Frost is a much faster game; Second as I said LD and LCW should be too fast for 1985's ZJH to deal with.

But to say players like today's TH, PG or even Persson can beat ZJH, I just have to disagree.

To make things simple let's state the following facts.

1. Today's PG is at least half level down from his 1998-99 level.
2. In 1997, a 32 year old ZJH easily beat Sun Jun in a 7-pt game (so that the difference in stamina would not matter much).
3. Sun Jun and PG are around the same level.

Now, the conclusion of ZJH in his prime vs PG today should be obvious, isn't it? ;)
Click to expand...

Alright, here is Morton Frost vs ZJH
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rcMFmtN4aZ8

And LD vs LCW
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mLAmgGVTH2I

Any people, with or without badminton experience can tell today's badminton are playing at a much higher intensity.
 
Krisna said:
Too bad Lin Dan needed Taufik to be famous... :rolleyes: indeed, LD had benefited many times from Taufik's lack of form... Too bad...

LD is not the greatest player of all time [Taufik is! :cool:]...
Click to expand...
LD missed TH alot. TH can't get pass the QF it seem.....

Plus TH isn't mouthing off about LD in the press much anymore, LD is getting less press exposure.... It's TH's fault
 
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If LD is hit by a truck today and can no longer play badminton, will he remain the best baddy player in history? "Was" is not the same as "is"

In that case, even I can beat LD because he will default :-) Does that make me the best baddy player since I can "beat" the former best?

Just deploying "reductio ad absurdum" to expose the proposition is flawed.
 
mettayogi said:
If LD is hit by a truck today and can no longer play badminton, will he remain the best baddy player in history? "Was" is not the same as "is"

In that case, even I can beat LD because he will default :-) Does that make me the best baddy player since I can "beat" the former best?

Just deploying "reductio ad absurdum" to expose the proposition is flawed.
Click to expand...
yup. that is why TH folded, walkout and avoided LD so many time. LD cant be the best when he can't play TH, right?
 
I'll ask the "dinner guest" question for badminton.

If you can choose any badminton player in history to play a competitive game with you, who would you choose? and why?
 
"Best" is ephemeral in sports

Let's say LD remains WR #1 and win gold in 2012. It can happen.

In 2016 LD won't be WR#1. How do you know LD 2016 can beat WR#1 in 2016? Obviously he can't, otherwise LD will still be WR#1. If someone insists LD will remain WR#1 in 2016, how about 2026? It will be absurd.

Comparing athletes from different era is futile. No time machine exists to let top player of old era to play current best.

Badminton and athletes keep changing and that makes badminton interesting. Personally I'll be disappointed if all top players play the same style in the future.
 
Yep.
Badminton requires an opponent to play to win. If X doesn't play LD, you can't claim LD is better than X with complete confidence. You can only make a judgment, and judgments are subject to disagreements.

In contrast, field & track or swimming records can be compared w/o opponents to show up. It's objectively verifiable data.

cooler said:
yup. that is why TH folded, walkout and avoided LD so many time. LD cant be the best when he can't play TH, right?
Click to expand...
 
mettayogi said:
Yep.
Badminton requires an opponent to play to win. If X doesn't play LD, you can't claim LD is better than X with complete confidence. You can only make a judgment, and judgments are subject to disagreements.

In contrast, field & track or swimming records can be compared w/o opponents to show up. It's objectively verifiable data.
Click to expand...
then u cant claim TH is the best either
 
mettayogi said:
Let's say LD remains WR #1 and win gold in 2012. It can happen.

In 2016 LD won't be WR#1. How do you know LD 2016 can beat WR#1 in 2016? Obviously he can't, otherwise LD will still be WR#1. If someone insists LD will remain WR#1 in 2016, how about 2026? It will be absurd.

Comparing athletes from different era is futile. No time machine exists to let top player of old era to play current best.

Badminton and athletes keep changing and that makes badminton interesting. Personally I'll be disappointed if all top players play the same style in the future.
Click to expand...
another TH fan, ....talking absurdity.
 
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