Line disputes when there are no umpires

[Brett]

In league play where there are no umpires or officials, what is the proper method of dealing with a dispute regarding a line call?

In a recent doubles match, I hit a shot that I saw land about 30 cm inside the back line of the court (i.e., it was not even close to being out - on close calls I give the other side the benefit of the doubt). My partner confirmed this call. On the opposing side, Player A, who was nearest to the shuttle when it hit the floor, called it out (I believe because of confusion with lines, as there are court lines for several other sports painted on the surface of the floor of this particular badminton court and the shuttle did land slightly behind one of those other lines).

Player A's partner, Player B, condescended to replay the point, but contended that under both the official rules of badminton and the longstanding rules of our particular league, Player A's call should be accepted as the final ruling on the point and replaying a point is not an officially permitted option. (Player B did not explain which player's judgment stands as final, but presumably it would be the player who saw the shot and was closest to the shuttle when it hit the floor). I contended that this ruling was incorrect, first based on comments I have read on this and other badminton websites on this issue. Second, after a full year of playing in our league, I have never before heard anyone mention this rule and no one plays by that rule in any event; instead, everyone always replays disputed points (which I believe is the most fair way of dealing with judgment disputes and promotes a friendlier relationship among everyone in the league).

I checked the official rules published on this site and found nothing dealing with this issue.

Can anyone shed any light on whether replaying a disputed shot is (a) the official rule; and (b) the preferred or more sensible solution.

Thanks

 

[alex]

Line disputes can be very frustrating, especially when 2 teams are equally strong and one winning shot or point can make a big difference.

Usually, when it comes to league play, both sides should be sensible enough to exercise the courtesy of giving the benefit of doubt to opponents. The player closest to the shot should make the call and "supposed" to be final. But if the other side is caught "not paying enough attention" to call a fair shot, one way to deal with it is to offer a friend from their team and your team to post at both backlines (theirs and yours) as "helper". These 2 helpers are likely to improve the awareness of the players to sight and call the shots, but if players are still not improving, helpers' calls can be considered if both sides agree.

My motto is: if I cannot call the shot out, then it IS in. But I also think replaying the shots also make sense during close league play when the other side seems to continuously take advantage of your courtesy. In short, I think replaying or re-serve is not a good practice for unsighted shots, as players tend to relax in judging close calls.

Regards
Alex

 

[Cheung]

Did u ask the IBF? They are very helpful and reply to e-mails. please let us know the answer as well

 

[kwun]

the honor system?

for all the places i have played badminton in, everyone uses the "honor" system. where, the person closest to the shot has the call. this has worked pretty well since all people i have played with are, as many pointed out, courteous and honest.

when there are close calls, the person has the option of either listening to the opposing party or not, but the final decision is still his. (replay is one of his options)

the "official rule" of badminton doesn't say anything about it since in official tournaments, line judges are always present. however, if, under club games, that player has effectively became the line judge, then that means the line judge will have the final decision and is not disputable.

this arrangement is iffy since the line judge will now have conflict of interest.

unfortunately, the honor system breaks down when dishonest players comes into the picture and start taking advantage of it. i have seen a couple of those, and people do start noticing it quite quickly and will start to avoid playing with them.

there are local rules, however, so it depends on the gym.

after 6 paragraphs, i am not sure if i have answered your question or if i have made it more and more confusing...

 

[paul]

RE: the honor system?

It is a problem though. Since in many tournements you don't get line judges until the final. I think its a good idea to get a friend to sit near the back line of your opponent. Your opponent will then be too embarressed to call close ones out..hopefully.

 

[Brett]

RE: the honor system?

Well, it does seem that there is no official rule either in our league or elsewhere, about disputed points, so hopefully, I will not have to deal with this problem frequently and when it does come up again, I will suggest replaying the point, which I feel is the fairest and most sportsperson-like way to deal with the issue.

Incidentally, the issue here was not one involving honesty, but merely an innocent error. Player A is a very pleasant and honest person who I believe would never deliberately make an inaccurate call. I just announced my disagreement with his call becuase it was so clearly erroneous and I believe he was merely confused about the lines on the court. My real argument was with Player B, who was very arrogant about the whole incident (Player B, who has played badminton more than ten years, unfortunately becomes very condescending, rather than pleasantly helpful, when dealing with individuals in our league with less experience). Luckily virtually everyone else in our league, regardless of their level of skill and experience, is very helpful and friendly toward all newer players.

Thanks for your input.

Brett

 

[Erik]

RE: the honor system?

There are no oficial rules for calling lines in matches witout umpires. Basically there are therefore two options, either
1. the sides call their own lines, or 2. there must be general agreement about all calls with the honor system in the back
the players' minds at all times. In case of option 1 players accept their opponents' calls as final. In case of option 2 there shall be a let when sides do not agree. Mind an umpire shall always ask a line judge to confrim his call in case of dispute.
When in doubt, players can do the same thing by asking wether their opponents are sure of their call.

In case of league badminton it is of course best to have a leaugue policy but if this is not the case, oposing teams could
decide upon a policy for their particular tie rather than using a different system each time the problem presents itself.

I know that the IBF is working on Laws of Badminton without court officials, but these will take sometime to develope

In my country (The Netherlands) we have the policy that matches are scored by home team players. These scorers have
the authority to rule on all line calls. Players are however invited to feel free to advise on all calls. The scorer will usually
follow this advice, but is under no obligation to do so. In this way dishonest calls can be nutralized.

 

[Howles01]

RE: the honor system?

Well, it does seem that there is no official rule either in our league or elsewhere, about disputed points, so hopefully, I will not have to deal with this problem frequently and when it does come up again, I will suggest replaying the point, which I feel is the fairest and most sportsperson-like way to deal with the issue.

Incidentally, the issue here was not one involving honesty, but merely an innocent error. Player A is a very pleasant and honest person who I believe would never deliberately make an inaccurate call. I just announced my disagreement with his call becuase it was so clearly erroneous and I believe he was merely confused about the lines on the court. My real argument was with Player B, who was very arrogant about the whole incident (Player B, who has played badminton more than ten years, unfortunately becomes very condescending, rather than pleasantly helpful, when dealing with individuals in our league with less experience). Luckily virtually everyone else in our league, regardless of their level of skill and experience, is very helpful and friendly toward all newer players.

Thanks for your input.

Brett

I started playing in 1968and have always understood if there was a contested point, playing a LET was the fairest answer. However, I recently came up against a player who insisted "my side of the net my call." I think this is an asinine way of thinking and does not lend to a sportsperson-like way to deal with the issue.